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  3. Swarming defenses outweigh franchise QB's.

Swarming defenses outweigh franchise QB's.

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  • R RoyceRolls

    @nickers said:

    If you can't score points.. you cant win in the first place.. the QB then D...

    Who said defense can't score points, or at very least put an average offense in position to score easy points
    Comeonman ComeonmanC Very Popular Reacting Well Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Week One Done One Month Later One Year In
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    ComeonmanC Comeonman wrote on last edited by
    #9

    @roycerolls said:

    Who said defense can't score points, or at very least put an average offense in position to score easy points

    Yep. Again, look at the current champs
    tiamat63T nickersN 2 Replies Last reply
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    • S SkippinTurtles

      D should always be stronger than O. Short of an Aaron Rodgers, build your D and develop a competent offense.

      Orion OrionO Conversation Starter Dedicated Very Popular Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done
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      OrionO Orion wrote on last edited by
      #10

      @skippinturtles said:

      D should always be stronger than O. Short of an Aaron Rodgers, build your D and develop a competent offense.

      You've got it exactly backwards.

      A good defense only matters if you can make it to the playoffs......and you're not sniffing the playoffs without an offense that can score points.

      BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE
      nickersN 1 Reply Last reply
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      • OrionO Orion

        @skippinturtles said:

        D should always be stronger than O. Short of an Aaron Rodgers, build your D and develop a competent offense.

        You've got it exactly backwards.

        A good defense only matters if you can make it to the playoffs......and you're not sniffing the playoffs without an offense that can score points.

        nickers nickersN Conversation Starter Dedicated Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done Very Popular
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        nickersN nickers wrote on last edited by
        #11

        @orion said:

        You've got it exactly backwards.

        A good defense only matters if you can make it to the playoffs......and you're not sniffing the playoffs without an offense that can score points.

        You need both.. not going far without either. But I agree with your post.

        Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~
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        • ComeonmanC Comeonman

          @roycerolls said:

          Who said defense can't score points, or at very least put an average offense in position to score easy points

          Yep. Again, look at the current champs
          tiamat63 tiamat63T Conversation Starter Dedicated Reacting Well Collaborator First Post Posting Machine Week One Done One Month Later One Year In Very Popular
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          tiamat63T tiamat63 wrote on last edited by
          #12

          @comeonman said:

          Yep. Again, look at the current champs

          The current champs also have a historically good defense. The 2013 hawks and 2015 Broncos have been models of defensive dominance in very short spans. Its not likely to happen again soon.

          That said. The model for sustained success isn't having sole focus to one side of the ball. Balance is necessary otherwise you'll be shouldering the burden with only half your players.

          I'd lean on the Broncos defense this year being the most impressive I've seen in some time because there were stretches when their offensive was totally inept.

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          • miktoxic miktoxicM
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            miktoxicM miktoxic wrote on last edited by
            #13

            it seems like the past regime was adament about building the D. too bad none of their picks have panned out as planned.

            key to building anything is to make sure the building blocks aren't made of butter.

            DieHardBrownsFanD 1 Reply Last reply
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            • miktoxicM miktoxic

              it seems like the past regime was adament about building the D. too bad none of their picks have panned out as planned.

              key to building anything is to make sure the building blocks aren't made of butter.

              DieHardBrownsFan DieHardBrownsFanD Conversation Starter Dedicated Reacting Well Very Popular Collaborator Posting Machine First Post One Month Later Week One Done One Year In
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              DieHardBrownsFanD DieHardBrownsFan wrote on last edited by
              #14

              @miktoxic said:

              it seems like the past regime was adament about building the D. too bad none of their picks have panned out as planned.

              key to building anything is to make sure the building blocks aren't made of butter.

              HA!

              "You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.” - Janis Joplin, 1970.
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              • ComeonmanC Comeonman

                @roycerolls said:

                Who said defense can't score points, or at very least put an average offense in position to score easy points

                Yep. Again, look at the current champs
                nickers nickersN Conversation Starter Dedicated Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done Very Popular
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                nickersN nickers wrote on last edited by
                #15

                @comeonman said:

                Yep. Again, look at the current champs

                Current doesn't stay current for too long..They don't get there without Manning..

                Lets see how average they are this season...

                Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~
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                • SkippinTurtles S Conversation Starter Dedicated First Post Collaborator One Year In Week One Done One Month Later
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                  S SkippinTurtles wrote on last edited by
                  #16

                  Building a franchise D is easier than finding a franchise QB.

                  nickersN OrionO 2 Replies Last reply
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                  • S SkippinTurtles

                    Building a franchise D is easier than finding a franchise QB.

                    nickers nickersN Conversation Starter Dedicated Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done Very Popular
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                    nickersN nickers wrote on last edited by
                    #17

                    @skippinturtles said:

                    Building a franchise D is easier than finding a franchise QB.

                    If it were that easy .. Everyone would do it..

                    Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~
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                    • LogicIsForSquaresL LogicIsForSquares

                      Will do.

                      One Post One PostO
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                      One PostO One Post wrote on last edited by
                      #18

                      @logicisforsquares said:

                      Will do.

                      Dude seriously I've been stressed out today and it's getting to me. I read this man thanks for the laugh. Very cool. 🙂
                      https://www.facebook.com/Mike-Black-Sunday-Stories-1780988822148720/?ref=bookmarks
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                      • S SkippinTurtles

                        Building a franchise D is easier than finding a franchise QB.

                        Orion OrionO Conversation Starter Dedicated Very Popular Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done
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                        OrionO Orion wrote on last edited by
                        #19

                        @skippinturtles said:

                        Building a franchise D is easier than finding a franchise QB.

                        Our regimes have made everything look hard to do.

                        Here's why I think we should build an offense first:

                        1) With a good offense you're never really out of a game.

                        2) You may be able to outscore teams to cover for your defense and win games.

                        3) The games most probably will be more exciting and more entertaining to the masses.

                        With a good offense we MIGHT even make the playoffs...or contend for them.

                        As has been said, you need both if you want to be a champion as the defense is the separator once you make the playoffs.

                        And on offense you HAVE TO be able to pass the ball well. Again, some sort of 'feared' balance is needed (you have to be able to run the ball somewhat at least).

                        A good defense cannot score enough points to cover for an inept offense.

                        When you come to the conclusion that you DON'T have a good enough QB, then you have to step back up to the plate and try to hit the home run......again......and again.....until you DO get your QB, because...the position is just that important to success these days. It doesn't have to be a Tom Brady (though that's the goal) but it can't be a backup quality QB as your starter.

                        BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE
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                        • Tour2ma Tour2maT In Memoriam Dedicated Conversation Starter Reacting Well Posting Machine Collaborator First Post One Year In One Month Later Week One Done Very Popular
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                          Tour2maT Tour2ma wrote on last edited by
                          #20

                          No... the QB has to be a Tom Brady-like in many regards.

                          "When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196
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                          • calfoxwc C Dedicated Very Popular Conversation Starter Collaborator First Post Posting Machine Reacting Well Week One Done One Year In One Month Later
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                            C calfoxwc wrote on last edited by calfoxwc
                            #21

                            no, no, no.

                            doesn't matter which one you build first, you try to build both - the best building blocks

                            as you can get them.

                            If Brady had been drafted by the Browns, nobody would know who he was - it's the Arcie Manning

                            syndrome - you can't win without the pieces in place.

                            Now, a swarming defense is eleven guys playing in sync. A true, elite franchise qb is only one player.

                            11 > 1. Now, seriously - Peyton Manniing took a playoff caliber team to the superbowl and won it.

                            The Broncos got to the playoffs in 2011...with freaking Kyle Orton and Tim Tebow, the latter saved their

                            season. Orton started, they lost a few games, and then Tim Tebow took over.

                            Tim Tebow was a popsickle stick.

                            But Denver had most of the pieces in place. The qb made the difference, and Tebow isn't an

                            elite franchise qb.

                            Building a football team to win, is like the old mousetrap game racing another mousetrap game. You have to

                            get all the right pieces in place, or the mouse won't be trapped. It does't work. Now, you are missing a few pieces,

                            sure, you can duct tape a popsickle stick into the mousetrap and make it work... if you have a good popsickle stick.

                            Past regimes of the Browns just didn't get it. They were like "say, we want our mousetrap game to work, let's use

                            this expensive pencil, and a few grapes and an avacado, and try to make the mousetrap work".

                            Nah. Hue and Co are way, way too smart and experienced for that. They get it.

                            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse_Trap_(game)

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                            • SkippinTurtles S Conversation Starter Dedicated First Post Collaborator One Year In Week One Done One Month Later
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                              S SkippinTurtles wrote on last edited by
                              #22

                              Brady won his first 3 SB's with a swarming defense and the best kicker ever. He's above average, not special.

                              The GipperT nickersN 2 Replies Last reply
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                              • S SkippinTurtles

                                Brady won his first 3 SB's with a swarming defense and the best kicker ever. He's above average, not special.

                                The Gipper The GipperT In Memoriam Very Popular
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                                The GipperT The Gipper wrote on last edited by
                                #23

                                @skippinturtles said:

                                Brady won his first 3 SB's with a swarming defense and the best kicker ever. He's above average, not special.

                                Yea, I don't think you are going to get many people to agree with you. Brady is top 3 QBs ever.

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                                • S SkippinTurtles

                                  Brady won his first 3 SB's with a swarming defense and the best kicker ever. He's above average, not special.

                                  nickers nickersN Conversation Starter Dedicated Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done Very Popular
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                                  nickersN nickers wrote on last edited by
                                  #24

                                  @skippinturtles said:

                                  He's above average, not special.

                                  Yes and only the best damn QB in modern times.. Go back to school , Charlie.

                                  Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~
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                                  • S SkippinTurtles

                                    D should always be stronger than O. Short of an Aaron Rodgers, build your D and develop a competent offense.

                                    MasterDog MasterDogM
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                                    MasterDogM MasterDog wrote on last edited by MasterDog
                                    #25

                                    @skippinturtles said:

                                    D should always be stronger than O. Short of an Aaron Rodgers, build your D and develop a competent offense.

                                    Easier said than done.

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                                    • BrownsfaninPa BrownsfaninPaB
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                                      BrownsfaninPaB BrownsfaninPa wrote on last edited by
                                      #26

                                      I will always say that a team needs a strong defense. Its my favorite side of the team. DE, DT, & LB are my favorite positions. I know a team needs a productive QB, and a good RB & WR, but I will stick to building a strong defense 100%.

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                                      • SkippinTurtles S Conversation Starter Dedicated First Post Collaborator One Year In Week One Done One Month Later
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                                        S SkippinTurtles wrote on last edited by
                                        #27

                                        Loading your D with talent always makes sense. Trent Dilfer was garbage, but he has more rings than Warren Moon, Dan Marino and Pihilip Rivers. Building your D is more realistic than praying for a franchise QB. Sometimes even "franchise" QB's win jack shit. Scoring points is great. Hurting your opponent is better, especially if you get a ring.

                                        nickersN 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • S SkippinTurtles

                                          Loading your D with talent always makes sense. Trent Dilfer was garbage, but he has more rings than Warren Moon, Dan Marino and Pihilip Rivers. Building your D is more realistic than praying for a franchise QB. Sometimes even "franchise" QB's win jack shit. Scoring points is great. Hurting your opponent is better, especially if you get a ring.

                                          nickers nickersN Conversation Starter Dedicated Posting Machine Collaborator First Post Reacting Well One Year In One Month Later Week One Done Very Popular
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                                          nickersN nickers wrote on last edited by
                                          #28

                                          @skippinturtles said:

                                          Loading your D with talent always makes sense. Trent Dilfer was garbage, but he has more rings than Warren Moon, Dan Marino and Pihilip Rivers. Building your D is more realistic than praying for a franchise QB. Sometimes even "franchise" QB's win jack shit. Scoring points is great. Hurting your opponent is better, especially if you get a ring.

                                          having shit QB is no way to build a dynasty

                                          Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~
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