No Love for Quinn
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It's not about DA's draft position, D&S, it's about Quinn's.
Like it or not, a first round pick was used to draft Quinn and an organization cannot afford to waste those picks on players who never even see the field. Having a guy bust is one thing, having him never play for no good reason is another entirely.
And a first round QB with Quinn's pedigree certainly should not be kept off the field for "just plain not that bad". A first round pick is selected to PLAY, and ideally to improve the team. What you and Lum fail to realize is that DA is NOT improving the team with his "not that bad" play, and therefore he's gotta go.
Finally, if it takes Quinn -- or any other player, for that matter -- to "improve" to DA's level of "just plain not that bad", then we will never get past being "just plain not that bad" as a franchise.
Not exactly the heights I'm shooting for.
That's all nice and dandy, but what if after you get the first rounder in, you realize your 6th rounder is playing at a higher level and you want to win now? Do you play the first rounder because he's a first rounder, or do you play the guy you genuinely think gives you the best chance to win???
So many people here seem to think this scenario hasn't existed... well folks, either it did, or the last coaching and management staff was just screwing with you personally even though their careers would be jeopardized.
It'll be interesting to see what the new group does.
That's all nice and dandy, but what if after you get the first rounder in, you realize your 6th rounder is playing at a higher level and you want to win now? Do you play the first rounder because he's a first rounder, or do you play the guy you genuinely think gives you the best chance to win???
So many people here seem to think this scenario hasn't existed... well folks, either it did, or the last coaching and management staff was just screwing with you personally even though their careers would be jeopardized.
It'll be interesting to see what the new group does.
You always play the guys that give the team the best chance to win. That's not the argument here.
The whole point of this never-ending conversation is that RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION by paying/playing DA, and that decision cost us not only the whole 2008 season but both of them their jobs and the organization millions of dollars.
You can make whatever excuses you want to make for DA but the facts that matter are clear: DA failed to win games and failed to lead the team in a positive direction. While he was the starting QB, the Browns looked awful more than they looked good. Period.
If he was a quality NFL QB, he would have been part of the solution. He clearly and consistently was part of the problem. And that's what it boils down to now.
DA had his chance. He got paid to be the starting QB. He failed. Those that made the decision to make him the starting QB were fired. DA should be fired as well.
Which brings us back to: we spent a first-round pick on a top QB. Normally, getting a guy like Quinn is cause for excitement for a franchise and the fan base was rightly excited about the possibilities of a highly-touted QB playing in Cleveland.
Many of us would like to see if that excitement based on potential has a basis in reality.
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That's all nice and dandy, but what if after you get the first rounder in, you realize your 6th rounder is playing at a higher level and you want to win now? Do you play the first rounder because he's a first rounder, or do you play the guy you genuinely think gives you the best chance to win???
So many people here seem to think this scenario hasn't existed... well folks, either it did, or the last coaching and management staff was just screwing with you personally even though their careers would be jeopardized.
It'll be interesting to see what the new group does.
You always play the guys that give the team the best chance to win. That's not the argument here.
The whole point of this never-ending conversation is that RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION by paying/playing DA, and that decision cost us not only the whole 2008 season but both of them their jobs and the organization millions of dollars.
You can make whatever excuses you want to make for DA but the facts that matter are clear: DA failed to win games and failed to lead the team in a positive direction. While he was the starting QB, the Browns looked awful more than they looked good. Period.
If he was a quality NFL QB, he would have been part of the solution. He clearly and consistently was part of the problem. And that's what it boils down to now.
DA had his chance. He got paid to be the starting QB. He failed. Those that made the decision to make him the starting QB were fired. DA should be fired as well.
Which brings us back to: we spent a first-round pick on a top QB. Normally, getting a guy like Quinn is cause for excitement for a franchise and the fan base was rightly excited about the possibilities of a highly-touted QB playing in Cleveland.
Many of us would like to see if that excitement based on potential has a basis in reality.
You always play the guys that give the team the best chance to win. That's not the argument here.
The whole point of this never-ending conversation is that RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION by paying/playing DA, and that decision cost us not only the whole 2008 season but both of them their jobs and the organization millions of dollars.
You can make whatever excuses you want to make for DA but the facts that matter are clear: DA failed to win games and failed to lead the team in a positive direction. While he was the starting QB, the Browns looked awful more than they looked good. Period.
If he was a quality NFL QB, he would have been part of the solution. He clearly and consistently was part of the problem. And that's what it boils down to now.
DA had his chance. He got paid to be the starting QB. He failed. Those that made the decision to make him the starting QB were fired. DA should be fired as well.
Which brings us back to: we spent a first-round pick on a top QB. Normally, getting a guy like Quinn is cause for excitement for a franchise and the fan base was rightly excited about the possibilities of a highly-touted QB playing in Cleveland.
Many of us would like to see if that excitement based on potential has a basis in reality.
You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
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You always play the guys that give the team the best chance to win. That's not the argument here.
The whole point of this never-ending conversation is that RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION by paying/playing DA, and that decision cost us not only the whole 2008 season but both of them their jobs and the organization millions of dollars.
You can make whatever excuses you want to make for DA but the facts that matter are clear: DA failed to win games and failed to lead the team in a positive direction. While he was the starting QB, the Browns looked awful more than they looked good. Period.
If he was a quality NFL QB, he would have been part of the solution. He clearly and consistently was part of the problem. And that's what it boils down to now.
DA had his chance. He got paid to be the starting QB. He failed. Those that made the decision to make him the starting QB were fired. DA should be fired as well.
Which brings us back to: we spent a first-round pick on a top QB. Normally, getting a guy like Quinn is cause for excitement for a franchise and the fan base was rightly excited about the possibilities of a highly-touted QB playing in Cleveland.
Many of us would like to see if that excitement based on potential has a basis in reality.
You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?
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You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?
Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?
Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.
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Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?
Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.
Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.
WHAT COMPETITION?
I missed where Savage or Crennel EVER said there was a competition. Stop revising history.
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If Quinn gets traded, I'm hoping we either keep Anderson or get someone else.
I don't want us drafting Sanchez, because I think he's a bust of epic proportions at #5, especially considering the other players that may be available that we can actually use and do need.
I'd much rather ride the year out with DA and see if the new staff can do something with him, then draft a QB next year if they can't.
JMO.
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If Quinn gets traded, I'm hoping we either keep Anderson or get someone else.
I don't want us drafting Sanchez, because I think he's a bust of epic proportions at #5, especially considering the other players that may be available that we can actually use and do need.
I'd much rather ride the year out with DA and see if the new staff can do something with him, then draft a QB next year if they can't.
JMO.
If Quinn gets traded, I'm hoping we either keep Anderson or get someone else.
I don't want us drafting Sanchez, because I think he's a bust of epic proportions at #5, especially considering the other players that may be available that we can actually use and do need.
I'd much rather ride the year out with DA and see if the new staff can do something with him, then draft a QB next year if they can't.
JMO.
We need farm teams for the nfl.... Quinn could have been playing in the D league or whatever and already be ready to step in.
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Even though Kokinis didn't say much at his press conference, I did pick up something very telling.
Kokinis said there will be a QB competition and as of now, both are still on the team. Then he said Quinn is upstairs working with Dabol and they have been working on the playbook every day. He wouldn't confirm that DA had minor surgery during the off season but said DA is working out and when minicamp get here he expects him to be 100% and competing with Quinn.
I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.
Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?
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@inspecta said:
Hey Lemosely, is that Vingh Rames in your sig?Kind of looks like him or Karl Weathers (sp?), but it's not. Just a pic from Gears of War or Halo.
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You always play the guys that give the team the best chance to win. That's not the argument here.
The whole point of this never-ending conversation is that RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION by paying/playing DA, and that decision cost us not only the whole 2008 season but both of them their jobs and the organization millions of dollars.
You can make whatever excuses you want to make for DA but the facts that matter are clear: DA failed to win games and failed to lead the team in a positive direction. While he was the starting QB, the Browns looked awful more than they looked good. Period.
If he was a quality NFL QB, he would have been part of the solution. He clearly and consistently was part of the problem. And that's what it boils down to now.
DA had his chance. He got paid to be the starting QB. He failed. Those that made the decision to make him the starting QB were fired. DA should be fired as well.
Which brings us back to: we spent a first-round pick on a top QB. Normally, getting a guy like Quinn is cause for excitement for a franchise and the fan base was rightly excited about the possibilities of a highly-touted QB playing in Cleveland.
Many of us would like to see if that excitement based on potential has a basis in reality.
You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
Um, we do know, D&S. The Browns finished 4-12. DA was the starter for the crucial first half of the season. How'd we start out again? 1-5, I believe?
Oh, and are RAC and Savage still employed by the Browns? No.
Finally, do you think they would have been fired had Quinn been playing, regardless of the Browns' finish?
No, again.
So what were you saying about their decision to play DA again? Still confused?
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No to mention the additional 1st and 3rd round picks that could have been on the team had we let DA go. Who knows how those picks would have impacted our 2008 draft and thus our 2009 draft.
But one thing is for sure: two potential high-impact players would have made a big difference, either to the offense or defense.
But keeping DA obviously was the right choice...
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Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?
Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.
Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.
You mean the coach that got fired? Yeah, pretty darn good judge of talent he was. Of course leave it to a DA lover to accuse anyone who doesn't think of DA as a good QB of being a BQ lover. You've never seen me say anything about BQ one way or the other. Just that DA sucks and this team is going nowhere if he is the starter.
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You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.
In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.
I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.
Um, we do know, D&S. The Browns finished 4-12. DA was the starter for the crucial first half of the season. How'd we start out again? 1-5, I believe?
Oh, and are RAC and Savage still employed by the Browns? No.
Finally, do you think they would have been fired had Quinn been playing, regardless of the Browns' finish?
No, again.
So what were you saying about their decision to play DA again? Still confused?
Um, we do know, D&S. The Browns finished 4-12. DA was the starter for the crucial first half of the season. How'd we start out again? 1-5, I believe?
Oh, and are RAC and Savage still employed by the Browns? No.
Finally, do you think they would have been fired had Quinn been playing, regardless of the Browns' finish?
No, again.
So what were you saying about their decision to play DA again? Still confused?
Actually, coming off a preseason concussion, a preseason that he only played all of 15 plays or so, they started DA over the guy who played all preseason. They started 0 and 3, then won 3 of the next 5 'til Lerner yanked him... 1 and 6 after he was yanked, and that against what you say was a less crucial schedule.
RAC and Savage are gone, and people here are scared spitless that DA would have a chance to compete against BQ. It'll be curious what the new regime does.
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Um, we do know, D&S. The Browns finished 4-12. DA was the starter for the crucial first half of the season. How'd we start out again? 1-5, I believe?
Oh, and are RAC and Savage still employed by the Browns? No.
Finally, do you think they would have been fired had Quinn been playing, regardless of the Browns' finish?
No, again.
So what were you saying about their decision to play DA again? Still confused?
Actually, coming off a preseason concussion, a preseason that he only played all of 15 plays or so, they started DA over the guy who played all preseason. They started 0 and 3, then won 3 of the next 5 'til Lerner yanked him... 1 and 6 after he was yanked, and that against what you say was a less crucial schedule.
RAC and Savage are gone, and people here are scared spitless that DA would have a chance to compete against BQ. It'll be curious what the new regime does.
Actually, coming off a preseason concussion, a preseason that he only played all of 15 plays or so, they started DA over the guy who played all preseason. They started 0 and 3, then won 3 of the next 5 'til Lerner yanked him... 1 and 6 after he was yanked, and that against what you say was a less crucial schedule.
RAC and Savage are gone, and people here are scared spitless that DA would have a chance to compete against BQ. It'll be curious what the new regime does.
Considering there was no competition, it amazes me you still try to claim there was. So Savage's and RAC's word is gospel except for that statement, eh? Oh, and the excuse that LERNER had DA pulled? That's hilarious. You DA lovers sure do grasp for every straw possible....LOL
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Even though Kokinis didn't say much at his press conference, I did pick up something very telling.
Kokinis said there will be a QB competition and as of now, both are still on the team. Then he said Quinn is upstairs working with Dabol and they have been working on the playbook every day. He wouldn't confirm that DA had minor surgery during the off season but said DA is working out and when minicamp get here he expects him to be 100% and competing with Quinn.
I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.
Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?
I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.
Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?
According to Doerschuk DA's been a regular at Berea: http://blogs.cantonrep.com/2009/04/freshbr...n-in-the-house/
Is curious about the playbook question though.
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I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.
Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?
According to Doerschuk DA's been a regular at Berea: http://blogs.cantonrep.com/2009/04/freshbr...n-in-the-house/
Is curious about the playbook question though.
Is curious about the playbook question though.
Quinn's probably "working on" the playbook with Dabol because he's not nearly as cerebral as Derek-Bear and needs all the tutoring he can get.
Either that or they just figure that Anderception will play equally poorly whether he actually knows the offense or not, so why waste the time.
I'm guessing it's the latter.
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Started 2 and 3 not 1 and 5. and ended up at 3 and 5. .375 win percentage. For sure not great but there were some big drops that were momentum changers against Dallas and Baltimore. But, the defense also played well enough to win 2 other games if the offense and DA would have been able to produce. So 5 - 3 was well within reason or at worst 4 -4.
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I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.
Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?
According to Doerschuk DA's been a regular at Berea: http://blogs.cantonrep.com/2009/04/freshbr...n-in-the-house/
Is curious about the playbook question though.
According to Doerschuk DA's been a regular at Berea: http://blogs.cantonrep.com/2009/04/freshbr...n-in-the-house/
Is curious about the playbook question though.
Funny, The Golf Channel showed him playing in AZ in a celebrity Pro-Am just a few weeks ago and before that I saw him playing in Palm Springs. He may have been in and out to say hello and maybe work out for awhile, but he has been out west playing golf most of the winter and also in March.
I just thought the comment was a little funny that he stated "Quinn and Dabol are upstairs working on the playbook. They have been working everyday". He never mentioned Anderson and was very vague when questioned about his off season surgery. His only comment was,"He's working out". He didn't say where.
But, we will know what's going to happen in a week.
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