HOF news. Clay Mathews a Semi-Finalist

The Gipper

Zombo said:

Tomlinson

Owens

Warner

Dawkins

Kenn

Zombo

--I assume Coryell is a veterans committee pick? If so, him too.

Actually, he is not. Only players get in with the veterans choices. He must compete with others.

And what about Jimmy Johnson? Should any coach that wins 2 titles get in?

Tom Coughlin

George Seifert

Tom Flores

Mike Shanahan

All get in, no?

The Gipper

@one-post said:
Kurt Warner needs in.

I think he makes it. No other QBs in the semifinalist list.

The Gipper

Just FYI, here is the list of players who are not in the above semi-finalist list, yet who are among the Top 50 "Producers" in NFL history per that PFR Career Average stat, with their place on the list:

1. Peyton Manning

t7. Tom Brady

t7. Ray Lewis

11. Drew Brees

20. Julius Peppers

28. Jim Marshall

t32. Randy Moss

t32. Ken Anderson

42. Charles Woodson

45. Reggie Wayne

49. Jeff Saturday

50. Zach Thomas

Blue: active

Green: retired but not yet HOF eligible (less than 5 years)

Red: retired and eligible....but not yet inducted.

One Post

@the-gipper said:
I think he makes it. No other QBs in the semifinalist list.

I hope so. He's a good guy.

Tour2ma

@the-gipper said:
I think he makes it. No other QBs in the semifinalist list.

Is that some kind of rule? A QB in every class?

Kurt's a great, cinderella story and caught proverbial lightening in a bottle with "The Greatest Show on Turf". But his career numbers are marginal for the HOF... 36th in career yards... T-35th in TDs... but is 10th in Rating.

And then there's the SB... 3 appearances... went 1-2...

Worthy candidate to be sure... worthy inductee? Perhaps, but not a slam dunk.

Should he get in, then is Phil Simms next up? Similar career numbers albeit over more starts. Won 2 SBs and holds the record for completion percentage in a SB.

The Gipper

@the-gipper said:

PFR rating among all the following players:

Morten Andersen, K – 1982-1994 New Orleans Saints, 1995-2000, 2006-07 Atlanta Falcons, 2001 New York Giants, 2002-03 Kansas City Chiefs, 2004 Minnesota Vikings | (Times as a Semifinalist: 5 – 2013-17)

NOT in Top 250

Steve Atwater, S – 1989-1998 Denver Broncos, 1999 New York Jets | (Times as a Semifinalist: 6 – 2012-17)

NOT in Top 250

Tony Boselli, T – 1995-2001 Jacksonville Jaguars, 2002 Houston Texans (injured reserve) | (Times as a Semifinalist: 2 – 2016-17)

NOT in Top 250

Isaac Bruce, WR – 1994-2007 Los Angeles/St. Louis Rams, 2008-09 San Francisco 49ers | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

Tied for #94

Don Coryell, Coach – 1973-77 St. Louis Cardinals, 1978-1986 San Diego Chargers | (Times as a Semifinalist: 9 – 2005, 2010-17)

N/A Coach

Roger Craig, RB – 1983-1990 San Francisco 49ers, 1991 Los Angeles Raiders, 1992-93 Minnesota Vikings | (Times as a Semifinalist: 9 – 2009-17)

Tied for #243

Terrell Davis, RB – 1995-2001 Denver Broncos | (Times as a Semifinalist: 11 – 2007-2017)

NOT in Top 250

Brian Dawkins, S, 1996-2008 Philadelphia Eagles, 2009-2011 Denver Broncos | (Times as a Semifinalist: 1 – 2017)

#79

Alan Faneca, G – 1998-2007 Pittsburgh Steelers, 2008-09 New York Jets, 2010 Arizona Cardinals | (Times as a Semifinalist: 2 – 2016-17)

#63

Chris Hinton, G/T – 1983-89 Baltimore/Indianapolis Colts, 1990-93 Atlanta Falcons, 1994-95 Minnesota Vikings | (Times as a Semifinalist: 1 – 2017)

NOT in Top 250

Torry Holt, WR – 1999-2008 St. Louis Rams, 2009 Jacksonville Jaguars | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

NOT in Top 250

Joe Jacoby, T – 1981-1993 Washington Redskins | (Times as a Semifinalist: 7 – 2005, 2008, 2013-17)

NOT in Top 250

Edgerrin James, RB – 1999-2005 Indianapolis Colts, 2006-08 Arizona Cardinals, 2009 Seattle Seahawks | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

#136

Jimmy Johnson, Coach – 1989-1993 Dallas Cowboys, 1996-99 Miami Dolphins | (Times as a Semifinalist: 4 – 2014-17)

N/A Coach

Mike Kenn, T – 1978-1994 Atlanta Falcons | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

#88

Ty Law, CB – 1995-2004 New England Patriots, 2005, 2008 New York Jets, 2006-07 Kansas City Chiefs, 2009 Denver Broncos | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

Tied for #243

John Lynch, FS – 1993-2003 Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 2004-07 Denver Broncos | (Times as a Semifinalist: 5 – 2013-17)

Tied for #206

Clay Matthews, LB – 1978-1993 Cleveland Browns, 1994-96 Atlanta Falcons | (Times as a Semifinalist: 2 – 2012, 2017)

Tied for #94

Kevin Mawae, C/G – 1994-97 Seattle Seahawks, 1998-2005 New York Jets, 2006-09 Tennessee Titans | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

#47

Karl Mecklenburg, LB – 1983-1994 Denver Broncos | (Times as a Semifinalist: 6 – 2012-17)

Tied for #243

Terrell Owens, WR – 1996-2003 San Francisco 49ers, 2004-05 Philadelphia Eagles, 2006-08 Dallas Cowboys, 2009 Buffalo Bills, 2010 Cincinnati Bengals |(Times as a Semifinalist: 2 – 2016-17)

#24

Jason Taylor, DE – 1997-2007, 2009, 2011 Miami Dolphins, 2008 Washington Redskins, 2010 New York Jets | (Times as a Semifinalist: 1 – 2017)

#37

LaDainian Tomlinson, RB – 2001-09 San Diego Chargers, 2010-11 New York Jets | (Times as a Semifinalist: 1 – 2017)

42#

Hines Ward, WR – 1998-2011 Pittsburgh Steelers | (Times as a Semifinalist: 1 – 2017)

Tied for #206

Kurt Warner, QB – 1998-2003 St. Louis Rams, 2004 New York Giants, 2005-09 Arizona Cardinals | (Times as a Semifinalist: 3 – 2015-17)

Tied for #243

Darren Woodson, S – 1992-2003 Dallas Cowboys | (Times as a Semifinalist: 2 – 2015, 2017)

To be considered for election to the Pro Football Hall of Fame, a nominated player or coach must not have participated as an active player or coach for five consecutive seasons.

The Gipper

@tour2ma said:

Is that some kind of rule? A QB in every class?

No, but QBs are a special case, don't you agree?

Kurt's a great, cinderella story and caught proverbial lightening in a bottle with "The Greatest Show on Turf". But his career numbers are marginal for the HOF... 36th in career yards... T-35th in TDs... but is 10th in Rating.

And then there's the SB... 3 appearances... went 1-2...

Here is the list of QBs who started in 3 or more Super Bowls:
Starts Player Record Team(s), Super Bowls % Ref, 6 Tom Brady 4–2 New England Patriots - XXXVI, XXXVIII, XXXIX, XLII, XLVI, XLIX 67% ^[1] 5 John Elway 2–3 Denver Broncos - XXI, XXII, XXIV, XXXII, XXXIII 40% ^[2] 4 Terry Bradshaw 4–0 Pittsburgh Steelers - IX, X, XIII, XIV 100% ^[3]Joe Montana 4–0 San Francisco 49ers - XVI, XIX, XXIII, XXIV 100% ^[4]Roger Staubach 2–2 Dallas Cowboys - VI, X, XII, XIII 50% ^[5]Peyton Manning* 2-2 Indianapolis Colts - XLI, XLIV; Denver Broncos - XLVIII, 50 50% ^[6]Jim Kelly 0–4 Buffalo Bills - XXV, XXVI, XXVII, XXVIII 0% ^[7] 3 Troy Aikman 3–0 Dallas Cowboys - XXVII, XXVIII, XXX 100% ^[8]Bob Griese 2–1 Miami Dolphins - VI, VII, VIII 67% ^[9]Ben Roethlisberger 2–1 Pittsburgh Steelers - XL, XLIII, XLV 67% ^[10]Kurt Warner 1–2 St. Louis Rams - XXXIV, XXXVI; Arizona Cardinals - XLIII 33% ^[11]Fran Tarkenton 0–3 Minnesota Vikings - VIII, IX, XI 0% ^[12]
How many of these will NOT make the HOF? Note: 8 of them have already been inducted....Two others are Brady and Manning...and then there is BR and Warner. Who else would not make it?

Worthy candidate to be sure... worthy inductee? Perhaps, but not a slam dunk.

Should he get in, then is Phil Simms next up? Similar career numbers albeit over more starts. Won 2 SBs and holds the record for completion percentage in a SB.

Phil Simms only won 1 Super Bowl. And only started in one. Jeff Hostetler played that game...and that entire offseason for Giants.

Unsympathetic

I'm happy with anyone other than Hines Ward. That guy should not be anywhere near the HoF.

Zombo

@the-gipper said:

Actually, he is not. Only players get in with the veterans choices. He must compete with others.

And what about Jimmy Johnson? Should any coach that wins 2 titles get in?

Tom Coughlin

George Seifert

Tom Flores

Mike Shanahan

All get in, no?

Johnson eventually.

Coughlin and Shanny probably.

Zombo

The Gipper

@unsympathetic said:
I'm happy with anyone other than Hines Ward. That guy should not be anywhere near the HoF.

He will have to wait a few years at least. They are making all WRs wait it seems. Even T.O. was not put in on his first chance.

T.O., Bruce, could both get in first.

When Moss becomes eligible and if he is not in, he may have to wait some more. So, it could be a while.

Then there is Calvin Johnson who has retired.

Tour2ma

Phil Simms only won 1 Super Bowl. And only started in one. Jeff Hostetler played that game...and that entire offseason for Giants.

Ah... two rings, but was sidelined by injury for one after leading NYG to 11-3 record and leading league in QB Rating.

Fact remains he won as many as Kurt and was a perfect 1-0.

The Gipper

@tour2ma said:

Ah... two rings, but was sidelined by injury for one after leading NYG to 11-3 record and leading league in QB Rating.

Fact remains he won as many as Kurt and was a perfect 1-0.

I, and all others will take Warner.

And even objectively.....Warner had a better career production average than Simms.....if you think that stat has any validity. I think it has some. (not perfect, but pretty good)

nickers

Mathews , Mecklenberg and Lynch get My vote...if it counted...

Tour2ma

@the-gipper said:

I, and all others will take Warner.

And even objectively.....Warner had a better career production average than Simms.....if you think that stat has any validity. I think it has some. (not perfect, but pretty good)

Point of order... never said Simms before Warner... said if Warner, then he makes case for Simms.

nickers

I really hope Clay Mathews gets in.. His longevity speaks for itself.. His conditioning. His ability to adapt in any defensive scheme was enormously huge. He always seemed to be around the ball. His positioning and technique was pretty exceptional.. If he lacked one asset.. I'd say he didn't have the speed of an LT or Ray Ray.. Or Butkus..