Browns to make pitch for Jimmy G // Trubisky #1 QB on their board
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The problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard.
He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown.
Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could".
I'd like to see JG for our 2nd this year and a 4th next year with the ability to make it a 2nd based on his performance. If we do that and grab Garrett or Allen and Hooker I'd call it a coup. I'd also like that trade along with Garrett or Allen and Mike Williams. Draft a center in the 3rd, trade back up into the 3rd and draft Mahomes too. Steal Trumaine Johnson, find a safety boom Super Bowl lolThe problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard.
He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown.
Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could".
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i wouldn't be mad if we get Jimmy G this year. It's better that than Kizer or god forbid Watson.
i wouldn't be mad if we get Jimmy G this year. It's better that than Kizer or god forbid Watson.
The kid is solid, smart, and has a quick release. We liked him and Derek Carr the year we drafted Manziel. I think Jimmy G has the ability to develop into a great QB.
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Dude is gonna be a stud. but you'd probably rather have a project, another black tarkenton, or bortles, right?
I'd take any of the QBs in this draft for four years over one year of JG.
Even trash bag Chad Kelly.
Even trash bag Chad Kelly.
I knew you'd come around...
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Dude is gonna be a stud. but you'd probably rather have a project, another black tarkenton, or bortles, right?
I'd take any of the QBs in this draft for four years over one year of JG.
Even trash bag Chad Kelly.
I'd take any of the QBs in this draft for four years over one year of JG.
Even trash bag Chad Kelly.
TCPO went from "Garroppollo is worth no later than a 2nd (maybe it was 3rd) to "I'd take any of the QBs in this draft over him." What gives?
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Thats not what I mean. What I am getting at is every fucking time one of Brady's back ups become available via trade of waivers, everyone loses their shit. A QB who learned under Brady!!! Wow he must be good. But stats point to the opposite. I mean the most successful Brady back up was Hoyer, and he was out of 6+ Qb's to be released or traded. Look at him, thats fine. But don't proclaim him a franchise QB just because of where he came from and what he did in the 2 games he played this season.
Every time? Enough people have seen what happened to Matt Cassell, Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallett in life after NE (like previous coaches from NE in particular) to know these aren't franchise QBs. Having said that, Hoyer got us off to a 7-4 start in 2014 which was a pleasant surprise to say the least. I know he had a horrible game in the playoffs for Houston last year.
Is there a more overused phrase than "franchise QB" while so many college offenses and coaches aren't preparing their QBs for the NFL ahead throughout their #1 priority of winning. For example, which of the unbeatable college teams in the National Championship are/did build up their QB's resume for the NFL ahead? Not much different than the rest of college football right now challenging those with the task of projecting great football ahead from QB prospects in today's crapshoot.
At this time, I'll settle for a freakin keeper out of the draft especially since the last time we were able to do so required the supplemental draft of 1985. Before that, we have to go all the way back to the 13th round of 1972 to remind ourselves how much vision and poise should be counted as much as arm strength in our QB evaluations. Vision, poise and accuracy were the assets behind the only League MVP caliber QB we've seen here in the last 50 years. In our quest to reach on the bionic arm of Brandon Weeden, we refused to allow ourselves the alternative to enjoy the vision, poise and accuracy of Russell Wilson. He's frequenting playoffs in spite of some very bad offensive lines. In order to spot vision, we have to hope our front office has finally has vision.
Every time? Enough people have seen what happened to Matt Cassell, Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallett in life after NE (like previous coaches from NE in particular) to know these aren't franchise QBs. Having said that, Hoyer got us off to a 7-4 start in 2014 which was a pleasant surprise to say the least. I know he had a horrible game in the playoffs for Houston last year.
Is there a more overused phrase than "franchise QB" while so many college offenses and coaches aren't preparing their QBs for the NFL ahead throughout their #1 priority of winning. For example, which of the unbeatable college teams in the National Championship are/did build up their QB's resume for the NFL ahead? Not much different than the rest of college football right now challenging those with the task of projecting great football ahead from QB prospects in today's crapshoot.
At this time, I'll settle for a freakin keeper out of the draft especially since the last time we were able to do so required the supplemental draft of 1985. Before that, we have to go all the way back to the 13th round of 1972 to remind ourselves how much vision and poise should be counted as much as arm strength in our QB evaluations. Vision, poise and accuracy were the assets behind the only League MVP caliber QB we've seen here in the last 50 years. In our quest to reach on the bionic arm of Brandon Weeden, we refused to allow ourselves the alternative to enjoy the vision, poise and accuracy of Russell Wilson. He's frequenting playoffs in spite of some very bad offensive lines. In order to spot vision, we have to hope our front office has finally has vision.
I would say everytime. I get that people liked Jimmy during the draft, hell I liked him too. But its always seems like the media's mission to help NE inflate any potential trade value their backup QBs have.
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How many of Brady's back ups have gone on to have careers as at least average starters? Every fucking one was touted as the next coming of Christ but they all never lived up to the bill.
Every fucking one was touted as the next coming of Christ but they all never lived up to the bill.
Really?.....touted as the next coming of Christ?.....Cassel Mallet Hoyer???....by who?
How does one live up to the bill of getting waived....or traded for a 7th?.....
Not much to live up to, eh?
Thats not what I mean. What I am getting at is every fucking time one of Brady's back ups become available via trade of waivers, everyone loses their shit. A QB who learned under Brady!!! ...... But don't proclaim him a franchise QB just because of where he came from and what he did in the 2 games he played this season.
Who is saying that JG is great "because he learned under Brady?".....dont see one single comment ...anywhere.... saying that...
Assuming?....or do you actually have an example....
I would say everytime. I get that people liked Jimmy during the draft, hell I liked him too. But its always seems like the media's mission to help NE inflate any potential trade value their backup QBs have.
So...the media inflated the trade value of these guys...???
Hoyer was so inflated, that he was waived...then sat for 3 months before getting picked up.....
Mallett was inflated off the charts, to the point that he was traded for a 7th round pick, then waived......
Cassel was inflated by the media??....or by New England?.....who franchised him.....then traded him, with an All Pro LB for a 2nd....
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I'd take any of the QBs in this draft for four years over one year of JG.
Even trash bag Chad Kelly.
TCPO went from "Garroppollo is worth no later than a 2nd (maybe it was 3rd) to "I'd take any of the QBs in this draft over him." What gives?
I meant I'd take any of the QBs in the draft over trading a first for JG.TCPO went from "Garroppollo is worth no later than a 2nd (maybe it was 3rd) to "I'd take any of the QBs in this draft over him." What gives?
You don't trade a first round pick for an expiring contract.
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Every fucking one was touted as the next coming of Christ but they all never lived up to the bill.
Really?.....touted as the next coming of Christ?.....Cassel Mallet Hoyer???....by who?
How does one live up to the bill of getting waived....or traded for a 7th?.....
Not much to live up to, eh?
Thats not what I mean. What I am getting at is every fucking time one of Brady's back ups become available via trade of waivers, everyone loses their shit. A QB who learned under Brady!!! ...... But don't proclaim him a franchise QB just because of where he came from and what he did in the 2 games he played this season.
Who is saying that JG is great "because he learned under Brady?".....dont see one single comment ...anywhere.... saying that...
Assuming?....or do you actually have an example....
I would say everytime. I get that people liked Jimmy during the draft, hell I liked him too. But its always seems like the media's mission to help NE inflate any potential trade value their backup QBs have.
So...the media inflated the trade value of these guys...???
Hoyer was so inflated, that he was waived...then sat for 3 months before getting picked up.....
Mallett was inflated off the charts, to the point that he was traded for a 7th round pick, then waived......
Cassel was inflated by the media??....or by New England?.....who franchised him.....then traded him, with an All Pro LB for a 2nd....
Really?.....touted as the next coming of Christ?.....Cassel Mallet Hoyer???....by who?
How does one live up to the bill of getting waived....or traded for a 7th?.....
Not much to live up to, eh?
Who is saying that JG is great "because he learned under Brady?".....dont see one single comment ...anywhere.... saying that...
Assuming?....or do you actually have an example....
So...the media inflated the trade value of these guys...???
Hoyer was so inflated, that he was waived...then sat for 3 months before getting picked up.....
Mallett was inflated off the charts, to the point that he was traded for a 7th round pick, then waived......
Cassel was inflated by the media??....or by New England?.....who franchised him.....then traded him, with an All Pro LB for a 2nd....
OK, Harry was being a little hyperbolic. What was the last we heard (current radio silence)? We want a first and a fourth? Compared to a seventh? Just Lombardi beating the drums for his pal Bill? About as inflated as it gets Mud. If the Patriots can get that for Jimmy- more power to 'em. I hope and pray it's not the Browns who are going to be that dumb.
Hey, I'm on board for Jimmy for a 7th.
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Really?.....touted as the next coming of Christ?.....Cassel Mallet Hoyer???....by who?
How does one live up to the bill of getting waived....or traded for a 7th?.....
Not much to live up to, eh?
Who is saying that JG is great "because he learned under Brady?".....dont see one single comment ...anywhere.... saying that...
Assuming?....or do you actually have an example....
So...the media inflated the trade value of these guys...???
Hoyer was so inflated, that he was waived...then sat for 3 months before getting picked up.....
Mallett was inflated off the charts, to the point that he was traded for a 7th round pick, then waived......
Cassel was inflated by the media??....or by New England?.....who franchised him.....then traded him, with an All Pro LB for a 2nd....
OK, Harry was being a little hyperbolic. What was the last we heard (current radio silence)? We want a first and a fourth? Compared to a seventh? Just Lombardi beating the drums for his pal Bill? About as inflated as it gets Mud. If the Patriots can get that for Jimmy- more power to 'em. I hope and pray it's not the Browns who are going to be that dumb.
Hey, I'm on board for Jimmy for a 7th.
What was the last we heard (current radio silence)?
Not his strongest track, but I like the original...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
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If we take Trubisky we give up the 1st pick in the draft for our QB, and we are out of the race for the top Def. players in the draft. We still have 12,33,65 to pick up Def. players to help this team.
Jimmy G. could be the right direction to go but people think a 1 and 4 is to much to spend on him. But remember this, there are what about 6 teams looking for there QB, Jimmy G. is not going to go cheep. I would try to set the deal in stone now before the draft, and teams start bidding on his services.
I would go hard after Jimmy, I would offer NE our 2nd. (65) this year, and our 2nd. next year. We still have 3 top picks for Def. and we walk out with our QB, the top Def. pick, and 12 and 33 to boot.
If Jimmy is a top 20 QB he is worth the 2 seconds, if Trubisky is a top 20 QB he is worth the 1st pick, If both bomb out I would rather loose 2 seconds than the first pick. Both are going to have risks but I do think that Jimmy is the lower risk.....
If we take Trubisky we give up the 1st pick in the draft for our QB, and we are out of the race for the top Def. players in the draft. We still have 12,33,65 to pick up Def. players to help this team.
Jimmy G. could be the right direction to go but people think a 1 and 4 is to much to spend on him. But remember this, there are what about 6 teams looking for there QB, Jimmy G. is not going to go cheep. I would try to set the deal in stone now before the draft, and teams start bidding on his services.
I would go hard after Jimmy, I would offer NE our 2nd. (65) this year, and our 2nd. next year. We still have 3 top picks for Def. and we walk out with our QB, the top Def. pick, and 12 and 33 to boot.
If Jimmy is a top 20 QB he is worth the 2 seconds, if Trubisky is a top 20 QB he is worth the 1st pick, If both bomb out I would rather loose 2 seconds than the first pick. Both are going to have risks but I do think that Jimmy is the lower risk.....
I have to add to my comments above, Everyone knows we have to hit on this draft to turn this team around, that means we first have to address the QB, no matter who we draft, without a stable QB it wont make a difference, So we have to address that one first, Question... is that QB on this team now? Most would say NO.... and at best a poor maybe..... We have a few options here, 1.) Take the best QB in the draft, costing us the #1 pick. 2.) Trading for a QB that might be better than we get in the draft. 3.) FA
1.) Draft - option
2.) Trade -option
3.) FA -- poor option - At best buys us a year. ( I dont think many on here wouldnt agree. )
So now we have only 2 Real options left, Draft or trade, This front office has to do one of the 2, Draft the best QB, or Trading for the best QB, I dont care which way the Browns go, as long as we get the best QB we can get.
I would go hard after Jimmy, I would offer NE our 2nd. (65) this year, and our 2nd. next year. We still have 3 top picks for Def. and we walk out with our QB, the top Def. pick, and 12 and 33 to boot.
If possible, We could now trade down to 3 or 4, picking up one of the two 2nd rd. picks We give NE. So the whole deal cost us one 2nd. and we still get Allen or Gerritt.
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Oh ok, now it makes sense why as a kid I always knew grown ups were full of shit.Welcome to the world of grownups.
I only quoted the pieces of what you said that I wished to respond to. Your post can stand on its own without me having to regurgitate the whole thing.
I mean your post was almost as bad as MSNBC.
Mitch2Pryor said:
Oh ok, now it makes sense why as a kid I always knew grown ups were full of shit.
I mean your post was almost as bad as MSNBC.
Not sure what you meant by that, but I will take as "your post is intelligent, cogent, substantive, and makes me look like an ass" which it does.
If you want your entire posts regurgitated, be a child and post the same thing 3 or 4 times.
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The problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard.
He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown.
Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could".
The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. With Haslam's trigger finger, that instant success is necessary. Any way you acquire a QB is a risk, and eventually you're going to have to pay him if he's franchise material.
I actually really like Mitch, hence my username. It's just the logic that an inexperienced rook would be worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown success (albeit short term) wouldn't even be worth #33.
If we want to be competitive next year, the smart thing to do would be sacrifice #33 and something next year for a QB, and capitalize on the deep defensive talent in this draft.
If we take Mitch, which I would be fine with, it's gonna be a few years before we are competitive, and is Haslam really going to wait that long?
Mitch2Pryor said:
The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. With Haslam's trigger finger, that instant success is necessary. Any way you acquire a QB is a risk, and eventually you're going to have to pay him if he's franchise material.
I actually really like Mitch, hence my username. It's just the logic that an inexperienced rook would be worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown success (albeit short term) wouldn't even be worth #33.
If we want to be competitive next year, the smart thing to do would be sacrifice #33 and something next year for a QB, and capitalize on the deep defensive talent in this draft.
If we take Mitch, which I would be fine with, it's gonna be a few years before we are competitive, and is Haslam really going to wait that long?
WE would be competitive faster with an outstanding QB than we would be with a defensive player. Simple fact of life.
Dallas Cowboys went from a .500 team to the best record in football because of the QB they got. Yes,they also got that top notch RB...and every team needs that. But they got to the top because of a QB, not because of defense.
A QB will take you further faster than any other position (or two) on the team.
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Oh, Jeezus. Watch the film.The problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard.
He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown.
Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could".
He is better than our QBs.
He is 25 and can paid an incentive based contact.
What is wrong with you homos?
Z
Zombo said:
Oh, Jeezus. Watch the film.
He is better than our QBs.
He is 25 and can paid an incentive based contact.
What is wrong with you homos?
Z
A. I don't want to give up anything more than a mid 2d round pick for him (see...I came to see things a bit more your way, previously I did'nt want to give up more than a 3)
B. He will be a FA....he won't want an incentive laden contract, he will want a guaranteed money deal....or his agent would be a fool.
C. I would NOT want to franchise him....not unless he really was the difference in this team making the playoffs. Franchising him means you pay him the average of the top 5 QBs in the league. I don't think we are ready to put him in the Rodgers/Brady/BR/ type category
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If we take Trubisky we give up the 1st pick in the draft for our QB, and we are out of the race for the top Def. players in the draft. We still have 12,33,65 to pick up Def. players to help this team.
Jimmy G. could be the right direction to go but people think a 1 and 4 is to much to spend on him. But remember this, there are what about 6 teams looking for there QB, Jimmy G. is not going to go cheep. I would try to set the deal in stone now before the draft, and teams start bidding on his services.
I would go hard after Jimmy, I would offer NE our 2nd. (65) this year, and our 2nd. next year. We still have 3 top picks for Def. and we walk out with our QB, the top Def. pick, and 12 and 33 to boot.
If Jimmy is a top 20 QB he is worth the 2 seconds, if Trubisky is a top 20 QB he is worth the 1st pick, If both bomb out I would rather loose 2 seconds than the first pick. Both are going to have risks but I do think that Jimmy is the lower risk.....
If we take Trubisky we give up the 1st pick in the draft for our QB, and we are out of the race for the top Def. players in the draft. We still have 12,33,65 to pick up Def. players to help this team.
Jimmy G. could be the right direction to go but people think a 1 and 4 is to much to spend on him. But remember this, there are what about 6 teams looking for there QB, Jimmy G. is not going to go cheep. I would try to set the deal in stone now before the draft, and teams start bidding on his services.
I would go hard after Jimmy, I would offer NE our 2nd. (65) this year, and our 2nd. next year. We still have 3 top picks for Def. and we walk out with our QB, the top Def. pick, and 12 and 33 to boot.
If Jimmy is a top 20 QB he is worth the 2 seconds, if Trubisky is a top 20 QB he is worth the 1st pick, If both bomb out I would rather loose 2 seconds than the first pick. Both are going to have risks but I do think that Jimmy is the lower risk.....
For a 1 and a 4, one of those other teams can have him. And if he is just a Top 20 QB, he is worth a 4th rounder.
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Mitch2Pryor said:
The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. With Haslam's trigger finger, that instant success is necessary. Any way you acquire a QB is a risk, and eventually you're going to have to pay him if he's franchise material.
I actually really like Mitch, hence my username. It's just the logic that an inexperienced rook would be worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown success (albeit short term) wouldn't even be worth #33.
If we want to be competitive next year, the smart thing to do would be sacrifice #33 and something next year for a QB, and capitalize on the deep defensive talent in this draft.
If we take Mitch, which I would be fine with, it's gonna be a few years before we are competitive, and is Haslam really going to wait that long?
Ha, what's to say even with Jimmy we'd be "competitive"? BTW, it's been argued elsewhere what if McDaniels gets the SF HC job? No one should know Garropolo better. If he doesn't make a play for him, no one else should either.
Ha, what's to say even with Jimmy we'd be "competitive"? BTW, it's been argued elsewhere what if McDaniels gets the SF HC job? No one should know Garropolo better. If he doesn't make a play for him, no one else should either.
There you go. The 49ers, because of what you say, very well may be a better trade partner than the Browns. They may give up more, and Josh would have working knowledge of Marcopolo mor than anyone else.
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Mitch2Pryor said:
The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. With Haslam's trigger finger, that instant success is necessary. Any way you acquire a QB is a risk, and eventually you're going to have to pay him if he's franchise material.
I actually really like Mitch, hence my username. It's just the logic that an inexperienced rook would be worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown success (albeit short term) wouldn't even be worth #33.
If we want to be competitive next year, the smart thing to do would be sacrifice #33 and something next year for a QB, and capitalize on the deep defensive talent in this draft.
If we take Mitch, which I would be fine with, it's gonna be a few years before we are competitive, and is Haslam really going to wait that long?
WE would be competitive faster with an outstanding QB than we would be with a defensive player. Simple fact of life.
Dallas Cowboys went from a .500 team to the best record in football because of the QB they got. Yes,they also got that top notch RB...and every team needs that. But they got to the top because of a QB, not because of defense.
A QB will take you further faster than any other position (or two) on the team.
Dallas Cowboys went from a .500 team to the best record in football because of the QB they got. Yes,they also got that top notch RB...and every team needs that. But they got to the top because of a QB, not because of defense.
This is the most incorrect thing that I've ever heard you say.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
the Cowboys were missing a few pieces, they added two pieces, the rb was
a lock, the qb a wonderful accident for them.
"yawn"
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Dallas Cowboys went from a .500 team to the best record in football because of the QB they got. Yes,they also got that top notch RB...and every team needs that. But they got to the top because of a QB, not because of defense.
This is the most incorrect thing that I've ever heard you say.
This is the most incorrect thing that I've ever heard you say.
You are right. Cowboys went from 4-12 to 13-3 primarily due to the play of their new QB and RB. And as good as the RB is, I attribute more to the QB.
What else of significance changed on that team?
Their defensive personell wasn't that big of a change. Their OL either (it was always good)
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Dallas Cowboys went from a .500 team to the best record in football because of the QB they got. Yes,they also got that top notch RB...and every team needs that. But they got to the top because of a QB, not because of defense.
This is the most incorrect thing that I've ever heard you say.
This is the most incorrect thing that I've ever heard you say.
not even close....
the Cowboys were missing lost a few pieces, they added two pieces, the rb was
a lock, the qb a wonderful accident for them.
"yawn"
fify....the actually lost pcs, then got them back.....
You are right. Cowboys went from 4-12 to 13-3 primarily due to the play of their new QB and RB. And as good as the RB is, I attribute more to the QB.
What else of significance changed on that team?
They were not really a 4-14 team that suddenly went to 13-3.....but actually a 12-4, that lost their QB and star RB, Demarco Murray)....so, they got worse when they lost their 2 stars and dropped to 4 wins for a single year.....and then immediately returned to being a 12 win team upon replacing those 2.....
And, the QB stats have been steady for 3 years....almost to the yard.........BUT, the RB stats fell WAY OFF for 2015 and rebounded when a new RB was added...
So....to answer your question from above...What else of significance changed on that team?......The only significant changes were a huge drop in rushing when Murray left.....and a huge increase when Elliot was added......
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