Jimmy Garoppolo Speculation
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I'm not saying he will. Assuming the Patriots shop him- it will be interesting what they can get. You should know by now, I'm not in the trade for Jimmy camp- especially with our #12.
And if he's as valuable as you think he is- you won't be able to keep him in 2018 for peanuts.
So, if he ended up being our franchise QB, he isn't worth #12?
Also, if we did trade up #12, we might get something in addition to JG with it.
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@boo-fagley said:
Like Matt Cassel in the 2009 offseason? Cassel was 230th player taken in the 7th round.
NE franchised him and did not pay him the franchise tag amount. He was traded. Its the same scenario for Garropolo who was the 62th player taken in the 2nd round. The franchise tag binds the unrestricted free agent player to a 1 year contract to where he cannot just walk without the teams say so.
OK, so franchise him - now a team is on the hook for $25m for an unproven essentially rookie QB. The value of your tradable asset has diminished considerably.
Cassel also had a full, eleven-win season of football under his belt.
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@boo-fagley said:
Cassel did not have Garropolos arm.
Chicago is going to get him anyway. Garropolo is from Illinois and played at East Illinois.
So he won't be traded then? Because the only way his home town and college are relevant are if he hits free agency.
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@boo-fagley said:
We have the 2017 offseason, 2017 regular season and the 2018 off season to find out what happens.
QBs are always being IRed early in the season due to freak injuries. Your a 2017 team thats ready to make a run at a championship and you lose your QB. In most cases the backup QB is the backup for a reason. Do you give the Pats a 2018 first and salvage the season?
In 2017? Probably not, given that there's a chance Romo will still be with the Cowboys and available. Regardless, that has nothing to do with what you were saying - we're talking about making it through the 2017 season and into the 2018 offseason with no takers on JG.
Here's what NE is looking at:
- moving him now, when the market is filled with QB needy teams and you can start a bidding war
- holding on to him until after FA opens up, when QB's like Taylor and Cutler have signed (and eliminated two teams from your bidding war)
- holding on to him until after the draft, when teams like Chicago, Cleveland, SF, NY and probably Denver all address their QB needs. This is when, as you suggested, a championship team MIGHT have an injury and pay a premium for a guy, though its unlikely that a championship contending team would pay a first rounder for a question mark
- holding on to him throughout 2017 and then tagging him in 2018 in order to move him to a QB-needy team NOT named Cleveland, SF, Chicago, NY, Denver or Buffalo (they'll have addressed their QB positions this year)
Which one of those sounds like the most logical choice?
I understand your defense of NE, but it's odds on they aren't going to franchise tag JG and risk having to pay two QB's top money. It just isn't going to happen.
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@boo-fagley said:
Yes, thats correct.
control his rights
- A "non-exclusive" franchise player must be offered a one-year contract for an amount no less than the average of the top five cap hits at the player's position for the previous five years applied to the current salary cap, or 120 percent of the player's previous year's salary, whichever is greater. A non-exclusive franchise player may negotiate with other NFL teams, but if the player signs an offer sheet from another team, the original team has a right to match the terms of that offer, or if it does not match the offer and thus loses the player, is entitled to receive two first-round draft picks as compensation.
I know you're just throwing that out there for another "what if", but you're smoking some real good stuff if you think any NFL team is going to give you two first round picks for Jimmy.
@boo-fagley said:
Cassel did not have Garropolos arm.
Chicago is going to get him anyway. Garropolo is from Illinois and played at East Illinois.
I can only hope. MHO- their #36 is plenty enough for your wunderkid.
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@boo-fagley said:
Like Matt Cassel in the 2009 offseason? Cassel was 230th player taken in the 7th round.
NE franchised him and did not pay him the franchise tag amount. He was traded. Its the same scenario for Garropolo who was the 62th player taken in the 2nd round. The franchise tag binds the unrestricted free agent player to a 1 year contract to where he cannot just walk without the teams say so.
If he was given the franchise tag, then traded, then the team that traded for him had to have given him the franchise tag money, unless they negotiated a different deal.
Overall, I would say that the team that traded for him...if they gave him the franchise tag money....then that team was full of fucking dumbasses.
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We'll if he's traded he doesn't get much off say, so him being from IL has little to do with anything.@boo-fagley said:
Yes he will be traded because if Garrapolo hits free agency any team that wants now has to compete with with everyone that wants Garrpolo in for visit.
Would rather deal exclusively with 1 team the Patriots or take your chances competing against other franchises?
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@boo-fagley said:
Yes, McGoo dumb ass.
First Garrapolo has to sign the Tag. If and when he is traded a guaranteed 25 million signing bonus over 5 years is nothing. Plus, Garrapolo would recieve salary and incentives. Arsewieller was paid 21 million his first season in Houston and you are belly aching over 25 million.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2016/3/9/11143754/brock-osweiler-signing-free-agent-texans-broncos
I mean, do you get a cut of his salary? Are you and he butt buddies? Why this insistence that JG is going to be franchised and be given that money?
Nobody...I mean NOBODY, on here or on Planet Earth believes that would happen or that he is worth that.
And...the fact is: Osweiler may be a perfect example of why that is not going to happen. No one will pay that kind of money to an untested, unprove commodity like Osweiler/Garropolo again.
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@boo-fagley said:
Yes, McGoo dumb ass.
First Garrapolo has to sign the Tag. If and when he is traded a guaranteed 25 million signing bonus over 5 years is nothing. Plus, Garrapolo would recieve salary and incentives. Arsewieller was paid 21 million his first season in Houston and you are belly aching over 25 million.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2016/3/9/11143754/brock-osweiler-signing-free-agent-texans-broncos
That 25 million is NOT a signing bonus spread over 5 years. That would be his one year salary for the year he is playing under the franchise tag.
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@boo-fagley said:
McGoo
Garrapolo will be traded and he will receive no less than 25 million his first season. 25 million in signing bonus money with the new club.
Yea, sure. Keep thinking that.
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@boo-fagley said:
Still stuck on counting pennies.
How do you know what will happen?
You are welcome to throw me 25 million worth of pennies.
How do I know it? Because the people that run NFL teams are not as delusional as you.
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@boo-fagley said:
A signing bonus is a lump sum of money to be paid to a player when he signs a contract. This bonus is often a key aspect of contract negotiations, because it is the only truly guaranteed money in any contract.
We all know what a signing bonus is. It could be one dollar or many millions.
You just go ahead and keep dreaming and call us all when JG gets that 25 million dollar signing bonus.
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No one is budging...
Won't be long until we see how it plays out...
Carry on...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
$25m in signing bonus is a tall order for a QB with almost no NFL playing time. It's doubtful he'll receive that much as a signing bonus.
More than likely it will be a something like a three year $65 mil base extension with around $40 guaranteed, with plenty of escalators and a player option fourth. That puts him at a high annual number and is short enough that he can still get a giant Flacco-esque contract extension before he turns 29 should he become some sort of world beater.
EDIT: my math was wrong
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He'll get an Osweiler - Tyrod deal where he has to prove himself in two years and then he is either cut or extended.
Zombo
@boo-fagley said:
Still stuck on counting pennies.
How do you know what will happen?
Right back at ya- how in the hell do YOU know? Garrapolo has a smaller body of work than Osweilier, yet teams are going to pony up a dream trade & contract to the Patriots for Jimmy? Don't think so. Plenty of teams (not just the Browns) WILL count pennies weighing what Garropolo will cost against a rookie contract.
@boo-fagley said:
McGoo
Garrapolo will be traded and he will receive no less than 25 million his first season. 25 million in signing bonus money with the new club.
Homer, homer, homer. And Josh Gordon will be reinstated and lead the Browns and the league in yards and touchdowns.
Zombo said:
He'll get an Osweiler - Tyrod deal where he has to prove himself in two years and then he is either cut or extended.
Zombo
Point being Z- this year the Texans are squarely behind the 8 ball- they're stuck with suck in Osweiler.
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A fans comment on Garrett's video and Garrapolo: "It's ALL part of the Hoodie's master plan.....he's already sucked them in...Garrett gives them the brushoff, and then Garropolo becomes simply irresistable...he's feeding off their weakness...like a shark...."
:lol:Cleveland is going to find a way to really fuck this up. It's what they do best. Please God, just once, grant them a brain cell in the FO.
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@boo-fagley said:
Youre interpreting the word 'entitled" wrong.
The Patriots do not necessarily have to accept 2 - 1st round picks. They can lower compensation to what they see fit as value.
How do you know what any NFL team will do?
The franchise tag allows teams to protect their investment -- which is a significant value. Even if a team does not particularly want to keep a player, or feels a long-term deal is hopeless, it can tag the player and put him on the trading block, knowing the value of the player is greater than the compensatory third-round pick the team could receive for losing a high-caliber player to free agency.
What do you think washington would get if they tag cousins this year again, after he led them to two winning seasons the last two years (after winning 7 games total the previous two) with not a great deal of help from his defense? They might get a first round pick for him. Maybe. Jimmy G? Has shown nowhere close to even Cousins' level of play, consistently, because he's only played like 4 games in 4 years.
This whole concept of Jimmy being a sure fire thing worth even one first round pick doesn't seem to have much basis in reality to be honest.
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@boo-fagley said:
A 1st round pick for Bradford? How did that work out?
Pretty well actually... over 70% completion rate... 4:1 TD/INT ratio.
Zimmer is more than happy enough to hand the keys to Sam again in 2017.
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