Camp Trade Down
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"Umbrageous" wft? lol. A word I don't know. dammit, Gipper - I'll have to look it up later.
Essentially means: inclined to take offense easily.
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"Umbrageous" wft? lol. A word I don't know. dammit, Gipper - I'll have to look it up later.
Essentially means: inclined to take offense easily.
"Umbrageous" wft? lol. A word I don't know. dammit, Gipper - I'll have to look it up later.
Essentially means: inclined to take offense easily.
As in still tied to the umbrageous cord?
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"Umbrageous" wft? lol. A word I don't know. dammit, Gipper - I'll have to look it up later.
Essentially means: inclined to take offense easily.
As in still tied to the umbrageous cord?
As in still tied to the umbrageous cord?
Someone apparently is.
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so after that combine how much do you think Myles Garrett is worth? think we could get 3 first rounders? 2 firsts and 2 seconds?
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so after that combine how much do you think Myles Garrett is worth? think we could get 3 first rounders? 2 firsts and 2 seconds?
so after that combine how much do you think Myles Garrett is worth? think we could get 3 first rounders? 2 firsts and 2 seconds?
How much? A lot. Based on measurables- the scouts had it right. He is a once in a generation player. I'd be a little more concerned if he hadn't backed that up with plenty of spectacular on field tape. There have been plenty of workout warriors like Vernon Gholston who promptly busted in the NFL.
As to what we'd want- it would totally depend on how far down we'd have to move. But I just can't see the Browns trading out of #1 this year. We've passed on too many studs in previous years. Garrrett is the closest to a sure thing you're ever going to see on defense. It's either him or Mitch.
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Pluto weighs in on Garrett after the combine.
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2017/03/cleveland_browns_combine_scrib.html
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The trade down issue boils down to this: Even if you think you can get a top notch player at #1 overall......is it worth it to pass over that one player for the chance to get 2-3 really good players. On a team that has as many holes as Swiss Cheese as the Browns, it may be tempting to do the trade down.
E.g. Is, say, having the Tits #5 and #18 a better choice for the team than having #1. In theory you could have two superior players in lieu of one fantastic player.
Does that help the team better?
(Clearly not if you draft Trent Richardson and Brandon Weeden in round one....but if you get Clay Matthews and Ozzie Newsome?)
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Tennessee is the only team I would consider trading 1 to as I would want the 2 x 1s at least
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Fuck right off with that bullshit
What if we traded with San Diego and they gave us Bosa and their Number 7?
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I could live with a trade down, but not past all of these 3, Garrett Allen or Thomas. We need that pass rusher and those are the top 3 IMO. So no drop beyond the #4 pick if you are sure someone you are trading with is taking a QB @ #1.
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I'd say anybody looking to take one of the quarterbacks at number one is desperate.
And we should be able to take them to the cleaners.
WSS
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I'd say anybody looking to take one of the quarterbacks at number one is desperate.
And we should be able to take them to the cleaners.
WSS
I'd say anybody looking to take one of the quarterbacks at number one is desperate.
And we should be able to take them to the cleaners.
WSS
That would be the Cleveland Browns.
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Trade down with Jacksonville to #4 for a 2nd and 3rd take Mitch, use #12 on OJ Howard . This draft class is loaded with defense you could load up with all the extra picks.
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Trade down with Jacksonville to #4 for a 2nd and 3rd take Mitch, use #12 on OJ Howard . This draft class is loaded with defense you could load up with all the extra picks.
Trade down with Jacksonville to #4 for a 2nd and 3rd take Mitch, use #12 on OJ Howard . This draft class is loaded with defense you could load up with all the extra picks.
Sorry but if you take 2 O players as your first two, you will not get premier D players from 33 on. Good? Sure. Great? No.
Besides if you trade down to #4 there is no guarantee Mitch does not go to either SF or Chi. Why would you trade down that far with that kind of risk? Makes no sense.
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Trade down with Jacksonville to #4 for a 2nd and 3rd take Mitch, use #12 on OJ Howard . This draft class is loaded with defense you could load up with all the extra picks.
Trade down with Jacksonville to #4 for a 2nd and 3rd take Mitch, use #12 on OJ Howard . This draft class is loaded with defense you could load up with all the extra picks.
Well Jax may be in the market for a DE/OLB So? What is the status of Dante Fowler? Is he like so badly injured as to be unsalvageable?
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I don't think there are many teams willing to give up the typical ransom required to move into the number one spot. I don't recall it happening too often for a defensive player. If for some reason several teams start to think there is a sure-fire pro-bowl qb, then things might start getting interesting.Yes, a few teams think pretty highly of a few of the different qbs, but it doesn't seem there is a consensus cant miss qb to generate the trade-buzz required for the expensive trades.
A few years ago the Dolphins moved from 12 to 3 and just swapped 1st and gave up their second. I think if Garret is still the number one player come draft day (and I think he will be) then I think the trade price will be something similar (a little stronger as it is the #1). I just don't see teams willing to bet the farm in order to select a defensive player, especially in a defensive loaded draft.
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I don't think there are many teams willing to give up the typical ransom required to move into the number one spot. I don't recall it happening too often for a defensive player. If for some reason several teams start to think there is a sure-fire pro-bowl qb, then things might start getting interesting.Yes, a few teams think pretty highly of a few of the different qbs, but it doesn't seem there is a consensus cant miss qb to generate the trade-buzz required for the expensive trades.
A few years ago the Dolphins moved from 12 to 3 and just swapped 1st and gave up their second. I think if Garret is still the number one player come draft day (and I think he will be) then I think the trade price will be something similar (a little stronger as it is the #1). I just don't see teams willing to bet the farm in order to select a defensive player, especially in a defensive loaded draft.
I don't think there are many teams willing to give up the typical ransom required to move into the number one spot. I don't recall it happening too often for a defensive player. If for some reason several teams start to think there is a sure-fire pro-bowl qb, then things might start getting interesting.Yes, a few teams think pretty highly of a few of the different qbs, but it doesn't seem there is a consensus cant miss qb to generate the trade-buzz required for the expensive trades.
A few years ago the Dolphins moved from 12 to 3 and just swapped 1st and gave up their second. I think if Garret is still the number one player come draft day (and I think he will be) then I think the trade price will be something similar (a little stronger as it is the #1). I just don't see teams willing to bet the farm in order to select a defensive player, especially in a defensive loaded draft.
So? What is your answer then? Just use #1 on a guy...or trade it?
While a lot of people here are convinced about what the Browns are going to do...they have to remember this group's short history: analytics says multiply your assets. A Trade down is not out of the question.....IF someone comes along and is desperate for that #1 pick the Browns have already announced that they are open to the possibility.
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I don't think there are many teams willing to give up the typical ransom required to move into the number one spot. I don't recall it happening too often for a defensive player. If for some reason several teams start to think there is a sure-fire pro-bowl qb, then things might start getting interesting.Yes, a few teams think pretty highly of a few of the different qbs, but it doesn't seem there is a consensus cant miss qb to generate the trade-buzz required for the expensive trades.
A few years ago the Dolphins moved from 12 to 3 and just swapped 1st and gave up their second. I think if Garret is still the number one player come draft day (and I think he will be) then I think the trade price will be something similar (a little stronger as it is the #1). I just don't see teams willing to bet the farm in order to select a defensive player, especially in a defensive loaded draft.
I don't think there are many teams willing to give up the typical ransom required to move into the number one spot. I don't recall it happening too often for a defensive player. If for some reason several teams start to think there is a sure-fire pro-bowl qb, then things might start getting interesting.Yes, a few teams think pretty highly of a few of the different qbs, but it doesn't seem there is a consensus cant miss qb to generate the trade-buzz required for the expensive trades.
A few years ago the Dolphins moved from 12 to 3 and just swapped 1st and gave up their second. I think if Garret is still the number one player come draft day (and I think he will be) then I think the trade price will be something similar (a little stronger as it is the #1). I just don't see teams willing to bet the farm in order to select a defensive player, especially in a defensive loaded draft.
Agree... #1's for "the" QB seen as the future of a franchise carry a premium trade value beyond that of any other position... and if that view is held by more than one franchise, then it's the stuff that WSH deals for RG3 are made of.
But in the era of the "common draft" there have been blockbusters for non-QBs and even "non-skill" positions. Both Orlando Pace (Rams gave up 4 picks in 1997) and Russell Maryland ('91 Cowboys gave up players and a couple picks) come to mind.
RBs, the position with the second highest number of players taken #1 overall, doesn't seem to have produced such trades. However, the Ditka-NO deal for a 5th to land Ricky Williams jumps out. Granted, the RB history was amassed in a different era, one that emphasized the run game far more than it is today, but that only shows that times change. And one of the things that has changed is the emphasis on rushing the QB.
Interestingly the third most overall #1's have been spent on DL. And a scan of the draft shows most are DEs. But the last two "premier" edge rushers, Super Mario and Clowney, did not attract enough an offer to pry either of them away from the Texans. Coincidentally neither proved to be very good QB classes.
Who knows? It'll be interesting though...
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I don't think there are many teams willing to give up the typical ransom required to move into the number one spot. I don't recall it happening too often for a defensive player. If for some reason several teams start to think there is a sure-fire pro-bowl qb, then things might start getting interesting.Yes, a few teams think pretty highly of a few of the different qbs, but it doesn't seem there is a consensus cant miss qb to generate the trade-buzz required for the expensive trades.
A few years ago the Dolphins moved from 12 to 3 and just swapped 1st and gave up their second. I think if Garret is still the number one player come draft day (and I think he will be) then I think the trade price will be something similar (a little stronger as it is the #1). I just don't see teams willing to bet the farm in order to select a defensive player, especially in a defensive loaded draft.
So? What is your answer then? Just use #1 on a guy...or trade it?
While a lot of people here are convinced about what the Browns are going to do...they have to remember this group's short history: analytics says multiply your assets. A Trade down is not out of the question.....IF someone comes along and is desperate for that #1 pick the Browns have already announced that they are open to the possibility.
So? What is your answer then? Just use #1 on a guy...or trade it?
While a lot of people here are convinced about what the Browns are going to do...they have to remember this group's short history: analytics says multiply your assets. A Trade down is not out of the question.....IF someone comes along and is desperate for that #1 pick the Browns have already announced that they are open to the possibility.
I think they take Garrett at 1. While yes there are a lot great players that can be had a few spots lower, I just don't think you are going to get the return to make it worth it as other teams are going to see that as well. Garrett might not end up being the best defensive player out of this draft, but a big majority of scouts seem to agree that he has the highest percentage of being a top-tier defensive player. With each spot you move down, your are a.) subtracting a couple of percentage points from that probability or b.) taking a player that doesn't have as high of a ceiling while maybe having about the same hit probability. I just don't think you are going to get any kind of significant value to make it worth dropping down that percentage.
The wild card is if a team falls in love with a qb and they don't think he will make it past the 49ers (or if the 49ers want to secure him as they are afraid of other teams). As of right now, I just don't see that happening. There are 3 qbs being talked about as the top qb, and I am not even sure that there are many teams that would take their top choice of qb over several of the top defensive studs. It only takes one team to absolutely fall in love with a guy, but as of now I just don't see that happening.
Look at the loaded 2011 draft class and the teams that got screwed. There were so many hits in the top 17, that as long as you didn't take a qb you got a stud. This looks like it is setting up to be pretty similar (many thought Dareus or Peterson were the top defensive players, but the Broncos actually didn't get any trade request/probes so even at number 2 they didn't have any real trade value so they took a guy many had a few spots lower). I won't be shocked if 3 qbs are taken in the top 10, but I also wouldn't be surprised if the Browns have a shot to trade up from the 33rd pick to about the 25th to take Mitch. I get there are teams in the top 10 that need qb's, and I wouldn't be surprised if Watson and Mitch are gone early, it is just there are so many studs in the top 20 that teams might take the security of a legit defensive player over the crapshoot qb class.
I get you need a qb, just don't force it. You are not a qb away from being a contender, but with the slew of picks you have in this loaded draft plus next year you could be there very quickly. You have the chance to really stabilize your team, take it.
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So? What is your answer then? Just use #1 on a guy...or trade it?
While a lot of people here are convinced about what the Browns are going to do...they have to remember this group's short history: analytics says multiply your assets. A Trade down is not out of the question.....IF someone comes along and is desperate for that #1 pick the Browns have already announced that they are open to the possibility.
I think they take Garrett at 1. While yes there are a lot great players that can be had a few spots lower, I just don't think you are going to get the return to make it worth it as other teams are going to see that as well. Garrett might not end up being the best defensive player out of this draft, but a big majority of scouts seem to agree that he has the highest percentage of being a top-tier defensive player. With each spot you move down, your are a.) subtracting a couple of percentage points from that probability or b.) taking a player that doesn't have as high of a ceiling while maybe having about the same hit probability. I just don't think you are going to get any kind of significant value to make it worth dropping down that percentage.
The wild card is if a team falls in love with a qb and they don't think he will make it past the 49ers (or if the 49ers want to secure him as they are afraid of other teams). As of right now, I just don't see that happening. There are 3 qbs being talked about as the top qb, and I am not even sure that there are many teams that would take their top choice of qb over several of the top defensive studs. It only takes one team to absolutely fall in love with a guy, but as of now I just don't see that happening.
Look at the loaded 2011 draft class and the teams that got screwed. There were so many hits in the top 17, that as long as you didn't take a qb you got a stud. This looks like it is setting up to be pretty similar (many thought Dareus or Peterson were the top defensive players, but the Broncos actually didn't get any trade request/probes so even at number 2 they didn't have any real trade value so they took a guy many had a few spots lower). I won't be shocked if 3 qbs are taken in the top 10, but I also wouldn't be surprised if the Browns have a shot to trade up from the 33rd pick to about the 25th to take Mitch. I get there are teams in the top 10 that need qb's, and I wouldn't be surprised if Watson and Mitch are gone early, it is just there are so many studs in the top 20 that teams might take the security of a legit defensive player over the crapshoot qb class.
I get you need a qb, just don't force it. You are not a qb away from being a contender, but with the slew of picks you have in this loaded draft plus next year you could be there very quickly. You have the chance to really stabilize your team, take it.
I get you need a qb, just don't force it. You are not a qb away from being a contender, but with the slew of picks you have in this loaded draft plus next year you could be there very quickly. You have the chance to really stabilize your team, take it.
Very wise...
What's your take on your Broncos' QB situation?
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