Schefter: Browns still split between taking Garrett and Trubisky with #1 pick
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Weeden didn't make progressions or read defenses, he simply played catch with the best receiver in the country. If my memory serves me, the big 12 didn't have a single top 80 defense that year while the big ten had 7 in the top 40, which was part of my reasoning for taking either Wilson or Cousins late as opposed to reaching for Weeden or Tannehill. 2012 was they year to draft 1 overall.
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I know enough Gip.
I know that many experts feel that this draft class is heavy on defense, but lacking in QBs.
I know that if we take another QB and he fails, like Weeden, Manziel, and Quinn, it is going to be another regime change... again.
A. Those experts are NOT the ones doing the drafting for the Cleveland Browns. the Browns experts think they are more expert than any other experts.
B. You still have to take a Risk......be it at QB or at DE. The one guy is JUST as big a risk at the other guy. If you don't want to take a risk, take a seat on the couch.
The problem with Cleveland is, they don't give their QBs a legitimate shot.
Maybe to a point...but, the fact is, all these past Browns QBs didn't exactly go anywhere and light it up when they did get shots, now did they?
Kessler can be a solid QB. Why draft a guy #1 who is only 1 inch taller, and has less college experience?
Because he has a ton more talent. Much better arm, legs, quicker release, etc. etc.
Brandon Weeden had a lot more height and experience than either of him...that didn't help him, now did it?
It would be stupid to take Mitch @ 1. 31st ranked defense, 26 qb sacks. That is putrid.
But nooooo.. let's reach for Mitch @ 1. He is going to magically fix everything!
They will win MORE with a franchise QB than they will with a DE. You think that a DE will magically fix things? that is ignorance.
Cleveland needs to take off the blinders and draft the best player @ 1.
And that best player may in fact be the QB. You just never think about that, do you.
Garrett will at least strike some fear into the opposing defenses..
Not as a rookie, I doubt it. And who knows if he ever does.
How can you even argue that Garrett couldn't beat out Carl Nassib? Garrett is head-and-shoulders above Nassib..
Him and Ogbah would be a nasty duo along the front 7.
Again, you are making asshole assumptions about a player that you really have no clue about how he will perform. That is as big an asshole assumption as an assumption I would make that MT will be the next Tom Brady.
We don't know about either. Garrett could be Barky Mingo 2.0 as easily as MT could be a washup.
No one is a lock. Whether they are drafted #1 or #101. They all need to earn their stripes.
Bark Mingo was a bust from the get go. He didn't really have the size to handle quality olineman in the NFL. Garrett at least has the intangibles..
But you are right.. He could not pan out.. He could very easily be the next Courtney Brown.
Im just not sure I see the potential for bust as high in MG, as I do in MT.
Hell with all of the picks we have we could trade up and nab MT, if Cleveland feels so strongly about him, but doesn't want to pass up a potentially great DE..
Jets and Niners are teams that could be interested in trading with us on draft day..
No one is a lock. Whether they are drafted #1 or #101. They all need to earn their stripes.
Bark Mingo was a bust from the get go. He didn't really have the size to handle quality olineman in the NFL. Garrett at least has the intangibles..
But you are right.. He could not pan out.. He could very easily be the next Courtney Brown.
Im just not sure I see the potential for bust as high in MG, as I do in MT.
Hell with all of the picks we have we could trade up and nab MT, if Cleveland feels so strongly about him, but doesn't want to pass up a potentially great DE..
Jets and Niners are teams that could be interested in trading with us on draft day..
I am on board with that. Get both of them. Trade up. Though, I don't know about the Jets and 49ers. Jets, it has been reported, are in line to want a QB, and MT is top of their list. That is why in another thread I talked about moving up from 12 to 5 with the Tits. Though...I have seen some reports that both the Niners and Bears may still be in the QB market, even with recent signings.
Moving from 12 to 2 with SF? A. That presumes that SF doesn't want a QB there, and B....WTF would it take to do that? A lot I suspect.
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How much, Gip, do you think it would take to trade up from #12 to lets say. 2 or 6?
A 1st next year? Two 2nd rounders this year? Two second rounders next year?
I would be happy with Garrett @ 1, and trading with SF to take MT, IF they are 100% sure he is "the guy"
SF receives our #12, #52 and our 1st next year
We receive the #2 pick.
How much, Gip, do you think it would take to trade up from #12 to lets say. 2 or 6?
A 1st next year? Two 2nd rounders this year? Two second rounders next year?
I would be happy with Garrett @ 1, and trading with SF to take MT, IF they are 100% sure he is "the guy"
SF receives our #12, #52 and our 1st next year
We receive the #2 pick.
I outlined this on another thread. To move up to #5, under the Jimmy Johnson chart, we would have to give up #52 plus a lower pick. Under the Harvard chart, a #4-5 should do it.
Of course, that is assuming the trade partner wants to stick strictly with those charts, which they likely sure as hell would not want to do. They would want a premium.
To go from #12 to #2?
I don't know per the charts..but what you say could certainly be the Niners asking price.
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It's going to be a very interesting draft night. Snooze and you lose.
And just to add more smoke and mirrors.https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-mock-draft-5-0-jets-trade-up-to-take-a-qb/
It's going to be a very interesting draft night. Snooze and you lose.
And just to add more smoke and mirrors.https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-mock-draft-5-0-jets-trade-up-to-take-a-qb/
Jets trade from #6 to #2 to get MT? Wouldn't discount the possibility.
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It's going to be a very interesting draft night. Snooze and you lose.
And just to add more smoke and mirrors.https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-mock-draft-5-0-jets-trade-up-to-take-a-qb/
I would be angry if Im a Jets fan and they do this, they need to trade down not up!
I would be angry if Im a Jets fan and they do this, they need to trade down not up!
Why?
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Weedeen, Quinn and Manziel were fails because they ALL had glaring flaws- the only knocks on Mitch are he only played one year and has some minor footwork issues.
It's well known I started the Trubisky Train, and I'm still on it to a certain extent.
OK... I'll play. What was Wheezy's glaring flaw? Brady-kins'?
I'll spot you Manziel... after all you likely have other things to do today.
Will also spot you that none could read a Defense when they were drafted... although I think Brady Q was close. Kind of a determinative factor and a skill Trubs hasn't demonstrated to any extent I've seen. Also one that comes with "experience"...
When did Gip steal your train? ๐ฅท
OK... I'll play. What was Wheezy's glaring flaw? Brady-kins'?
I'll spot you Manziel... after all you likely have other things to do today.
Will also spot you that none could read a Defense when they were drafted... although I think Brady Q was close. Kind of a determinative factor and a skill Trubs hasn't demonstrated to any extent I've seen. Also one that comes with "experience"...
When did Gip steal your train? ๐ฅท
And you thought I was the engineer when I was only the conductor.
All aboard?
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I would be angry if Im a Jets fan and they do this, they need to trade down not up!
Why?
Why?
They're an old team with needs all over the roster, giving up their future draft picks now would be stupid
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Why?
They're an old team with needs all over the roster, giving up their future draft picks now would be stupid
They're an old team with needs all over the roster, giving up their future draft picks now would be stupid
In other words, they should be thinking like the Browns did last year. I get it.
Actually, IMO, despite only winning 1 game last year, the Browns are in better shape than the Jets.
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They're an old team with needs all over the roster, giving up their future draft picks now would be stupid
In other words, they should be thinking like the Browns did last year. I get it.
Actually, IMO, despite only winning 1 game last year, the Browns are in better shape than the Jets.
Actually, IMO, despite only winning 1 game last year, the Browns are in better shape than the Jets.
And I would agree with that. I don't see Bowles lasting much longer, I thought he may have gone this off season as part of the rebuild.
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NYJ still is working under the delusion that they are only a QB away.
And just to add more smoke and mirrors.https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-mock-draft-5-0-jets-trade-up-to-take-a-qb/
That fits with one of the hottest rumors going... that SF is looking to trade down multiple times and accumulate picks.
With both Shanny and Lynch on fresh, 6-year deals they are in no need of shortcuts... just a bunch of really good prospects.
EDIT: Holy shit... PFF has Adams falling to us at 12? Color me ecstatic...
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Weeden didn't make progressions or read defenses, he simply played catch with the best receiver in the country. If my memory serves me, the big 12 didn't have a single top 80 defense that year while the big ten had 7 in the top 40, which was part of my reasoning for taking either Wilson or Cousins late as opposed to reaching for Weeden or Tannehill. 2012 was they year to draft 1 overall.
Weeden didn't make progressions or read defenses, he simply played catch with the best receiver in the country. If my memory serves me, the big 12 didn't have a single top 80 defense that year while the big ten had 7 in the top 40, which was part of my reasoning for taking either Wilson or Cousins late as opposed to reaching for Weeden or Tannehill. 2012 was they year to draft 1 overall.
I'll just ditto what you said about Wheezy for Tour- besides being near geriatric. Quinn? Not accurate. Notre Dame curse.
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Weeden didn't make progressions or read defenses, he simply played catch with the best receiver in the country. If my memory serves me, the big 12 didn't have a single top 80 defense that year while the big ten had 7 in the top 40, which was part of my reasoning for taking either Wilson or Cousins late as opposed to reaching for Weeden or Tannehill. 2012 was they year to draft 1 overall.
Weeden didn't make progressions or read defenses, he simply played catch with the best receiver in the country. If my memory serves me, the big 12 didn't have a single top 80 defense that year while the big ten had 7 in the top 40, which was part of my reasoning for taking either Wilson or Cousins late as opposed to reaching for Weeden or Tannehill. 2012 was they year to draft 1 overall.
Agree on the D -reading, but not sure about the progressions bit.
And you thought I was the engineer when I was only the conductor.
Trust me... I'd never think you were an Engineer... a lawyer, yes, but never an Engineer.
I know because I are an engineer...
I'll just ditto what you said about Wheezy for Tour- besides being near geriatric. Quinn? Not accurate. Notre Dame curse.
Well that's not fair... Trubs hasn't shown he can read a D either...
BTW... the correct answer for Wheezy was "slow release".
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
No one is a lock. Whether they are drafted #1 or #101. They all need to earn their stripes.
Bark Mingo was a bust from the get go. He didn't really have the size to handle quality olineman in the NFL. Garrett at least has the intangibles..
But you are right.. He could not pan out.. He could very easily be the next Courtney Brown.
Im just not sure I see the potential for bust as high in MG, as I do in MT.
Hell with all of the picks we have we could trade up and nab MT, if Cleveland feels so strongly about him, but doesn't want to pass up a potentially great DE..
Jets and Niners are teams that could be interested in trading with us on draft day..
I am on board with that. Get both of them. Trade up. Though, I don't know about the Jets and 49ers. Jets, it has been reported, are in line to want a QB, and MT is top of their list. That is why in another thread I talked about moving up from 12 to 5 with the Tits. Though...I have seen some reports that both the Niners and Bears may still be in the QB market, even with recent signings.
Moving from 12 to 2 with SF? A. That presumes that SF doesn't want a QB there, and B....WTF would it take to do that? A lot I suspect.
I am on board with that. Get both of them. Trade up. Though, I don't know about the Jets and 49ers. Jets, it has been reported, are in line to want a QB, and MT is top of their list. That is why in another thread I talked about moving up from 12 to 5 with the Tits. Though...I have seen some reports that both the Niners and Bears may still be in the QB market, even with recent signings.
Moving from 12 to 2 with SF? A. That presumes that SF doesn't want a QB there, and B....WTF would it take to do that? A lot I suspect.
I opined that Gip in a previous thread. Yikes, and here- according to the JJ chart, is what it would take for the Browns to jump up to #2 overall. A ton is right. Our #12 & #52 this year, and our first round and one of the seconds in 2018. Shades of the Goff\ Wentz trade ups last year. Doable? Certainly. Likely? About a million to one against.
Much less costly for the Jets to make the jump. I'll disagree with PFF though the 49ers would just take their #6 and a second rounder.
Annndddd.... if Mitch gets to #5, I have the Titans on speed dial. The draft value chart says just our #52 gets it done to move there. Of course, the Jets would again be in a better position, as the Titans would only be moving down one spot.
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LOL... Meanwhile back at "Point / Counterpoint"... Gip, you ignorant slut...
The Browns would be insane to take Mitchell Trubisky over Myles Garrett at No. 1
Cameron DaSilva @camdasilva Apr 12, 2017 at 1:25p ET
For more than a month, it seemed like Myles Garrett was a lock to go first overall. At the NFL Combine, he performed like an athletic freak, and then improved on those numbers at his pro day.
Everything was lining up for him to be the unquestioned No. 1 pick, but things may be changing. Multiple reports surfaced on Wednesday suggesting the Cleveland Browns are torn on what to do with the top pick. No, this is not a joke. The Browns are actually considering passing on a blue-chip defensive end in favor of, wait for it, a quarterback.
This isnโt the first time the Browns have been linked to a player besides Garrett, either. Earlier this week, it was reported that Leonard Fournette was in consideration for the top overall pick. A running back, in todayโs NFL, with the first pick in the draft.
However, if Cleveland were to actually pass on Garrett for Mitchell Trubisky, it would likely go down as one of the worst selections in NFL history. Itโs not about how bad Trubisky is โ he could turn out to be a nice quarterback. Itโs about Garrett being head-and-shoulders above every other player in this class.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Von Miller says no one in the AFC North can handle Garrett.
Bowles .
Bowles? After reading this, now I know why Tunsil wore a mask,with dope even with his in-laws
..Tell'em again Von Miller. Schefter's only pad experience comes with a #2 Pencil All aboard?
now figure a way above Tennessee to go get Adams or Hooker.Then am blowing the Amtrak whistle back home
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Weeden didn't make progressions or read defenses, he simply played catch with the best receiver in the country. If my memory serves me, the big 12 didn't have a single top 80 defense that year while the big ten had 7 in the top 40, which was part of my reasoning for taking either Wilson or Cousins late as opposed to reaching for Weeden or Tannehill. 2012 was they year to draft 1 overall.
Agree on the D -reading, but not sure about the progressions bit.
And you thought I was the engineer when I was only the conductor.
Trust me... I'd never think you were an Engineer... a lawyer, yes, but never an Engineer.
I know because I are an engineer...
I'll just ditto what you said about Wheezy for Tour- besides being near geriatric. Quinn? Not accurate. Notre Dame curse.
Well that's not fair... Trubs hasn't shown he can read a D either...
BTW... the correct answer for Wheezy was "slow release".
Agree on the D -reading, but not sure about the progressions bit.
Trust me... I'd never think you were an Engineer... a lawyer, yes, but never an Engineer.
I know because I are an engineer...
Well that's not fair... Trubs hasn't shown he can read a D either...
BTW... the correct answer for Wheezy was "slow release".
OK, I'll claim Zen enlightenment on all of the three Tour. None of 'em passed my eye test, though Wee-done probably came closest. I called "bum" before we drafted any of them. Same way I feel about Mitch- in an opposite way.....
BTW, I'm not necessarily saying take Mitch over Garrett either. Just greedy, and I want both of them on the Browns.
Reluctantly, if it's one or the other, I take Garrett. And should Myles bust, it will be a bust of historic proportions, above the level of Jamarcus Russell or Ki-Jana Carter. SO like the Browns. -
Two more... and I did not doctor the title...
The Browns Can't Possibly Fuck This Up...Right?
http://deadspin.com/the-browns-cant-possibly-fuck-this-up-right-1794264774
and one more... albeit a little less graphic...
NFL Draft: Browns need to stick with Myles Garrett at No. 1
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If the Browns go with Trubisky at one, a lot of us might be laughing ourselves into the floor, but...
I will know they made the right decision. It's easier to find pass rush help later, than to find a starting
qb later.
But I think they will take Garrett, even though he says he doesn't want to play in the NFL a long time.....
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The Browns have drafted 6 1st round busts in the past five years, what's one more?
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