Manny Ramirez SUSPENDED 50 Games - Performance Enhancers
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Every sport has their Shawne Merrimans.
Some say it's okay because EVERYONE is doing it. I've been told I'm no better for BACKING the sport if I KNOW this is going on. Here's where I slam on the brakes and REMIND people that sports as RICH as the NFL have the $$$ to test as deeply as they should. This would INCLUDE detection of the new drug of choice HGH.
Does GREED kill this idea? I mean how many double digit millionaires are they sending on an all expenses paid free trip to Hawaii every February with payoffs like $10,000 apiece for the losing Pro Bowl squad and $20,000 apiece for the winning team? Those payoffs are just my guesstimate but I hope you get my point. Think about it the next time you attend a game, pay for parking, buy the tickets, food and beverages for the family after you've paid the price for tickets for all. I haven't mentioned purchasing game jerseys for players that aren't staying employed by the Browns long enough for the exhange value justification.
I LOVED the NFL before it got REALLY dirty because I LOVE football. I'm holding out hope this commish will do something about it all to clean up the game. Nothing wrong with getting back to SHEER hard work and stop rewarding the guys that cheat the most. I used to be a HUGE bodybuilding fan when I was naive. But that sport ended up rewarding the biggest cheaters much like the NFL in the 70s. Dallas & Pittsburgh had the most guys cheating so they found themselves in the most Superbowls right? What followed? The thinking that since nothing is being done about it beyond condonin winning at all costs - the ONLY way to beat these guys is to JOIN them in how widespread the winning at all costs mentality needs to be. One problem. They forgot kids want to emulate their heros so the NEXT generation of Jim Haslett and Bill Romanowski would later rationalize the Steelers as to why they did what they did. Like it or not, the NFL has shed a blind eye on this. SI did a casket count of Steelers being buried prematurely. When you see Mike Webster, often confused with Superman in his playing days, dying of a massive coronary at age 50 - you can only ask HOW does Superman die of a weak heart?
What are young kids seeing today? Arod, Manny, and Merriman are ALL paid insanely high as elite players in their sport. That's the message like it or not. The ONLY way to beat them is to JOIN them. Any of these guys losing bonuses or an ounce of sleep? What makes them do so?
IMO, justifying something as right because EVERYONE is doing it when there's considerable resources to STOP it is a copout. If they clean up the NFL and MLB, who's going to stop watching it? That's my ultimate hope.
Do you know when I QUIT following MLB? When it gave me the middle finger for the umpteenth time in it's play stoppage from another absurd strike. What drew people back? Cal Ripken's streak and a bunch steroid cycles chasing a home run record. In the process, the wonderful LONG standing home run records made by guys of average build and non-compromised ethics were deemed forgettable. And folks, Roger Clemons isn't ANY better than Barry Bonds when he referred his wife to the RIGHT guy to set her body up for the RIGHT look in her bikini poses for the magazine shoot. Mrs Clemons used the same road map her husband had for Shortcut City and very coincidentally used the SAME guy. Go figure and guess who allegedly didn't know a THING about it? Haven't you ever just wondered HOW Mrs Clemons knew exactly whom to look to for such a secret shortcut? The SCARY thing is half the Senators at that farce of a hearing Congress held were better at getting Roger's autograph for their children than they were at conecting the dots that led Mrs Clemons to Roger's go-to boy. I'm guessing the autographs behind closed doors made him a more honorable liar than Barry bonds has ever been.
If I wanted to follow Counterfeit Champions - I would have been a Pittsburgh Steelers fan. But guess what? I'm a Cleveland Browns fan! Always have been - always will be. If the Browns are juicing more than other teams or they hired a Team Doctor like DR HGH in Pittsburgh, color me naive.
- Tom F.
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@inspecta said:
Baseball blows, and I'm with Flugs, they went very wrong when a bunch of juiced up posers erased the records of real men with real talent.I haven't followed baseball with any fervor since I was a kid and Charles Nagy was on the mound and Carlos Baerga was at 2nd base.
I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
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@inspecta said:
Baseball blows, and I'm with Flugs, they went very wrong when a bunch of juiced up posers erased the records of real men with real talent.I haven't followed baseball with any fervor since I was a kid and Charles Nagy was on the mound and Carlos Baerga was at 2nd base.
I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
Good points Larry! And I'd LOVE for the NFL to stop making a horrible role model like Shawne Merriman as their poster boy. Do you remember what fan told everyone on our board that gaining 54 pounds of lean muscle in 15 months is physiologically impossible without serious weird science involved? Dude was a NOBODY struggling to gain more reps on a ho-hum Maryland football team PRE-weird science.
If the league has the WEALTH to do the right thing - then handcuffing cheaters is every bit as important as handcuffing pass rushers and defensive backs in today's game.
It's NOT the game that needs to be corrected - it's the lookaway behind the game they've been cleverly disguising as "winning at all costs" as if positive connotation is deserved. Does anyone REALLY think Jim Haslett or Bill Romanowski tackled ballcarriers any better than Ray Nitchske or Dick Butkus? Has the NFL produced a better RB than Jim Brown since the 60s? My point is the game NEVER sucked before Pittsburgh turned football into the team with the most juice has the most electricity for a Trophy. My favorite football team has always been an EASY choice because I've seen the cheap imitations since the day they changed the name of the Championship to Superbowl. The Browns were in 10 consecutive Pro Football Championships from 1946 to 1955. Could the Boston Celtics even lay claim to such an impressive feat? They won their 8th and last NFL Championship in 1964, which was a decade before the NFL's Dark Ages of steroids.
- Cliff Notes Clavin (The author formerly known as Flugel)
-
Every sport has their Shawne Merrimans.
Some say it's okay because EVERYONE is doing it. I've been told I'm no better for BACKING the sport if I KNOW this is going on. Here's where I slam on the brakes and REMIND people that sports as RICH as the NFL have the $$$ to test as deeply as they should. This would INCLUDE detection of the new drug of choice HGH.
Does GREED kill this idea? I mean how many double digit millionaires are they sending on an all expenses paid free trip to Hawaii every February with payoffs like $10,000 apiece for the losing Pro Bowl squad and $20,000 apiece for the winning team? Those payoffs are just my guesstimate but I hope you get my point. Think about it the next time you attend a game, pay for parking, buy the tickets, food and beverages for the family after you've paid the price for tickets for all. I haven't mentioned purchasing game jerseys for players that aren't staying employed by the Browns long enough for the exhange value justification.
I LOVED the NFL before it got REALLY dirty because I LOVE football. I'm holding out hope this commish will do something about it all to clean up the game. Nothing wrong with getting back to SHEER hard work and stop rewarding the guys that cheat the most. I used to be a HUGE bodybuilding fan when I was naive. But that sport ended up rewarding the biggest cheaters much like the NFL in the 70s. Dallas & Pittsburgh had the most guys cheating so they found themselves in the most Superbowls right? What followed? The thinking that since nothing is being done about it beyond condonin winning at all costs - the ONLY way to beat these guys is to JOIN them in how widespread the winning at all costs mentality needs to be. One problem. They forgot kids want to emulate their heros so the NEXT generation of Jim Haslett and Bill Romanowski would later rationalize the Steelers as to why they did what they did. Like it or not, the NFL has shed a blind eye on this. SI did a casket count of Steelers being buried prematurely. When you see Mike Webster, often confused with Superman in his playing days, dying of a massive coronary at age 50 - you can only ask HOW does Superman die of a weak heart?
What are young kids seeing today? Arod, Manny, and Merriman are ALL paid insanely high as elite players in their sport. That's the message like it or not. The ONLY way to beat them is to JOIN them. Any of these guys losing bonuses or an ounce of sleep? What makes them do so?
IMO, justifying something as right because EVERYONE is doing it when there's considerable resources to STOP it is a copout. If they clean up the NFL and MLB, who's going to stop watching it? That's my ultimate hope.
Do you know when I QUIT following MLB? When it gave me the middle finger for the umpteenth time in it's play stoppage from another absurd strike. What drew people back? Cal Ripken's streak and a bunch steroid cycles chasing a home run record. In the process, the wonderful LONG standing home run records made by guys of average build and non-compromised ethics were deemed forgettable. And folks, Roger Clemons isn't ANY better than Barry Bonds when he referred his wife to the RIGHT guy to set her body up for the RIGHT look in her bikini poses for the magazine shoot. Mrs Clemons used the same road map her husband had for Shortcut City and very coincidentally used the SAME guy. Go figure and guess who allegedly didn't know a THING about it? Haven't you ever just wondered HOW Mrs Clemons knew exactly whom to look to for such a secret shortcut? The SCARY thing is half the Senators at that farce of a hearing Congress held were better at getting Roger's autograph for their children than they were at conecting the dots that led Mrs Clemons to Roger's go-to boy. I'm guessing the autographs behind closed doors made him a more honorable liar than Barry bonds has ever been.
If I wanted to follow Counterfeit Champions - I would have been a Pittsburgh Steelers fan. But guess what? I'm a Cleveland Browns fan! Always have been - always will be. If the Browns are juicing more than other teams or they hired a Team Doctor like DR HGH in Pittsburgh, color me naive.
- Tom F.
IMO, justifying something as right because EVERYONE is doing it when there's considerable resources to STOP it is a copout. If they clean up the NFL and MLB, who's going to stop watching it? That's my ultimate hope.
- Tom F.
Terrific post Tom. We've gone down this road for nearly a decade in various formats so while I applaud you for your inclusiveness, allow me to tell the naive to blow it out their ass when they continue to wag their finger at MLB while supporting the NFL. I get why those people prefer one sport to the other, but they're lying their sweet ass off if they point to PEDs as a bullet point.
This was hardly a dark day for baseball. Sucked ass for my fantasy team, but not for the sport. Simply validated testing.
I'm going to post a terrific column from Craig Calcaterra in a sec, but before that here's Bill James saying something that the children may not like to hear but they're going to think it all the same:
You give me the opportunity to earn $22 million a year by taking steroids, I’ll shoot the pharmacist if I have to. I’m not saying it’s right. I’m not saying I shouldn’t be punished for shooting the pharmacist. I am saying it is self-righteous to pretend that I don’t have the same human failings that these guys do, and further, if you are insisting that you don’t have them, I don’t believe you.
Calcaterra:
Manny’s suspension: less crisis than opportunity
by Craig Calcaterra
May 08, 2009
Come and step into my time machine for a moment. I want to show you something.
(Flash forward)
Nov. 3, 2009
LOS ANGELES (AP)—A season filled with ups and downs finished at the highest possible point last night for the Los Angeles Dodgers, as they defeated the Boston Red Sox for their seventh World Series championship in franchise history.
"It's a long season," said a champagne-soaked Dodgers manager Joe Torre, "and the key to surviving a long season is staying healthy and team depth, and those are both things we had in spades."
(Flash back)
I can see that, can't you? As the news of Manny Ramirez's suspension was breaking yesterday morning, the Dodgers were sitting pretty with a six-and-a-half game lead over the Giants and an eight-and-a-half game lead over everyone else in the division. None of the Dodgers' competitors seems poised or equipped to make a run. Last year the Dodgers stood two games out of first place on July 31 when Ramirez joined the team. This year they will likely be at least two games— more, I'd bet—ahead of the pack on July 3 when Ramirez joins the team, impacting them in much the same way any big ticket deadline deal impacts a team. Except his legs will be fresher, his body less battered and bruised by the seemingly interminable baseball season.
What's more, the $7 million the Dodgers will have saved could be used for an additional deadline pickup or two, and whoever steps in for Manny will either be helped by having taken the extra reps or definitively determined to be useless, which will prompt the team to make shakeups it might not otherwise have done. Obviously you'd rather have Manny Ramirez in your lineup, but as the old saying goes, crisis is another word for opportunity, and the Dodgers' big lead affords them the luxury to make an omelet out of all of these broken eggs.
(Flash forward)
Sept. 17, 2011
NEW YORK, N.Y. (AP)—NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell will announce today that football players and owners have reached an agreement on a tougher drug-testing program, one modeled after that employed in Major League Baseball, sources said. Discussions regarding a change in the league's testing program have been ongoing for over two years.
"It was really the Manny Ramirez thing in baseball that got the ball rolling here," said a source in the commissioner's office who asked to remain unnamed because he was not permitted to speak about the plan before its unveiling.
"Sure, football has always been assumed to have less of a drug problem than baseball. And yeah, on paper, the policies were pretty similar. But once Manny was suspended, people started to wonder why none of the big football stars have ever been caught. Our linemen average 320 pounds for cryin' out loud. It strained credulity that the NFL was so much cleaner than baseball, and that's when everyone figured out all of our loopholes and dirty secrets. These days baseball is considered the gold standard of drug testing in American sports, and frankly, we needed to get our house in order too."
(Flash back)
Probably wishful thinking on my part, but really, isn't Manny Ramirez's positive test and subsequent suspension a good thing for baseball? Isn't it, contrary to the reports out last night, a validation of the testing system? It certainly represents that which baseball's critics sought just a few short years ago: a relatively swift and automatic system that isn't bogged down by union maneuvering and litigation any time a violation is found.
It's also strong evidence that baseball's testing regime is not just for show, with the occasional Quad-A player and international prospect sacrificed in the name of false purity. Manny Ramirez is one of the biggest stars in the game, and if he can be caught, anyone can. There certainly has been no NFL equivalent of Manny Ramirez caught red-handed, and I find that quite curious. Regardless, this news, if anything, should give us greater confidence about the current state of drugs in baseball, not less.
(Flash forward)
July 23, 2018
COOPERSTOWN, N.Y. (AP)—For more than two decades, Manny Ramirez unnerved opposing pitchers while inhabiting the batter's box with an almost preternatural calm. On Sunday, he was calm again as he took the stage for his induction into the Baseball Hall of Fame—the same stage upon which other immortals have broken down with emotion when similarly honored. Guess it was just Manny being Manny one last time.
There was a time, however, when such a sight seemed unthinkable. That was in 2009 when Ramirez was suspended for 50 games for violating the league's substance abuse policy. Baseball's anti-doping program was still in its early stages then, and Ramirez was the first major star to be suspended for performance enhancing drugs.
At the time, any association with steroids was thought of as a Hall of Fame death sentence. And indeed, it has only been recently that PED-associated players who have long been eligible for induction—players like Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire and Roger Clemens—have been allowed into the Hall without buying a ticket. Why the sea change in national sentiment?
"Perspective," said Baseball Writers Association of America President Joe Posnanski. "An understanding of history. An appreciation that steroids, while altering our relationship with the game and its players, didn't alter the game itself nearly as much as many of us thought 15 years ago." Posnanski continued:
"As more and more information about what went on in baseball in the so-called 'Steroid Era' came to light, it became apparent that we didn't have a situation in which evil cheaters preyed upon overmatched innocents. Far more players used than initially realized, the effects were scattershot at best, and it eventually became obvious to all of us that, while steroids brought some benefits, they didn't make a Hall of Famer. Sure, 500 home runs doesn't mean the same thing now as it meant when I was a kid, but if we can induct pitchers who threw off of 18-inch mounds, took amphetamines and scuffed baseballs in the '60s, we can certainly induct guys who took HGH in the '90s."
(Flash back)
OK, I'll admit that one may be the biggest stretch of all, but it's not totally implausible, is it? Each time a new player— especially a superstar—is pushed out of the PED closet, it means that the era in which we've been living is, ironically, less illegitimate than we previously believed. Why? Because the more players who are found to have used PEDs, the less accurate it is to say that anyone truly had an unfair advantage. Sure, on a matchup-by-matchup basis there were users facing non-users, but the caricature of a small group of cheaters ruining it for everyone else in the game grows more ridiculous as each new name surfaces.
Let's face the facts: Many, many ballplayers have used PEDs in recent years. So many, that the allegation that any one user had an unfair advantage is at risk of becoming obsolete. As I've said time and time again, rather than demonizing these guys, calling for bans and locking the doors of the Hall of Fame, perhaps we should simply acknowledge that PEDs are best thought of as a generation's unique playing conditions like dead balls, segregated leagues, and giant strike zones. We have no problem acknowledging that 18 wins and a 2.50 ERA didn't make a guy anything special in 1904, so why is it so hard to come to grips with and adjust to the fact that 400 or 500 home runs don't necessarily make anyone special today?
Have PEDs thrown us so off our game that we can't tell the difference between a Hall of Famer and and a non-Hall of Famer? I don't believe so, and I think that eventually the writers and historians will realize this too.
Okay, our time traveling is over. Pretty trippy, huh? But before you say anything, I should let you know: What we saw was only one potential future. Time is not set in stone, and indeed, there are many other potential futures as well. Which one we actually experience depends on a lot of things. Solar flares. Chaos Theory. How much emotion and how little logic we employ when we come to a historical crossroads.
We're at one now, so it's probably a pretty good time to think about rather than simply emote at what lies before us.
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/...an-opportunity/
Beanpot
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@inspecta said:
Baseball blows, and I'm with Flugs, they went very wrong when a bunch of juiced up posers erased the records of real men with real talent.I haven't followed baseball with any fervor since I was a kid and Charles Nagy was on the mound and Carlos Baerga was at 2nd base.
I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
How do you do that exactly?
The void their records part. Do you just ignore Sosa's career even though he never once tested positive for performance enhancers? You'd clearly have to do the same for Clemente and everyone in his era, what with greenies stacked on the table of locker rooms for all to enjoy back in the day.
Obviously, the same gifts were given to football players.
I just don't understand how anyone can be so certain - so positive - that certain players benefited from enhancers while others clearly did not.
Beanpot
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Here is an example of a bulking cycle where HCG is used.
8 Week Mens BULKING Cycle
[KIT 8]
$500.00
Cycle reviewed and approved by BIG A, IFBB PRO, owner of www.professionalmuscle.com
* WEEKS 1- 6: Danabol 30mg Every Day
* WEEKS 1- 8: Deca Durabolin 400mg Per Week
* WEEKS 1- 8: Sustanon 750mg Per Week
* WEEKS 1-10: Anastrozol 0.25mg Every Day
* WEEKS 1-10: HCG 300-500iu Every 4-5 Days
* WEEK 11 : 40mg Nolva/100mg Clomid Every Day
* WEEK 12 : 30mg Nolva/ 50mg Clomid Every Day
* WEEK 13: 20mg Nolva/ 50mg Clomid Every Day
THIS KIT CONTAINS:
* 2 x HCG (Pregnyl) 5000 IU, 1 amp by Organon
* 1 x NOLVADEX (TAMOXIMED) (tamoxifene) 10mg/tab by Balkan Pharmaceuticals (Size: 50 tabs)
* 1 x ANASTROZOL 0.25 MG by Balkan Pharmaceuticals (Size: 100 tabs)
* 3 x CLOMID 50mg by Balkan Pharmaceuticals (Size: 10 tabs)
* 4 x DECA-DURABOLIN 200mg/ml by Stealth Labs (Size: 5 ml)
* 1 x SUSTANON 250 mg/ml by Stealth Labs (Size: 20 ml)
* 1 x SUSTANON 250 mg/ml by Stealth Labs (Size: 5 ml)
* 3 x DANABOL 10 MG by Balkan Pharmaceuticals (Size: 50 tabs)
Here is a profile of the drug. This is an older article and says the drug can't be tested for, so that is false. Manny has been juicing for years, my only question is he had to have somebody holding his hand for him doing it cuz that dumb bastard is way too stupid to do juice on his own.
HCG (Generic name: Human chorionic gonadotropin)
Pregnyl by Organon. 5,000 to 20,000 IU (International Units) per 10 cc vials. This drug is not a steroid but it is widely used in athletics today. HCG is a natural protein hormone secreted by the human placenta and purified form the urine of pregnant women. This hormone is not a natural male hormone but mimics the natural hormone LH (Luetinising Hormone) almost identically. This LH stimulates the production of testosterone by the testis in males. Thus HCG sends the same message and results in increased testosterone production by the testis due to HCG’s effect on the leydig cells of the testis.
Normally this HCG is used to treat women with certain ovarian disorders and it is used to stimulate the testis of men who may be hypogonadal. Athletes use HCG to increase the body’s own natural production of testosterone which is often depressed by long term steroid use. Also when steroids are used in high dosages they can cause false signals to the hypothalamus that results in a depressed signal to the testicles. Over a period of weeks of this depressed signal the testicles ability to respond to any signal from the pituitary becomes very weak, which results in testicular atrophy. To avoid this athletes will use HCG to keep an artificial signal going to the testis and preventing testicular atrophy. When administered, HGC raises serum testosterone very quickly. A rise in testosterone firs appears in about two hours after injecting HCG. The second peak occurs about two to four days later.
HCG therapy has been found to be very effective in the prevention of testicular atrophy and to use the body’s own biochemical stimulating mechanisms to increase plasma testosterone level during training. Some steroid users find that they have some of their best strength and size gains while using HCG in conjunction with the steroids. This may wee be due to the facts that the body has high level of natural androgens as well as the artificial steroid hormones at that time.
The optimal dosage for an athlete using HCG has never been established, but it is thought that a single shot of 1000 to 2000 IU per week will get the desired results. Cycles on the HCG should be kept down to three weeks at a time with an off cycle of at least a month in between. For example, one might use the HCG for two to three weeks in the middle of a cycle, and for two or three weeks at the end of a cycle. It has been speculated that the prolonged use of HCG could repress the body’s own production of gonadotropins permanently. This is why the short cycles are the best way to go.
The side effects from HCG use include gynecomastia, water retention, and an increase in sex drive, mood alterations, headaches, and high blood pressure. HCG raises androgen levels in males by up to 400% but it also raises estrogen levels dramatically as well. This is why it can cause a real case of gynecomastia if dosages get too elevated for that person. Another side effect seen from HCG use is morning sickness (nausea and vomiting). There have been no cases of overdose complications with the use of HCG nor have there been any associated carcinomas, liver or renal impairment. HCG was at one point looked at to see if it could carry the AIDS virus, due to the fact that it is biologically active, but the latest word is that this could not be possible in any way.
So we see how HCG be used by athletes to avoid some of the problems associated with abruptly stopping a steroid cycle. This product is also not picked up on steroid tests, so some athletes use it to keep androgen levels high before a contest that has drug testing. HCG must be refergerated after it is mixed together, and it then has a life of about 10 weeks. It is taken intramuscularly only; this drug is often available by order of a physician if you show symptoms of hypogonadism. It is hard to find on the black market.
HCG (Generic name: Human chorionic gonadotropin)
Pregnyl by Organon. 5,000 to 20,000 IU (International Units) per 10 cc vials. This drug is not a steroid but it is widely used in athletics today. HCG is a natural protein hormone secreted by the human placenta and purified form the urine of pregnant women.
hCG is the substance detected by home pregnancy tests.
Woof Woof, Kathy http://cognitivemanifesto.com/ http://www.skadden.com/index.cfm?contentID=49&officeID=9 Bendix ESP -
Look, Womanny isn't a bad guy, she was suffering from herniated ovaries.
That suspension was so uncalled for.
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HCG (Generic name: Human chorionic gonadotropin)
Pregnyl by Organon. 5,000 to 20,000 IU (International Units) per 10 cc vials. This drug is not a steroid but it is widely used in athletics today. HCG is a natural protein hormone secreted by the human placenta and purified form the urine of pregnant women.
hCG is the substance detected by home pregnancy tests.
hCG is the substance detected by home pregnancy tests.
Umm, yeah, but I'm going out on a limb and saying ManRam wasn't taking it for that particular purpose nor was he trying to cut weight.
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I love baseball; I really do...this stuff just makes me sad...bunch of tools
When do we get a real team back in Cleveland?
Beans - Offer is still open for a Clippers game at Huntington Park...on me; we can rehash old RR days under the sun
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I played baseball for a better part of my childhood and now I am an assistant coach for the high school that I graduated from. It really hurts me when I hear the guys on my team say they look up to these douche nozzles. I honestly can't see a reason to realistically look at anyone in MLB that's name is out there for records or hitting titles or whatever and says he's clean. I honestly can't think of anyone that contends for the hitting crown that's clean other than pujols. As far as pitching goes it makes my stomach turn when you hear of kids coming out of high school and college that are having Tommy John surgery to even stand a chance of competing in the big leagues. These kids are throwing so hard and basically rebuilding their arms just to have a chance to pursue their childhood dream of playing in the pros. When the guys they are sacrificing the bodies for are nothing but mere cowards and cheats. And these assholes are suppoed to be role models. Bud Selig should be beaten for allowing this to get this far. Thanks for ruining one of America's past times.
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I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
How do you do that exactly?
The void their records part. Do you just ignore Sosa's career even though he never once tested positive for performance enhancers? You'd clearly have to do the same for Clemente and everyone in his era, what with greenies stacked on the table of locker rooms for all to enjoy back in the day.
Obviously, the same gifts were given to football players.
I just don't understand how anyone can be so certain - so positive - that certain players benefited from enhancers while others clearly did not.
Beanpot
How do you do that exactly?
The void their records part. Do you just ignore Sosa's career even though he never once tested positive for performance enhancers? You'd clearly have to do the same for Clemente and everyone in his era, what with greenies stacked on the table of locker rooms for all to enjoy back in the day.
Obviously, the same gifts were given to football players.
I just don't understand how anyone can be so certain - so positive - that certain players benefited from enhancers while others clearly did not.
Beanpot
Ok, I'll grant you lousy testing. It's just a coincidence Maris' record stood for decades, and all of a sudden, a bunch of guys were hitting 70 HR a year. Funny how no one's come close lately.
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Before we start sending all the modern day athletes to Siberia as punishment keep in mind that drugs have always played a part in major league baseball....
In the 50's and 60's, the locker rooms on EVERY TEAM was chock full of anphetamines (sic) "speeders" to help the player gety through the day....
Feeling a little sluggish, go see the trainer and get a handfull of christmas trees, that will amp up your play....
The modern athelete, with the monster salaries, just took it to a higher level.....
I'm not saying it's acceptable but with the most powerful labor union behind you, some players choose to do whatever is necessary to keep that major league paycheck....
Speeders have been the staple in both the NFL & MLB since I can remember...
When I was in college, the Steelers trained at West Liberty State College in West Virginia....
Bobby Lane & his teammates would be out in the bars, the local hangout "the bucket of blood", into the wee hours of the morning... The next day they took speeders to get them through practice...
I'm not saying it's right or fair, just saying what it is and what I saw.....
T.Dawg
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Before we start sending all the modern day athletes to Siberia as punishment keep in mind that drugs have always played a part in major league baseball....
In the 50's and 60's, the locker rooms on EVERY TEAM was chock full of anphetamines (sic) "speeders" to help the player gety through the day....
Feeling a little sluggish, go see the trainer and get a handfull of christmas trees, that will amp up your play....
The modern athelete, with the monster salaries, just took it to a higher level.....
I'm not saying it's acceptable but with the most powerful labor union behind you, some players choose to do whatever is necessary to keep that major league paycheck....
Speeders have been the staple in both the NFL & MLB since I can remember...
When I was in college, the Steelers trained at West Liberty State College in West Virginia....
Bobby Lane & his teammates would be out in the bars, the local hangout "the bucket of blood", into the wee hours of the morning... The next day they took speeders to get them through practice...
I'm not saying it's right or fair, just saying what it is and what I saw.....
T.Dawg
Before we start sending all the modern day athletes to Siberia as punishment keep in mind that drugs have always played a part in major league baseball....
In the 50's and 60's, the locker rooms on EVERY TEAM was chock full of anphetamines (sic) "speeders" to help the player gety through the day....
Feeling a little sluggish, go see the trainer and get a handfull of christmas trees, that will amp up your play....
The modern athelete, with the monster salaries, just took it to a higher level.....
I'm not saying it's acceptable but with the most powerful labor union behind you, some players choose to do whatever is necessary to keep that major league paycheck....
Speeders have been the staple in both the NFL & MLB since I can remember...
When I was in college, the Steelers trained at West Liberty State College in West Virginia....
Bobby Lane & his teammates would be out in the bars, the local hangout "the bucket of blood", into the wee hours of the morning... The next day they took speeders to get them through practice...
I'm not saying it's right or fair, just saying what it is and what I saw.....
T.Dawg
Good points but steroids are a whole other level as far as drugs go, they really do make a huge difference.
Is a pig's ass pork? -
i didn't like baseball then, dislike it even more now. they got busted at a publicity stunt, and are pushing it threw despite the fact. pretty sad actually.
as rating were falling, the only thing to spring the life back into baseball was the mcguire run. baseball execs knowing sold their livlihood, and american pastime, down the river for money.
they'll reap what they sow....especially if they let these records stand.
and xxxx pete rose...trying to capitalize on this situation to get into the hall of fame.
this sports pathetic....
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i didn't like baseball then, dislike it even more now. they got busted at a publicity stunt, and are pushing it threw despite the fact. pretty sad actually.
as rating were falling, the only thing to spring the life back into baseball was the mcguire run. baseball execs knowing sold their livlihood, and american pastime, down the river for money.
they'll reap what they sow....especially if they let these records stand.
and xxxx pete rose...trying to capitalize on this situation to get into the hall of fame.
this sports pathetic....
i didn't like baseball then, dislike it even more now. they got busted at a publicity stunt, and are pushing it threw despite the fact. pretty sad actually.
as rating were falling, the only thing to spring the life back into baseball was the mcguire run. baseball execs knowing sold their livelihood, and American pastime, down the river for money.
they'll reap what they sow....especially if they let these records stand.
and xxxx pete rose...trying to capitalize on this situation to get into the hall of fame.
this sports pathetic....
All I'll say is I'm damn glad baseball is way down on my list of pro sports. They let the inmates run the asylum for far too long.
Beans is the baseball purist- seems like. You have some mighty good points. And what it boils down to- if everybody's cheating, then nobody's cheating. Juiced up pitchers throwing at juiced up batters.
Ironic Rose's nickname "Charlie Hustle" pretty accurately describes why he'll never see the HOF in his lifetime- and it serves him right. And the voters seem to agree that steroids are something that keeps you out of the Hall.
Yeah, McGuire was only taking androsterone. Clemens accidentally sat on a needle 20 times while his wife was taking HGH. Bonds thought "the Clear" was in one of my bottles of Curacao. How much is he paying his trainer to go to jail again to keep his dirty not-so-secret secret?
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I'll ditto that. Until baseball takes the same stance as track & field, first offense you're gone for two years, next one is a lifetime ban. And void all their records while you're at it. No one shed a tear when Ben "the steroid factory" Johnson got his world record in the 100 wiped out. As far as I'm concerned, McGuire, Sosa's, A-roid, Bonds, & Clemens records all belong in the trash can, and like Pete Rose- no Hall of Fame for you.
How do you do that exactly?
The void their records part. Do you just ignore Sosa's career even though he never once tested positive for performance enhancers? You'd clearly have to do the same for Clemente and everyone in his era, what with greenies stacked on the table of locker rooms for all to enjoy back in the day.
Obviously, the same gifts were given to football players.
I just don't understand how anyone can be so certain - so positive - that certain players benefited from enhancers while others clearly did not.
Beanpot
How do you do that exactly?
The void their records part. Do you just ignore Sosa's career even though he never once tested positive for performance enhancers?
I just don't understand how anyone can be so certain - so positive - that certain players benefited from enhancers while others clearly did not.
Beanpot
Sosa may have never tested positive, but the loser was caught corking the bat
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/...osa_ejected_ap/
That alone is enough to cast doubt over him. If he cheated then, he'd probably cheated before. Its not too far a stretch to think that modifying a bat could become modifying onesself
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How did this thread go from Manny bashing to Pete Rose bashing? Pete wasn't doing any PED's! Pete Rose gambled on baseball AFTER his playing days were over! Regardless of how many of you hate his guts, Rose earned a place in the Hall of Fame for how he played the game! What he did after he was done playing was wrong, yes. But it cannot detract from his playing career! Don't ever let him back in baseball at any level. But put the PLAYER where he belongs, in the Baseball Hall of Fame!
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Pete Rose's numbers as a player are HOF material... The trouble is, as a manager, he bet on baseball--even doing it during a game from the club house...
In every major league contract there's a clause that specifically says that gambling on baseball is cause for lifetime suspension... It's very clear and each year during spring training it's reinforced time and time again... All active players, coaches, managers or front office personnel are subject to expulsion if engaging in gambling...
I loved Pete Rose, played the game the way it's supposed to be played but he committed baseballs mortal sin and deserves what he got... He knew upfront what he was risking and now is paying the price... Shoeless Joe Jackson is not in the HOF for the same reason... Sorry but Pete Rose is where he belongs, did it to himself and that's the way it is...... You can't have selective inforcement..
T.Dawg
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Pete Rose's numbers as a player are HOF material... The trouble is, as a manager, he bet on baseball--even doing it during a game from the club house...
In every major league contract there's a clause that specifically says that gambling on baseball is cause for lifetime suspension... It's very clear and each year during spring training it's reinforced time and time again... All active players, coaches, managers or front office personnel are subject to expulsion if engaging in gambling...
I loved Pete Rose, played the game the way it's supposed to be played but he committed baseballs mortal sin and deserves what he got... He knew upfront what he was risking and now is paying the price... Shoeless Joe Jackson is not in the HOF for the same reason... Sorry but Pete Rose is where he belongs, did it to himself and that's the way it is...... You can't have selective inforcement..
T.Dawg
Pete Rose's numbers as a player are HOF material... The trouble is, as a manager, he bet on baseball--even doing it during a game from the club house...
In every major league contract there's a clause that specifically says that gambling on baseball is cause for lifetime suspension... It's very clear and each year during spring training it's reinforced time and time again... All active players, coaches, managers or front office personnel are subject to expulsion if engaging in gambling...
I loved Pete Rose, played the game the way it's supposed to be played but he committed baseballs mortal sin and deserves what he got... He knew upfront what he was risking and now is paying the price... Shoeless Joe Jackson is not in the HOF for the same reason... Sorry but Pete Rose is where he belongs, did it to himself and that's the way it is...... You can't have selective inforcement..
T.Dawg
You judge a player by there playing career to get in the hall of fame. What Rose did while a manager should have no bearing on his HOF status as a player. If you dont want to put him in as a manager thats fine but he should be in based on his playing career
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