Impacts of Our 2017 Draft on Our 53-man Roster
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When do they assign numbers to the new players? There was a picture of Kizer holding up a Browns #17, but we know Garrett cannot have #15 in the NFL.
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Actually sorry i am wrong he only keeps 8-9 DL and 6 LB
Actually sorry i am wrong he only keeps 8-9 DL and 6 LB
Feels more typical... but still a little high for the 53... especially for a 4-man DL. Somewhere you'd like to double up who a backup is backing up. and get by with 7. LBs get the advantage of being needed on S/Ts.
And now one of those 5s is a hybrid that might allow us to do more 4-3 stuff without subs. Like how he was used in College
Downside? If he's injured, then he requires two backups. Or if there's an injury to one of his position-mates, his utilization can be restricted.
What's Danny's value if we just got picks for him?
Good question... coming off a coming out season including a pro bowl? Maybe a 2nd and change with one or both "conditional"?
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I'm interested to see where guys like Orchard and Schobert end up either at DL or LB. Also, There are a lot of offensive lineman depth that the Browns seemed to really like. I'm curious as to how many they keep moving forward. Guys such as Reiter, Fabiano, Greco, Drango..not even mentioning Erving and Coleman.
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Here's our haul: one QB, one RB, one TE, one OT, one DE, two DTs, one CB, one S and one K.
Plus we're adding UDFAs at a rapid clip as in customary, but who knows what's in that pile. What we do know is when you spend a pick, you do it expecting that prospect to, at a minimum, make your team, your 53-man roster.
Clearly no area will be impacted more in 2017 than our DL... and in particular DT. This thought came racing thru my noggin' last nite and then was gone 'til a a while ago.
This will not be the first DL discussion here. When we changed DCs we had a thread examining his impact with obvious emphasis on the change to his base 4-3 from Horton's base 3-4. At that time, IIRC, I with others were happy to fit Danny into our new DC's 4-3 at the 0 or 1 tech. Did not even have to work hard to do so. Then there was Des... coming off injury at 30. Some discussion of starter at the 3-tech, but assuming full recovery a useful player.And then we go and draft not one, but two stout, yet reportedly quick DTs.
We now have 9, yes, 9 DTs on our roster. A couple can be considered DT/DE swingmen, but the DE slots are pretty full. The DTs are in the order I've handicapped them:
- Shelton, Danny
- Bryant, Desmond
- Ogunjobi, Larry
- Cooper, Xavier
- Meder, Jamie
- Wright, Gabe
- Lawrence-Stample, Nile
- Brantley, Caleb
- Coley, Trevon
At most we carry five? Clearly one looks sacrificial, Coley. Then maybe there's Lawrence-Stample, but he was a well-regarded late pick in 2016. Then there's Brantley, who is in an "iffy" class by himself, but we're full up here. Even should these three all go, and Stample , more need to go as well.
So my questions are:
- Is Danny really versatile enough for Williams D?
- Is Des young enough for our youth movement?
Here's our haul: one QB, one RB, one TE, one OT, one DE, two DTs, one CB, one S and one K.
Plus we're adding UDFAs at a rapid clip as in customary, but who knows what's in that pile. What we do know is when you spend a pick, you do it expecting that prospect to, at a minimum, make your team, your 53-man roster.
Clearly no area will be impacted more in 2017 than our DL... and in particular DT. This thought came racing thru my noggin' last nite and then was gone 'til a a while ago.
This will not be the first DL discussion here. When we changed DCs we had a thread examining his impact with obvious emphasis on the change to his base 4-3 from Horton's base 3-4. At that time, IIRC, I with others were happy to fit Danny into our new DC's 4-3 at the 0 or 1 tech. Did not even have to work hard to do so. Then there was Des... coming off injury at 30. Some discussion of starter at the 3-tech, but assuming full recovery a useful player.
And then we go and draft not one, but two stout, yet reportedly quick DTs.
We now have 9, yes, 9 DTs on our roster. A couple can be considered DT/DE swingmen, but the DE slots are pretty full. The DTs are in the order I've handicapped them:
- Shelton, Danny
- Bryant, Desmond
- Ogunjobi, Larry
- Cooper, Xavier
- Meder, Jamie
- Wright, Gabe
- Lawrence-Stample, Nile
- Brantley, Caleb
- Coley, Trevon
At most we carry five? Clearly one looks sacrificial, Coley. Then maybe there's Lawrence-Stample, but he was a well-regarded late pick in 2016. Then there's Brantley, who is in an "iffy" class by himself, but we're full up here. Even should these three all go, and Stample , more need to go as well.
So my questions are:
- Is Danny really versatile enough for Williams D?
- Is Des young enough for our youth movement?
I have always seen Cooper listed as a DE.
But, yes, I do think that Bryant may be on thin ice because of age, injury.
But...he does have ONE thing going for him: Harvard. Sashi may not want to see his home boy go home.
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On 53
He keeps more lineman and less line backers it almost looks like he prefers 4-2-5
Browns ARE thin at OLB. If they really do use this type of formation, then that thinness may be abrogated.
But then....we were fairly thin at DB....at least quality wise...though we do have bodies. How many and who of those do we keep?
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On 53
He keeps more lineman and less line backers it almost looks like he prefers 4-2-5
And now one of those 5s is a hybrid that might allow us to do more 4-3 stuff without subs. Like how he was used in College
And now one of those 5s is a hybrid that might allow us to do more 4-3 stuff without subs. Like how he was used in College
Could be.
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I'm interested to see where guys like Orchard and Schobert end up either at DL or LB. Also, There are a lot of offensive lineman depth that the Browns seemed to really like. I'm curious as to how many they keep moving forward. Guys such as Reiter, Fabiano, Greco, Drango..not even mentioning Erving and Coleman.
I'm interested to see where guys like Orchard and Schobert end up either at DL or LB. Also, There are a lot of offensive lineman depth that the Browns seemed to really like. I'm curious as to how many they keep moving forward. Guys such as Reiter, Fabiano, Greco, Drango..not even mentioning Erving and Coleman.
And now Roderick Johnson. They didn't trade up for this guy to cut him.
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I'm interested to see where guys like Orchard and Schobert end up either at DL or LB. Also, There are a lot of offensive lineman depth that the Browns seemed to really like. I'm curious as to how many they keep moving forward. Guys such as Reiter, Fabiano, Greco, Drango..not even mentioning Erving and Coleman.
I'm interested to see where guys like Orchard and Schobert end up either at DL or LB. Also, There are a lot of offensive lineman depth that the Browns seemed to really like. I'm curious as to how many they keep moving forward. Guys such as Reiter, Fabiano, Greco, Drango..not even mentioning Erving and Coleman.
No bigger, class of '16 disappointment in my eyes than Schobert. I knew he's be athletically challenged in the NFL, but thought he had the head to compensate. Instead he looked lost... and athletically outclassed.
Feels like Orch will be our early-down LOLB giving way to a DB in our passing packages.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Moving on to our next log jam... The OL...
We now have 15 OL on our roster (plus a UDFA or two now). At most we keep 9 on the 53. Starters look to be:
Thomas - Bito - Tretter - Zeitler - Coleman
"Safe" backups look to be:
- OT - Johnson
- OG/C - Greco & Fabs(?)
- Swing - Drango (w/ Greco on deck)
PS eligible (less than three accrued seasons & six active games) candidates include:
Fabs (1&4), Reiter (1&1), Sterup (1&0), UDFAs (0&0)...
Too much tape on Fabs; roll the dice on Rieter?; Sterup looks like a safe stash as should be a UDFA or two
Not PS eligible:
Ikard (3&6), Erving, Martin, McCants ... buh-bye?
That's 15... pot's right... deal.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I'm interested to see where guys like Orchard and Schobert end up either at DL or LB. Also, There are a lot of offensive lineman depth that the Browns seemed to really like. I'm curious as to how many they keep moving forward. Guys such as Reiter, Fabiano, Greco, Drango..not even mentioning Erving and Coleman.
No bigger, class of '16 disappointment in my eyes than Schobert. I knew he's be athletically challenged in the NFL, but thought he had the head to compensate. Instead he looked lost... and athletically outclassed.
Feels like Orch will be our early-down LOLB giving way to a DB in our passing packages.
No bigger, class of '16 disappointment in my eyes than Schobert. I knew he's be athletically challenged in the NFL, but thought he had the head to compensate. Instead he looked lost... and athletically outclassed.
Feels like Orch will be our early-down LOLB giving way to a DB in our passing packages.
And yet, Schobert is listed as our starter at ROLB. It is why I said OLB was to me a priority need. Browns however did NOT address that position in the draft. Yes, you would think Orchard would step up and claim that spot....but Mr. 18 1/2 sacks in college has not done so.
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Moving on to our next log jam... The OL...
We now have 15 OL on our roster (plus a UDFA or two now). At most we keep 9 on the 53. Starters look to be:
Thomas - Bito - Tretter - Zeitler - Coleman
"Safe" backups look to be:
- OT - Johnson
- OG/C - Greco & Fabs(?)
- Swing - Drango (w/ Greco on deck)
PS eligible (less than three accrued seasons & six active games) candidates include:
Fabs (1&4), Reiter (1&1), Sterup (1&0), UDFAs (0&0)...
Too much tape on Fabs; roll the dice on Rieter?; Sterup looks like a safe stash as should be a UDFA or two
Not PS eligible:
Ikard (3&6), Erving, Martin, McCants ... buh-bye?
That's 15... pot's right... deal.
Moving on to our next log jam... The OL...
We now have 15 OL on our roster (plus a UDFA or two now). At most we keep 9 on the 53. Starters look to be:
Thomas - Bito - Tretter - Zeitler - Coleman
"Safe" backups look to be:
- OT - Johnson
- OG/C - Greco & Fabs(?)
- Swing - Drango (w/ Greco on deck)
PS eligible (less than three accrued seasons & six active games) candidates include:
Fabs (1&4), Reiter (1&1), Sterup (1&0), UDFAs (0&0)...
Too much tape on Fabs; roll the dice on Rieter?; Sterup looks like a safe stash as should be a UDFA or two
Not PS eligible:
Ikard (3&6), Erving, Martin, McCants ... buh-bye?
That's 15... pot's right... deal.
Erving ass is definitely in the frying pan. Somehow though I think Martin or McCants stays over Fabiano.
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Excellent first step step quickness but he can't control himself, doesn't use his arms to keep length and engage interior lineman and doesn't get skinny low like our newly taken (Jobi) 3tech.
Awesome..Football talk nutz & botz is back^^
.. I think he has to change again. Slim down some more to maybe 325 to generate a little more penetration in 50/50 pass/run situations and even then I'm not sure that's his game vs. say Brantley.
I looked at the 2016 Rams. They had retained the big, 6'5 325 DT from their St Louis days, Brockers. Stout 1 tech who also averaged around 3.5 sacks per season. Of course he had Aaron Donald next to him.
Maybe the D change is enough for Danny to improve his career high, also career total, 1.5 sack performance in 2016. But then I looked at Ogunjobi's Combine profile. His comparable? Aaron Donald... of course... may we be so lucky... or better yet, so good.
Bottom line: At what point in changing Danny does his value as a more balanced, Browns' DT fall below his trade value as a run-stuffing, 3-4 NT?
Fair enough..As long as I don't have to watch "fat air balloon" Danny. imo Danny looked to find his playing weight last season..Animal loves playing football. Just give him a weight Mongo
My Fab 5--Danny-Des-Jobi-Brantley-Meder.////.Stample & Gabe sat on PS before. X Copp got any eligibility? Awesome..Football talk nutz & botz is back^^
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Some of you need to get the idea of Danny being let go out of your head. Regardless of what your preconceived ideas of 34/43 should be, he will fill the classic 0/1 tech role under coach Williams in a similar manner
that he has previously. Only now he'll be 1-gapping 90% of the time. He may lose another 5lbs or so so he can check in around 325-330, but he's a probowl caliber interior run defender. In the AFCN when the elements
can turn on you starting in November, that type of presence to slow a teams running game becomes that much more important. You still need someone to hold their ground against double teams in this defense the same as before.
That man is Danny Shelton.
Don't believe me? Please refer to Snacks Harrison for the Gmen as your dose of truth.
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Awesome..Football talk nutz & botz is back^^
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Some of you need to get the idea of Danny being let go out of your head. Regardless of what your preconceived ideas of 34/43 should be, he will fill the classic 0/1 tech role under coach Williams in a similar manner
that he has previously. Only now he'll be 1-gapping 90% of the time. He may lose another 5lbs or so so he can check in around 325-330, but he's a probowl caliber interior run defender. In the AFCN when the elements
can turn on you starting in November, that type of presence to slow a teams running game becomes that much more important. You still need someone to hold their ground against double teams in this defense the same as before.
That man is Danny Shelton.
Don't believe me? Please refer to Snacks Harrison for the Gmen as your dose of truth.
-
Awesome..Football talk nutz & botz is back^^
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Some of you need to get the idea of Danny being let go out of your head. Regardless of what your preconceived ideas of 34/43 should be, he will fill the classic 0/1 tech role under coach Williams in a similar manner
that he has previously. Only now he'll be 1-gapping 90% of the time. He may lose another 5lbs or so so he can check in around 325-330, but he's a probowl caliber interior run defender. In the AFCN when the elements
can turn on you starting in November, that type of presence to slow a teams running game becomes that much more important. You still need someone to hold their ground against double teams in this defense the same as before.
That man is Danny Shelton.
Don't believe me? Please refer to Snacks Harrison for the Gmen as your dose of truth.
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Lighten up Brutus Ninja with a half Buckeye Shell
It's a compliment that a poster can actually determine a position players technique to a T. Glad your here.maybe I'll try back in 3 more years..Your stuff got Adoree Jackson gone by round 1... EDIT---Tour all I got on our OL for now is the answer to--Ca Ka meal Erving---If this new Magic Card Dealer OL Coach can't deal a Joker on this Guy...it's 
Browns & Buffett: Got to go fishin, Down to rock bottom again, with just a few Friends -
Actually sorry i am wrong he only keeps 8-9 DL and 6 LB
Feels more typical... but still a little high for the 53... especially for a 4-man DL. Somewhere you'd like to double up who a backup is backing up. and get by with 7. LBs get the advantage of being needed on S/Ts.
And now one of those 5s is a hybrid that might allow us to do more 4-3 stuff without subs. Like how he was used in College
Downside? If he's injured, then he requires two backups. Or if there's an injury to one of his position-mates, his utilization can be restricted.
What's Danny's value if we just got picks for him?
Good question... coming off a coming out season including a pro bowl? Maybe a 2nd and change with one or both "conditional"?
Feels more typical... but still a little high for the 53... especially for a 4-man DL. Somewhere you'd like to double up who a backup is backing up. and get by with 7. LBs get the advantage of being needed on S/Ts.
Downside? If he's injured, then he requires two backups. Or if there's an injury to one of his position-mates, his utilization can be restricted.
Good question... coming off a coming out season including a pro bowl? Maybe a 2nd and change with one or both "conditional"?
That's pretty crazy for a guy who was picked 10th and is young.
-
Moving on to our next log jam... The OL...
We now have 15 OL on our roster (plus a UDFA or two now). At most we keep 9 on the 53. Starters look to be:
Thomas - Bito - Tretter - Zeitler - Coleman
"Safe" backups look to be:
- OT - Johnson
- OG/C - Greco & Fabs(?)
- Swing - Drango (w/ Greco on deck)
PS eligible (less than three accrued seasons & six active games) candidates include:
Fabs (1&4), Reiter (1&1), Sterup (1&0), UDFAs (0&0)...
Too much tape on Fabs; roll the dice on Rieter?; Sterup looks like a safe stash as should be a UDFA or two
Not PS eligible:
Ikard (3&6), Erving, Martin, McCants ... buh-bye?
That's 15... pot's right... deal.
Moving on to our next log jam... The OL...
We now have 15 OL on our roster (plus a UDFA or two now). At most we keep 9 on the 53. Starters look to be:
Thomas - Bito - Tretter - Zeitler - Coleman
"Safe" backups look to be:
- OT - Johnson
- OG/C - Greco & Fabs(?)
- Swing - Drango (w/ Greco on deck)
PS eligible (less than three accrued seasons & six active games) candidates include:
Fabs (1&4), Reiter (1&1), Sterup (1&0), UDFAs (0&0)...
Too much tape on Fabs; roll the dice on Rieter?; Sterup looks like a safe stash as should be a UDFA or two
Not PS eligible:
Ikard (3&6), Erving, Martin, McCants ... buh-bye?
That's 15... pot's right... deal.
I wonder if Greco can beat out Tretter. That's a pretty good player to have riding pine.
As for the numbers here, I'd say it's your starting 5, Johnson, Greco, Drango, Reiter.
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Awesome..Football talk nutz & botz is back^^
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Some of you need to get the idea of Danny being let go out of your head. Regardless of what your preconceived ideas of 34/43 should be, he will fill the classic 0/1 tech role under coach Williams in a similar manner
that he has previously. Only now he'll be 1-gapping 90% of the time. He may lose another 5lbs or so so he can check in around 325-330, but he's a probowl caliber interior run defender. In the AFCN when the elements
can turn on you starting in November, that type of presence to slow a teams running game becomes that much more important. You still need someone to hold their ground against double teams in this defense the same as before.
That man is Danny Shelton.
Don't believe me? Please refer to Snacks Harrison for the Gmen as your dose of truth.
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Football nuts and bolts talk is back. As in actual football talk rather than just draft talk.
Yes, I polished my Gumby decoder this morning. We have a poster on my A&M board who types just as poorly but is a football savant, so I'm used to it.
-
Awesome..Football talk nutz & botz is back^^
What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Some of you need to get the idea of Danny being let go out of your head. Regardless of what your preconceived ideas of 34/43 should be, he will fill the classic 0/1 tech role under coach Williams in a similar manner
that he has previously. Only now he'll be 1-gapping 90% of the time. He may lose another 5lbs or so so he can check in around 325-330, but he's a probowl caliber interior run defender. In the AFCN when the elements
can turn on you starting in November, that type of presence to slow a teams running game becomes that much more important. You still need someone to hold their ground against double teams in this defense the same as before.
That man is Danny Shelton.
Don't believe me? Please refer to Snacks Harrison for the Gmen as your dose of truth.
-
Moving on to our next log jam... The OL...
We now have 15 OL on our roster (plus a UDFA or two now). At most we keep 9 on the 53. Starters look to be:
Thomas - Bito - Tretter - Zeitler - Coleman
"Safe" backups look to be:
- OT - Johnson
- OG/C - Greco & Fabs(?)
- Swing - Drango (w/ Greco on deck)
PS eligible (less than three accrued seasons & six active games) candidates include:
Fabs (1&4), Reiter (1&1), Sterup (1&0), UDFAs (0&0)...
Too much tape on Fabs; roll the dice on Rieter?; Sterup looks like a safe stash as should be a UDFA or two
Not PS eligible:
Ikard (3&6), Erving, Martin, McCants ... buh-bye?
That's 15... pot's right... deal.
I wonder if Greco can beat out Tretter. That's a pretty good player to have riding pine.
As for the numbers here, I'd say it's your starting 5, Johnson, Greco, Drango, Reiter.
I wonder if Greco can beat out Tretter. That's a pretty good player to have riding pine.
As for the numbers here, I'd say it's your starting 5, Johnson, Greco, Drango, Reiter.
Can't see John winning a starting role from where we are. TBH can't even be sure he makes the team given his Lizzie. But if he recovers well enough to regain 90% of his form, then his dual backup capability should keep him around. Of course, if he's not recovered and goes PUP... that ain't bad either.
Fabs vs. Reiter... interesting problem. I only went Fabs because he has more tape on him making it easier for a claim off our PS.
Football nuts and bolts talk is back. As in actual football talk rather than just draft talk.
Yes, I polished my Gumby decoder this morning. We have a poster on my A&M board who types just as poorly but is a football savant, so I'm used to it.
And it is worth polishing... there be gems in them thar jumbles...
Plus when mine fails, which it occasionally does, I just furrow my brow, scratch my nutz and boltz, and chuckle...
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What in the actual fuck does that even mean?
Lighten up Brutus Ninja with a half Buckeye Shell
It's a compliment that a poster can actually determine a position players technique to a T. Glad your here.maybe I'll try back in 3 more years..Your stuff got Adoree Jackson gone by round 1... EDIT---Tour all I got on our OL for now is the answer to--Ca Ka meal Erving---If this new Magic Card Dealer OL Coach can't deal a Joker on this Guy...it's Lighten up Brutus Ninja with a half Buckeye Shell
It's a compliment that a poster can actually determine a position players technique to a T. Glad your here.maybe I'll try back in 3 more years..Your stuff got Adoree Jackson gone by round 1... EDIT---Tour all I got on our OL for now is the answer to--Ca Ka meal Erving---If this new Magic Card Dealer OL Coach can't deal a Joker on this Guy...it's Forgive me if my tone sounded short. It wasn't, I was genuinely confused and I love that phrase.
Having said that, I appreciate the kind words. I don't think I got
Jackson drafted that high. I called him high 2nd fringe first with world's of potential. Similar to how fond I was of Orchard.
Adoree is raw with his feet and hands, but he was drafted that high for what he can be - not what he is.
Good to return to football talk and not draft talk, by the way.
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