Browns looking at WR trade ?
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A 2nd for Jarvis Landry would be good. A 3rd would be a steal.
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The Jags opening up for Hurns might interest me more. Give us some size out the perimeter.
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There will be 100 WR on the waiver wire Saturday, I bet at least one or two are better than what is on our roster. Since we have first crack at the waiver wire, why would we waste a draft pick on somebody that will probably get cut on Saturday anyway. Just sit back and wait.
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There will be 100 WR on the waiver wire Saturday, I bet at least one or two are better than what is on our roster. Since we have first crack at the waiver wire, why would we waste a draft pick on somebody that will probably get cut on Saturday anyway. Just sit back and wait.
There will be 100 WR on the waiver wire Saturday, I bet at least one or two are better than what is on our roster. Since we have first crack at the waiver wire, why would we waste a draft pick on somebody that will probably get cut on Saturday anyway. Just sit back and wait.
There is a large difference between "getting someone who is better than what we currently have" and "getting a difference maker".
Landry is an athletic freak. He's not a johnny come lately waiver wire addition.
I dont see how the two can be compared. Surrounding Kizer with talent is going to help his growth.
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There will be 100 WR on the waiver wire Saturday, I bet at least one or two are better than what is on our roster. Since we have first crack at the waiver wire, why would we waste a draft pick on somebody that will probably get cut on Saturday anyway. Just sit back and wait.
There is a large difference between "getting someone who is better than what we currently have" and "getting a difference maker".
Landry is an athletic freak. He's not a johnny come lately waiver wire addition.
I dont see how the two can be compared. Surrounding Kizer with talent is going to help his growth.
Surrounding Kizer with talent is going to help his growth.
I'm going to take issue with that... hear me out...
- Biggest deficiency I've seen in Kizer, and maybe the only one, is that he is not reading the D post-snap, but rather locking onto his pre-snap primary.
- The more success he has playing QB the wrong way, the more it is reinforced.
- The better his receiving corps, the more success he will have playing the wrong way... I've already seen Derek Anderson.
By the above I am not saying our Corps should be talentless. We need route runners with good hands. The danger in excessive receiving talent is enabling QB play that is not sound fundamentally.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Hmm. Surround your qb with mediocre wide receivers... and that helps his development.......
like, he doesn't have anybody to throw to, so he ...grows ...as a qb.....
nope. not seein it... probably just me.
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Surrounding Kizer with talent is going to help his growth.
I'm going to take issue with that... hear me out...
- Biggest deficiency I've seen in Kizer, and maybe the only one, is that he is not reading the D post-snap, but rather locking onto his pre-snap primary.
- The more success he has playing QB the wrong way, the more it is reinforced.
- The better his receiving corps, the more success he will have playing the wrong way... I've already seen Derek Anderson.
By the above I am not saying our Corps should be talentless. We need route runners with good hands. The danger in excessive receiving talent is enabling QB play that is not sound fundamentally.
I'm going to take issue with that... hear me out...
- Biggest deficiency I've seen in Kizer, and maybe the only one, is that he is not reading the D post-snap, but rather locking onto his pre-snap primary.
- The more success he has playing QB the wrong way, the more it is reinforced.
- The better his receiving corps, the more success he will have playing the wrong way... I've already seen Derek Anderson.
By the above I am not saying our Corps should be talentless. We need route runners with good hands. The danger in excessive receiving talent is enabling QB play that is not sound fundamentally.
I'm going to rewatch it today while recording so I can look in more detail. But I do recall from just first viewing on the web (without being able to replay in detail) that multiple times he made a read and changed the play pre-snap. I know that's different from post-snap, but encouraging nonetheless. I do know I hope our WR corps can get open AND be capable of bailing him out on off-target throws. The great ones do that and make it look easy.
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Hmm. Surround your qb with mediocre wide receivers... and that helps his development.......
like, he doesn't have anybody to throw to, so he ...grows ...as a qb.....
nope. not seein it... probably just me.
I've seen ample evidence of pre-snap reading as well. Problem is I've never seen him come off his pre-snap.
No better example than his great throw to Coleman after scrambling to his left. He locked on Coleman immediately and never came off him... and he got away with it. Great result... terrible QB play.
Hmm. Surround your qb with mediocre wide receivers... and that helps his development....... like, he doesn't have anybody to throw to, so he ...grows ...as a qb.....
nope. not seein it... probably just me.
lol... nah, you'll have plenty of company.... I know this one is "out there"... even for me.
But it would help if y'all at least stick to the scenario I presented...
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I don't like this "cut them all at once" policy. There should be some intitial cuts made now. That way, if someone is available, you can pick them up, get them into the lineup in the final preseason game, and get them into your system a bit. Now, all cuts being made only after the last preseason game means that a new team picking up a guy must inculcate them into their system only during the regular season. Bad policy imo.
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Agree, Gip... just doesn't seem to be in keeping with maximizing the league's talent level and strengthening the lesser teams.
Plus in the past waiver wire action has been a great source of fan discussion. This year? Not so much....
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Agree, Gip... just doesn't seem to be in keeping with maximizing the league's talent level and strengthening the lesser teams.
Plus in the past waiver wire action has been a great source of fan discussion. This year? Not so much....
Agree, Gip... just doesn't seem to be in keeping with maximizing the league's talent level and strengthening the lesser teams.
Plus in the past waiver wire action has been a great source of fan discussion. This year? Not so much....
Well...it probably WILL be once they end up making cuts. Right now, there is not much to discuss. Browns did let go of a couple of players: Des Bryant (probably so that he COULD get picked up by another team and get going with their system). Who else? And Browns did pick up at least one guy...another Bryant...the DB. Anyone else?
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Agree, Gip... just doesn't seem to be in keeping with maximizing the league's talent level and strengthening the lesser teams.
Plus in the past waiver wire action has been a great source of fan discussion. This year? Not so much....
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Agree, Gip... just doesn't seem to be in keeping with maximizing the league's talent level and strengthening the lesser teams.
Plus in the past waiver wire action has been a great source of fan discussion. This year? Not so much....
Well...it probably WILL be once they end up making cuts. Right now, there is not much to discuss. Browns did let go of a couple of players: Des Bryant (probably so that he COULD get picked up by another team and get going with their system). Who else? And Browns did pick up at least one guy...another Bryant...the DB. Anyone else?
Well...it probably WILL be once they end up making cuts. Right now, there is not much to discuss. Browns did let go of a couple of players: Des Bryant (probably so that he COULD get picked up by another team and get going with their system). Who else? And Browns did pick up at least one guy...another Bryant...the DB. Anyone else?
Not well expressed by me, but the thought was that in the past there were weeks of buzz around the waiver wire and roster moves with a fresh wave coming weekly.
This year, yes, there will be "buzz", but it's going to be compressed into 24 hours.
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Surrounding Kizer with talent is going to help his growth.
I'm going to take issue with that... hear me out...
- Biggest deficiency I've seen in Kizer, and maybe the only one, is that he is not reading the D post-snap, but rather locking onto his pre-snap primary.
- The more success he has playing QB the wrong way, the more it is reinforced.
- The better his receiving corps, the more success he will have playing the wrong way... I've already seen Derek Anderson.
By the above I am not saying our Corps should be talentless. We need route runners with good hands. The danger in excessive receiving talent is enabling QB play that is not sound fundamentally.
I'm going to take issue with that... hear me out...
- Biggest deficiency I've seen in Kizer, and maybe the only one, is that he is not reading the D post-snap, but rather locking onto his pre-snap primary.
- The more success he has playing QB the wrong way, the more it is reinforced.
- The better his receiving corps, the more success he will have playing the wrong way... I've already seen Derek Anderson.
By the above I am not saying our Corps should be talentless. We need route runners with good hands. The danger in excessive receiving talent is enabling QB play that is not sound fundamentally.
I'd be more inclined to agree if I saw anything from Kizer that would indicate he plays "the wrong way". He's showing a ton of plus traits - in the physical, mechanical and mental aspects.
He does lock onto reads at times, but he's a rookie and that will happen. He's also shown an ability to move through his progressions at times as well, so I'm not worried about him getting locked into bad habits.
I was actually against adding a receiver, but after this week's preseason game I'm all for adding a sure handed athletic talent. Kizer has the arm talent and poise to be something fun, but watching him deliver strikes to Britt and the others and seeing them hit the turf was supremely depressing.
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I'm going to take issue with that... hear me out...
- Biggest deficiency I've seen in Kizer, and maybe the only one, is that he is not reading the D post-snap, but rather locking onto his pre-snap primary.
- The more success he has playing QB the wrong way, the more it is reinforced.
- The better his receiving corps, the more success he will have playing the wrong way... I've already seen Derek Anderson.
By the above I am not saying our Corps should be talentless. We need route runners with good hands. The danger in excessive receiving talent is enabling QB play that is not sound fundamentally.
I'd be more inclined to agree if I saw anything from Kizer that would indicate he plays "the wrong way". He's showing a ton of plus traits - in the physical, mechanical and mental aspects.
He does lock onto reads at times, but he's a rookie and that will happen. He's also shown an ability to move through his progressions at times as well, so I'm not worried about him getting locked into bad habits.
I was actually against adding a receiver, but after this week's preseason game I'm all for adding a sure handed athletic talent. Kizer has the arm talent and poise to be something fun, but watching him deliver strikes to Britt and the others and seeing them hit the turf was supremely depressing.
He's also shown an ability to move through his progressions at times as well,
TC, I honestly have not seen it... not even a hint of it... so if you have a particular play in mind, please let me know.
Everything else I agree with... so he has a chance... but that last step is a big one.
One factor I may have overlooked completely is his being fueled by a desire to make Brian Kelly look like the ass many of us think he is. The way Kizer is now talking in glowing terms about his growing relationship with Hue gave rise to the thought of this possible "incentive".
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Except most plays are designed to go to a primary target, or a secondary target, and most plays in the NFL do not have time to develop into tertiary reads.
Maybe think about that, and then you would see him playing the position correctly.
There were a handful of pretty bad plays he had during the first two weeks where he "locked in" and sat in the pocket too long and didn't know where to go with the ball. Those were less frequent in Week 3. That's called progress.
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https://www.dawgsbynature.com/2017/8/28/16211560/browns-could-be-doing-homework-on-trading-for-wr
Recent article on the matter. Not much said in it that hasn't already been said here.
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He's also shown an ability to move through his progressions at times as well,
TC, I honestly have not seen it... not even a hint of it... so if you have a particular play in mind, please let me know.
Everything else I agree with... so he has a chance... but that last step is a big one.
One factor I may have overlooked completely is his being fueled by a desire to make Brian Kelly look like the ass many of us think he is. The way Kizer is now talking in glowing terms about his growing relationship with Hue gave rise to the thought of this possible "incentive".
TC, I honestly have not seen it... not even a hint of it... so if you have a particular play in mind, please let me know.
Everything else I agree with... so he has a chance... but that last step is a big one.
One factor I may have overlooked completely is his being fueled by a desire to make Brian Kelly look like the ass many of us think he is. The way Kizer is now talking in glowing terms about his growing relationship with Hue gave rise to the thought of this possible "incentive".
I'm not good at finding videos to back myself up, but being at the Bucs game I can tell you he did do this at least 2-3 times. There's no doubt he locked onto guys as well, though. He moved up in the pocket extremely well on two occasions (to include the beautiful throw to Coleman) that I was really impressed by as well.
In regards to the WR trade, FWIW local news down here have directly quoted Adam Gase in saying that Jarvis Landry would not be moved by the Dolphins.
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Except most plays are designed to go to a primary target, or a secondary target, and most plays in the NFL do not have time to develop into tertiary reads.
Maybe think about that, and then you would see him playing the position correctly.
There were a handful of pretty bad plays he had during the first two weeks where he "locked in" and sat in the pocket too long and didn't know where to go with the ball. Those were less frequent in Week 3. That's called progress.
Except most plays are designed to go to a primary target, or a secondary target, and most plays in the NFL do not have time to develop into tertiary reads. Maybe think about that, and then you would see him playing the position correctly.
There were a handful of pretty bad plays he had during the first two weeks where he "locked in" and sat in the pocket too long and didn't know where to go with the ball. Those were less frequent in Week 3. That's called progress.
Thus the term primary?
But it's also true that the primary changes based upon the Defensive set... and the Defensive set can change post-snap.
Mike, I'm still working through the TB game, but I did watch the video compilation of every pass Kizer made in the game focusing on his mechanics. But I also watch his helmet and if a QB is coming off his primary it tends to move. I am not seeing it move, but I am still looking. If you have a particular play or plays, let me know.
As for the first two weeks... your "handful" were the times his primary was not open per the route design. Playing against the 2's and 3's there were a lot of open primaries.
I'm not good at finding videos to back myself up, but being at the Bucs game I can tell you he did do this at least 2-3 times. There's no doubt he locked onto guys as well, though. He moved up in the pocket extremely well on two occasions (to include the beautiful throw to Coleman) that I was really impressed by as well.
I'll look for them.... the pocket movement has been noted.
On the Coleman throw I did note the "look off" someone (TCPO?) pointed out earlier in the discussion. There was a quick glance to the middle of the field following the pump fake... probably part of the play design to hold the safety
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