8 Drops in one game
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Saquon Barkley is who we need to get this run game out the shitter
He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
Our run game is in the shitter.
Now I know many of you remember Trent Richardson so I can see the concern..
This Barkley cat will probably go top 10, maybe even top 5.
But when is the last time we had a game changer at RB? Jamal Lewis? Jerome Harrison?
Im talking a game changer... It's been about 25+ years..
Having a solid run game will take pressure off of Kizer, set up play action, and give him another weapon to go to.
It's not everyday, 230 lb running backs, with 4.3 speed, come out of college.. This kid is special. -
Saquon Barkley is who we need to get this run game out the shitter
He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
If it is analytic driven...then I CAN very well believe that they would draft Barkley. If the analytics definitely point to him being a top asset, you better ass believe that our FO would consider him.
I just would hope that he would not become like so many other top Penn St. RBs. For a while there several were being picked high in the draft: Curtis Enis, Blair Thomas, Kijana Carter. All complete busts. But if he turned out to be like Lydell Mitchell or Franco Harris (without the cowardly running out of bounds constantly for which Jim Brown criticized him). That would be OK.
Would not many look at him like another Ezekiel Elliott?
There was one guy...Booger McFarland who said the Barkley is the best RB prospect to come along since Barry Sanders.
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He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
Our run game is in the shitter.
Now I know many of you remember Trent Richardson so I can see the concern..
This Barkley cat will probably go top 10, maybe even top 5.
But when is the last time we had a game changer at RB? Jamal Lewis? Jerome Harrison?
Im talking a game changer... It's been about 25+ years..
Having a solid run game will take pressure off of Kizer, set up play action, and give him another weapon to go to.
It's not everyday, 230 lb running backs, with 4.3 speed, come out of college.. This kid is special.Our run game is in the shitter.
Now I know many of you remember Trent Richardson so I can see the concern..
This Barkley cat will probably go top 10, maybe even top 5.
But when is the last time we had a game changer at RB? Jamal Lewis? Jerome Harrison?
Im talking a game changer... It's been about 25+ years..
Having a solid run game will take pressure off of Kizer, set up play action, and give him another weapon to go to.
It's not everyday, 230 lb running backs, with 4.3 speed, come out of college.. This kid is special.Ezekiel Elliott. Adrian Peterson? Err, you mean the Browns? Probably Lewis.
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I think one of the more frustrating aspects of the receivers is that our front office didn't figure out a way to really help our young QB out, and that's a shame. Obviously nobody thought Coleman would be out so early, but how many people in this chat room harped on the sad state of our WR crew? So many people knew we'd struggle catching the ball, and we were force-fed multiple stories about Ricardo Louis being a threat, and how he's "turned the corner", and how he looks like a different player...just enough. We can't catch the ball, and we certainly can't catch a ball that's not perfectly thrown. Other than Duke, Leslie, and Britt (somehow), we haven't made the tough catches, and that's EXACTLY what we HAVE to do in order to move the damn chains.
Now, I WILL say that at least the WR's got open, and that's no small feat. I was seriously worried that our guys wouldn't get open all year, and our poor QB would be stuck trying to find the smallest of the small windows. That doesn't seem to be the case anymore, and as I watched the game again (ouch) I continuously noticed our guys actually getting....OPEN. The real killer was when Kizer screwed up in the red zone and threw the out instead of the inside pattern because once again, our guy was open. First and goal at the 7 yard line...didn't happen. And you know what? GOD FORBID some of these deflections hit the damn ground. I know Britt could've caught that ball, but Jesus. And the one against the Ravens that Weddle caught? Gimme a break.
Something else happened as I watched the game again, and that's how much better Deshone Kizer looked. I'm NOT saying he looked "good" by ANY stretch of the imagination, but it wasn't as bad as it FELT like. Some of his throws were excellent, as was his decision making during parts of the game. Some of those slants to Duke Johnson were right on point, and he made a couple of beautiful deep passes too. That one to Britt was PERFECT, and I'm still not sure why he went out of bounds. He wouldn't have gone the distance, but it looked to me like he could've stayed in play. That deep ball to Ricardo Louis was perfect as well, but obviously skillet hands dropped it like he normally does. He probably would've been tackled when he caught it, but if he somehow shakes that one guy, he's gone. Remember long touchdowns? Neither do I.
I thought some passes to Devalve were excellent, too. I know he had a drop, and it's inexcusable, but Devalve continues to be solid. And how about that looping pass to the open Njoku at the goal line? Yeah he was open, but still...Kizer FINALLY didn't try to throw it too hard, and he put perfect touch on it. I'm starting to see a LITTLE bit of finesse from Kizer, and that's a good thing. I don't put any stock in the final interception Kizer threw, so his final day doesn't look too awful. He really should've had just the one pick, and then his numbers would've looked decent.
What I want to talk about, and the reason we lost, are the drops and the penalties. I realize the refs didn't do us any favors (shocking), but the offensive pass interference calls HAVE TO STOP. I have NEVER, and I mean, NEVER seen that many calls in my LIFE. It's unbelievable. What's more, I've never seen THAT many drops AND that many pass interference calls COMBINED in 6 games, let alone just the last 4 quarters. We need to surround Kizer with talent, and it's pathetic what we're doing to this guy. Taylor Gabriel anyone? Wouldn't HE look good?
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I think one of the more frustrating aspects of the receivers is that our front office didn't figure out a way to really help our young QB out, and that's a shame. Obviously nobody thought Coleman would be out so early, but how many people in this chat room harped on the sad state of our WR crew? So many people knew we'd struggle catching the ball, and we were force-fed multiple stories about Ricardo Louis being a threat, and how he's "turned the corner", and how he looks like a different player...just enough. We can't catch the ball, and we certainly can't catch a ball that's not perfectly thrown. Other than Duke, Leslie, and Britt (somehow), we haven't made the tough catches, and that's EXACTLY what we HAVE to do in order to move the damn chains.
Now, I WILL say that at least the WR's got open, and that's no small feat. I was seriously worried that our guys wouldn't get open all year, and our poor QB would be stuck trying to find the smallest of the small windows. That doesn't seem to be the case anymore, and as I watched the game again (ouch) I continuously noticed our guys actually getting....OPEN. The real killer was when Kizer screwed up in the red zone and threw the out instead of the inside pattern because once again, our guy was open. First and goal at the 7 yard line...didn't happen. And you know what? GOD FORBID some of these deflections hit the damn ground. I know Britt could've caught that ball, but Jesus. And the one against the Ravens that Weddle caught? Gimme a break.
Something else happened as I watched the game again, and that's how much better Deshone Kizer looked. I'm NOT saying he looked "good" by ANY stretch of the imagination, but it wasn't as bad as it FELT like. Some of his throws were excellent, as was his decision making during parts of the game. Some of those slants to Duke Johnson were right on point, and he made a couple of beautiful deep passes too. That one to Britt was PERFECT, and I'm still not sure why he went out of bounds. He wouldn't have gone the distance, but it looked to me like he could've stayed in play. That deep ball to Ricardo Louis was perfect as well, but obviously skillet hands dropped it like he normally does. He probably would've been tackled when he caught it, but if he somehow shakes that one guy, he's gone. Remember long touchdowns? Neither do I.
I thought some passes to Devalve were excellent, too. I know he had a drop, and it's inexcusable, but Devalve continues to be solid. And how about that looping pass to the open Njoku at the goal line? Yeah he was open, but still...Kizer FINALLY didn't try to throw it too hard, and he put perfect touch on it. I'm starting to see a LITTLE bit of finesse from Kizer, and that's a good thing. I don't put any stock in the final interception Kizer threw, so his final day doesn't look too awful. He really should've had just the one pick, and then his numbers would've looked decent.
What I want to talk about, and the reason we lost, are the drops and the penalties. I realize the refs didn't do us any favors (shocking), but the offensive pass interference calls HAVE TO STOP. I have NEVER, and I mean, NEVER seen that many calls in my LIFE. It's unbelievable. What's more, I've never seen THAT many drops AND that many pass interference calls COMBINED in 6 games, let alone just the last 4 quarters. We need to surround Kizer with talent, and it's pathetic what we're doing to this guy. Taylor Gabriel anyone? Wouldn't HE look good?
Something else happened as I watched the game again, and that's how much better Deshone Kizer looked.
Saw the same thing live... more surveying, if not actual progressions... some touch here and there... a better "time to bail" clock. While still not the norm.... still not the go to modes... I saw more of them.
And that's a good thing.
#BabySteps
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Something else happened as I watched the game again, and that's how much better Deshone Kizer looked.
Saw the same thing live... more surveying, if not actual progressions... some touch here and there... a better "time to bail" clock. While still not the norm.... still not the go to modes... I saw more of them.
And that's a good thing.
#BabySteps
Saw the same thing live... more surveying, if not actual progressions... some touch here and there... a better "time to bail" clock. While still not the norm.... still not the go to modes... I saw more of them.
And that's a good thing.
#BabySteps
Just watch the game for the last 12 minutes or so. I could see a QB really running an offense and trying to get us back in the game. Had we had a decent clock manager and a reasonable onside kick, this could have ended very differently.
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Saw the same thing live... more surveying, if not actual progressions... some touch here and there... a better "time to bail" clock. While still not the norm.... still not the go to modes... I saw more of them.
And that's a good thing.
#BabySteps
Just watch the game for the last 12 minutes or so. I could see a QB really running an offense and trying to get us back in the game. Had we had a decent clock manager and a reasonable onside kick, this could have ended very differently.
Just watch the game for the last 12 minutes or so. I could see a QB really running an offense and trying to get us back in the game. Had we had a decent clock manager and a reasonable onside kick, this could have ended very differently.
Yes, both onside kick attempts were pretty lame....and never had a chance to be successful. Rookie kicker. Maybe like our other rookies we can hope he will get better.
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He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
If it is analytic driven...then I CAN very well believe that they would draft Barkley. If the analytics definitely point to him being a top asset, you better ass believe that our FO would consider him.
I just would hope that he would not become like so many other top Penn St. RBs. For a while there several were being picked high in the draft: Curtis Enis, Blair Thomas, Kijana Carter. All complete busts. But if he turned out to be like Lydell Mitchell or Franco Harris (without the cowardly running out of bounds constantly for which Jim Brown criticized him). That would be OK.
Would not many look at him like another Ezekiel Elliott?
There was one guy...Booger McFarland who said the Barkley is the best RB prospect to come along since Barry Sanders.
If it is analytic driven...then I CAN very well believe that they would draft Barkley. If the analytics definitely point to him being a top asset, you better ass believe that our FO would consider him.
I just would hope that he would not become like so many other top Penn St. RBs. For a while there several were being picked high in the draft: Curtis Enis, Blair Thomas, Kijana Carter. All complete busts. But if he turned out to be like Lydell Mitchell or Franco Harris (without the cowardly running out of bounds constantly for which Jim Brown criticized him). That would be OK.
Would not many look at him like another Ezekiel Elliott?
There was one guy...Booger McFarland who said the Barkley is the best RB prospect to come along since Barry Sanders.
Analytics is about maximizing value.
Using a top 5 pick overall on the position with easily the shortest shelf life would in no way be an analytics-driven move.
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He is an amazing talent. No doubt.
But I can't see using the Browns top pick - which most of us would agree will be another top 5 pick - on ANY RB. And for a team that is so analytic-driven, I have a hard time believing they would either.
If it is analytic driven...then I CAN very well believe that they would draft Barkley. If the analytics definitely point to him being a top asset, you better ass believe that our FO would consider him.
I just would hope that he would not become like so many other top Penn St. RBs. For a while there several were being picked high in the draft: Curtis Enis, Blair Thomas, Kijana Carter. All complete busts. But if he turned out to be like Lydell Mitchell or Franco Harris (without the cowardly running out of bounds constantly for which Jim Brown criticized him). That would be OK.
Would not many look at him like another Ezekiel Elliott?
There was one guy...Booger McFarland who said the Barkley is the best RB prospect to come along since Barry Sanders.
There was one guy...Booger McFarland who said the Barkley is the best RB prospect to come along since Barry Sanders.
Booger McFarland is also the guy that told the football world that Garrett takes plays off..That's not a booger..That's a brain Cell..McFarland also played at Louisiana State..Your stooping to "The Waterboy" level with McFarland
Browns & Buffett: Got to go fishin, Down to rock bottom again, with just a few Friends -
Booger was right about Myles.
Though off off the cuff atrociously wrong about Barkley. Best since Barry Sanders? Is Barry Sanders even the best since Barry Sanders?
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There was one guy...Booger McFarland who said the Barkley is the best RB prospect to come along since Barry Sanders.
Booger McFarland is also the guy that told the football world that Garrett takes plays off..That's not a booger..That's a brain Cell..McFarland also played at Louisiana State..Your stooping to "The Waterboy" level with McFarland
Booger McFarland is also the guy that told the football world that Garrett takes plays off..That's not a booger..That's a brain Cell..McFarland also played at Louisiana State..Your stooping to "The Waterboy" level with McFarland
Garrett did take plays off....in college. That was accurate. And I will still reserve judgment on Garrett until he actually plays in some real NFL games...and not in preseason.
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Mostly on the WRs. Louis dropped a pass that my 6 year old nephew would have made. Yes Kizer is missing on a few throws but his a rookie QB thats expected, but when you have shitheads like "Butterfinger Britt" dropping balls left and right, that does Kizer no favors. Also why the fuck are we throwing the ball 50 times a game, like WTF!
Also why the fuck are we throwing the ball 50 times a game, like WTF!
Penalties+underwhelming run game+dropped passes=3 and long and a stagnant offense. I don't know the numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that the Browns average yards to gain on 3rd down is worst in the league. Add in the fact that the Browns haven't held a lead all season.... teams that are always playing from behind and can't stay on schedule offensively rarely run the ball.
At at this point we can only hope that the youngest team in the league can grow up a bit as the season wears on.
Edit: https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/third-down-conversion-pct
Cleveland is 31st in 3rd down conversion % at 27% a figure that is almost 10 percentage points lower than last years team. this team will struggle until they find a way to limit the self-inflicted wounds.
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Also why the fuck are we throwing the ball 50 times a game, like WTF!
Penalties+underwhelming run game+dropped passes=3 and long and a stagnant offense. I don't know the numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that the Browns average yards to gain on 3rd down is worst in the league. Add in the fact that the Browns haven't held a lead all season.... teams that are always playing from behind and can't stay on schedule offensively rarely run the ball.
At at this point we can only hope that the youngest team in the league can grow up a bit as the season wears on.
Edit: https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/third-down-conversion-pct
Cleveland is 31st in 3rd down conversion % at 27% a figure that is almost 10 percentage points lower than last years team. this team will struggle until they find a way to limit the self-inflicted wounds.
Penalties+underwhelming run game+dropped passes=3 and long and a stagnant offense. I don't know the numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that the Browns average yards to gain on 3rd down is worst in the league. Add in the fact that the Browns haven't held a lead all season.... teams that are always playing from behind and can't stay on schedule offensively rarely run the ball.
At at this point we can only hope that the youngest team in the league can grow up a bit as the season wears on.
Edit: https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/third-down-conversion-pct
Cleveland is 31st in 3rd down conversion % at 27% a figure that is almost 10 percentage points lower than last years team. this team will struggle until they find a way to limit the self-inflicted wounds.
And yet, to me, still....the reason the Browns lost that game was because of their poor defensive coverage of T.Y. Hilton.
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Is this on our receivers? Are they literally the least competent in all the NFL?? Is this the case or does Kizer not throw a "catchable ball"? I will say he seems to throw the short passes like they are meant to penetrate concrete. What say you experts?
Is this on our receivers? Are they literally the least competent in all the NFL?? Is this the case or does Kizer not throw a "catchable ball"? I will say he seems to throw the short passes like they are meant to penetrate concrete. What say you experts?
I've been leaning toward blaming Kizer somehow and perhaps him not throwing a catchable ball ... that is until I attended a high school game last night that had a mammoth QB at the helm. This kid was one of the biggest, broadest kids on the field on either side of the ball and he played QB. He threw 90% of his passes with no touch on the ball. After being off the mark on his first few throws (each time I've watched him play), he threw a few receivers open and he threw many hard passes with the nose down that receivers went down and stabbed. My point is, that this HUGE QB hasn't fully honed his touch yet and these little dime-a-dozen 155-lb WR's who might play in a few backyard Turkey Bowls with their neighborhood friends after high school, adapted to one another, so I'm off the "catchable ball" whitchhunt.
I believe it's a mentality. I just read in another thread where a couple of posters here were mocking if Jim Brown could play in this era. They sighted his size and the size of would-be tacklers of the era. What they failed to measure was Jim Browns heart and determination. A stat and measure not even worth dissecting with this current Browns franchise since their return in 1999. It is a lack on concentration, a lack of pride, a lack of accountability, a lack of leadership. What would Manning do with such drops in a game? What would Farve do? What would Belichick do? ... there's your answer. High School kids have more pride.
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Just review the 2nd half offensive possessions of Colts game..The best coach/QB teaching moments of season..Deep ball has touch with elevation. Kizer issue comes on short routes, holding ball till creating death grip on ball to protect..comes out flat with no touch like throwing a dart at a balloon board 50 mph..Hue forced Kizer on one play just to throw a lolly-pop bubble screen to sideline just to settle down his accuracy..Does the 2nd Half team show up 4 quarters this week? To the Bunch that are going to game this week..EnJoy!!Be Loud!! Get Some & Get a Win!!
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Penalties+underwhelming run game+dropped passes=3 and long and a stagnant offense. I don't know the numbers, but I'd be willing to bet that the Browns average yards to gain on 3rd down is worst in the league. Add in the fact that the Browns haven't held a lead all season.... teams that are always playing from behind and can't stay on schedule offensively rarely run the ball.
At at this point we can only hope that the youngest team in the league can grow up a bit as the season wears on.
Edit: https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/third-down-conversion-pct
Cleveland is 31st in 3rd down conversion % at 27% a figure that is almost 10 percentage points lower than last years team. this team will struggle until they find a way to limit the self-inflicted wounds.
And yet, to me, still....the reason the Browns lost that game was because of their poor defensive coverage of T.Y. Hilton.
And yet, to me, still....the reason the Browns lost that game was because of their poor defensive coverage of T.Y. Hilton.
No arguments here, the first half defense of the Browns was an embarrassment. I'm glad they made the proper adjustments at the half, but it was too late by then.
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They've still had a chance to win each game so far, which is amazing considering they've looked like garbage. Kizer was never close to being ready, and he'll get much better as the year progresses, but why on earth is he throwing the ball 40+ times a game? There is no "commitment to run the ball" as Hue promised. Add in the fact that penalties and drops often kill any early momentum, and it's not looking good for them unless something changes.
Nobody expected a playoff team this year, but it's been brutal to watch an entire WR roster drop pass after pass, or get flagged every other play
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They've still had a chance to win each game so far, which is amazing considering they've looked like garbage. Kizer was never close to being ready, and he'll get much better as the year progresses, but why on earth is he throwing the ball 40+ times a game? There is no "commitment to run the ball" as Hue promised. Add in the fact that penalties and drops often kill any early momentum, and it's not looking good for them unless something changes.
Nobody expected a playoff team this year, but it's been brutal to watch an entire WR roster drop pass after pass, or get flagged every other play
They've still had a chance to win each game so far, which is amazing considering they've looked like garbage. Kizer was never close to being ready, and he'll get much better as the year progresses, but why on earth is he throwing the ball 40+ times a game? There is no "commitment to run the ball" as Hue promised. Add in the fact that penalties and drops often kill any early momentum, and it's not looking good for them unless something changes.
Nobody expected a playoff team this year, but it's been brutal to watch an entire WR roster drop pass after pass, or get flagged every other play
Four offensive pass interference penalties in one game was almost impressive, in a sadistic way.
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