monday night football crew trolls....
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I'm still not convinced that had we of drafted him, he would be something else entirely....... and not in a good Las Vegas way.
Man, bro, c'mon. This is the worst apologetic euphemism of all. " Yeah, he's good, but I 'm just not sure he would have worked in Cleveland".
Dude, just man up and admit it, the Browns are a laughing stock because of their drafting. The Browns blew it with Wentz, and Goff, too. Julio Jones wasn't good enough, Ben wasn't good enough.................. always the excuse, "Oh, he wouldn't have worked out in Cleveland".
Here is the real issue. For whatever reason, the Cleveland Browns have purposely chosen not to participate in the drafting of top QBs and WRs, and it has finally come home to haunt us.
Man, bro, c'mon. This is the worst apologetic euphemism of all. " Yeah, he's good, but I 'm just not sure he would have worked in Cleveland".
Dude, just man up and admit it, the Browns are a laughing stock because of their drafting. The Browns blew it with Wentz, and Goff, too. Julio Jones wasn't good enough, Ben wasn't good enough.................. always the excuse, "Oh, he wouldn't have worked out in Cleveland".
Here is the real issue. For whatever reason, the Cleveland Browns have purposely chosen not to participate in the drafting of top QBs and WRs, and it has finally come home to haunt us.
I guess it's just decades of being beaten down............
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No no no. None of this nonsense they people knew Wentz would be good. None of these comments saying he'd perform like that here
Go look at the Eagles skill players. Now look at ours
No no no. None of this nonsense they people knew Wentz would be good. None of these comments saying he'd perform like that here
Go look at the Eagles skill players. Now look at ours
He was #1 or #2 in most scouts reports, so I think tons of people expected him to be very good. The Eagles gave up a lot to get that pick. They expected him to be awesome too. Nobody really expected it this fast, or expected him to have 17 TD's already, but they absolutely thought he'd be a good QB with sky high upside. What's pathetic is he had more wins after 3 games than we'll prob have in 2 full seasons. Hey, it's not like there was a law keeping them from picking a standout WR other than Coleman, injuries suck, its not his fault, but he's still been unable to play.
It is relevant because he was right there for the Browns and everyone knows we F'd up. Two yrs in a row, the higher powers of football are dropping a potential pro bowler right in your lap, and our decision makers think "nah, we're good w/ our QB's" Not to play favorites, they also miss on any WR they draft as well.
You realize the last rookie QB that had some highlight reel throws and showed promise in a W for us was JFF? You should be able to put more than 1 win together in 1.5 seasons. There is no way they have that little talent, and if they truly have that little talent, then that's just more proof that the organization has absolutely no idea what it's doing and Sashi And Paul need beaten with rubber hoses.
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Zombo said:
They haven't mentioned the 5 times we could have had Cousins ... so there's that.
Zombo
I think I will post this whenever I see that guy mentioned.
Kirk Cousins can blow me.
WSS
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No no no. None of this nonsense they people knew Wentz would be good. None of these comments saying he'd perform like that here
Go look at the Eagles skill players. Now look at ours
No no no. None of this nonsense they people knew Wentz would be good. None of these comments saying he'd perform like that here
Go look at the Eagles skill players. Now look at ours
I have, and it's really not true. First off, it's not my job that I get paid 100's of thousands of dollars to do to decide who is good and who isn't. There are pretty solid rumors that this FO thought Wentz wasn't even going to be a top 20 QB. That's bad, really bad.
Now let's talk about the talent fallacy. Here's all the guys who caught and rushed for the Eagles in 2016: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/phi/2016.htm
Tell me, who jumps off the page at you there? Let's start with Ertz, because he's a good player no doubt. But beyond that-Jordan Matthews, the dude they traded because they didn't see enough talent?Nelson Agholor, the dude who until the end of last year was firmly on the "bust" bubble? Ryan Matthews, the oft injured back? Darren Sproles, a good player but who was 32 last year? Point is, while the talent was perhaps marginally better, it wasn't days better. Wentz showed last year he was the dude despite the talent.
So yeah, they upgraded a decent bit for 2017. Here's the roster now: http://www.nfl.com/teams/philadelphiaeagles/roster?team=PHI
But who ACTUALLY jumps off the page there again beside Ertz? Alshon Jeffrey, a oft injured dude who couldn't get more than a "show me" 1 year deal? Torrey Smith, a long since journeyman? Blount, a bruiser for sure but who's turning 32 this year?
So no man, the talent isn't days ahead of ours. The difference is they have a QB who MAKES the talent better, not EXPECTS the talent to bail him out. That fundamental difference is there for quality, franchise QB's and the garbage we've been churning since 1999. There's no excuse-this dude literally fell into our lap and somehow he got brushed aside.
I'll leave you with this:
This isn't the type of Sheet someone learns. This is the type of thing someone has or they don't. We easily could have drafted the guy who had it, and we didn't. Plain and simple, and this is the type of mistake that should cost jobs.
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No no no. None of this nonsense they people knew Wentz would be good. None of these comments saying he'd perform like that here
Go look at the Eagles skill players. Now look at ours
No no no. None of this nonsense they people knew Wentz would be good. None of these comments saying he'd perform like that here
Go look at the Eagles skill players. Now look at ours
The flipside to that is that you can build up your other skill positions once you have your guy. Wentz may not look like the player he is now for the Eagles but he would still look like something you could build a team around. The Kizer pick and likely one other would have been WRs.
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There's no justifying it, the browns made a terrible decision in not drafting Wentz. It almost makes me sick to my stomach honestly. He's the next Big Ben and instead we got a wr who can't keep his hand in one piece. Colossal swing and a miss.
There's no justifying it, the browns made a terrible decision in not drafting Wentz. It almost makes me sick to my stomach honestly. He's the next Big Ben and instead we got a wr who can't keep his hand in one piece. Colossal swing and a miss.
You pretty much nailed it. Our front office will never get away from Wentz, and they'll never get away from Watson. It will haunt them and our fans for years to come. I predicted it will cost our front office their jobs. When we brought in Hue and the new front office, the MAIN GOAL was obviously to construct a team built for the long run, but do you remember how everyone was talking about "getting the QB position fixed"? Yeah, and how's THAT going so far, brain trust? The worst part was how Sashi doubled down on his ignorance by saying, "We didn't have him as a top 20 QB"? BWAHAHAHAHA.
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There's no justifying it, the browns made a terrible decision in not drafting Wentz. It almost makes me sick to my stomach honestly. He's the next Big Ben and instead we got a wr who can't keep his hand in one piece. Colossal swing and a miss.
There's no justifying it, the browns made a terrible decision in not drafting Wentz. It almost makes me sick to my stomach honestly. He's the next Big Ben and instead we got a wr who can't keep his hand in one piece. Colossal swing and a miss.
You cant just say coleman. Who else did the browns draft with the trade down accumulation of draft picks?
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There's no justifying it, the browns made a terrible decision in not drafting Wentz. It almost makes me sick to my stomach honestly. He's the next Big Ben and instead we got a wr who can't keep his hand in one piece. Colossal swing and a miss.
You cant just say coleman. Who else did the browns draft with the trade down accumulation of draft picks?
You cant just say coleman. Who else did the browns draft with the trade down accumulation of draft picks?
The Browns got the following:
#8 pick (turned to 15) to pick Coleman-not working out so far
3rd round pick-OT shone Coleman. He is a starter but not showing to be elite, yet anyway
2017-1st round pick-hard to say exactly due to trade, but closest pick would have been for Peppers. Big ol bag of nope so far.
2018- 2nd round pick, obviously TBD.
So yeah man, I can say in that trade the Eagles were the CLEAR winners unless that 2nd round pick turns into an elite franchise QB.
You pretty much nailed it. Our front office will never get away from Wentz, and they'll never get away from Watson. It will haunt them and our fans for years to come. I predicted it will cost our front office their jobs. When we brought in Hue and the new front office, the MAIN GOAL was obviously to construct a team built for the long run, but do you remember how everyone was talking about "getting the QB position fixed"? Yeah, and how's THAT going so far, brain trust? The worst part was how Sashi doubled down on his ignorance by saying, "We didn't have him as a top 20 QB"? BWAHAHAHAHA.
Watson I can at least justify, at least a little bit. There was a good bit to like, but there was a lot of question marks that still could be exposed at teams prepare for him. Wentz draft status basically boiled down to the fact he hurt his wrist (understandable) and he played in FCS (somewhat legit). Literally everything else was A+ draft stock.
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Yeah? Actually I'd rather be in the brown situation than taken Jared Goff, who cost the first overall pick. It's a crapshoot kids.
WSS
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I didn't want goff at all. ... I even showed pics of Wentz and his pretty girlfriend...
and then couldn't find a pic of goff with anybody ever. He was boring.
Ah, just draft Josh Allen next year and we can forget about agonizing over Wentz.
Once in a long while, the Browns should read my mock drafts in the first round. Oh, wait,
maybe they did - they drafted Joe Thomas. LOL
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Yeah? Actually I'd rather be in the brown situation than taken Jared Goff, who cost the first overall pick. It's a crapshoot kids.
WSS
Yeah? Actually I'd rather be in the brown situation than taken Jared Goff, who cost the first overall pick. It's a crapshoot kids.
WSS
I was obviously all in on Wentz ... But Goff is in first place too. 9 TDs 4 INTs. Our QBs are 7 TDs 17 Ints and last place.
But Goff was awful last year ... so there is hope for Kizer next year. Too late to get the Rams coach, I guess.
Zombo
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I'm curious how many people here really wanted the Browns to take a DII QB with 20 or so college starts, who made about a 1/3rd the college pass attempts as Goff #2 overall.
I mean, it's turned out to be the right call, but I'll totally admit I wasn't buying Wentz as he entered the Draft. That being said, this isn't meant to be an excuse for the Browns front office passing him up. They get paid tons of money to make these decisions. I'm a slapdick on a message board talking to other slapdicks.
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i think the fans (including you and i) knew that wentz was the real deal BUT wait.............let's trade down!!!!
i think the fans (including you and i) knew that wentz was the real deal BUT wait.............let's trade down!!!!
I didn't... still don't...
Where’s Tour2ma and his cowpoop theory about how Wentz can’t throw down field or work through progressions?
Hey Mikey! Good old, "Manziel hit'em in stride", Mikey...
Just wrote up how I still don't see "progressions" from Carson... doesn't come off his primary ever, unless he's pressured.
As for throw downfield... I don't reacall that, but if I said it, I was wrong. Kid throws a great deep ball... kid throws a great ball period... just to his first read... unless he's pressured.
Don't be a stranger...
Oh.... and you can't say "poop" anymore here...
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Carson Wentz vs Redskins..
68.0%
268 Yards
4TDs
1INT
126.3 Rating
Should have drafted Carson Wentz..
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I didn't want goff at all. ... I even showed pics of Wentz and his pretty girlfriend...
and then couldn't find a pic of goff with anybody ever. He was boring.
Ah, just draft Josh Allen next year and we can forget about agonizing over Wentz.
Once in a long while, the Browns should read my mock drafts in the first round. Oh, wait,
maybe they did - they drafted Joe Thomas. LOL
I didn't want goff at all.
I did...
A lot easier to admit this season.
I'm curious how many people here really wanted the Browns to take a DII QB with 20 or so college starts, who made about a 1/3rd the college pass attempts as Goff #2 overall.
I mean, it's turned out to be the right call, but I'll totally admit I wasn't buying Wentz as he entered the Draft. That being said, this isn't meant to be an excuse for the Browns front office passing him up. They get paid tons of money to make these decisions. I'm a slapdick on a message board talking to other slapdicks.
There were plenty that wanted Wentz.... but as Mikey, with whom you never had the pleasure of posting, intimated, I was not among them for the very reasons you mentioned.
Now? Everyone with an inkling is coming out of the Wentz woodwork. Romanticizing the guy as a consensus "top one or two" pick when he wasn't. The guy that caused CBS Sports to give the Iggles draft a "B-" for overdrafting him... for overraching for him.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I didn't want goff at all.
I did...
A lot easier to admit this season.
I'm curious how many people here really wanted the Browns to take a DII QB with 20 or so college starts, who made about a 1/3rd the college pass attempts as Goff #2 overall.
I mean, it's turned out to be the right call, but I'll totally admit I wasn't buying Wentz as he entered the Draft. That being said, this isn't meant to be an excuse for the Browns front office passing him up. They get paid tons of money to make these decisions. I'm a slapdick on a message board talking to other slapdicks.
There were plenty that wanted Wentz.... but as Mikey, with whom you never had the pleasure of posting, intimated, I was not among them for the very reasons you mentioned.
Now? Everyone with an inkling is coming out of the Wentz woodwork. Romanticizing the guy as a consensus "top one or two" pick when he wasn't. The guy that caused CBS Sports to give the Iggles draft a "B-" for overdrafting him... for overraching for him.
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Zombo said:
They haven't mentioned the 5 times we could have had Cousins ... so there's that.
Zombo
WHY IN GODDAMN HELL DIDN'T WE DRAFT BART STARR IN 1956 TO TAKE OVER FROM THE RETIRING OTTO GRAHAM. DAMMIT HE WAS THERE FOR US TO PICK AT #200. INSTEAD WE TAKE THE LIKES OF SHERMAN PLUNKETT, BILL UNDERDONK....YES...THAT'S HIS REAL NAME. HARRY JAVERNICK, AND THURLOW COOPER. IT MAKES MY BLOOD BOIL TO THINK THAT WE COULDA HAD HIM AND WE PASSED ON HIM. I DON'T CARE THAT I WAS 4 YEARS OLD AT THE TIME AND I AM NOW 65....ITS JUST ANOTHER LINE OF DAMNED STUPID MISTAKES BY THE BROWNS FRONT OFFICE. BY CHRIST WHY CAN'T THEY DO SOMETHING RIGHT FOR ONCE! THAT PAUL BROWN COULDN'T TELL A QB FROM A GOPHER HOLE!!!!!
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Zombo said:
They haven't mentioned the 5 times we could have had Cousins ... so there's that.
Zombo
WHY IN GODDAMN HELL DIDN'T WE DRAFT BART STARR IN 1956 TO TAKE OVER FROM THE RETIRING OTTO GRAHAM. DAMMIT HE WAS THERE FOR US TO PICK AT #200. INSTEAD WE TAKE THE LIKES OF SHERMAN PLUNKETT, BILL UNDERDONK....YES...THAT'S HIS REAL NAME. HARRY JAVERNICK, AND THURLOW COOPER. IT MAKES MY BLOOD BOIL TO THINK THAT WE COULDA HAD HIM AND WE PASSED ON HIM. I DON'T CARE THAT I WAS 4 YEARS OLD AT THE TIME AND I AM NOW 65....ITS JUST ANOTHER LINE OF DAMNED STUPID MISTAKES BY THE BROWNS FRONT OFFICE. BY CHRIST WHY CAN'T THEY DO SOMETHING RIGHT FOR ONCE! THAT PAUL BROWN COULDN'T TELL A QB FROM A GOPHER HOLE!!!!!
WHY IN GODDAMN HELL DIDN'T WE DRAFT BART STARR IN 1956 TO TAKE OVER FROM THE RETIRING OTTO GRAHAM. DAMMIT HE WAS THERE FOR US TO PICK AT #200. INSTEAD WE TAKE THE LIKES OF SHERMAN PLUNKETT, BILL UNDERDONK....YES...THAT'S HIS REAL NAME. HARRY JAVERNICK, AND THURLOW COOPER. IT MAKES MY BLOOD BOIL TO THINK THAT WE COULDA HAD HIM AND WE PASSED ON HIM. I DON'T CARE THAT I WAS 4 YEARS OLD AT THE TIME AND I AM NOW 65....ITS JUST ANOTHER LINE OF DAMNED STUPID MISTAKES BY THE BROWNS FRONT OFFICE. BY CHRIST WHY CAN'T THEY DO SOMETHING RIGHT FOR ONCE! THAT PAUL BROWN COULDN'T TELL A QB FROM A GOPHER HOLE!!!!!
We get your point.
If Kizer wins a championship like Ryan did everyone will move on from who we have passed over in the past few years.
Until then, it is legitimate conversation on the Browns Board.
Certainly not worth being yelled at in Red All Caps for discussing it.
Z
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WHY IN GODDAMN HELL DIDN'T WE DRAFT BART STARR IN 1956 TO TAKE OVER FROM THE RETIRING OTTO GRAHAM. DAMMIT HE WAS THERE FOR US TO PICK AT #200. INSTEAD WE TAKE THE LIKES OF SHERMAN PLUNKETT, BILL UNDERDONK....YES...THAT'S HIS REAL NAME. HARRY JAVERNICK, AND THURLOW COOPER. IT MAKES MY BLOOD BOIL TO THINK THAT WE COULDA HAD HIM AND WE PASSED ON HIM. I DON'T CARE THAT I WAS 4 YEARS OLD AT THE TIME AND I AM NOW 65....ITS JUST ANOTHER LINE OF DAMNED STUPID MISTAKES BY THE BROWNS FRONT OFFICE. BY CHRIST WHY CAN'T THEY DO SOMETHING RIGHT FOR ONCE! THAT PAUL BROWN COULDN'T TELL A QB FROM A GOPHER HOLE!!!!!
We get your point.
If Kizer wins a championship like Ryan did everyone will move on from who we have passed over in the past few years.
Until then, it is legitimate conversation on the Browns Board.
Certainly not worth being yelled at in Red All Caps for discussing it.
Z
Zombo said:
If Kizer wins a championship like Ryan did everyone will move on from who we have passed over in the past few years.
Or Rosen... or Darnold... or Allen... or ToursSuperSecretSleeperV2018 (who's climbing boards already)
or...
Alex Smith...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Man, bro, c'mon. This is the worst apologetic euphemism of all. " Yeah, he's good, but I 'm just not sure he would have worked in Cleveland".
Dude, just man up and admit it, the Browns are a laughing stock because of their drafting. The Browns blew it with Wentz, and Goff, too. Julio Jones wasn't good enough, Ben wasn't good enough.................. always the excuse, "Oh, he wouldn't have worked out in Cleveland".
Here is the real issue. For whatever reason, the Cleveland Browns have purposely chosen not to participate in the drafting of top QBs and WRs, and it has finally come home to haunt us.
I guess it's just decades of being beaten down............
I guess it's just decades of being beaten down............
It's okay, but you know the first step in beating bad behavior is a face it a la...."I am an alcoholic"
The Browns have a culture problem and it isn't just the FO, The fans, media and some past, influential players feed this mess. Remember, we had two owners that know nothing about football. For whatever reason, the culture around Cleveland is that the team should not "waste" draft picks on QBs and playmakers. This crap about accumulating assets, building for the future, adding all the foundation players, is a cancer............and absolute cancer. You can see the results of it right here on this board. We are 1 - 22 under this philosophy, we have watched great QBs and playmakers come and go....over and over........... and STILL...........there is a prevailing thought process here of F$%# em, those guys suck and would not have been right for our system.
Jesus, Joseph and Mary..............Goff, Wentz, Rivers, J. Jones, AJ, Green, Roethlisberger, and on and on it goes. yeah, none of those guys were a fit for us......... we have gems like Corey Coleman and Kizer.
I am telling you, the first key to the Browns getting better is to get Jim Brown, Bernie Kosar and Doug Dieken as far away from the organization as possible. This BS workman style of drafting has provided 17 years of feces. I don't know of any team who has spent more money or time on the damned OL. JB spent his entire career whining about how Jim Taylor and Paul Horngung had great offensive lines, and I promise you, he is still chirping his BS into Haslam's ear.
Until the Browns management comes forward and says loudly and clearly, " We have been wrong, we have wasted our draft picks on non-essential players, they will continue to be the laughing stock of the NFL.
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