Tashaun Gipson Hopes to "Hang 40" on Browns
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So y'all would have Jimmy stay incredibly under the cap and make more money instead of keeping a decent FS? Jesus. Dude was young and good, Sashi Brown's job is to make Jimmy a team to win for as cheap as possible, which is why we didn't resign him. It doesn't differ much from letting T.J. Ward go without even offering anything. We continue to develop players and then let them play somewhere else. Like Mudfly said awhile back, We cut a bunch of vets and people who were skilled and replaced them with basically infants who are inept. Sure, some of them will be decent, but will we ever get a playoff team without spending the Cap? And please don't say we're going to spend a lot of Cap this offseason and we've been waiting for the third offseason, because until we do it I don't believe it. In fact, I bet we'd let Josh Gordon walk even if he has a great end of the season just to save Jimmy money.
A large deal of the process has to do with saving JIMMY MONEY, if you want to argue against that, show me the proof.
So y'all would have Jimmy stay incredibly under the cap and make more money instead of keeping a decent FS? Jesus. Dude was young and good, Sashi Brown's job is to make Jimmy a team to win for as cheap as possible, which is why we didn't resign him. It doesn't differ much from letting T.J. Ward go without even offering anything. We continue to develop players and then let them play somewhere else. Like Mudfly said awhile back, We cut a bunch of vets and people who were skilled and replaced them with basically infants who are inept. Sure, some of them will be decent, but will we ever get a playoff team without spending the Cap? And please don't say we're going to spend a lot of Cap this offseason and we've been waiting for the third offseason, because until we do it I don't believe it. In fact, I bet we'd let Josh Gordon walk even if he has a great end of the season just to save Jimmy money.
A large deal of the process has to do with saving JIMMY MONEY, if you want to argue against that, show me the proof.
Here's a thought... actually make your case then I'll tear it apart. I'll even give you a peek at my counter...
- Collins...
- Zeitler...
- Osweiler...
As for Tashaun "Dude was young and good" Gipson... yes, he was. He was also badly injured and has never been the same, but he wanted to be paid for what he was pre-injury. ust another in a long line of players whose value we nailed.
If we did what you (and Mud) wanted, we'd be in cap hell before we ever got playoff competitive... and all in the name of a few, meaningless wins.
spending more money usually results in getting better players. or you can keep ricardo louis and bryce treggs and go 1-24.
Two words... Albert Haynesworth...
Need more? Dwayne Bowe...
**Drops Mic**
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
So y'all would have Jimmy stay incredibly under the cap and make more money instead of keeping a decent FS? Jesus. Dude was young and good, Sashi Brown's job is to make Jimmy a team to win for as cheap as possible, which is why we didn't resign him. It doesn't differ much from letting T.J. Ward go without even offering anything. We continue to develop players and then let them play somewhere else. Like Mudfly said awhile back, We cut a bunch of vets and people who were skilled and replaced them with basically infants who are inept. Sure, some of them will be decent, but will we ever get a playoff team without spending the Cap? And please don't say we're going to spend a lot of Cap this offseason and we've been waiting for the third offseason, because until we do it I don't believe it. In fact, I bet we'd let Josh Gordon walk even if he has a great end of the season just to save Jimmy money.
A large deal of the process has to do with saving JIMMY MONEY, if you want to argue against that, show me the proof.
Here's a thought... actually make your case then I'll tear it apart. I'll even give you a peek at my counter...
- Collins...
- Zeitler...
- Osweiler...
As for Tashaun "Dude was young and good" Gipson... yes, he was. He was also badly injured and has never been the same, but he wanted to be paid for what he was pre-injury. ust another in a long line of players whose value we nailed.
If we did what you (and Mud) wanted, we'd be in cap hell before we ever got playoff competitive... and all in the name of a few, meaningless wins.
spending more money usually results in getting better players. or you can keep ricardo louis and bryce treggs and go 1-24.
Two words... Albert Haynesworth...
Need more? Dwayne Bowe...
**Drops Mic**
2017
Cleveland Browns
Approximate space: $105 million
A couple of years of caution and few homegrown talents to reward allowed the Browns to carry over more than $50 million from last year's cap. That accounts for nearly half of this season's league-leading total. Receiver Terrelle Pryor Sr. is in position to consume some of that space, but the Browns already have given linebacker Jamie Collins a four-year extension (2017 cap hit: $12.1 million) and almost certainly will roll over a significant portion of their current space to 2018.
Since the total salary cap from 2013-2016 is $554.55 million, then every NFL team, including the Browns, must have a cash spend of at least 89% of that by the end of the 2016 league year, which is $493.55 million.
More like he had to get someone like Collins and Zeitler.
Need more? Dwayne Bowe...
Just more proof that we need better talent evaluators in there so it doesn't happen again. (cough, BRITT, cough)
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But you said higher pay means better players?
Now I'm confused...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
2017
Cleveland Browns
Approximate space: $105 million
A couple of years of caution and few homegrown talents to reward allowed the Browns to carry over more than $50 million from last year's cap. That accounts for nearly half of this season's league-leading total. Receiver Terrelle Pryor Sr. is in position to consume some of that space, but the Browns already have given linebacker Jamie Collins a four-year extension (2017 cap hit: $12.1 million) and almost certainly will roll over a significant portion of their current space to 2018.
Since the total salary cap from 2013-2016 is $554.55 million, then every NFL team, including the Browns, must have a cash spend of at least 89% of that by the end of the 2016 league year, which is $493.55 million.
More like he had to get someone like Collins and Zeitler.
Need more? Dwayne Bowe...
Just more proof that we need better talent evaluators in there so it doesn't happen again. (cough, BRITT, cough)
2017
Cleveland Browns
Approximate space: $105 million
A couple of years of caution and few homegrown talents to reward allowed the Browns to carry over more than $50 million from last year's cap. That accounts for nearly half of this season's league-leading total. Receiver Terrelle Pryor Sr. is in position to consume some of that space, but the Browns already have given linebacker Jamie Collins a four-year extension (2017 cap hit: $12.1 million) and almost certainly will roll over a significant portion of their current space to 2018.
Since the total salary cap from 2013-2016 is $554.55 million, then every NFL team, including the Browns, must have a cash spend of at least 89% of that by the end of the 2016 league year, which is $493.55 million.
More like he had to get someone like Collins and Zeitler.
Actually we haven't been in "have to spend mode" for a couple seasons now.
And not sure where you got your "approximate" data, but it's clearly months old as it mentions Pryor's bite at the apple. It's also clearly wrong.
Total Cap Liabilities: $155,357,654- Top 51: $84,174,780
- Team Cap Space: $61,841,025
- Offense: $62,618,337
- Defense: $48,438,905
- Special: $5,102,292
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My question about Tashaun's statement: He plays defense, does he not? Then why would he say that he wants to hang "40" on the Browns...assuming he means 40 points.
Shouldn't a defensive player's thought process be more like "We want to hang a Goose Egg" on them? I mean....if the Jags "hang 40" on the Browns...that would be the accomplishment of the offense, not the defense, no? Beyond that....what if the Jags DO "hang 40" on the Browns......but the Browns "hang 42" on that defense? That would be a real slap in the face, no? (not that I would ever expect this offense to score 42 on anyone, particularly the Jags).
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The claim was Gipson is no better than what is currently on the Browns roster which is silly.
BTW, Kindred is a SS while Gip is a FS. So it's not really an apples to apples comparison.
Semi-silly perhaps... but just proves the naysyaers don't have a monopoly on hyperbole...
Peppers was also in my analysis, but then he's not really a FS either... is he?
And then there's the whole issue of Gip being worth his contract... an issue you deftly avoided.
Semi-silly perhaps... but just proves the naysyaers don't have a monopoly on hyperbole...
Peppers was also in my analysis, but then he's not really a FS either... is he?
And then there's the whole issue of Gip being worth his contract... an issue you deftly avoided.
Peppers is a non-factor due to where he plays, certainly no fault of his.
I would say overpaying a free agent is the norm in the NFL.
Is Gip worth $35 million? How about Kenny Britt...is he worth $32 million?
Two things that will define you: Your determination when you have nothing. Your attitude when you have everything. - Mike McCartney -
Semi-silly perhaps... but just proves the naysyaers don't have a monopoly on hyperbole...
Peppers was also in my analysis, but then he's not really a FS either... is he?
And then there's the whole issue of Gip being worth his contract... an issue you deftly avoided.
Peppers is a non-factor due to where he plays, certainly no fault of his.
I would say overpaying a free agent is the norm in the NFL.
Is Gip worth $35 million? How about Kenny Britt...is he worth $32 million?
Is Gip worth $35 million? How about Kenny Britt...is he worth $32 million?
Based upon Britt's 2017 performance? Well, that's a rhetorical question isn't it? Based upon his 2016 performance? Absolutely...
Can you say the same about Gip?
Games Def Interceptions Fumbles Sacks & Tackles Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Int Yds TD Lng PD FF Fmb FR Yds TD Sk Tkl Ast Sfty AV Career 75 67 18 430 2 67 30 1 1 1 0 0 223 92 27 4 yrs CLE 50 42 14 324 2 62 23 1 1 0 0 0 156 79 20 2 yrs JAX 25 25 4 106 0 67 7 0 0 1 0 0 67 13 7 2012 22 CLE fs 39 10 3 1 23 0 23 1 23 6 2 2013 23 CLE FS 39 16 15 5 143 1 44 12 63 31 6 2014* 24 CLE FS 39 11 11 6 158 1 62 8 1 0 0 0 0 28 24 8 2015 25 CLE FS/rcb 39 13 13 2 0 0 0 2 0 1 0 0 0 42 18 4 2016 26 JAX FS 39 16 16 1 30 0 30 2 34 7 7 2017 27 JAX FS 39 9 9 3 76 0 67 5 0 0 1 0 0 33 6 "When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
But you said higher pay means better players?
Now I'm confused...
Kenny Britt was never a WR1. Showed flashes of talent but was lazy. Dwayne Bowe was streaky at best and never a top 5 WR in the league. Collins was one of the only top tier signings we had recently. Usually, more pay = the players are better, doesn't mean people don't make mistakes, but the biggest mistake is leaving gaps all around your team and expecting twenty some year olds to play neck and neck with veterans.
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Well... Britt wasn't signed to be a WR1 was he? Wasn't paid WR1 money, was he?
Yes, he under performed at points in his career including this season to date... until DET, where he lit it up early.... That's the guy we thought we'd signed to be our #2 behind Coleman.
Misses aren't uncommon... even with FAs who have a longer track record. However, I can't recall a member here who did not see the disaster coming that was Dwayne Bowe.
And least we forget... Collins was not an FA signing. He was a "roll-the-dice-and-trade-for-a-player-in-a-contract-year" who saw what we were doing in Believeland and bought into it enough to extend and stay.
Not sure anyone gives our "dismal worthless" FO enough credit for that one.
Good discussion...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Well... Britt wasn't signed to be a WR1 was he? Wasn't paid WR1 money, was he?
Yes, he under performed at points in his career including this season to date... until DET, where he lit it up early.... That's the guy we thought we'd signed to be our #2 behind Coleman.
Misses aren't uncommon... even with FAs who have a longer track record. However, I can't recall a member here who did not see the disaster coming that was Dwayne Bowe.
And least we forget... Collins was not an FA signing. He was a "roll-the-dice-and-trade-for-a-player-in-a-contract-year" who saw what we were doing in Believeland and bought into it enough to extend and stay.
Not sure anyone gives our "dismal worthless" FO enough credit for that one.
Good discussion...
Well... Britt wasn't signed to be a WR1 was he? Wasn't paid WR1 money, was he?
Yes, he under performed at points in his career including this season to date... until DET, where he lit it up early.... That's the guy we thought we'd signed to be our #2 behind Coleman.
Misses aren't uncommon... even with FAs who have a longer track record. However, I can't recall a member here who did not see the disaster coming that was Dwayne Bowe.
And least we forget... Collins was not an FA signing. He was a "roll-the-dice-and-trade-for-a-player-in-a-contract-year" who saw what we were doing in Believeland and bought into it enough to extend and stay.
Not sure anyone gives our "dismal worthless" FO enough credit for that one.
Good discussion...
I'm not talking about the F.O. at all. I'm talking if Jimmy is willing to part ways with his money to sign more FA's or to resign players. So far in his tenor as owner, he hasn't proved that he will.
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Jimmah and the FO are inseparable when it comes to spending... so yes, you are talking about the FO... which in addition to the Collins dice-roll has spent on:
- the Bito extension,
- Zeitler,
- Joe's raise... while he was already under contract...
- Tretter... bit of a pattern in these first four...
- McCourty and Taylor... there.. got off the OL.
Pretty sure I named every player who is not playing under rookie contract... which BTW are cheap contracts. How many picks have we made in the past 3 and 4 years? 30 and 40? Plus UDFAs?
And that's not to mention the $35mm (or was it 50?) or so he poured into stadium rennovations. Do you really think he lays out that kind of cash only to skimp on the product so the place is only half full by the end of Sept?
How 'bout the $16mm paid for a 2nd round pick?
The guaranteed money to get Bowe gone? The past couple staffs... The past couple GMs...
If you can ignore all that, then you are one tuff nut. But a nut with one more year, about 16 months actually, to decry Jimmah's financial commitment.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
So, the more I research this game, the more it looks like it COULD be closer to 40-0 than not. It's bad for us, no question about it. Why? Mainly because of the defensive scheme Jax runs, and the probable injuries of our two starting OT's. I know Hue said we might get Shon Coleman back, but I wouldn't bet on it. Additionally, Tretter popped up on the injury report with like three different injuries, so that's not good either. Jax doesn't blitz a lot. Instead, they consistently rush 4 and their DL runs a BUNCH of stunts and twists. This often confuses OL's and causes all kinds of trouble. If we had our starting OL, I'd feel a LITTLE bit better, but we're far from healthy right now, and it could be a VERY long day for our QB who is suffering from a painful rib injury. It's pretty much the worst matchup we could've hoped for after the injuries suffered in the Lions' game.
Making matters infinitely worse, Jax has talented LB's and DB's. Jalen Ramsey is giving up basically next to nothing this season, and he's a big, strong, athletic CB. Welcome back Corey Coleman. And since Jax doesn't blitz too much, you can bet there are going to be tons of people around the ball in the secondary. Those screen passes to Duke probably won't work, and I don't see the stupid WR screens working either. Right now, I'd probably bet money Kizer doesn't make it through the entire game healthy. He's going to get dropped over and over again.
Our big hope is that Bortles craps the sheets and gives us a few turnovers...maybe even a pick-6. Perhaps we can get a special teams play as well....we're certainly due for one. Bottom line, it's going to be a tough day.
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Well... Britt wasn't signed to be a WR1 was he? Wasn't paid WR1 money, was he?
Yes, he under performed at points in his career including this season to date... until DET, where he lit it up early.... That's the guy we thought we'd signed to be our #2 behind Coleman.
Misses aren't uncommon... even with FAs who have a longer track record. However, I can't recall a member here who did not see the disaster coming that was Dwayne Bowe.
And least we forget... Collins was not an FA signing. He was a "roll-the-dice-and-trade-for-a-player-in-a-contract-year" who saw what we were doing in Believeland and bought into it enough to extend and stay.
Not sure anyone gives our "dismal worthless" FO enough credit for that one.
Good discussion...
Not sure anyone gives our "dismal worthless" FO enough credit for that one.
Good discussion...
I think actually the FO deserves credit for their work in free agency. There have been many more hits than misses. Their draft picks are a bit of a different story however, at least to this point.
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So, the more I research this game, the more it looks like it COULD be closer to 40-0 than not. It's bad for us, no question about it. Why? Mainly because of the defensive scheme Jax runs, and the probable injuries of our two starting OT's. I know Hue said we might get Shon Coleman back, but I wouldn't bet on it. Additionally, Tretter popped up on the injury report with like three different injuries, so that's not good either. Jax doesn't blitz a lot. Instead, they consistently rush 4 and their DL runs a BUNCH of stunts and twists. This often confuses OL's and causes all kinds of trouble. If we had our starting OL, I'd feel a LITTLE bit better, but we're far from healthy right now, and it could be a VERY long day for our QB who is suffering from a painful rib injury. It's pretty much the worst matchup we could've hoped for after the injuries suffered in the Lions' game.
Making matters infinitely worse, Jax has talented LB's and DB's. Jalen Ramsey is giving up basically next to nothing this season, and he's a big, strong, athletic CB. Welcome back Corey Coleman. And since Jax doesn't blitz too much, you can bet there are going to be tons of people around the ball in the secondary. Those screen passes to Duke probably won't work, and I don't see the stupid WR screens working either. Right now, I'd probably bet money Kizer doesn't make it through the entire game healthy. He's going to get dropped over and over again.
Our big hope is that Bortles craps the sheets and gives us a few turnovers...maybe even a pick-6. Perhaps we can get a special teams play as well....we're certainly due for one. Bottom line, it's going to be a tough day.
So, the more I research this game, the more it looks like it COULD be closer to 40-0 than not.
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Not sure anyone gives our "dismal worthless" FO enough credit for that one.
Good discussion...
I think actually the FO deserves credit for their work in free agency. There have been many more hits than misses. Their draft picks are a bit of a different story however, at least to this point.
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Is Gip worth $35 million? How about Kenny Britt...is he worth $32 million?
Based upon Britt's 2017 performance? Well, that's a rhetorical question isn't it? Based upon his 2016 performance? Absolutely...
Can you say the same about Gip?
Games Def Interceptions Fumbles Sacks & Tackles Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Int Yds TD Lng PD FF Fmb FR Yds TD Sk Tkl Ast Sfty AV Career 75 67 18 430 2 67 30 1 1 1 0 0 223 92 27 4 yrs CLE 50 42 14 324 2 62 23 1 1 0 0 0 156 79 20 2 yrs JAX 25 25 4 106 0 67 7 0 0 1 0 0 67 13 7 2012 22 CLE fs 39 10 3 1 23 0 23 1 23 6 2 2013 23 CLE FS 39 16 15 5 143 1 44 12 63 31 6 2014* 24 CLE FS 39 11 11 6 158 1 62 8 1 0 0 0 0 28 24 8 2015 25 CLE FS/rcb 39 13 13 2 0 0 0 2 0 1 0 0 0 42 18 4 2016 26 JAX FS 39 16 16 1 30 0 30 2 34 7 7 2017 27 JAX FS 39 9 9 3 76 0 67 5 0 0 1 0 0 33 6 Based upon Britt's 2017 performance? Well, that's a rhetorical question isn't it? Based upon his 2016 performance? Absolutely...
Can you say the same about Gip?
We could talk about Britt’s 2013 season, you know the one where he caught a whopping 96 yards.
Or we can talk about Hue benching his azz this year...money well spent!
Two things that will define you: Your determination when you have nothing. Your attitude when you have everything. - Mike McCartney -
https://www.dawgsbynature.com/2017/11/16/16667272/browns-activate-corey-coleman-but-say-goodbye-to-once-hyped-kasen-williams Our roster'd WR's are C.Coleman-R. Louis-S.Coats-B.Treggs-K.Britt-R.Higgins....Who here thinks Kasen Williams clears waivers than we get him on our PS? now bidding almost last in waiver wire claims.. Al Saunders please set-up to the pod em..we got a consensus question..
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https://www.dawgsbynature.com/2017/11/16/16667272/browns-activate-corey-coleman-but-say-goodbye-to-once-hyped-kasen-williams Our roster'd WR's are C.Coleman-R. Louis-S.Coats-B.Treggs-K.Britt-R.Higgins....Who here thinks Kasen Williams clears waivers than we get him on our PS? now bidding almost last in waiver wire claims.. Al Saunders please set-up to the pod em..we got a consensus question..
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Based upon Britt's 2017 performance? Well, that's a rhetorical question isn't it? Based upon his 2016 performance? Absolutely...
Can you say the same about Gip?
We could talk about Britt’s 2013 season, you know the one where he caught a whopping 96 yards.
Or we can talk about Hue benching his azz this year...money well spent!
We could talk about Britt’s 2013 season, you know the one where he caught a whopping 96 yards.
Or we can talk about Hue benching his azz this year...money well spent!
Way to hone in on the one season that's an anomaly in his career...
... and top it with an event after the decision. Hindsight is always impresses me.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
We could talk about Britt’s 2013 season, you know the one where he caught a whopping 96 yards.
Or we can talk about Hue benching his azz this year...money well spent!
Way to hone in on the one season that's an anomaly in his career...
... and top it with an event after the decision. Hindsight is always impresses me.
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