There is no 'the process' with this team....
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All the data of course. defensive and offensive efficiency ratings this year. then those compared to last year. pythags this year compared to last year. We'll see what the next several games bring.
Pythags this..In 2016 we clearly missed on getting WR Rishard Matthews from Miami now a Titian for 3 years at 15M..In 2017 LB AJ Klein goes from Panthers to Saints for 4 years 24M..Analytic Data is garbage when Berry & Grigson can't see pure on the field talent evaluations right in front of them.. at a steal for the $$ on a contract..The complete whiffs on field talent over numbers are killers
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Only stats needed. The wins, losses, months trying. Flat line means plug pulling time
So let me try.....
Wins / Losses x Time = X
Got it!!
X = The Process
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I haven't been thrilled with Hue Jackson, but I'm way more aggrevated by our front office. Everyone wants to point to Sashi missing on Wentz and Watson, and those are egregious mistakes, but let's look at another, smaller mistake that displays his incompetence. Sashi cut Taylor Gabriel to make room for HIS drafted WRs like Rashard Higgins, Jordan Payton, and Ricardo Louis. I don't believe any of those 3 guys make it on an active NFL roster. The one exception COULD be Higgins, as Kizer has missed him for at least three touchdowns this year, and Higgins has been open multiple other times for big gains. His hands have proven to be mostly reliable, and he MIGHT help someone. But Taylor Gabriel is making plays. Some of them big. That's an inexcusable miss and it really shows just how out of his depth Sashi is at his job.
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I wanted to keep Gabe as well, but c'mon... let's not over-romanticize him. He's a solid #3... no more... no less. He's not a building block in his mid-20's.
Is he better than our kids (I can hear you ask)? Yes... but we had to learn that and now that we have... easy fix.
Part of the philosophy of this FO... this organization... is to invest in and develop young players. No better examples than Kizer and Njoku and Garrett... players we can have for a decade, if they develop.
As for egregious? ummmm.... no...
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I'm not saying Taylor Gabriel cures our ills, I'm merely using his departure as just one shining example of Sashi's futility. And your point that we want to invest in young players doesn't make sense. How old was Gabriel when he left? 24? Are you saying we should only develop young players WE draft our sign? Sashi didn't sign him originally, but the Browns basically gave him his start. It's one example of how poorly Sashi evaluates talent. And if you look at our worst position groupings, where do we lack the most talent? WR and QB on offense. So what's the excuse about screwing it up? Nobody else on this board thought Gabriel was worse than the idiots we kept, so how does Sashi get it wrong? Our radio guys thought it was terrible, our fans (ones I know) were ticked, and people in the media weren't happy, yet Sashi messes it up. Why cut Joe Haden? Did he dominate in Pittsburgh? No, but he didn't embarrass himself either. We needed some veteran leadership on this team, and that's another mistake made by him. And don't get me started on Wentz and Watson. Sashi single-handedly kept us in the dark ages by messing up our roster. He has the final say. His shoulders bare the weight of this talent-starved debacle called the Browns.
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I'm saying he was not worth (to us) what the Falc's paid him... which is $2.75mm this season.
And Sashi does not "evaluate talent"... so there's that.
That ought to get you started...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I wanted to keep Gabe as well, but c'mon... let's not over-romanticize him. He's a solid #3... no more... no less. He's not a building block in his mid-20's.
Is he better than our kids (I can hear you ask)? Yes... but we had to learn that and now that we have... easy fix.
Part of the philosophy of this FO... this organization... is to invest in and develop young players. No better examples than Kizer and Njoku and Garrett... players we can have for a decade, if they develop.
As for egregious? ummmm.... no...
Part of the philosophy of this FO... this organization... is to invest in and develop young players. No better examples than Kizer and Njoku and Garrett... players we can have for a decade, if they develop.
two of those are first round draft picks. The philosophy of every single team in the league is to develop their first round draft picks(which, weeds excepted, are by definition young players)....so that part isn't a philosophy. One way in which organizations and front offices are judged are on whether or not those picks hit. We'll see if players like Njoku and Peppers do eventually play well, and thats how the organization will be judged.
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I'm saying he was not worth (to us) what the Falc's paid him... which is $2.75mm this season.
And Sashi does not "evaluate talent"... so there's that.
That ought to get you started...
And Sashi does not "evaluate talent"... so there's that.
Sashi has done a great job gathering picks and making deals. I applaud him for that. But Andrew Berry has done a sub-par job at best picking the talent, and having someone with a great eye to help him would be beneficial on us hitting on the next two drafts in my opinion.
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I'm saying he was not worth (to us) what the Falc's paid him... which is $2.75mm this season.
And Sashi does not "evaluate talent"... so there's that.
That ought to get you started...
I'm saying he was not worth (to us) what the Falc's paid him... which is $2.75mm this season.
And Sashi does not "evaluate talent"... so there's that.
That ought to get you started...
I thought he had final say on the roster- sounds like evaluating talent to me.... I've already pointed out- if it was a "consensus" the "consensus" seriously overvalued McCarron, and valued draft picks more than a potential franchise QB twice. They're batting with two strikes on them already Tour- one more, and they're OUT.
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Since all you're looking at are the wins and losses, how can you tell when sashi was hired? Were the Browns a great power before he arrived?
And if you can't tell the difference...... how, exactly, is sashi the problem?
What's the basis for stating that replacing Sashi would make a change --- given that your data haven't shown his hiring to be consequential in the first place?
This "ride down from the heavens and magically make no mistakes" role is a job description that no human I've ever met would take on. Sounds like this is a classic "build someone up as a savior simply so that we can knock him down when it turns out he's human after all" move. Even Belichick got 5 years here - and if you watch the old stories of Belichick closely, you'll see plenty of binders where he uses analytics to quantify players in the draft.
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Only stats needed. The wins, losses, months trying. Flat line means plug pulling time
So let me try.....
Wins / Losses x Time = X
Got it!!
X = The Process
-
I'm saying he was not worth (to us) what the Falc's paid him... which is $2.75mm this season.
And Sashi does not "evaluate talent"... so there's that.
That ought to get you started...
I thought he had final say on the roster- sounds like evaluating talent to me.... I've already pointed out- if it was a "consensus" the "consensus" seriously overvalued McCarron, and valued draft picks more than a potential franchise QB twice. They're batting with two strikes on them already Tour- one more, and they're OUT.
I thought he had final say on the roster- sounds like evaluating talent to me.... I've already pointed out- if it was a "consensus" the "consensus" seriously overvalued McCarron, and valued draft picks more than a potential franchise QB twice. They're batting with two strikes on them already Tour- one more, and they're OUT.
So Berry is the defacto GM? Don't think so, h.
As for McCarron... disagree. Not that the offer was high... I've already written that it was. But that it was "seriously" high. Already know that when dealing with a Divisional rival you are going to overpay. We did for Zeitler, only in this case not because the Bengals had a role, but because there was a bonus for us in his signing of weakening them.
Finally I don't see two strikes... not even sure I see one. Because "potential" is not the yardstick. Were it then were up to at least strike 6... maybe 8.
Since all you're looking at are the wins and losses, how can you tell when sashi was hired? Were the Browns a great power before he arrived?
And if you can't tell the difference...... how, exactly, is sashi the problem?
What's the basis for stating that replacing Sashi would make a change --- given that your data haven't shown his hiring to be consequential in the first place?
This "ride down from the heavens and magically make no mistakes" role is a job description that no human I've ever met would take on. Sounds like this is a classic "build someone up as a savior simply so that we can knock him down when it turns out he's human after all" move. Even Belichick got 5 years here - and if you watch the old stories of Belichick closely, you'll see plenty of binders where he uses analytics to quantify players in the draft.
Ed Zachery...
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Part of the philosophy of this FO... this organization... is to invest in and develop young players. No better examples than Kizer and Njoku and Garrett... players we can have for a decade, if they develop.
two of those are first round draft picks. The philosophy of every single team in the league is to develop their first round draft picks(which, weeds excepted, are by definition young players)....so that part isn't a philosophy. One way in which organizations and front offices are judged are on whether or not those picks hit. We'll see if players like Njoku and Peppers do eventually play well, and thats how the organization will be judged.
two of those are first round draft picks. The philosophy of every single team in the league is to develop their first round draft picks(which, weeds excepted, are by definition young players)....so that part isn't a philosophy. One way in which organizations and front offices are judged are on whether or not those picks hit. We'll see if players like Njoku and Peppers do eventually play well, and thats how the organization will be judged.
As a general rule aren't 1st rounders supposed to have immediate impact? Start Day 1?
Point was the players I listed aren't just young, they are young for 2017 draft picks. Garrett... 21. Njoku... 21. Kizer... 21. Then add the sheer number of picks we've made and rostered over the past two years. It is a philosophy emphasis that permeates our approach... and that includes round one.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
two of those are first round draft picks. The philosophy of every single team in the league is to develop their first round draft picks(which, weeds excepted, are by definition young players)....so that part isn't a philosophy. One way in which organizations and front offices are judged are on whether or not those picks hit. We'll see if players like Njoku and Peppers do eventually play well, and thats how the organization will be judged.
As a general rule aren't 1st rounders supposed to have immediate impact? Start Day 1?
Point was the players I listed aren't just young, they are young for 2017 draft picks. Garrett... 21. Njoku... 21. Kizer... 21. Then add the sheer number of picks we've made and rostered over the past two years. It is a philosophy emphasis that permeates our approach... and that includes round one.
As a general rule aren't 1st rounders supposed to have immediate impact? Start Day 1?
Point was the players I listed aren't just young, they are young for 2017 draft picks. Garrett... 21. Njoku... 21. Kizer... 21. Then add the sheer number of picks we've made and rostered over the past two years. It is a philosophy emphasis that permeates our approach... and that includes round one.
whether a player without any nfl experience is 21 or 22 is really a trivial and likely meaningless point as it applies here. And Most round 1-5 guys drafted each year by teams(good and bad) make the roster...plus some udfas every year(to a varying degree of course). Every first round pick is going to be with every team the next year and the year after that(and usually the year after that) per the way the cba is done. So even good teams build up bunches of 'young' players. Thats just the nature of the nfl with its average career length. Very bad teams like the browns, for obvious reasons, tend to acquire more picks than they are generally slotted to recieve...none of these things speak to a game-changing process or philosophy here for a very bad team.
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There's a difference between general rule and fundamental philosophy. Exhibits A, B and C were in my above post; here are
- Exhibit D... Shon Coleman... an unfinished project we were willing to stash for a nearly a year knowing he'd not see the field.
- Exhibit E... Keeping four mid to late WR picks a second year, when little promise was seen year one.
- Exhibit F... 24 picks in two years.
Not every pick is an example... not as if there aren't similar examples by other teams... but developing young players is a stated core principle of this organization and there's plenty of support that is what they are doing.
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