The Jacksonville approach
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It's not a bad idea to build a base or nucleus of the team through the draft maybe get some blue chip top picks -but- when the necessary good/great FA players come along it would be nice with their cap room to land a few.
QUESTION do good/great FAs really want to go to Cleveland now? It's worked somewhat for the Indians but they have the FO, manager and core winning team established, same for the Cavaliers except for LBJ getting old(er).
More chance of getting decent FA's now we have Dorsey and Wolfe in the FO
More chance of getting decent FA's now we have Dorsey and Wolfe in the FO
And who really was responsible for the Britt disaster anyway, Sushi or Huey?
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And who really was responsible for the Britt disaster anyway, Sushi or Huey?
Sushi was in charge of the 53 man roster, so I would say that one was on him.
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According to overthecap.com the Browns have 110+ million of cap space. Jacksonville spent heavily the last couple of years and it has paid off. We theoretically have enough money to make 6 players the highest paid in their position. I don't think it's a good idea, but just to get an idea of how much cap we have here is what we could do.
K. Cousins- 27m
L. Bell- 15m
J. Landry- 18m
S. Richardson- 20m
T. Johnson- 15m
L. Joyner- 13m
That's 108 million of our 110+ million in cap space. It would put us in cap hell in the future but we really should make a move for 3 or 4 of these guys. We wouldn't have to pay some of these guys that much but we could if need be. Bottom line we can turn this team around over night just like Jacksonville did.
Yup... Britt was on the FO... and Britt.
I don't think it's a good idea...
I agree.... not having enough cap space to sign your own draft is never a good idea.
I get the impression a lot of people think the Browns don't want to spend money on FA's. As I see it, they didn't want to spend money on players who would make them good enough to keep losing forever. As it is now, they have a lot of "tape" on young players that will allow them to better pick in the draft and the FA market. By that I mean they have a better idea of the talent level of the roster.
I really believe the strategy over the last two seasons was to go young and lose often, gather up as many good draft picks as possible and get the QB of the future in this draft (2018). That's why it was so easy to trade down from Wentze and Watson...neither were compelling prospects and the 2018 QB's provided a safety net that allowed the Browns to load up on draft picks and lose with youth (as in develope homegrown talent) safe in the knowledge that they would get their QB in this draft. LB Schobert is a prime example. Does he emerge as a pro bowl LB if he was playing behind a 28-30 year old FA LB? No. Do the Browns get their choice of QB's in this draft with 2-4 FA's starting in 2017 and getting us 3-4 wins? No.
This team is poised to start winning games and moving forward on the overall talent level issue. Sashi Brown is a victim of his own system (see Dr. Frankenstien's monster). The new front office should have the know how to get us the talent via FA and the draft that Sashi Brown gave his professional life for. I think we as Browns fans are looking at a very dynamic near future for talent gathering and team building. Keep in mind, the AFC North is an aging division and Cleveland could be the up and coming power of the AFC North. In a QB driven league the Browns are set to draft their QB of the next decade and the rest of the division is hoping to squeeze another 1-3 seasons out of their aging QB's. Good luck to them in finding another franchise QB to replace their retiring franchise QB.
Pretty astute for a Newb... now if you'll just master the concept of paragraphs...
In a nutshell drafting and developing young talent was the primary route selected by this organization. It was not the exclusive route as veteran additions Zeitler, Tretter, Collins, McCourty and others including, yes, Britt, stand as testimony. Some of this vet talent was far from "cheap"... something "highest paid" tends to not be.
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And who really was responsible for the Britt disaster anyway, Sushi or Huey?
Tour will tell you it was "the consensus". LOL, it's the guys getting around in a circle and pointing fingers at everyone but themselves saying "it's your fault."
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And who really was responsible for the Britt disaster anyway, Sushi or Huey?
Tour will tell you it was "the consensus". LOL, it's the guys getting around in a circle and pointing fingers at everyone but themselves saying "it's your fault."
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The Jags approach:
1. Hired a new FO guy, a "football guy"... check
2. New coach to change the culture.. FAIL
3. Draft a top 3 QB... we will see
4. Commit to running the football and playing great defense... personnel-close, coaching-nowhere near
5. Stack starting 11 ( on both sides) with 1st & 2nd rounders and FAs... getting there with picks, need more impact FAs
Overall, the Browns still have a lot of work to do...
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Our owner thinks its better to get new players through the draft and to steer clear of FA studs......he.thinks it's the better policy in obtaining his goal of 1-31
Our owner thinks its better to get new players through the draft and to steer clear of FA studs......he.thinks it's the better policy in obtaining his goal of 1-31
I would like to pork his wife. I don't care about this schiddy team. I want to pork Haslams wife. Hell, I'll pork Haslam.
The Cleveland Browns have the hardest hit players in the NFL -
Our owner thinks its better to get new players through the draft and to steer clear of FA studs......he.thinks it's the better policy in obtaining his goal of 1-31
I would like to pork his wife. I don't care about this schiddy team. I want to pork Haslams wife. Hell, I'll pork Haslam.
I would like to pork his wife. I don't care about this schiddy team. I want to pork Haslams wife. Hell, I'll pork Haslam.
You have to pork Hue first....chain of command...Hue reports directly to Haslam ...and is that before or after you have done Paxton
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Our owner thinks its better to get new players through the draft and to steer clear of FA studs......he.thinks it's the better policy in obtaining his goal of 1-31
I would like to pork his wife. I don't care about this schiddy team. I want to pork Haslams wife. Hell, I'll pork Haslam.
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I believe Sashi pretty much had an aversion to free agency. He wanted to get the best guy he could for the cheapest price. But that meant he signed very few actually good players. I don't know if, per se, Jimmy told him to hold the line on salaries...but that was the Sashi/Depo approach.
Do we know about Dorsey's track record with FAs? Will he go after some big fish? He has the cap space....will he use it?
I agree that several things could/should happen that would potentially put this team on good footing....even for next year:
A. That they DO acquire 3-4 quality free agents to give this team a boost in talent.
B. That they hit quite well with their 5 first and second round draft picks...and beyond. Look at the Saints...they had 4 rookies contributing mightily to a team that went to the playoffs after being fairly shite for 3 years.
C. That their current young players improve. The Garrett's, Njokus, Peppers, Sheltons, Ogbah's, Colemans...both of them, Nassib, Schobert, Ogunjobi and etc. etc.
D. That some of their top players get healthy and stay healthy....including Joe Thomas, Jamie Collins, Ogbah....and this includes young guys like Howard Wilson...and Rod Johnson.
E. We need all of these things to happen....and one more: that our coaching staff not be the epitome of ineptitude that they appeared to be last year. This, in fact, may be the hardest of each of these factors to achieve.
And, well...I dont 'know if that is the Jacksonville way...but it needs to be the Cleveland way.
I believe Sashi pretty much had an aversion to free agency. He wanted to get the best guy he could for the cheapest price. But that meant he signed very few actually good players. I don't know if, per se, Jimmy told him to hold the line on salaries...but that was the Sashi/Depo approach.
Do we know about Dorsey's track record with FAs? Will he go after some big fish? He has the cap space....will he use it?
I agree that several things could/should happen that would potentially put this team on good footing....even for next year:
A. That they DO acquire 3-4 quality free agents to give this team a boost in talent.
B. That they hit quite well with their 5 first and second round draft picks...and beyond. Look at the Saints...they had 4 rookies contributing mightily to a team that went to the playoffs after being fairly shite for 3 years.
C. That their current young players improve. The Garrett's, Njokus, Peppers, Sheltons, Ogbah's, Colemans...both of them, Nassib, Schobert, Ogunjobi and etc. etc.
D. That some of their top players get healthy and stay healthy....including Joe Thomas, Jamie Collins, Ogbah....and this includes young guys like Howard Wilson...and Rod Johnson.
E. We need all of these things to happen....and one more: that our coaching staff not be the epitome of ineptitude that they appeared to be last year. This, in fact, may be the hardest of each of these factors to achieve.
And, well...I dont 'know if that is the Jacksonville way...but it needs to be the Cleveland way.
You make some good points and most of them are pretty straight forward, yet they are things that have eluded us for years. For example, we need our young studs to take a step next year, something that hasn't happened nearly as much as we've needed. This is where I feel bringing back our head coach and defensive coordinator will really shine. Learning the complexities of the NFL is something most rookies struggle with, but it's a huge advantage to them if they're coming back to the same system in their next season.
Think about players like Schobert, Njoku, Ogbah, Garrett, Coleman, and even Gordon. They get to start the season already knowing what to expect, the language, the calls, and the other intricacies that are known to be difficult to master. It's a giant advantage and not something to understate. Heck, even Kizer has a monster advantage over any rookie coming in, and I can't see any of the rookies beating him out for that reason.
Something else I'd like to do that Jacksonville did is copy their defense and running game. I know we need to draft a QB early, I really do, but I'd really like to figure out a way to get two defensive players in the first round and then figure out a way to jump back into the first round for our QB. Minkah Fitzpatrick and Bradley Chubb as our 2 top picks? Add another big name DB in free agency? Make it just dang near impossible to score on us....like the Jags this year. Myles Garrett is a beast on the inside, and you could line up Chubb and Ogbah on the outside, and figure out ways to get Garrett free on the inside on passing downs. Then we get a RB with a 2nd round selection.
I know it won't happen, and I realize we've avoided selecting a QB with a high pick for far too long, but just because we need a QB early, doesn't mean that there's one who deserves to go that high. All of them have pluses, all of them have minuses. I'm just not sure anyone in the QB class is worth a #1 pick...but it's still January and we have a lot of time before the draft. I've already changed my mind 3 times, so it'll probably change 5 more, haha.
Jacksonville gets to the QB and they do it without blitzing a lot. They also have a talented secondary that benefits from the lack of blitzing, which is something OURS doesn't receive. If we end up picking where we're slotted and we don't trade, I'd be happy with 2 of the first five picks being DB's. Get me Minkah Fitzpatrick (as free safety) and then draft a corner early in the second round. It appears to be a solid cornerback draft, and I feel we missed out last year with the Peppers pick (it's still early, but he didn't have the season we hoped for, obviously). If we do pick a QB at 1, then maybe we explore pass rushers in free agency? Those typically command BIG money, but money is one of the few things we actually have at the moment.
Jacksonville made it this far with a decent QB. Heck, they just won a playoff game 2 weeks ago where Bortles had more RUSHING yards than passing yards. Kizer had a rough year, no doubt. But I'm not counting him out, especially if we can truly get a nasty defense. That's easier said than done, and I still have my doubts about Gregg Williams and his blitz happy style, but I expect a dramatic defensive increase in 2018, and that alone could win us a couple of games.
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Meanwhile back at the thread...
Polian was talking the other day about how hard it is to sustain "the JAX way". How many pieces have to be assembled... maintained... paid. Said at 4 to 5 years the window is about half of what it is for a potent Offense.
Interesting stuff...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Our owner thinks its better to get new players through the draft and to steer clear of FA studs......he.thinks it's the better policy in obtaining his goal of 1-31
Our owner thinks its better to get new players through the draft and to steer clear of FA studs......he.thinks it's the better policy in obtaining his goal of 1-31
That -or- FA studs that know we're 1-31 in our last 32 games and 4-49 in our last 53 games don't think their careers will be long enough to justify their decision to come here.
We have a new FO that shows me our owner may be willing to sever ties with stuff that wasn't working. At least I hope it does....
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