Camp Barkley #1 Overall
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Our discussion's over already?
How does a 65 yard TD run once a game help you when the rest of time you can't muster up a yard and a half?
I don't know what stat you are talking about here.
You're saying that if you take out the big plays he makes, then he's just as good as a player like Crowell? What about when he makes guys miss on 3rd down to move the chains? Or the receiving yards? Or the kickoff returns? Do you get extra points for 3rd downs or picking up blocks? What are the rules in this game you want to play? Which stat are you ultimately judging this player by? Are all runningbacks that you judge scrutinized by the same measure? What are a player like Adrian Peterson's numbers like in comparison to Barkley's numbers, with and then without whatever stat or numbers your using to rank these guys?
What I do is much simpler- I use my eyes and intuition to "see" what I can see. You can play or you can't play. I see Barkley as a special talent. If I was a captain and I'm picking teams, with my first pick I'm pointing at Barkley- I'm going to win if I get this guy. Have you ever went to a basketball park at night and played pick up games under the lights? You learn things. A stat is just an attempt to systematically describe what transpired. But we all know that games aren't played by the numbers, the numbers come after the act.
If we draft Barkley- who is the best playmaker on the team. Who are you giving the ball to on the first play? Who are you giving the ball to on the last play to win the game?
I don't know what stat you are talking about here.
You're saying that if you take out the big plays he makes, then he's just as good as a player like Crowell? What about when he makes guys miss on 3rd down to move the chains? Or the receiving yards? Or the kickoff returns? Do you get extra points for 3rd downs or picking up blocks? What are the rules in this game you want to play? Which stat are you ultimately judging this player by? Are all runningbacks that you judge scrutinized by the same measure? What are a player like Adrian Peterson's numbers like in comparison to Barkley's numbers, with and then without whatever stat or numbers your using to rank these guys?
What I do is much simpler- I use my eyes and intuition to "see" what I can see. You can play or you can't play. I see Barkley as a special talent. If I was a captain and I'm picking teams, with my first pick I'm pointing at Barkley- I'm going to win if I get this guy. Have you ever went to a basketball park at night and played pick up games under the lights? You learn things. A stat is just an attempt to systematically describe what transpired. But we all know that games aren't played by the numbers, the numbers come after the act.
If we draft Barkley- who is the best playmaker on the team. Who are you giving the ball to on the first play? Who are you giving the ball to on the last play to win the game?
No, he's worse than Crowell. Crowell could ball up SEC defenses on a consistent basis without relying on 85 yard runs for a respectable YPC (a YPC that was still 80th or whatever it was in the country for Barkley, mind you).
If Barkley is what you say he is as a RB, he won't be returning kicks, so yeah, we can throw that out.
We're judging him by his rushing stats. An honest, objective look at how they're going to translate to the NFL. IF you want to just concede that and say "well he's not the best pure running back BUT he is adequate there and can do so many other things, and therefore he's worthy of #1," then fine. We'd just then be arguing about whether a guy with THOSE skills is worthy of #1. At present, however, I'm arguing that he is not a particularly good pure runningback. That's the issue. That's what I'm discussing. I'd like you to focus on that and the fact that you seem to not want to indicates to me you don't have a good response.
And by the way I'm not dismissing the value of intensity or clutchness or any of the other intangibles you bring up. Those should, however, be reflected in his stats as a RB, and they simply are not. That's a problem.
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Agree with war on this one. ^^^^
Agree with war on this one. ^^^^
Yea, pretty much.
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Unreal, this kid. He's the closest thing to a Superman we're going to find. If anybody need one, it's Cleveland. Just watch the video and tell me that Coleman wouldn't thrive with this guy around. Coleman would go to a whole 'nother level. Saquon is a leader and I have to think that, as young as our team is, our guys will gravitate to him.
What would a Barkley/Mayfield locker room, with Gordon and everybody look like?... I mean, stats are just stats. Everybody is good, it's about when it's time to execute, who come in clutch. Games are so tough and closely matched, in most cases, it comes down to the team and who wants it more, who BELIEVES they are going to win. We have to get away from the Mercenary type of team that we've been. Players coming and leaving all the time, coaches coming and leaving, so on and so on. We have believe in each other. We need to grind this out and learn from it, let it burn so we can win next timer. What hurt is it to a player when loyalty is gone, but the pain is real for fans- when Kenny Britt is going to the Superbow. For guys like Joe Thomas, Josh Gordon and Joe Ha...damn. But for players like Kevin Hogan, Christian Kirksey it's gotta burn... this thing we're trying to build, it's built in the trenches- during the grind. But we will rise from this, to heights not yet seen, to heights not yet dreamed. The best is ahead of us. Belief, trust and love.
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
I can't be the only person who gets this image in their head after reading a PoG post, right?
I can't be the only person who gets this image in their head after reading a PoG post, right?
look in front yard..The Barkley Cinderella Stagecoach just pulled up
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I can't be the only person who gets this image in their head after reading a PoG post, right?
look in front yard..The Barkley Cinderella Stagecoach just pulled up
look in front yard..The Barkley Cinderella Stagecoach just pulled up
"Is this stagecoach beeper-friendly?"
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The video is 6 minutes long. You aren't doing your work, you've shown that you haven't.
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
How sweet would it be to draft a #1 Overall RB?
It's kind of cheating because we also have the #4- lol, but still!
Superstar.
It creates belief. It's what we need.
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
Unreal, this kid. He's the closest thing to a Superman we're going to find. If anybody need one, it's Cleveland. Just watch the video and tell me that Coleman wouldn't thrive with this guy around. Coleman would go to a whole 'nother level. Saquon is a leader and I have to think that, as young as our team is, our guys will gravitate to him.
What would a Barkley/Mayfield locker room, with Gordon and everybody look like?... I mean, stats are just stats. Everybody is good, it's about when it's time to execute, who come in clutch. Games are so tough and closely matched, in most cases, it comes down to the team and who wants it more, who BELIEVES they are going to win. We have to get away from the Mercenary type of team that we've been. Players coming and leaving all the time, coaches coming and leaving, so on and so on. We have believe in each other. We need to grind this out and learn from it, let it burn so we can win next timer. What hurt is it to a player when loyalty is gone, but the pain is real for fans- when Kenny Britt is going to the Superbow. For guys like Joe Thomas, Josh Gordon and Joe Ha...damn. But for players like Kevin Hogan, Christian Kirksey it's gotta burn... this thing we're trying to build, it's built in the trenches- during the grind. But we will rise from this, to heights not yet seen, to heights not yet dreamed. The best is ahead of us. Belief, trust and love.
Unreal, this kid. He's the closest thing to a Superman we're going to find. If anybody need one, it's Cleveland. Just watch the video and tell me that Coleman wouldn't thrive with this guy around. Coleman would go to a whole 'nother level. Saquon is a leader and I have to think that, as young as our team is, our guys will gravitate to him.
What would a Barkley/Mayfield locker room, with Gordon and everybody look like?... I mean, stats are just stats. Everybody is good, it's about when it's time to execute, who come in clutch. Games are so tough and closely matched, in most cases, it comes down to the team and who wants it more, who BELIEVES they are going to win. We have to get away from the Mercenary type of team that we've been. Players coming and leaving all the time, coaches coming and leaving, so on and so on. We have believe in each other. We need to grind this out and learn from it, let it burn so we can win next timer. What hurt is it to a player when loyalty is gone, but the pain is real for fans- when Kenny Britt is going to the Superbow. For guys like Joe Thomas, Josh Gordon and Joe Ha...damn. But for players like Kevin Hogan, Christian Kirksey it's gotta burn... this thing we're trying to build, it's built in the trenches- during the grind. But we will rise from this, to heights not yet seen, to heights not yet dreamed. The best is ahead of us. Belief, trust and love.
And what about your other hero Kevin Hogan if the Browns draft Baker?
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Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
Why would the Browns waste a first rounder on Baker Mayfield when you've told us, over and over, that Kevin Hogan is a future franchise QB?
If you are going to troll, at least stick to the script.
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I was hyped on Barkely early this season, but I've seen him disappear a lot.Maybe they were limiting his snaps or whatever, mybe PSU just wasn't that great.
Love and Penny were the most impressive backs I've seen this year. I've seen numerous games for both, and every time they had the ball they were a threat to score. their stats reflect that as well. Love may be a bit small, but damn he was awesome. He even got injured 3/4 thru the season, and he was still putting up close to 200 yds a game. Penny actually had 5 straight 200+ yd games including the bowl game, but he gets no love from anyone.
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Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
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Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
The point is that you have said how great Hogan is and can be. It's not like he's old. So if you believe that (not trolling), and it actually happened, then it would be incredibly idiotic to draft a QB at 4. Then either your all world franchise guy Hogan or Mayfield would be a backup. So it would be a waste of a pick in your world
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Well, I tried to have an actual discussion....
YPC isn't a tell all stat War. I already addressed that, I said you have to take into account the player and his abilities OUTSIDE the college system.
Simple question. Is he capable of doing the things he does in college in the pros? The player doesn't change, or become a different player at the next level. What I mean is why wouldn't he be successful at the next level? Do you think he is too slow? Can't catch the ball? Can't block in pass protection? Can't read a defense, find the hole or follow his blocking assignments?
I don't mind having an actual discussion at all actually. I'm just saying you are basing your decision off of one stat, ypc. There is much more to a running back then ypc. A lot has to do with the gameplan and the blocking up front, some of it goes to the defense and their scheme. Some of it is attributed to the actual player. Can you show any evidence or do you have evidence outside of the "ypc" end all be all stat that you are judging the most complete back Urban Meyer has seen in the last 30 years?
I'm responding but you are not doing your research brother.
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How sweet would it be to draft a #1 Overall RB?
It's kind of cheating because we also have the #4- lol, but still!
Superstar.
It creates belief. It's what we need.
How sweet would it be to draft a #1 Overall RB?
It's kind of cheating because we also have the #4- lol, but still!
Superstar.
It creates belief. It's what we need.
I'll believe Barkley has Super Star potential when he runs a 4.12 40- like Bo Jackson did at the combine. That would qualify as rare talent, and something to get excited about. Until then- color me unimpressed.
Would it be that bad if Hogan started the season while Baker learned from Hogan's experience? Hogan with Barkley, Gordon, Coleman and Njoku. They are gonna put up a lot of points if they get to work together and develop some chemistry.
Po, Hogan's not going from the inactive list to NFL starter. Give it up already. If anything the QB depth chart will be Smith (I hope)- Mayfield\Darnold- Kizer. Hogan is about as good as gonzo, unless they keep him around for kicks and giggles as a spare arm in training camp. Nah- he's a ERFA, I doubt the Browns are going to pay him any more money to hang around. If it makes you feel better, Kevin has collected $850,000 for two years of being a roster hanger on. We all should be so lucky...
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Well, I tried to have an actual discussion....
YPC isn't a tell all stat War. I already addressed that, I said you have to take into account the player and his abilities OUTSIDE the college system.
Simple question. Is he capable of doing the things he does in college in the pros? The player doesn't change, or become a different player at the next level. What I mean is why wouldn't he be successful at the next level? Do you think he is too slow? Can't catch the ball? Can't block in pass protection? Can't read a defense, find the hole or follow his blocking assignments?
I don't mind having an actual discussion at all actually. I'm just saying you are basing your decision off of one stat, ypc. There is much more to a running back then ypc. A lot has to do with the gameplan and the blocking up front, some of it goes to the defense and their scheme. Some of it is attributed to the actual player. Can you show any evidence or do you have evidence outside of the "ypc" end all be all stat that you are judging the most complete back Urban Meyer has seen in the last 30 years?
I'm responding but you are not doing your research brother.
YPC isn't a tell all stat War. I already addressed that, I said you have to take into account the player and his abilities OUTSIDE the college system.
Simple question. Is he capable of doing the things he does in college in the pros? The player doesn't change, or become a different player at the next level. What I mean is why wouldn't he be successful at the next level? Do you think he is too slow? Can't catch the ball? Can't block in pass protection? Can't read a defense, find the hole or follow his blocking assignments?
I don't mind having an actual discussion at all actually. I'm just saying you are basing your decision off of one stat, ypc. There is much more to a running back then ypc. A lot has to do with the gameplan and the blocking up front, some of it goes to the defense and their scheme. Some of it is attributed to the actual player. Can you show any evidence or do you have evidence outside of the "ypc" end all be all stat that you are judging the most complete back Urban Meyer has seen in the last 30 years?
I'm responding but you are not doing your research brother.
Actually you're just ignoring my posts until I call you back to the conversation.
You have to explain why the YPC was so absurdly bad at times. I can't recall a first round back that had those kind of things on his resume. I know YPC isn't everything, but when yours is that bad, it shoots to the top of the relevancy charts.
To answer the question in your second paragraph: no, he's not capable of padding his stats into the realm of respectability with a 50+ run almost every game in the pros.
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http://www.espn.com/ncf/recap/_/id/undefined
Slowing Saquon - Barkley, who looked like the Heisman frontrunner just three weeks ago, had little room to run behind an offensive line without it's starting Left Tackle.
Ryan Bates, who was hurt Oct. 28th against Ohio State, missed his second game with an undisclosed injury. Barkley has been held to 63 rushing yards or fewer in each of the last three games.
"It's part of the game," Barkley said. "Obviously I'm aware of what teams are going to try and do and teams are going to try to take away our run game and take away our backs."
Penn State: Three games ago, Penn State was sitting at No. 2 and had a clear path to the playoff with a bona fide Heisman Trophy front-runner in Barkley leading the offense. With two losses and one shaky start later, Penn State can't get Barkley going on the ground, and his Heisman chances are becoming slimmer.
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- So there you go War, losing a LT and Defenses scheming to stop the run. That was a three game stretch at least, in which their only 2 losses of the season came as well.
*The very next game against Nebraska, on the very first offensive play Barkley took a run for 65 yards down the sideline.
*The Georgia game? His stats don't look good, 10 carries - 47 yards for a long of 33 right? Not good as you would say, "take out the long of 33 yards and Barkley only ran for 14 yards on 9 carries"! Well... there's this. You just have to try a little harder to get the information you seek. http://www.espn.com/ncf/recap/_/id/undefined
"McSorley threw a stadium-record 85-yard touchdown pass to Saquon Barkley for one of his four scoring strikes and also ran for a touchdown in No. 5 Penn State's 56-0 victory over Georgia State 56-0 on Saturday night.
"That was something that was in my mind," McSorley said. "Last week, personally, I didn't put our team in the best position through my play to win the game. Obviously, we were able to come out with a win but I felt that I didn't put our team in the best position."
That's all he did against Georgia State (0-2) and he got off to a fast start.
McSorley completed 14 of 19 passes for 258 yards in the first half to help Penn State (3-0) take a 35-0 lead in a rare prime-time game against a non-Power Five opponent.
The junior quarterback finished 18 of 23 for 309 yards and running back Saquon Barkley had 226 all-purpose yards despite being sidelined for a stretch in the second quarter with a stomach bug.
Barkley returned to the game after a brief evaluation but wasn't needed much longer. Penn State rested most of its starters after scoring on its first drive of the second half.
"I thought Trace definitely threw the ball better," Penn State coach James Franklin said. "Saquon, he's just got so many tools. You're talking about a 230-pound guy that can make you miss, can run you over and can burst down the sideline."
BARKLEY'S OMINOUS TENT VISIT
Penn State's sideline got a scare when Barkley signaled he needed a breather midway through the second quarter.
The Heisman candidate had just lowered his head on an inside run and was piled on by Panthers defenders. Although he popped up quick, Barkley walked slowly to the bench, sat down and hung his head for a bit before being shuffled into the team's nearby medical tent by the team's head athletic trainer.
Barkley emerged after a few minutes and returned to the game apparently no worse for wear. He said afterward he ate something before the game that didn't agree with him and was fine after a brief reprieve.
"It didn't really affect me in the game," Barkley said.
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So, there's an explanation for four games that you were concerned about. In the one game the kid had 142 receiving yards and a TD.
Need I continue? Or do you got it from here, I've shared his stat log below for easy reference.
2017 SPLITS ATT YDS AVG LNG TD REC YDS AVG LNG TD Season 217 1271 5.9 92 18 54 632 11.7 85 3 Home 104 664 6.4 80 10 25 431 17.2 85 3 September 86 574 6.7 80 4 27 386 14.3 85 2 CAREER STATS RUSHING RECEIVING SEASON ATT YDS AVG LNG TD REC YDS AVG LNG TD 2017 217 1271 5.9 92 18 54 632 11.7 85 3 2016 272 1496 5.5 81 18 28 402 14.4 44 4 2015 182 1076 5.9 56 7 20 161 8.1 32 1 2017 Game Log Rushing Receiving DATE OPP RESULT ATT YDS AVG LNG TD REC YDS AVG LNG TD 9/2 Akron W 52-0 14 172 12.3 80 2 3 54 18.0 43 0 9/9 Pittsburgh W 33-14 14 88 6.3 22 1 4 45 11.3 46 1 9/16 Georgia State W 56-0 10 47 4.7 33 0 4 142 35.5 85 1 9/23 @Iowa W 21-19 28 211 7.5 44 1 12 94 7.8 15 0 9/30 Indiana W 45-14 20 56 2.8 8 0 4 51 12.8 36 0 10/7 @Northwestern W 31-7 16 75 4.7 53 2 2 9 4.5 8 0 10/21 Michigan W 42-13 15 108 7.2 69 2 3 53 17.7 42 1 10/28 @Ohio State L 39-38 21 44 2.1 36 1 4 23 5.8 10 0 11/4 @Michigan State L 27-24 14 63 4.5 36 0 3 33 11.0 20 0 11/11 Rutgers W 35-6 14 35 2.5 11 2 1 20 20.0 21 0 11/18 Nebraska W 56-44 17 158 9.3 65 3 6 66 11.0 24 0 11/25 @Maryland W 66-3 16 77 4.8 17 2 1 4 4.0 4 0 PLAYSTATION FIESTA BOWL 12/30 Washington W 35-28 18 137 7.6 92 2 7 38 5.4 12 0
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain-
) You aren't doing your work
) page 10 yippie!!
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