Why was the run defense so bad?
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Sadly some of the bigger gains were the Steelers using our over-aggressiveness to the weakside/open end.
The first one @ :30 seconds wasn't the greatest fill by Collins either. Then the problem with having an off-ball MIKE backer is that if he flows laterally one way, it's awfully hard to make up for the lost ground the other. That aside, Myles realizes he got upfield too quickly and then fought to get back around and stay square.
Another @ :40 demonstrates what I'm talking about with Schobert. He isn't your classic downhill backer. A few seconds into that frame you'll see the alley, Joe stops, plants his feet and kills his motion. For those that complained about D'qwell Jackson, this should look familiar. As a backer you can't sit there and wait because you're going to get Shmucked up with a RB gaining even more steam. A little snag on MG stopped him from cleaning Conner sideways. Zebra's need to keep an eye on that.
The next one @ :53 I called live. Went at the strength/Myles and brought the guard. General rule you follow the pull, especially if you haven't seen any RPO's or assignment conflicts. Which isn't a tendency the Steelers have in the RZ. First Shmuck up was on MG - you see the pull you blow it up. Don't wait for it to get to you. Run defense is unselfish football. Second Shmuck up was... #26? Is that Kindred? I have no idea what he was playing here or why he followed the TE on the seal/pin. It's a monumentally dumb read because he knows that is HIS gap. Again, boils down to assignment football and being unselfish. Hold your gap, fill and rally to the ball carrier.
The others to close out the first half were good calls by the Steelers on the draw, going after an over-aggressive Williams using a variety of 5 man pressures
The next run Conner almost scored on was @ 1:20. Same god damn gun/pull look he scored on previously. Minus the fact the TE looked for the SLB/Contain and the guard was leading through. We appeared to be out leveraged before the play even happened.
The big one I'm talking about that teams will use against us moving forward is @ 1:33.
Once again going at Myles as the WSE/Open end. This is a designed cutback the whole way and even if it wasn't, our interior line was blown TF up. We simply lack interior lineman to consistently anchor and hold the point it appears. Of course by this point the defense had been out there quite a bit so I'm sure some fatigue was setting in. On a base block usually you'll double the 1-tech then the center or guard will disengage and peel to the second level. Pittsburgh never had to bother with that, they went right for the backers never having to even throw a double. Myles gets a step or too far upfield and the design is there when Collins fills against the lead. Not winning on the interior and being over-aggressive on the edge. MG will need to show discipline moving forward with that. Reminds me of a kid I played with, Joey (won't use his last name) 6'4 225, long butt arms. Could beat a TE and get around the edge like a MoFo. He just couldn't hold his ground and didn't enjoy contact so teams ran right at him.
The next few runs are displays of not breaking down, not playing your assignment/gap, arriving to the ball carrier not under control and our DB's not attacking their lanes with heads up football and quality tackling. This is on coach Williams. Aggressive is good, over aggressive is why the designed cutbacks and counter pulls will eat his defenses alive. We also lack a true anchor in the middle. Something I was hoping Danny would continue, maybe we would sign Hankins for but perhaps the answer is already on roster with Carl Davis.
Either way, assignment gap sound football and understanding you need to earn those pass rushing snaps is what this team needs to drill into their head.
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are there mulligans in the nfl? like can we call tampa and say hi, nice opening day win but oh btw we're gonna need carl back?
are there mulligans in the nfl? like can we call tampa and say hi, nice opening day win but oh btw we're gonna need carl back?
Well.....as far as TB is concerned.....there WAS talk that maybe Ryan Fitzpatrick would be the veteran "Bridge" QB that we would bring in here, rather than TT. But they did not go that route.
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what stood out to be on the run at 1:33 was thatbyeah myles might be upfield a little too much, but he does funnel the run inside. Collins gets the lead block but its schobert that got swallowed up by the center. Not good. As a mlb'er u have to slide off to a side. You read the FB...The fb was going left so schobert should have ripped to his right. Ibstead he engages straight up with the center, and thats that.
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on the very next play which is a TD run, dear god look at the penetration to the 2nd level that the steers o line gets. This is precisely what didnt happen last year with danny and jamie up the middle.
I dont know, i guess this is where i part ways with williams on defensive philosophy. You keep ur two gap monster, u keep the guy who can do 1 or 2 gap (jamie), and u rotate in other guys who might be more one gapping penetrators.
First impressions feel like instead of building on a strength last year, we tore it up to be pass rush pass rush pass rush. When other teams, like the steelers...managed throughout the years to do both. Its not like we had some massively overpaid coksuckers on the line either that we had to get rid of for cap concerns. Makes no sense.
teams now are gonna do exactly what u do to a gifted pass rusher, u run at him..negate his pass rushing. And we really dont have an opposite edge to make them pay for that. Nassib at least ran down those runs at myles from behind. We had a DL could affect the play like an extra LB'er from the other side of the field.That game footage tiamat put up just reinforced my initial smell test when i heard of the cuts
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what stood out to be on the run at 1:33 was thatbyeah myles might be upfield a little too much, but he does funnel the run inside. Collins gets the lead block but its schobert that got swallowed up by the center. Not good. As a mlb'er u have to slide off to a side. You read the FB...The fb was going left so schobert should have ripped to his right. Ibstead he engages straight up with the center, and thats that.
what stood out to be on the run at 1:33 was thatbyeah myles might be upfield a little too much, but he does funnel the run inside. Collins gets the lead block but its schobert that got swallowed up by the center. Not good. As a mlb'er u have to slide off to a side. You read the FB...The fb was going left so schobert should have ripped to his right. Ibstead he engages straight up with the center, and thats that.
I don't think Schobert had a chance to engage the center or not but as an off ball MIKE he is going to have to be quicker laterally than that.
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I repeat: Four Defensive Linemen on this team who had not been with them for a week.....no matter how good (and remember, they were cut by other teams....so how good are they)....cannot help.
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Sadly some of the bigger gains were the Steelers using our over-aggressiveness to the weakside/open end.
The first one @ :30 seconds wasn't the greatest fill by Collins either. Then the problem with having an off-ball MIKE backer is that if he flows laterally one way, it's awfully hard to make up for the lost ground the other. That aside, Myles realizes he got upfield too quickly and then fought to get back around and stay square.
Another @ :40 demonstrates what I'm talking about with Schobert. He isn't your classic downhill backer. A few seconds into that frame you'll see the alley, Joe stops, plants his feet and kills his motion. For those that complained about D'qwell Jackson, this should look familiar. As a backer you can't sit there and wait because you're going to get Shmucked up with a RB gaining even more steam. A little snag on MG stopped him from cleaning Conner sideways. Zebra's need to keep an eye on that.
The next one @ :53 I called live. Went at the strength/Myles and brought the guard. General rule you follow the pull, especially if you haven't seen any RPO's or assignment conflicts. Which isn't a tendency the Steelers have in the RZ. First Shmuck up was on MG - you see the pull you blow it up. Don't wait for it to get to you. Run defense is unselfish football. Second Shmuck up was... #26? Is that Kindred? I have no idea what he was playing here or why he followed the TE on the seal/pin. It's a monumentally dumb read because he knows that is HIS gap. Again, boils down to assignment football and being unselfish. Hold your gap, fill and rally to the ball carrier.
The others to close out the first half were good calls by the Steelers on the draw, going after an over-aggressive Williams using a variety of 5 man pressures
The next run Conner almost scored on was @ 1:20. Same god damn gun/pull look he scored on previously. Minus the fact the TE looked for the SLB/Contain and the guard was leading through. We appeared to be out leveraged before the play even happened.
The big one I'm talking about that teams will use against us moving forward is @ 1:33.
Once again going at Myles as the WSE/Open end. This is a designed cutback the whole way and even if it wasn't, our interior line was blown TF up. We simply lack interior lineman to consistently anchor and hold the point it appears. Of course by this point the defense had been out there quite a bit so I'm sure some fatigue was setting in. On a base block usually you'll double the 1-tech then the center or guard will disengage and peel to the second level. Pittsburgh never had to bother with that, they went right for the backers never having to even throw a double. Myles gets a step or too far upfield and the design is there when Collins fills against the lead. Not winning on the interior and being over-aggressive on the edge. MG will need to show discipline moving forward with that. Reminds me of a kid I played with, Joey (won't use his last name) 6'4 225, long butt arms. Could beat a TE and get around the edge like a MoFo. He just couldn't hold his ground and didn't enjoy contact so teams ran right at him.
The next few runs are displays of not breaking down, not playing your assignment/gap, arriving to the ball carrier not under control and our DB's not attacking their lanes with heads up football and quality tackling. This is on coach Williams. Aggressive is good, over aggressive is why the designed cutbacks and counter pulls will eat his defenses alive. We also lack a true anchor in the middle. Something I was hoping Danny would continue, maybe we would sign Hankins for but perhaps the answer is already on roster with Carl Davis.
Either way, assignment gap sound football and understanding you need to earn those pass rushing snaps is what this team needs to drill into their head.
Sadly some of the bigger gains were the Steelers using our over-aggressiveness to the weakside/open end.
MG ran himself out of a number of plays early. I did not notice it so much later.
Old rule of thumb for Offenses: Run at speed and away from strength.
We saw it Sunday and will see it many times this season. MG is going to be run at a lot.
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what stood out to be on the run at 1:33 was thatbyeah myles might be upfield a little too much, but he does funnel the run inside. Collins gets the lead block but its schobert that got swallowed up by the center. Not good. As a mlb'er u have to slide off to a side. You read the FB...The fb was going left so schobert should have ripped to his right. Ibstead he engages straight up with the center, and thats that.
I don't think Schobert had a chance to engage the center or not but as an off ball MIKE he is going to have to be quicker laterally than that.
I don't think Schobert had a chance to engage the center or not but as an off ball MIKE he is going to have to be quicker laterally than that.
he's strong enough to engage/disengage with OL because of his days as a 34 olb'er...but he doesnt get that thise nano seconds of engagement take him out of the play.
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Sadly some of the bigger gains were the Steelers using our over-aggressiveness to the weakside/open end.
MG ran himself out of a number of plays early. I did not notice it so much later.
Old rule of thumb for Offenses: Run at speed and away from strength.
We saw it Sunday and will see it many times this season. MG is going to be run at a lot.
MG ran himself out of a number of plays early. I did not notice it so much later.
Old rule of thumb for Offenses: Run at speed and away from strength.
We saw it Sunday and will see it many times this season. MG is going to be run at a lot.
last year he had jamie or danny fighting into that off guard gap. Now its a giant hole u can drive cars through. I like edges that get upfield enough to turn the runs inside, but then the interior guys gave to do their jobs. Jamie took on the lead block and no other lb'er showed up.
We might have to tell myles to read run first. As we saw yesterday, teams can still put up a bunch of points on u with the run. Gotta stop the run
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I don't think Schobert had a chance to engage the center or not but as an off ball MIKE he is going to have to be quicker laterally than that.
he's strong enough to engage/disengage with OL because of his days as a 34 olb'er...but he doesnt get that thise nano seconds of engagement take him out of the play.
he's strong enough to engage/disengage with OL because of his days as a 34 olb'er...but he doesnt get that thise nano seconds of engagement take him out of the play.
Not sure about this... remember he trimmed down significantly in prep for his move inside last season.
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he's strong enough to engage/disengage with OL because of his days as a 34 olb'er...but he doesnt get that thise nano seconds of engagement take him out of the play.
Not sure about this... remember he trimmed down significantly in prep for his move inside last season.
Not sure about this... remember he trimmed down significantly in prep for his move inside last season.
it still looks like he has power taking on guards and centers, they certainly dont throw him around if he has his base. But if the play is away from him he's done often cause he allows himself to tangle too much. When he does flow around those attempted blocks the guy makes some pretty eye opening plays behind the los.
I think pgh knew that ur nit gonna get around our defense much, our lb'ers are too fast....so they freeze em by running right at em. Thats when the DL is supppsed to keep OL from the 2nd level. But they come off the ball and as they feel themselving getting released they dont cave in they drift further upfield. Thats a big prob and i susoect a majirvreason why some of those big run plays you saw 2 to 3 steelers OL 5 or more yds deep just swallowing up 2nd level defenders.
really disappointed williams allowed a srrength to possibly become an acute weakness.We needed to keep our interior line as is from last year but should have worked harder at getting a vet LDE. That would gave solved our pressure issue. If u all saw mack last night...dear god, im wondering if we should have landed him afterall. He hasnt lost sht, he's the best def player in the NFL
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Connor will probably disappear next Sunday... I gotta figure someone will game plan for him.. The Browns certainly did not...
Connor will probably disappear next Sunday... I gotta figure someone will game plan for him.. The Browns certainly did not...
Well, you do have to give credit to the Steelers OL...(who do have 3 Pro Bowl players on that line) .and to their OL coach, Mike Munchak, whom I think may be the best in the business.
In fact, I had been in favor of the Browns hiring him as HC....when they hired Jackson. He had about a .500 record with the Tits, with a pretty lousy team and no QB.
So, I think that any reasonably competent RB could have performed well back there. If they had Carlos Hyde, he could be All Pro because of the blocking he would get.
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does joe wanna coach?
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Connor will probably disappear next Sunday... I gotta figure someone will game plan for him.. The Browns certainly did not...
Well, you do have to give credit to the Steelers OL...(who do have 3 Pro Bowl players on that line) .and to their OL coach, Mike Munchak, whom I think may be the best in the business.
In fact, I had been in favor of the Browns hiring him as HC....when they hired Jackson. He had about a .500 record with the Tits, with a pretty lousy team and no QB.
So, I think that any reasonably competent RB could have performed well back there. If they had Carlos Hyde, he could be All Pro because of the blocking he would get.
Well, you do have to give credit to the Steelers OL...(who do have 3 Pro Bowl players on that line) .and to their OL coach, Mike Munchak, whom I think may be the best in the business.
In fact, I had been in favor of the Browns hiring him as HC....when they hired Jackson. He had about a .500 record with the Tits, with a pretty lousy team and no QB.
So, I think that any reasonably competent RB could have performed well back there. If they had Carlos Hyde, he could be All Pro because of the blocking he would get.
Yeah... I was not big on Hue... Munchak has been there and played the game.. So I automatically would lend more creedence to his experience...
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Well, you do have to give credit to the Steelers OL...(who do have 3 Pro Bowl players on that line) .and to their OL coach, Mike Munchak, whom I think may be the best in the business.
In fact, I had been in favor of the Browns hiring him as HC....when they hired Jackson. He had about a .500 record with the Tits, with a pretty lousy team and no QB.
So, I think that any reasonably competent RB could have performed well back there. If they had Carlos Hyde, he could be All Pro because of the blocking he would get.
Yeah... I was not big on Hue... Munchak has been there and played the game.. So I automatically would lend more creedence to his experience...
Yeah... I was not big on Hue... Munchak has been there and played the game.. So I automatically would lend more creedence to his experience...
i dont think wylie is hues guy. He xame in with dirsey/haley. Im starting to smell a similiar situation to that fukking walruscunt who's name i cant remember but famously broke up the hillis/vickers combo that obliterated NFL front 7's, cause fullbacks dont matter.
not feeling good
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Yeah... I was not big on Hue... Munchak has been there and played the game.. So I automatically would lend more creedence to his experience...
i dont think wylie is hues guy. He xame in with dirsey/haley. Im starting to smell a similiar situation to that fukking walruscunt who's name i cant remember but famously broke up the hillis/vickers combo that obliterated NFL front 7's, cause fullbacks dont matter.
not feeling good
that fukking walruscunt who's name i cant remember
That would be Mike "walruscunt" Holmgren...
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Back to the original "run" thread. Just wait till we get a double running dose of Ingram/Kamara with Brees also throwing to Kamara out of the BF after Thomas has cleared out the flat. Anyone who has any of those players had better use them in their leagues this weekend. I'm using Brees for sure.
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Isn't Ingram serving a 4-week suspension?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Back to the original "run" thread. Just wait till we get a double running dose of Ingram/Kamara with Brees also throwing to Kamara out of the BF after Thomas has cleared out the flat. Anyone who has any of those players had better use them in their leagues this weekend. I'm using Brees for sure.
Back to the original "run" thread. Just wait till we get a double running dose of Ingram/Kamara with Brees also throwing to Kamara out of the BF after Thomas has cleared out the flat. Anyone who has any of those players had better use them in their leagues this weekend. I'm using Brees for sure.
Ingram is suspended...
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