Defense Secretary Mattis 'retiring' at end of February

[Westside Steve]

@clevfan4life said:

Its the way he just he did it, like he woke up and saud fuck it bring them home. To be clear im not against the concept, but u tell the military in advance so a draw down can be orchestrated without leaving an immeduate gaping suck hole for isis 2.0 to fill.

Surely u can agree with me on that. This move made almost in unison with those sanctions being lifted, i mean.....wtf?

I do agree with you there. But I don't see much difference in Assad versus Isis versus the Muslim Brotherhood versus whoever the hell else runs that shit hole. 

But no you don't pull this kind of shit with a man of respect like General Mattis. That's why he's there. You should call him up tell him I would like to do this or that and ask if and how we can do it. And follow his advice. 

But you've got to agree it's ironic to see some of the peace-loving members of the left now fire-breathing warhawks.

WSS

[Clevfan4life]

@westside-steve said:

But you've got to agree it's ironic to see some of the peace-loving members of the left now fire-breathing warhawks.

WSS

Yeah. What concept have i been imploring people here for years about? Principle. If ur against our troops stationed indefinitely in a sandy shithole where nothing they do will make any difference there and their mere presence makes people loathe us......then ur against it no matter who is potus. Ive been screaming at the lack of principle in this entire country for years. 

But what u also have to admit, its quite a show watching one relatively highly thought of individual after another going from shine to shit in often very short periods and not a single trumper says wait a minute........

And now we have this issue of trump lifting those sanctions.......

[Westside Steve]

@clevfan4life said:

And now we have this issue of trump lifting those sanctions.......

But I don't care about that. I have no particular animosity toward the russkis and never have. This modern-day McCarthyism is situational.

WSD

[Clevfan4life]

@westside-steve said:

But I don't care about that. I have no particular animosity toward the russkis and never have. This modern-day McCarthyism is situational.

WSD

Those men who were sanctioned were sanction because they tried to fuck with YOUR VOTE, and not just in 2016 but also the recent midterms. Ive been saying fir 2 years the russian intervention wasnt in behalf if their beloved Donald....they laugh at him.....they're sowing discord which means they'll help the side which generates the most rage from the other. Do not be surprised to see a "democratic socialist" as our next president and dont be surprised if there was russian involvement because the "rage factor" on the right will hit the lower atmosphere. 

You'll care then about russian or anyone elses interference then, i promise u that. 

[OldBrownsFan]

@clevfan4life said:

Yeah. What concept have i been imploring people here for years about? Principle. If ur against our troops stationed indefinitely in a sandy shithole where nothing they do will make any difference there and their mere presence makes people loathe us......then ur against it no matter who is potus. Ive been screaming at the lack of principle in this entire country for years. 

But what u also have to admit, its quite a show watching one relatively highly thought of individual after another going from shine to shit in often very short periods and not a single trumper says wait a minute........

And now we have this issue of trump lifting those sanctions.......

I see your point if someone who is hawkish all of a sudden changes their tune because of Trump. 

From what I know about Trump he has been consistent on not wanting to see this country bogged down in conflicts across the world with no end game or long term goals...his pulling the troops out of Syria are consistent with what he has always stated. I have mixed feelings about some of this now.  I supported taking out Ghadaffi but the reality is Libya was better off with Ghadaffi there instead of turning Libya into a failed state. I supported the Iraq war and taking out Hussein but the better option was probably just trying to contain Hussein instead of a war that put us trillions of dollars in debt and loss of American soldiers lives for what?  I thought Bush's idea of trying to bring democracy to some of these countries was a good idea but where did it get us? 

I support keeping the troops in Syria because ISIS has not been defeated and Trump saying they are will come back to bite him. Under Trump our military has done a great job in taking back almost all the territory ISIS once held but the cancer is still there and they are not defeated. Like I say though I have mixed feeling anymore about this as the results have not been good in a lot of our interventions around the world. And I hate to say this but when it comes to intervening in Muslim countries it seems no matter how much we try to help we will always be the infidels so why bother?

[Clevfan4life]

@oldbrownsfan said:

And I hate to say this but when it comes to intervening in Muslim countries it seems no matter how much we try to help we will always be the infidels so why bother?

And ive been arguing that point to u sunce i joined here. But noooowwww that rich white monkey holds that view now ur in favor of not bombing simple people who just want to grow some fucking olives then die peacefully. We fucking militarized those people over nearly a century now of faggotry in theur lands. 

I guess we beed to elect more rich white monkeys huh?

[OldBrownsFan]

@clevfan4life said:

And ive been arguing that point to u sunce i joined here. But noooowwww that rich white monkey holds that view now ur in favor of not bombing simple people who just want to grow some fucking olives then die peacefully. We fucking militarized those people over nearly a century now of faggotry in theur lands. 

I guess we beed to elect more rich white monkeys huh?

Nothing to do with Trump...I started questioning the wisdom of the Iraq war within a year. Colin Powell was right when he said if we broke it we bought it and he was right and what did we buy in the end? Same way with Libya I questioned the wisdom of what we did long before Trump. I'm still on board with Mattis, Pompeo and Bolton on keeping our troops in Syria mainly because I hate to see what is going to happen to the Kurds there who have helped us and always seem to get the short end of the stick for their help. 

[DieHardBrownsFan]

[Westside Steve]

@clevfan4life said:

Those men who were sanctioned were sanction because they tried to fuck with YOUR VOTE, and not just in 2016 but also the recent midterms. Ive been saying fir 2 years the russian intervention wasnt in behalf if their beloved Donald....they laugh at him.....they're sowing discord which means they'll help the side which generates the most rage from the other. Do not be surprised to see a "democratic socialist" as our next president and dont be surprised if there was russian involvement because the "rage factor" on the right will hit the lower atmosphere. 

You'll care then about russian or anyone elses interference then, i promise u that. 

No I wont. And the Democrats wouldn't give a shit about whatever the russkis did if their girl didn't lose. And she didn't lose because of anything the Russians put on Facebook she lost because she's the only candidate in the world people hated worse than Donald Trump. Plus whatever shit was revealed is shit she actually did so you guys, at least the regular Democrats, want to shoot the messenger. I don't remember any of the lefties shitting their pants over Woodward and Bernstein.

And we're going to have a Social Democrat in the White House soon enough. Not because of Any fake news from either side but because there are just too many lazy ass Deadbeats who are looking for a free ride and blame successful people for them not having one

WSS

[The Cysko Kid]

@clevfan4life said:

And ive been arguing that point to u sunce i joined here. But noooowwww that rich white monkey holds that view now ur in favor of not bombing simple people who just want to grow some fucking olives then die peacefully. We fucking militarized those people over nearly a century now of faggotry in theur lands. 

I guess we beed to elect more rich white monkeys huh?

Ha

You think the middle east is just some fucking peaceful olive farm?

Jesus Christ Cleve. I've rarely seen you say anything more fucking stupid than this. 

[Clevfan4life]

@the-cysko-kid said:

Ha

You think the middle east is just some fucking peaceful olive farm?

Jesus Christ Cleve. I've rarely seen you say anything more fucking stupid than this. 

1) i know far more about the middle east, its current and past history....than u would learn in 2 lifetimes.

2) The people in "power" in the middle east....are not peaceful olive farmers. But its the simple ngrs that suffer the most when we go waltzing in there and start unloading ammo warehouses. And its THOSE people then who the people in power use to keep their positions of power because they just parrot anti american rhetoric. 

You simply dont understand the dynamics in effect in that region that were put in place now over 100 years ago. 

[DieHardBrownsFan]

Spread your vast knowledge Cleve.  Lets hear it.  Besides talking shit.  Provide some fucking proof.

[The Cysko Kid]

@clevfan4life said:

1) i know far more about the middle east, its current and past history....than u would learn in 2 lifetimes.

2) The people in "power" in the middle east....are not peaceful olive farmers. But its the simple ngrs that suffer the most when we go waltzing in there and start unloading ammo warehouses. And its THOSE people then who the people in power use to keep their positions of power because they just parrot anti american rhetoric. 

You simply dont understand the dynamics in effect in that region that were put in place now over 100 years ago. 

1. Classic narcissistic arrogance. I've been there. You haven't. You have not a clue what I know about it. 

2. The middle east has been in a state of perpetual war for thousands of years. Caliphates mean anything to you? Crusades? Charles Martell?

You should shut the fuck up once in a while. 

[Clevfan4life]

@the-cysko-kid said:

2. The middle east has been in a state of perpetual war for thousands of years. 

That statement right there is why i dont bother. People just couldnt be bothered to become educated. 

"The Islamic Golden Age is the era in the history of Islam, traditionally dated from the 8th century to the 14th century, during which much of the historically Islamic world was ruled by various caliphates, and science, economic development and cultural works flourished.^[1][2][3] This period is traditionally understood to have begun during the reign of the Abbasid caliph Harun al-Rashid (786 to 809) with the inauguration of the House of Wisdom in Baghdad, where scholars from various parts of the world with different cultural backgrounds were mandated to gather and translate all of the world's classical knowledge into the Arabic language.^[4][5] This period is traditionally said to have ended with the collapse of the Abbasid caliphate due to Mongol invasionsand the Siege of Baghdad in 1258 AD.^[6] A few contemporary scholars place the end of the Islamic Golden Age as late as the end of 15th to 16th centuries.^[1]"[2][3]"

[Clevfan4life]

This is high school.history

[Clevfan4life]

@the-cysko-kid said:

1. Classic narcissistic arrogance. I've been there. You haven't. You have not a clue what I know about it.

Rudimentary knowledge of history isnt "narcissistic arrogance"...its just knowing something that people refuse to acknowledge and/or learn about no matter how many times its gently mentioned to.them. 

[DieHardBrownsFan]

@clevfan4life said:

That statement right there is why i dont bother. People just couldnt be bothered to become educated. 

"The Islamic Golden Age is the era in the history of Islam, traditionally dated from the 8th century to the 14th century, during which much of the historically Islamic world was ruled by various caliphates, and science, economic development and cultural works flourished.^[1][2][3] This period is traditionally understood to have begun during the reign of the Abbasid caliph Harun al-Rashid (786 to 809) with the inauguration of the House of Wisdom in Baghdad, where scholars from various parts of the world with different cultural backgrounds were mandated to gather and translate all of the world's classical knowledge into the Arabic language.^[4][5] This period is traditionally said to have ended with the collapse of the Abbasid caliphate due to Mongol invasionsand the Siege of Baghdad in 1258 AD.^[6] A few contemporary scholars place the end of the Islamic Golden Age as late as the end of 15th to 16th centuries.^[1]"[2][3]"

WTF is this supposed to prove?  Man your fucking stupid.

[Clevfan4life]

@diehardbrownsfan said:

WTF is this supposed to prove?  Man your fucking stupid.

It proves the middle east hasnt been in a perpetual state of war for billions of earth years, as was prior asserted. Are YOU this stupid?

[calfoxwc]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Middle_East

From the 3rd up to the course of the 7th century AD, the entire Middle East was dominated by the Byzantines and Sassanid Persia. From the 7th century, a new power was rising in the Middle East, that of Islam. The dominance of the Arabs came to a sudden end in the mid-11th century with the arrival of the Seljuq Turks. In the early 13th century, a new wave of invaders, the armies of the Mongol Empire, mainly Turkic, swept through the region. By the early 15th century, a new power had arisen in western Anatolia, the Ottoman emirs, linguistically Turkic and religiously Islamic, who in 1453 captured the Christian Byzantine capital of Constantinople and made themselves sultans.

Large parts of the Middle East became a warground between the Ottomans and Iranian Safavids for centuries starting in the early 16th century.

[calfoxwc]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Byzantine_Empire#Leonid_dynasty

The Arabs, now firmly in control of Syria and the Levant, sent frequent raiding parties deep into Asia Minor, and in 674–678 laid siege to Constantinople itself. The Arab fleet was finally repulsed through the use of Greek fire, and a thirty-years' truce was signed between the Empire and the Umayyad Caliphate.^[