Who is the bigger idiot

Dutch Oven

@nero said:

I would take the Baseball money, though I had to play the most boring sport on Earth

I'm confused Nero... If Murray took the baseball money, why would he have to play soccer? ?

leebladedawg

I don’t think Murray is stupid for wanting to give it a shot, if he lands in right spot with right coach he could be viable

not saying he will of course

Ibleedbrown

If Murray goes the NFL route then 1 of 2 unacceptable things happened. Either the A’s didn’t do their due dilligence to make sure the guy intended to play baseball, or he severely misled them about his post college intentions.

It’s not super uncommon that a 2 sport athlete could be drafted by MLB and NFL. If anyone remembers, Johnny Manziel was drafted as a shortstop by San Diego, l think. But they used a really low pick because they knew his intention was to play football.

However, before an MLB team burns their number 1 pick on a guy, there are usually conversations held between teams and players to discern what they plan to do. In baseball, players have options. They could go to or stay in college, they could go to Japan, or forego sports altogether and go for whatever career they studied for.

The Gipper

@hoorta said:

Yeah, that was Calvin Murphy 5' 9", also Spud Webb 5' 7", and he won the NBA dunk contest. Great- or just "pretty good"? BTW, researching this, the shortest player in NBA history was Muggsy Bogues, at all of 5'3"- even blocked a shot by the 7' Patrick Ewing. But the shortest NFL QB of recent memory was Doug Flutie at 5' 10". The list of QBs under 6' is might short...

There was a very short QB that I thought played for the Lions...or somebody back in the 50s/60s.....who I thought was like 5'8. But it was not Bobby Layne. I checked and he was 6'1".

But.....I found him: Eddie LeBaron: 5'7" Played for Redskins and Cowboys.

Passing

Year	Age
Career
7 yrs
4 yrs
1952	22
1953	23
1955*	25
1956	26
1957*	27
1958*	28
1959	29
1960	30
1961	31
1962*	32
1963	33

Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int%	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	Sk%	4QC	GWD	AV
Career				134	85	28-54-3	898	1796	50.0	13399	104	5.8	141	7.9	85	7.5	5.1	14.9	100.0	61.4		13	13	21
7 yrs	WAS			82	57	23-32-2	539	1104	48.8	8068	59	5.3	88	8.0	82	7.3	4.8	15.0	98.4	57.8		9	11
4 yrs	DAL			52	28	5-22-1	359	692	51.9	5331	45	6.5	53	7.7	85	7.7	5.6	14.8	102.5	67.2		4	2	21
1952	22	WAS	QB	14	12	7	1-6-0	96	194	49.5	1420	14	7.2	15	7.7	70	7.3	5.3	14.8	118.3	65.7		2	2
1953	23	WAS	QB	14	12	8	4-3-1	62	149	41.6	874	3	2.0	17	11.4	66	5.9	1.1	14.1	72.8	28.3		3	3
1955*	25	WAS	QB	14	12	8	4-4-0	79	178	44.4	1270	9	5.1	15	8.4	70	7.1	4.4	16.1	105.8	50.5		2	2
1956	26	WAS	qb	14	10	5	3-2-0	47	98	48.0	554	3	3.1	10	10.2	33	5.7	1.7	11.8	55.4	36.2		1	1
1957*	27	WAS	QB	14	12	12	5-6-1	99	167	59.3	1508	11	6.6	10	6.0	82	9.0	7.7	15.2	125.7	86.1		0	1
1958*	28	WAS	QB	14	12	10	4-6-0	79	145	54.5	1365	11	7.6	10	6.9	71	9.4	7.8	17.3	113.8	83.3		1	1
1959	29	WAS	QB	14	12	7	2-5-0	77	173	44.5	1077	8	4.6	11	6.4	49	6.2	4.3	14.0	89.8	54.0		0	1
1960	30	DAL	QB	14	11	10	0-9-1	111	225	49.3	1736	12	5.3	25	11.1	76	7.7	3.8	15.6	157.8	53.5		1	0	5
1961	31	DAL	QB	14	14	10	2-8-0	120	236	50.8	1741	14	5.9	16	6.8	80	7.4	5.5	14.5	124.4	66.7		3	2	6
1962*	32	DAL	QB	14	14	6	3-3-0	95	166	57.2	1436	16	9.6	9	5.4	85	8.7	8.1	15.1	102.6	95.4				8
1963	33	DAL	qb	14	13	2	0-2-0	33	65	50.8	418	3	4.6	3	4.6	75	6.4	5.3	12.7	32.2	67.3				2

13 comebacks, 13 game-winning drives - full summary

This 5'7 QB made the Pro Bowl 4 times

The Gipper

@nero said:

First things first, I loved the back and forth thoughtful discussion between Dutch and Mark. Very entertaining to say the least.

I would take the Baseball money, though I had to play the most boring sport on Earth (mjp, I'm looking at you).

You play soccer no....so yes...you play the most boring sport on Earth.

Anyway, you guy missed a point. Something that would make Murray not an idiot, but a genius.

Maybe he is not aiming for an NFL high paid career,

Maybe he wants something more...

Maybe he wants to reach the promised land...

Maybe he is one of those chosen ones, the most fortunate guys on Earth. The smartest of the bunch...

A backup QB career. My idols.

The Gipper

@gumby73 said:

The Jets!!

? ?

Yea, WTF is up with that. It does look like he was following a fly or a gnat.

hoorta

@the-gipper said:

There was a very short QB that I thought played for the Lions...or somebody back in the 50s/60s.....who I thought was like 5'8. But it was not Bobby Layne. I checked and he was 6'1".

But.....I found him: Eddie LeBaron: 5'7" Played for Redskins and Cowboys.

Passing

13 comebacks, 13 game-winning drives - full summary

This 5'7 QB made the Pro Bowl 4 times

I knew you'd find the Danny Devito of quarterbacks. But I said recent memory. For the sake of argument, let's use the year Steeler fans use when the NFL started- 1970. There aren't any 5' 7" quarterbacks in the NFL anymore, just like there aren't any 220 pound defensive ends....

BTW, mucking around- Sonny Jurgensen was in the sub 6' club at 5' 11". But not Sammy Baugh at 6' 2".

flyingfooldoug

@mark-o said:

He's going to make a shitton more money being drafted in the NFL. Plus he won't have to go to the minor leagues and ride a bus for a few years before playing in the Majors. Longer career most likely in baseball but I think I'd take the NFL money over baseball.

Baseball careers seem to last longer. On average a baseball player might make more money. The glamour is the NFL though. Bo knows.

Mark O

@flyingfooldoug said:

Baseball careers seem to last longer. On average a baseball player might make more money. The glamour is the NFL though. Bo knows.

Baseball career is almost definitely longer. Immediate money and chance to play in the big time is in the NFL. He's 3 years at least away from even being in major league baseball. That's a lot of bus rides and playing for peanuts as opposed to being a first round draft choice and being in the NFL. Will he have a long NFL career? No one knows. I doubt it because of his size but there's no guarantee he's making it to the majors either. First round draft picks in baseball flame out and are never heard from again much more often than they do in the NFL.

Vagitron

@mark-o said:

He's going to make a shitton more money being drafted in the NFL. Plus he won't have to go to the minor leagues and ride a bus for a few years before playing in the Majors. Longer career most likely in baseball but I think I'd take the NFL money over baseball.

Is he? His career longevity will likely be longer in the mlb. Deion sanders said in hindsight he would have only played in the mlb.

Mark O

@vagitron said:

Is he? His career longevity will likely be longer in the mlb. Deion sanders said in hindsight he would have only played in the mlb.

That's what I said. His career will be longer in baseball. But he isn't playing for the Oakland A's next season. Every baseball person I've heard says he will be playing for the Stockton A's in 2019 and best case scenario he ends the year in AA and then has a chance to play in Oakland in 2020. That's the best and fast tracked through the minor league system but there's no guarantees of that. Lots of first round baseball draft picks flame out and never make it to the majors. A much higher percentage than first round draft busts in the NFL.

Ibleedbrown

@vagitron said:

Is he? His career longevity will likely be longer in the mlb. Deion sanders said in hindsight he would have only played in the mlb.

Bo Jackson said the same. It really boils down to doing what he loves. He’s clearly pretty amped up at the prospect of playing in the NFL right now. I guess success and the Heisman will do that to a guy.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/96492338

CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS

@vagitron said:

Is he? His career longevity will likely be longer in the mlb. Deion sanders said in hindsight he would have only played in the mlb.

Deion wasn’t a QB. If a QB does his job right(gets the ball out quick/slides before contact) and doesn’t have idiots blocking for him, he should be able to limit the blows that everyone loves talking about.

Baker didn’t really take many “shots” last year, for example.

Browns149

There are not many people I would pick over Huey

Gunz41

@clevelandwantsplayoffs said:

Deion wasn’t a QB. If a QB does his job right(gets the ball out quick/slides before contact) and doesn’t have idiots blocking for him, he should be able to limit the blows that everyone loves talking about.

Baker didn’t really take many “shots” last year, for example.

Deion avoiding contact a lot. QBs cant help but so much how much they get hit, it is somewhat dependent position, as they are depending on line to block, and stationary at times. Also aren't a lot of late hits/ roughing on defenders.

The odds of getting hit are exponentially higher for QBs

CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS

@gunz41 said:

Deion avoiding contact a lot. QBs cant help but so much how much they get hit, it is somewhat dependent position, as they are depending on line to block, and stationary at times. Also aren't a lot of late hits/ roughing on defenders.

The odds of getting hit are exponentially higher for QBs

What you say is true. What I’m saying is some guys do take a LOT more hits than others...

Murray certainly isn’t built to take too many big shots, but he’s so fast and quick that it will be a tall task to do such.

TexasAg1969

@clevelandwantsplayoffs said:

What you say is true. What I’m saying is some guys do take a LOT more hits than others...

Murray certainly isn’t built to take too many big shots, but he’s so fast and quick that it will be a tall task to do such.

One really good blindside hit could send both careers into the shitter in a NY minute. Just use FB to leverage a better BB deal.

flyingfooldoug

@mark-o said:

Baseball career is almost definitely longer. Immediate money and chance to play in the big time is in the NFL. He's 3 years at least away from even being in major league baseball. That's a lot of bus rides and playing for peanuts as opposed to being a first round draft choice and being in the NFL. Will he have a long NFL career? No one knows. I doubt it because of his size but there's no guarantee he's making it to the majors either. First round draft picks in baseball flame out and are never heard from again much more often than they do in the NFL.

Don’t forget, baseball drafts players much younger than football. They generally need to wait a few years to finish growing. Baseball drafts kids. Football drafts grown men

Gunz41

@clevelandwantsplayoffs said:

What you say is true. What I’m saying is some guys do take a LOT more hits than others...

Murray certainly isn’t built to take too many big shots, but he’s so fast and quick that it will be a tall task to do such.

Murray has a little more quickness, but not anywhere close to speed of RG3 or Michael Vick, how did those work out.

People seem to look at speed/quickness/strength in college and just think it translates the exact same to pros, but that isn't the case.

Mark O

@flyingfooldoug said:

Don’t forget, baseball drafts players much younger than football. They generally need to wait a few years to finish growing. Baseball drafts kids. Football drafts grown men

Of course they do...and in a lot of ways he's still a kid as well at only 21 years old. Immediately, there's more money in football. Long term (assuming he makes the majors and is as good as his draft position) he would play longer and make more money in baseball.