Analytics in football

cvcanedy

@nickers said:

Anal-Litticks sounds as stupid to me now.. As when I first heard of it.. You can't measure heart or desire with it... To me.. It sounds like Corporate hogwash..

Oh my god. Old guy says old guy things.

Canton Mike

@nickers said:

Anal-Litticks sounds as stupid to me now.. As when I first heard of it.. You can't measure heart or desire with it... To me.. It sounds like Corporate hogwash..

@cvcanedy said:

Oh my god. Old guy says old guy things.

Nickers, I've got your back. Analytics, like computers, are great tools. However, if you become totally dependent on them, you have problems.

Mike

Dutch Oven

You anti-analytics guys have it wrong.

There isn't anything wrong with using analytics.

The real problem is the Browns analytics guys suck.

mjp28

@dutch-oven said:

You anti-analytics guys have it wrong.

There isn't anything wrong with using analytics.

The real problem is the Browns analytics guys suck.

I never cared how they did the spreadsheets as long as they were correct......then give them to me.

Same with any stats or analytics.

Tour2ma

@canton-mike said:

Analytics, like computers, are great tools. However, if you become totally dependent on them, you have problems.

So marry them with your traditional approach. That was always the plan... well... not always.

Took a break during the Dorsey "We Don't need no stinkin' Analytics... Football Guy Part Quatre" era...

Dutch Oven

@tour2ma said:

So marry them with your traditional approach. That was always the plan... well... not always.

Took a break during the Dorsey "We Don't need no stinkin' Analytics... Football Guy Part Quatre" era...

You mean the era when actual talent was added to this team?

Yeah, that totally sucked.

cvcanedy

@canton-mike said:

Nickers, I've got your back. Analytics, like computers, are great tools. However, if you become totally dependent on them, you have problems.

Mike

Agree, but purposely misspelling them like a 13 year old and claiming they are totally wrong is so pointless. Id love for use to have more constructive discussions

mjp28

@nickers said:

Anal-Litticks sounds as stupid to me now.. As when I first heard of it.. You can't measure heart or desire with it... To me.. It sounds like Corporate hogwash..

It's just a another tool like a computer or 40 time with a stop watch.

Someone has to take all of the mountains of data and put a plan together and pull the trigger....... that's all.

Tour2ma

@dutch-oven said:

You mean the era when actual talent was added to this team?

Yeah, that totally sucked.

And your absolute delight with the entire era was like the light of a 1000 suns...

nickers

@cvcanedy said:

Agree, but purposely misspelling them like a 13 year old and claiming they are totally wrong is so pointless. Id love for use to have more constructive discussions

You must be 12 then...

mjp28

@dutch-oven said:

You mean the era when actual talent was added to this team?

Yeah, that totally sucked.

When was that? This century or the last? Oh yeah I remember now I was driving a Mustang.

Dutch Oven

@tour2ma said:

And your absolute delight with the entire era was like the light of a 1000 suns...

I criticized John Dorsey's moves repeatedly.

You, on the other hand, couldn't stop fawning over Sashi and Co. Nary a word of criticism would ever spring from your fingers to keyboard for THE PROCESS. Your complete inability to be objective about that front office, at the time, in hindsight, or now again with their re-emergence, was frankly almost impressive.

Tour2ma

@dutch-oven said:

I criticized John Dorsey's moves repeatedly.

You, on the other hand, couldn't stop fawning over Sashi and Co. Nary a word of criticism would ever spring from your fingers to keyboard for THE PROCESS. Your complete inability to be objective about that front office, at the time, in hindsight, or now again with their re-emergence, was frankly almost impressive.

Thus my use of the pale red font color... pink is not one of the squares on my drop menu.
Untrue. I saw moves I did not agree with coming out of the Sashi era... particularly draft selections not made. Others like the unprecedented Osweiler trade I championed as brilliant. However, I understood what our FO was trying to do and that developing it was going to take time. So I defended The Process v1.0 and still will. There's a difference between defending a process and defending it's every output... something you are eager to claim for yourself (loved Dorsey, but criticized moves), but are unwilling for whatever reason to grant me. Why is that?

And while we are at it... as for Part Deux... I'm not convinced that is accurate. I'm not sure that what we are developing now is a process that will end up close to what started 4 years ago. Granted analytics will be playing a greater role in planning and on gameday, but so far I don't see what the plan is for marrying analytics and scouting, or developing scouting expertise.

Ibleedbrown

You ever say a word so many times that it starts to sounds silly? Analytics. Analytics.

mjp28

@ibleedbrown said:

You ever say a word so many times that it starts to sounds silly? Analytics. Analytics.

Kind of sounds like one of those late night fitness programs for women, do analytics and lose 15 pounds in one month.

Reminds me of Moneyball in baseball....... unless it works ! We'll see what the BROWNS version looks like.

Dutch Oven

@mjp28 said:

Kind of sounds like one of those late night fitness programs for women, do analytics and lose 15 pounds in one month.

Reminds me of Moneyball in baseball....... unless it works ! We'll see what the BROWNS version looks like.

We already did, or were you in a coma for the two years Sashi and Co. were running the team?

It looked like shit.

mjp28

@dutch-oven said:

We already did, or were you in a coma for the two years Sashi and Co. were running the team?

It looked like shit.

I mean the new and improved BROWNS v3.1 analytics for winners......really. Honest. 🥷

Unsympathetic

The reason it worked for the A's was because of competitive advantage: Nobody else was using it.

Now, everyone is using it... and the teams that don't are falling behind -- because they can't stop fawning over players who would only make one above-replacement-value play every other game because it was spectacular. The baseball analogy is the .200/200K/50 HR adam dunn.

The Gipper

@nickers said:

Anal-Litticks sounds as stupid to me now.. As when I first heard of it.. You can't measure heart or desire with it... To me.. It sounds like Corporate hogwash..

I think there is probably a lot of use for it in football. But I basically agree with you to a point. In baseball and basketball, the numbers game can be far more telling story about a player, because those are numbers games, and non-contact sports.

In football, no numbers, I do not believe, tell us how willing a defender is to stick his nose into a tackle and knock an opponent on his ass...or how much guts it takes to block for a QB or RB and manhandle the guy across the line from you to keep that man from tackling your RB/QB.

Maybe in those other sports, the numbers are the end all and be all of how good a player could be. In football, they are just an itty bitty part of it all.