The 'Who you watching?' 2020 thread.
-
Priority UDFA. Then agreed.
-
So I'm watching your boy Uche under the fine tooth comb. I kind of see some of the things you're talking about and I think he's a quality football player. But I think his premium isn't immediately primarily as a pass rusher. The kid is quite fluid in space and seems to have a good understanding of what is developing in front of him. He has that "see ball, get ball". He looks like Shaq Thompson at times. Good quicks and can use them as the 5th or 6th man when pressuring. Speaking of - his pass rush stance is... idk how to describe it. He looks like he's standing narrow ready to fire out of a chalk running sprints. He has a good first step, and I mean that - a good one. But it isn't elite, and his length, ability to bend around the edge or any type of counter move isn't ideal. But he did take his speed, put it into power and drive Tristan Wirfs back a few times. He even got a pressure on one of them. Beyond that? He got beat up pretty bad on both sides by the Iowa tackles. He's a 9-align on base downs as an on-ball linebacker. Then UM started using him all over vs Iowa. Sometimes as a decoy then sending pressure from the other side. In the 3-3 looks, he seems to move around quite a bit and flips in assignment between dropping and rushing, with an occasional "green light" to do either.
Vs Illinois and some of their option concepts, he would have a gap assignment, but attack it from an off ball LB look. Sometimes it looked like UM was already slanting their lines, so I'm sure this is by design. An interesting way of attacking spread teams who like to run laterally. Interesting that in some of the cover 2 looks he's the MLB as well. He just looks like a very space and speed dependent rusher. When he can get wide and get a full head of steam, he has the bull to drive some tackles back. But he never really wins the edge, drop his hips, then use his arms to create the pressure. Very scheme dependent and most of what he does is on tenacity + effort. Great motor by the way, kid never stops running. But the Illini RT ate him up pretty bad. Haven't seen a single counter move back to the inside.
Vs Penn State, he did a good job of getting to the flash blocks before they got to him. Once he got his hands on the lead, he held his ground and waited for help to arrive. Can't ask much more than that. Stopping the run consistently isn't about the individual making a play so much as everyone playing their role as a unit. Still not offering much on either side as the primary edge rusher though.
In 4 man fronts where it's obvious how and when he's coming, his quickness off the snap is somewhat neutralized by his lack of physical stature to be a reliable edge rusher. But when he's turned loose as an off backer linebacker who can gap exchange or be sent from different places it becomes a different story. Then he's able to get creative in his timing and rush technique and generate some pressure. I say some, because he's like a decent PG - he can space the floor and find the other man, but he isn't great at creating his own shot.
As the 5th or 6th man in the pressure the role looks much more effective. He drives backs and TE's chipping quite well and tends to put them into a QB's face creating a pressure and getting them off the spot.
He looks like a role player and off ball linebacker. The problem is, he doesn't have a hell of a lot of time mastering any one position so he'll need time, and a patient yet slightly creative coaching staff to use him properly. There is potential. But I don't see Trent Cole, undersized yet monstrous type player. And he isn't big enough to hold a 5tech spot down vs the run.
Not sure how high you intend on taking him or for what team, but right now as a linebacker I guess I could see a later day 2 pick.
-
So I'm watching your boy Uche under the fine tooth comb. I kind of see some of the things you're talking about and I think he's a quality football player. But I think his premium isn't immediately primarily as a pass rusher. The kid is quite fluid in space and seems to have a good understanding of what is developing in front of him. He has that "see ball, get ball". He looks like Shaq Thompson at times. Good quicks and can use them as the 5th or 6th man when pressuring. Speaking of - his pass rush stance is... idk how to describe it. He looks like he's standing narrow ready to fire out of a chalk running sprints. He has a good first step, and I mean that - a good one. But it isn't elite, and his length, ability to bend around the edge or any type of counter move isn't ideal. But he did take his speed, put it into power and drive Tristan Wirfs back a few times. He even got a pressure on one of them. Beyond that? He got beat up pretty bad on both sides by the Iowa tackles. He's a 9-align on base downs as an on-ball linebacker. Then UM started using him all over vs Iowa. Sometimes as a decoy then sending pressure from the other side. In the 3-3 looks, he seems to move around quite a bit and flips in assignment between dropping and rushing, with an occasional "green light" to do either.
Vs Illinois and some of their option concepts, he would have a gap assignment, but attack it from an off ball LB look. Sometimes it looked like UM was already slanting their lines, so I'm sure this is by design. An interesting way of attacking spread teams who like to run laterally. Interesting that in some of the cover 2 looks he's the MLB as well. He just looks like a very space and speed dependent rusher. When he can get wide and get a full head of steam, he has the bull to drive some tackles back. But he never really wins the edge, drop his hips, then use his arms to create the pressure. Very scheme dependent and most of what he does is on tenacity + effort. Great motor by the way, kid never stops running. But the Illini RT ate him up pretty bad. Haven't seen a single counter move back to the inside.
Vs Penn State, he did a good job of getting to the flash blocks before they got to him. Once he got his hands on the lead, he held his ground and waited for help to arrive. Can't ask much more than that. Stopping the run consistently isn't about the individual making a play so much as everyone playing their role as a unit. Still not offering much on either side as the primary edge rusher though.
In 4 man fronts where it's obvious how and when he's coming, his quickness off the snap is somewhat neutralized by his lack of physical stature to be a reliable edge rusher. But when he's turned loose as an off backer linebacker who can gap exchange or be sent from different places it becomes a different story. Then he's able to get creative in his timing and rush technique and generate some pressure. I say some, because he's like a decent PG - he can space the floor and find the other man, but he isn't great at creating his own shot.
As the 5th or 6th man in the pressure the role looks much more effective. He drives backs and TE's chipping quite well and tends to put them into a QB's face creating a pressure and getting them off the spot.
He looks like a role player and off ball linebacker. The problem is, he doesn't have a hell of a lot of time mastering any one position so he'll need time, and a patient yet slightly creative coaching staff to use him properly. There is potential. But I don't see Trent Cole, undersized yet monstrous type player. And he isn't big enough to hold a 5tech spot down vs the run.
Not sure how high you intend on taking him or for what team, but right now as a linebacker I guess I could see a later day 2 pick.
I guess I could see a later day 2 pick.
DraftScout agrees...
I think they have Dye too low... but just saw where he finished 2019 playing on a torn meniscus in one knee.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
DraftScout agrees...
I think they have Dye too low... but just saw where he finished 2019 playing on a torn meniscus in one knee.
Depends on where you're asking Dye to play IMHO. Watched Oregon early in the season... interesting inside backer prospect.
I was thinking 3rd... maybe early 4th for Uche depending on position runs. Physical attributes are there, just need to refine how you want him to play.
-
So I'm watching your boy Uche under the fine tooth comb. I kind of see some of the things you're talking about and I think he's a quality football player. But I think his premium isn't immediately primarily as a pass rusher. The kid is quite fluid in space and seems to have a good understanding of what is developing in front of him. He has that "see ball, get ball". He looks like Shaq Thompson at times. Good quicks and can use them as the 5th or 6th man when pressuring. Speaking of - his pass rush stance is... idk how to describe it. He looks like he's standing narrow ready to fire out of a chalk running sprints. He has a good first step, and I mean that - a good one. But it isn't elite, and his length, ability to bend around the edge or any type of counter move isn't ideal. But he did take his speed, put it into power and drive Tristan Wirfs back a few times. He even got a pressure on one of them. Beyond that? He got beat up pretty bad on both sides by the Iowa tackles. He's a 9-align on base downs as an on-ball linebacker. Then UM started using him all over vs Iowa. Sometimes as a decoy then sending pressure from the other side. In the 3-3 looks, he seems to move around quite a bit and flips in assignment between dropping and rushing, with an occasional "green light" to do either.
Vs Illinois and some of their option concepts, he would have a gap assignment, but attack it from an off ball LB look. Sometimes it looked like UM was already slanting their lines, so I'm sure this is by design. An interesting way of attacking spread teams who like to run laterally. Interesting that in some of the cover 2 looks he's the MLB as well. He just looks like a very space and speed dependent rusher. When he can get wide and get a full head of steam, he has the bull to drive some tackles back. But he never really wins the edge, drop his hips, then use his arms to create the pressure. Very scheme dependent and most of what he does is on tenacity + effort. Great motor by the way, kid never stops running. But the Illini RT ate him up pretty bad. Haven't seen a single counter move back to the inside.
Vs Penn State, he did a good job of getting to the flash blocks before they got to him. Once he got his hands on the lead, he held his ground and waited for help to arrive. Can't ask much more than that. Stopping the run consistently isn't about the individual making a play so much as everyone playing their role as a unit. Still not offering much on either side as the primary edge rusher though.
In 4 man fronts where it's obvious how and when he's coming, his quickness off the snap is somewhat neutralized by his lack of physical stature to be a reliable edge rusher. But when he's turned loose as an off backer linebacker who can gap exchange or be sent from different places it becomes a different story. Then he's able to get creative in his timing and rush technique and generate some pressure. I say some, because he's like a decent PG - he can space the floor and find the other man, but he isn't great at creating his own shot.
As the 5th or 6th man in the pressure the role looks much more effective. He drives backs and TE's chipping quite well and tends to put them into a QB's face creating a pressure and getting them off the spot.
He looks like a role player and off ball linebacker. The problem is, he doesn't have a hell of a lot of time mastering any one position so he'll need time, and a patient yet slightly creative coaching staff to use him properly. There is potential. But I don't see Trent Cole, undersized yet monstrous type player. And he isn't big enough to hold a 5tech spot down vs the run.
Not sure how high you intend on taking him or for what team, but right now as a linebacker I guess I could see a later day 2 pick.
So I'm watching your boy Uche under the fine tooth comb. I kind of see some of the things you're talking about and I think he's a quality football player. But I think his premium isn't immediately primarily as a pass rusher. The kid is quite fluid in space and seems to have a good understanding of what is developing in front of him. He has that "see ball, get ball". He looks like Shaq Thompson at times. Good quicks and can use them as the 5th or 6th man when pressuring. Speaking of - his pass rush stance is... idk how to describe it. He looks like he's standing narrow ready to fire out of a chalk running sprints. He has a good first step, and I mean that - a good one. But it isn't elite, and his length, ability to bend around the edge or any type of counter move isn't ideal. But he did take his speed, put it into power and drive Tristan Wirfs back a few times. He even got a pressure on one of them. Beyond that? He got beat up pretty bad on both sides by the Iowa tackles. He's a 9-align on base downs as an on-ball linebacker. Then UM started using him all over vs Iowa. Sometimes as a decoy then sending pressure from the other side. In the 3-3 looks, he seems to move around quite a bit and flips in assignment between dropping and rushing, with an occasional "green light" to do either.
Vs Illinois and some of their option concepts, he would have a gap assignment, but attack it from an off ball LB look. Sometimes it looked like UM was already slanting their lines, so I'm sure this is by design. An interesting way of attacking spread teams who like to run laterally. Interesting that in some of the cover 2 looks he's the MLB as well. He just looks like a very space and speed dependent rusher. When he can get wide and get a full head of steam, he has the bull to drive some tackles back. But he never really wins the edge, drop his hips, then use his arms to create the pressure. Very scheme dependent and most of what he does is on tenacity + effort. Great motor by the way, kid never stops running. But the Illini RT ate him up pretty bad. Haven't seen a single counter move back to the inside.
Vs Penn State, he did a good job of getting to the flash blocks before they got to him. Once he got his hands on the lead, he held his ground and waited for help to arrive. Can't ask much more than that. Stopping the run consistently isn't about the individual making a play so much as everyone playing their role as a unit. Still not offering much on either side as the primary edge rusher though.
In 4 man fronts where it's obvious how and when he's coming, his quickness off the snap is somewhat neutralized by his lack of physical stature to be a reliable edge rusher. But when he's turned loose as an off backer linebacker who can gap exchange or be sent from different places it becomes a different story. Then he's able to get creative in his timing and rush technique and generate some pressure. I say some, because he's like a decent PG - he can space the floor and find the other man, but he isn't great at creating his own shot.
As the 5th or 6th man in the pressure the role looks much more effective. He drives backs and TE's chipping quite well and tends to put them into a QB's face creating a pressure and getting them off the spot.
He looks like a role player and off ball linebacker. The problem is, he doesn't have a hell of a lot of time mastering any one position so he'll need time, and a patient yet slightly creative coaching staff to use him properly. There is potential. But I don't see Trent Cole, undersized yet monstrous type player. And he isn't big enough to hold a 5tech spot down vs the run.
Not sure how high you intend on taking him or for what team, but right now as a linebacker I guess I could see a later day 2 pick.
Depends on where you're asking Dye to play IMHO. Watched Oregon early in the season... interesting inside backer prospect.
I was thinking 3rd... maybe early 4th for Uche depending on position runs. Physical attributes are there, just need to refine how you want him to play.
Good write up Tia
Pretty much agree with all of that after watching and reading about him since he committed to Michigan.
I'll say PFF has been pretty high on Uche. They rated him the best player at the Sr Bowl.
PFF College@PFF_CollegeJosh Uche has been a monster in pass-rush since 2018.
His 22.5% QB pressure rate ranks first among edge defenders.
But yeah he's got some burst
I'll bet you he goes before the 4th though.
-
So I'm watching your boy Uche under the fine tooth comb. I kind of see some of the things you're talking about and I think he's a quality football player. But I think his premium isn't immediately primarily as a pass rusher. The kid is quite fluid in space and seems to have a good understanding of what is developing in front of him. He has that "see ball, get ball". He looks like Shaq Thompson at times. Good quicks and can use them as the 5th or 6th man when pressuring. Speaking of - his pass rush stance is... idk how to describe it. He looks like he's standing narrow ready to fire out of a chalk running sprints. He has a good first step, and I mean that - a good one. But it isn't elite, and his length, ability to bend around the edge or any type of counter move isn't ideal. But he did take his speed, put it into power and drive Tristan Wirfs back a few times. He even got a pressure on one of them. Beyond that? He got beat up pretty bad on both sides by the Iowa tackles. He's a 9-align on base downs as an on-ball linebacker. Then UM started using him all over vs Iowa. Sometimes as a decoy then sending pressure from the other side. In the 3-3 looks, he seems to move around quite a bit and flips in assignment between dropping and rushing, with an occasional "green light" to do either.
Vs Illinois and some of their option concepts, he would have a gap assignment, but attack it from an off ball LB look. Sometimes it looked like UM was already slanting their lines, so I'm sure this is by design. An interesting way of attacking spread teams who like to run laterally. Interesting that in some of the cover 2 looks he's the MLB as well. He just looks like a very space and speed dependent rusher. When he can get wide and get a full head of steam, he has the bull to drive some tackles back. But he never really wins the edge, drop his hips, then use his arms to create the pressure. Very scheme dependent and most of what he does is on tenacity + effort. Great motor by the way, kid never stops running. But the Illini RT ate him up pretty bad. Haven't seen a single counter move back to the inside.
Vs Penn State, he did a good job of getting to the flash blocks before they got to him. Once he got his hands on the lead, he held his ground and waited for help to arrive. Can't ask much more than that. Stopping the run consistently isn't about the individual making a play so much as everyone playing their role as a unit. Still not offering much on either side as the primary edge rusher though.
In 4 man fronts where it's obvious how and when he's coming, his quickness off the snap is somewhat neutralized by his lack of physical stature to be a reliable edge rusher. But when he's turned loose as an off backer linebacker who can gap exchange or be sent from different places it becomes a different story. Then he's able to get creative in his timing and rush technique and generate some pressure. I say some, because he's like a decent PG - he can space the floor and find the other man, but he isn't great at creating his own shot.
As the 5th or 6th man in the pressure the role looks much more effective. He drives backs and TE's chipping quite well and tends to put them into a QB's face creating a pressure and getting them off the spot.
He looks like a role player and off ball linebacker. The problem is, he doesn't have a hell of a lot of time mastering any one position so he'll need time, and a patient yet slightly creative coaching staff to use him properly. There is potential. But I don't see Trent Cole, undersized yet monstrous type player. And he isn't big enough to hold a 5tech spot down vs the run.
Not sure how high you intend on taking him or for what team, but right now as a linebacker I guess I could see a later day 2 pick.
Depends on where you're asking Dye to play IMHO. Watched Oregon early in the season... interesting inside backer prospect.
I was thinking 3rd... maybe early 4th for Uche depending on position runs. Physical attributes are there, just need to refine how you want him to play.
Good write up Tia
Pretty much agree with all of that after watching and reading about him since he committed to Michigan.
I'll say PFF has been pretty high on Uche. They rated him the best player at the Sr Bowl.
PFF College@PFF_CollegeJosh Uche has been a monster in pass-rush since 2018.
His 22.5% QB pressure rate ranks first among edge defenders.But yeah he's got some burst
I'll bet you he goes before the 4th though.
Good write up Tia
Pretty much agree with all of that after watching and reading about him since he committed to Michigan.
I'll say PFF has been pretty high on Uche. They rated him the best player at the Sr Bowl.
But yeah he's got some burst
There in lies my issue with PFF. They don't say who the pressure rate was against and pressure rate disbursement. Was he the primary edge? 5th man? 6th? Against an OT, TE, RB? Did he have a massive game against Rutgers then have problems vs decent OT's?
Really want to see where his strength is and why I say it's necessary to disguise him?
Go to 2:14 on the delay pressure. The only reason Penn State's QB doesn't get lit up is because their RB caught this out of the very corner of his eye... almost by the pure luck of timing.
He's basically a will backer who you can get creative with on passing D&D's. Because his first step is pretty damn good when he is flying downhill.
-
Good write up Tia
Pretty much agree with all of that after watching and reading about him since he committed to Michigan.
I'll say PFF has been pretty high on Uche. They rated him the best player at the Sr Bowl.
But yeah he's got some burst
There in lies my issue with PFF. They don't say who the pressure rate was against and pressure rate disbursement. Was he the primary edge? 5th man? 6th? Against an OT, TE, RB? Did he have a massive game against Rutgers then have problems vs decent OT's?
Really want to see where his strength is and why I say it's necessary to disguise him?
Go to 2:14 on the delay pressure. The only reason Penn State's QB doesn't get lit up is because their RB caught this out of the very corner of his eye... almost by the pure luck of timing.
He's basically a will backer who you can get creative with on passing D&D's. Because his first step is pretty damn good when he is flying downhill.
There in lies my issue with PFF. They don't say who the pressure rate was against and pressure rate disbursement. Was he the primary edge? 5th man? 6th? Against an OT, TE, RB? Did he have a massive game against Rutgers then have problems vs decent OT's?
Really want to see where his strength is and why I say it's necessary to disguise him?
Go to 2:14 on the delay pressure. The only reason Penn State's QB doesn't get lit up is because their RB caught this out of the very corner of his eye... almost by the pure luck of timing.
He's basically a will backer who you can get creative with on passing D&D's. Because his first step is pretty damn good when he is flying downhill.
Oh I don't disagree that he isn't going to come into the league and immediately start on every down on the edge. He'll need time to round out his game but the foundation and the athleticism are there. In the meantime, as you said, he can be used very effectively and creatively as a pass rusher.
It is also important to note we have basically 0 organic interior pass rush in 2019 (really missing Mo Hurst). To get pressure Don Brown had to do some different things in the front 7. And like I said earlier, we ran a lot more 3-3-5 sets to get Uche on the field and create that pressure.
-
There in lies my issue with PFF. They don't say who the pressure rate was against and pressure rate disbursement. Was he the primary edge? 5th man? 6th? Against an OT, TE, RB? Did he have a massive game against Rutgers then have problems vs decent OT's?
Really want to see where his strength is and why I say it's necessary to disguise him?
Go to 2:14 on the delay pressure. The only reason Penn State's QB doesn't get lit up is because their RB caught this out of the very corner of his eye... almost by the pure luck of timing.
He's basically a will backer who you can get creative with on passing D&D's. Because his first step is pretty damn good when he is flying downhill.
Oh I don't disagree that he isn't going to come into the league and immediately start on every down on the edge. He'll need time to round out his game but the foundation and the athleticism are there. In the meantime, as you said, he can be used very effectively and creatively as a pass rusher.
It is also important to note we have basically 0 organic interior pass rush in 2019 (really missing Mo Hurst). To get pressure Don Brown had to do some different things in the front 7. And like I said earlier, we ran a lot more 3-3-5 sets to get Uche on the field and create that pressure.
It is also important to note we have...
WHADAYA mean "we"?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
-
Overrated clap clap clap clap clap
Overrated clap clap clap clap clap
I can find a good video explaining what a 3-3-5 front is so you can follow along Gip.
Maybe a "My First Football Game" pop up book explaining the different type of linebackers?
Ja.brill Peppers - Cleveland Brown OldBrownsFan, on 02 Jun 2017 - 5:09PM said: "No you are not the work of the devil but you are deceived by the devil." Who's got it better than us? Nooooobody! -
It is also important to note we have...
WHADAYA mean "we"?
-
Overrated clap clap clap clap clap
I can find a good video explaining what a 3-3-5 front is so you can follow along Gip.
Maybe a "My First Football Game" pop up book explaining the different type of linebackers?
I can find a good video explaining what a 3-3-5 front is so you can follow along Gip.
Maybe a "My First Football Game" pop up book explaining the different type of linebackers?
Caught me one:
(and when was this ever about "what kind of LB he is....the issue is simply that no matter where/how he plays or lines up....you will over estimate his abilities simply because he comes from Fishagain.!
-
I can find a good video explaining what a 3-3-5 front is so you can follow along Gip.
Maybe a "My First Football Game" pop up book explaining the different type of linebackers?
Caught me one:
(and when was this ever about "what kind of LB he is....the issue is simply that no matter where/how he plays or lines up....you will over estimate his abilities simply because he comes from Fishagain.!
Caught me one:
(and when was this ever about "what kind of LB he is....the issue is simply that no matter where/how he plays or lines up....you will over estimate his abilities simply because he comes from Fishagain.!
No, not really. Ask me about Shea Patterson? Lol.
And are you just going to claim you "got me" any time I respond to you?
I mean if you say the sky is yellow and I say "no Gip, it's blue" is that a "gotcha'?
Oh and the linebackers comment is me still making phone of you for not knowing that, while you go around and proclaim your football insight.
-
Caught me one:
(and when was this ever about "what kind of LB he is....the issue is simply that no matter where/how he plays or lines up....you will over estimate his abilities simply because he comes from Fishagain.!
No, not really. Ask me about Shea Patterson? Lol.
And are you just going to claim you "got me" any time I respond to you?
I mean if you say the sky is yellow and I say "no Gip, it's blue" is that a "gotcha'?
Oh and the linebackers comment is me still making phone of you for not knowing that, while you go around and proclaim your football insight.
No, not really. Ask me about Shea Patterson? Lol.
And are you just going to claim you "got me" any time I respond to you?
I mean if you say the sky is yellow and I say "no Gip, it's blue" is that a "gotcha'?
No....only when I put an obvious post intended to trap you and get your goat.....and then your goat is gotten. Like this. I played on your sychophanaticism and you bit like a carp.
Uchee coochee may be a fine player...but who cares.
-
Football fans?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Football fans?
Woody only cares that he went to Fishagain. As a football fan...a Browns fan, I would care, if/when the Browns take him...and if he turns out to be something for them.
Do you think Uchee Coochee is all that and a bag of chips? And by that I mean do you think he is a guy the Browns should seriously look at? We have Garrett, Olivier, Clayton, Chad Thomas and a few other guys at our DE position. Do we need him there really? Or, as and "edge" player, would he play at one of our OLB spots. Would we want to consider him in lieu of Willie Harvey. That seems a more likely probability.
I actually am the one that chose him in Round 2 of our board draft (for the Texans...pick #57) but I am not sure the Browns would want to go Edge that early....given their priorities. Maybe if he was still there at #74? (that is where I took Malik Harrison...for the Browns at MLB.)
-
Football fans?
Woody only cares that he went to Fishagain. As a football fan...a Browns fan, I would care, if/when the Browns take him...and if he turns out to be something for them.
Do you think Uchee Coochee is all that and a bag of chips? And by that I mean do you think he is a guy the Browns should seriously look at? We have Garrett, Olivier, Clayton, Chad Thomas and a few other guys at our DE position. Do we need him there really? Or, as and "edge" player, would he play at one of our OLB spots. Would we want to consider him in lieu of Willie Harvey. That seems a more likely probability.
I actually am the one that chose him in Round 2 of our board draft (for the Texans...pick #57) but I am not sure the Browns would want to go Edge that early....given their priorities. Maybe if he was still there at #74? (that is where I took Malik Harrison...for the Browns at MLB.)
We have Garrett, Olivier, Clayton, Chad Thomas and a few other guys at our DE position. Do we need him there really? Or, as and "edge" player, would he play at one of our OLB spots. Would we want to consider him in lieu of Willie Harvey. That seems a more likely probability.
If only somebody had taken the time to watch several games and drawn up a quick synopsis....
-
We have Garrett, Olivier, Clayton, Chad Thomas and a few other guys at our DE position. Do we need him there really? Or, as and "edge" player, would he play at one of our OLB spots. Would we want to consider him in lieu of Willie Harvey. That seems a more likely probability.
If only somebody had taken the time to watch several games and drawn up a quick synopsis....
If only somebody had taken the time to watch several games and drawn up a quick synopsis....
I saw your synopsis but they didn’t answer my questions. Could The Browns use him and where would they use him.
-
I saw your synopsis but they didn’t answer my questions. Could The Browns use him and where would they use him.
Yes. I don't think it would be the greatest fit of talent + need, but I'm sure he could carve out a role. Then again, the word "use" is quite broad.
Ideally he'd go to a team that doesn't have as great of a need at linebacker and can bring him along slowly. Sadly that ain't us.
-
So I'm going back and (SLOWLY) charting defensive snaps for the Broncos under Joe Woods. Working backwards, which is admittedly not the best idea. Started with 2018 and I'm seeing glimpses of why Woods is bringing in some of the personnel we have and why the pursuit of Yannick or Clowney. Apologies for the upload, I know it takes up bandwidth. Warning, I've been drinking a fuck ton of coffee and listening to the entire Run The Jewels 3 album.
@tour2ma I had NO idea what color to go with since you said something about color blind. I felt hot pink ended up contrasting well. If it doesn't then throw me a life line on what works best for some of you with that particular issue.
Yes, this is a more "34" oriented look. But unlike most of what you would understand as a classic heads up 2 gapping system, you see the Wade Phillips influence very early on with the young Woods as DC. I did my best to align the text with the player. But I'll expand on some of this below.
- The bigger shaded nose is exactly why Billings was brought in. To combat the 2 TE sets and downhill nature of certain teams in the AFC. Against an IZ, his primary assignment will be to control the centers playside (right) shoulder, and work contact into the playside guard then plant his ass into that gap. If the guards works to the 2nd level, then the running back is dealing with the big boy still clogging the lane because he's been singled up. The shade for Billings is great because he isn't Haloti Ngata. I don't think a heads up Nose who can 2 gap consistently exists anymore in our NFL. It's an incredibly difficult position to play and to find. Which is why most every "34" you see now is almost exclusively a 1 gap or blended gap scheme. You'll notice neither of the other interior lineman are playing heads up on their man. Both playing into an assigned gap. You know who loves 2 TE sets by the way...? The Ravens. I can all but guarantee in the DC position interview, the question was brought up as to how you would slow down their rushing attack. A question Woods was ready to answer.
- The playside 4i tech will attack the OT outside shoulder against IZ if he's singled up, anchor and find the ball carrier. If he's getting chipped by the TE he'll anchor and plug. Against an OZ he'll keep his outside shoulder free vs the tackle, and continue working outside while possibly getting upfield.
- Playside closed edge (Bradley Chubb) will work the inline TE outside shoulder and have a similar attack to the playside 4i-tech. IZ he's going to stack, locate and work back inside. OZ he's going to keep his outside leverage, work upfield without taking himself out of the play and force the EMOL to either help chip him or move to the outside fun force. He's the "spill" man in the case of the stretch play.
- Weakside 3tech, which almost kind of makes this an under front of sorts (3 tech to the weakside) attacks the outside shoulder of the guard, same same... stacks and attacks. Should the weakside tackle downblock and double (dumb, especially considering that's Von fucking Miller to the weakside) he anchors and the weakside edge plays crashes down the line or plays and bootleg, waggle, etc etc accordingly. Generally the only way you turn that weakside edge loose is either you don't believe he's good enough to affect the play from the backside, you're going to bootleg off of his aggression (not likely in this case) or you have a FB or TE coming down the line to 'flash' block him. (You've seen me use that term before)
- Both linebackers play off their responsibilities given on what the playside read is. You can read the brief commentary I put next to players.
IF, this was a play to the weakside, the roles would be flipped... so to speak. The nose would work across the face of the center and disrupt being picked up by the backside guard. The weakside 3tech maintains outside leverage while working out and up. Weakside edge stacks outside hard and holds his leverage. Weakside linebacker now becomes the fill man and the strong side backer must flow laterally and play as run force/clean up.
But this explains some of the want for "bigger" bodies under Woods - Billings and, to a lesser extent, Clayborne. You'll almost never see a true 2 gap nose anymore. The 2 gap play is left to the "ends". Leonard Williams is a prime example for that while at USC, and drafted quite high (rightfully so) because of it.
And that's one of the reasons I bring up not only redundancy, but flexibility. In the above picture, the Browns currently have 2 different DI's who can play just about any spot along that line depending on the call and the opponent save for Billings - who is exclusively a nose. Jobi can play as the weakside 3tech along side Myles, which would net both a TON of 1 on 1 looks. Sheldon can play the strongside 4tech and have the quicks, yet strength, to do all that position requires between playing run and still being able to pressure the passer from a "base" look while anticipating run.
Clayborne can also play as that 4tech and, without too much risk of being exposed, even play as the "closed" end. However going off how he plays best and speaking of coach adaptability, he'll be in a 3pt stance. Which is one of the adjustments Woods will have to make to take our roster into consideration. This "34" will look much more Seahawks level of 43 under with the Browns.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login