My choice for next Browns Head coach is...
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But where did Marty take over a bad football team (not that I really think CLE is a bad football team, but an underachieving one)? So in that manner, he probably would do well that he'd get the most out of them. But at the same token, his teams underachieved once it got passed the regular season (not that CLE has been getting there).I just think getting Marty is too much of reaching back to CLE's past success. That would just reeks of desperation to me. Plus, Marty is in his mid 60's now.
I think it reeks of someone making a smart choice - picking a coach who has had success building teams into winners. Marty being in his 60s isn't a problem - he'll probably be ready to retire in a few years, at which point we can go after the young guy - it works nicely because you can get that guy and hand a good team to him (assuming Marty is successful).
My top two choices would be Marty and Cowher, then Mooch, and Vermeil. I just don't want another NFL rookie head coach.
If we could steal someone like Jeff Fisher, that would work, too.
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But where did Marty take over a bad football team (not that I really think CLE is a bad football team, but an underachieving one)? So in that manner, he probably would do well that he'd get the most out of them. But at the same token, his teams underachieved once it got passed the regular season (not that CLE has been getting there).I just think getting Marty is too much of reaching back to CLE's past success. That would just reeks of desperation to me. Plus, Marty is in his mid 60's now.
I think it reeks of someone making a smart choice - picking a coach who has had success building teams into winners. Marty being in his 60s isn't a problem - he'll probably be ready to retire in a few years, at which point we can go after the young guy - it works nicely because you can get that guy and hand a good team to him (assuming Marty is successful).
My top two choices would be Marty and Cowher, then Mooch, and Vermeil. I just don't want another NFL rookie head coach.
If we could steal someone like Jeff Fisher, that would work, too.
I'd agree completely with Cowher or Mooch (along with stealing Jeff Fisher). As well as getting some unknown up and coming coach (unless it is a coordinator everyone knows is ready).
With Marty, if you assume he's gone in a few years, then you have to worry players not playing for him (if you know a guy isn't gonna be around, players tend to kind of say F it, which we already got). Don't get me wrong, I like Marty, and if we were talking about any other team he hadn't previously coached, I'd say sure. But when a team reaches back in its history to hire a guy who was the last truly successful head coach for that team, it spells disaster. It's like when the Yankees rehired Billy Martin years ago (or when they considered bringing back sweet Lou).
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If we could steal someone like Jeff Fisher, that would work, too.I think at this point Fisher is probably tenured for life in Tennessee, unless Rug Adams loses his gourd like the Alameda Cryptkeeper.
I think there is actually a small part of my cold and bitter soul that is warming to the idea of having Spit Chin come in here and raise hell.
The pickings for quality experienced pro coacking material is mighty slim.
Doug
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Our needing to develop some young LB's is part of the reason why I think Ron Rivera might be an interesting choice.\ said:
Then again, I'd be happy with Singletary. The position we are hurting the most at, is LB, whether it be a lack of talent, or that the talent doesnt see the field.Just like how Singletary got a lot of credit for coaching up Patrick Willis, Rivera received some praise for turning an unknown UDFA (Jyles Tucker) into a starting-caliber 3-4 OLB.
Also, San Diego just promoted Rivera to DC, and early reports are very positive:
Word out of San Diego is that there is a renewed sense of energy with new defensive coordinator Ron Rivera in charge. Players are putting in extra time to fix technique issues that had previously gone unaddressed, and the defense’s overall enthusiasm is higher than it had been all season. Also, the playbook has been cut down to make things simpler and more straightforward.
His contract expires after this season, so we might be able to get him to come here & be our DC. More likely, it'll take a promotion to the top job to get him to come to Cleveland. -
Personally I agree with some of these other guys, I'm sick of being a guinie pig (sp) for new coaches. Lets get someone in here with some damn experince and do this job right. I am sick to death of losing. Enough already.
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If we could steal someone like Jeff Fisher, that would work, too.
I think at this point Fisher is probably tenured for life in Tennessee, unless Rug Adams loses his gourd like the Alameda Cryptkeeper.
I think there is actually a small part of my cold and bitter soul that is warming to the idea of having Spit Chin come in here and raise hell.
The pickings for quality experienced pro coacking material is mighty slim.
Doug
Ain't happening for a couple reasons.
a) Cowher wants a lottery payday.
and he wants to win.Both of wich are pretty much out of the question up there in dirty, dirty Cleveland.
Regards
..... an`at
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A) Lerner has plenty of money
We have our QB, we have talent, we just need the Coach and we will winC) I think you sound worried about the possibilty of us getting Cowher
Shouldnt you be worrying about how your QB is going to keep his arm on this week?
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I think yinz are over-rating the coaching spot - especially Cowher. He was a great motivator and a pretty good defense guy, but he couldn't draft offensive players for shit and he needed a strong o-coordinator and GM. Many an o-coordinator took a bullet under Cowher along with a GM.Over-rating? I used to think coaching was over-rated, too. Until RAC came into town, and I learned that you might not need a great coach, but a bad coach will hurt you just as much as a bad QB.
Maybe we're over-rating Cowher, but his record while in PITT speaks for itself.
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Per Tony Grossi:
Decide on who's calling the shots
Will the Savage-Romeo Crennel partnership survive a fifth season? Will both go or just Crennel?
If Savage stays, who's the next head coach? The instant front-runner would be Iowa coach Kirk Ferentz, one of Savage's best friends in the business. Why him? Savage's contract gives him control over the draft and the selection of the 53-player roster. Few experienced NFL coaches would agree to those conditions.
Hiring Ferentz -- who has resisted NFL overtures several times -- would probably mean a new offensive system, too. Considering the state of the defense, that might be biting off more than the Browns can chew in one off-season.
One alternative is to wipe the slate clean and hire Bill Cowher at $8 million a year. If owner Randy Lerner did that, he would reinstitute the coach as football czar -- something he swore off after the Butch Davis debacle.
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No, no, no on Marty. That move would reak of desperation. Reaching back 20 years to recapture past glory? No thank you.I don't quite understand why there is interest in him. He didn't do so well in Cleveland the last time (although he was well liked).
For those of you who think he's a good choice (again)...is it because our FO has changed or has something about his style changed?
Ummm.... He didn't?
I seem to remember playoffs and AFC championship games under his tenure.
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Marty's coaching record speaks for itself.Team Year Won Lost Ties Win % Finish Won Lost Win % Result CLE 1984 4 4 0 .500 3rd in AFC Central - - - - CLE 1985 8 8 0 .500 1st in AFC Central 0 1 .000 Lost to Miami Dolphins in Divisional Game. CLE 1986 12 4 0 .750 1st in AFC Central 1 1 .500 Lost to Denver Broncos in AFC Championship Game. CLE 1987 10 5 0 .667 1st in AFC Central 1 1 .500 Lost to Denver Broncos in AFC Championship Game. CLE 1988 10 6 0 .625 2nd in AFC Central 0 1 .000 Lost to Houston Oilers in AFC Wild-Card Game. KC 1989 8 7 1 .533 2nd in AFC West - - - - KC 1990 11 5 0 .688 2nd in AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to Miami Dolphins in Wild Card Game. KC 1991 10 6 0 .625 2nd in AFC West 1 1 .500 Lost to Buffalo Bills in Divisional Game. KC 1992 10 6 0 .625 2nd in AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to San Diego Chargers in Wild Card Game. KC 1993 11 5 0 .688 1st in AFC West 2 1 .667 Lost to Buffalo Bills in AFC Championship. KC 1994 9 7 0 .563 2nd in AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to Miami Dolphins in AFC Wild-Card Game. KC 1995 13 3 0 .813 1st in AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to Indianapolis Colts in AFC Divisional Game. KC 1996 9 7 0 .563 2st in AFC West - - - - KC 1997 13 3 0 .813 1st in AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to Denver Broncos in AFC Divisional Game. KC 1998 7 9 0 .438 4th in AFC West - - - - WAS 2001 8 8 0 .500 2nd in NFC East - - - - SD 2002 8 8 0 .500 3rd in AFC West - - - - SD 2003 4 12 0 .250 4thin AFC West - - - - SD 2004 12 4 0 .750 1stin AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to New York Jets in AFC Wild-Card Game. SD 2005 9 7 0 .563 3rdin AFC West - - - - SD 2006 14 2 0 .875 1stin AFC West 0 1 .000 Lost to New England Patriots in AFC Divisional Game. Total[4] 200 126 1 .613 5 13 .278
I'd be ok with being a contender EVERY YEAR.
If you remember, Cowher had a reputation for losing in the big game as well. He lost a ton of home AFC championship games and home playoff games.
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Honestly, I thought Romeo was kinda yesterday's news. He's about as inspiring as old dough, and I don't care if they're pros... that trickles down.The Steelers hit it out of the park again with a very young, very smart, very intense head coach. I like that route.
And the Ravens got a guy in John Harbaugh who just SEEMS like the guy in charge and the face of the organization.
Does Romeo seem like anybody's idea of the guy in charge?
Never liked it.
I am not sure which route I would like to go...young or established (established I like Art Shell, he is only 60 and if you take away the last years debacle he was 54-38....pretty good with Hostetler at QB and no RB)....but if you want to go new....here is a great article from ESPN on the HOT COACHING PROSPECTS (from last December, but many are still viable):
Ryan brothers among the assistants ready to become head coaches
Green
By Jeremy Green
Scouts Inc.
(Archive)
Updated: December 14, 2007, 10:47 AM ET
With the resignation of Atlanta head coach Bobby Petrino, the time has come to start talking about NFL assistant coaches who are ready to make the jump to head coach. The recent stints of Nick Saban and Petrino show that college head coaches moving to the NFL isn't always a great fit. Saban and Petrino were too spoiled, couldn't deal with the losses and as soon as things didn't go their way, they turned tail and looked for the next best college job.
This list is a group of guys that have spent time at the NFL level and understand that commitment it takes to build a program and win in the league. It should also be noted that coaches out of the NFL right now such as former Pittsburgh head coach Bill Cowher and San Diego's Marty Schottenheimer are not on the list but their résumés clearly speak for themselves. Obviously, any franchise would be lucky to bring them into their organizations.
1. Rex Ryan
Baltimore Ravens defensive coordinator
He has pioneered one of the best defenses in the NFL over the past few years. Injuries have hurt this unit in 2007, but it remains a top 10 defense because of the leadership of Ryan and the respect that every player on that unit has for him as a person and as a coach.
He is now the AHC, so if he could be pulled it would be a coupe!!!
2. Jason Garrett
Dallas Cowboys offensive coordinator
Even though he only has one year as an offensive coordinator in the NFL, he is ready to take the next step. Garrett spent the majority of his career as the No. 3 QB and learned a lot in the process. He has an excellent offensive mind and would be a great fit for a young organization that can be patient and watch him mature into an excellent head coach.
With the current meltdown in Dallas, he is likely to make the jump from AHC to HC in Dallas
3. Josh McDaniels
New England Patriots offensive coordinator/quarterbacks coach McDaniels is not talked about very often, but should not be ignored. Belichick gets all the credit for what has become "Patriots football" but look at the success Romeo Crennel is now having and the success Eric Mangini had in 2006. Those guys are solid head coaches because they learned from the best, so there is no reason to think McDaniels will not be successful as well.
No thanks, the genius in NE is Belichick...not any of his castoffs!
4. Clancy Pendergast
Arizona Cardinals defensive coordinator
Pendergast does not receive as much attention because the Cardinals have not had a ton of success, but he's done a great job with the defense. He has a "gym rat" mentality when it comes to coaching and no assistant coach watches as much film or does as many weekly and offseason breakdowns as Pendergast. He has a great defensive mind and is a master at adjusting his schemes on a weekly basis.
I like DC's as HC's...and the Cardinals have a tough run D...but it is primarily a 4-3!!! Still, I think with a few additions this team could transfer to a 4-3 nicely.
5. Mike Martz
Detroit Lions offensive coordinator
Unlike the first four guys on this list, he would fall more into the retread category. Say what you want about the guy that has been labeled by some as the "Mad Scientist," but the last time I checked, being a head coach is still about winning and Martz did that consistently in St. Louis and brought a Super Bowl championship to the city. Martz's teams score points and they put people in the seats.
In SF now. Not a big fan of Martz....but imagine what he could do with Quinn!!!
6. Mike Singletary
San Francisco 49ers assistant head coach/defense
He has never been a coordinator or a head coach, but his name is going to come up because as an ex-player who gets a ton of respect from the players that play for him. That's huge because gaining the respect of the players is half the battle in becoming a good NFL head coach and Singletary will have that from Day 1. He is not as polished right now as you may want, but he is still learning and a great fit for an organization that will allow its coach to grow on the go.
Wow....the jury is out, but he sure is making a mess right now!!!
7. Russ Grimm
Arizona Cardinals assistant head coach/offensive line coach
Grimm's name has come up in several places over the past few seasons and will again this year. He is tough, but fair and everywhere he has been, the players had a lot of respect for him. He is not real flashy and might be a step behind some of the guys mentioned ahead of him on this list in the Xs and Os area, but give him two solid coordinators and he will be fine because he is the type of guy that sees the entire big picture. That is more important then trying to be an offensive or defensive genius, as other NFL failures in the past have been labeled.
Right now he is AHC/OLC for Zona...and their offense is kicking it, big time!!!
8. Rob Ryan
Oakland defensive coordinator
Some say the Raiders defense has underachieved at times this season, but how consistent can you be on defense when you get inconsistent performances on offense every single week? Last season, there was a lot of animosity between the offense, defense and some of the coaching staff, but it was Ryan who worked behind the scenes to keep the team together. Some were lobbying for him to get the job this year and he has the coaching pedigree to be successful. The coaches that work for him and the players that play for him swear by him. He deserves an opportunity to take the next step.
Kiffin tried to get rid of him...and their D is terrible...so pass on this one.
9. Jim Haslett
St. Louis Rams defensive coordinator
Like Martz, he would fall into the retread category. Haslett has done a very good job with a Rams defense that is beat up and void of big time playmakers. Haslett made some mistakes as a head coach in New Orleans, but I'm willing to bet he has learned from them and will have more success the second time around.
HC of Rams...he isn't going anywhere!
10. Rob Chudzinski
Cleveland Browns offensive coordinator
You could make a case for him being the assistant coach of the year. In one season he has taken a historically terrible Browns offense and made it one of the best in the NFL. He has been a winner everywhere he has been, whether it was a player or coach at the University of Miami or his stint in San Diego under Schottenheimer. He is young, talented and knows the game. It might be a little early, but his time is coming.
I don't think he is ready. He showed signs...but unless the offense takes off in a big way under Quinn...I don't see him as a real option.
Anyway, interesting options.
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Isn't Martz with SF now?
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That wouldn't go against what I said. I said bad football teams. I agree he turns around underachieving ones.
I don't knock Marty with the old can't win the big one. Just like with Cowher. You get down to that part of the season and anything can happen.
My reasoning for not going for Marty are age and that to me it seems like reaching back into Browns past for glory. Of course if Marty came to CLE again, I'd welcome him w/ open arms. But I like Cowher or Mooch as an option more than Cowher.
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I think the fear on Mooch is the last taste in peoples mouth, his stint in DET.That's probably a lot of it!!
Plus for me, the major problems now with this team are on defense...I guess i'd have to knwo who his DC would be.
Yeah, who he got as a DC would be important (then again same with Marty).
My concern with Mooch would be that he has gotten into power struggles in SF and DET. Then again, both places had idiots running the franchise.
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I think the fear on Mooch is the last taste in peoples mouth, his stint in DET.That's probably a lot of it!!
Plus for me, the major problems now with this team are on defense...I guess i'd have to knwo who his DC would be.
Yeah, who he got as a DC would be important (then again same with Marty).
My concern with Mooch would be that he has gotten into power struggles in SF and DET. Then again, both places had idiots running the franchise.
Good point.
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mooch only won in SF with a team that had already been successful. he's essentially the west coast barry switzer.
not wanting marty is, in some ways, an emotional decision. yes, his teams are competitive, but they're also limited and unimaginative. cowher shed his reputation as a playoff loser. marty's done nothing but reinforce his with the same kind of defensive playcalling that we're all bitching about now.
if we can get cowher, that's fine, but i wouldn't bank on it.
there's no clear-cut great candidate out there. it's up to our owner to find a guy who can run a football team, and randy simply isn't up to that task. the reason the steelers keep finding great coaches is beacuse the rooneys know football. it's their family's heritage.
spags might be a good choice. he's innovative, which is good, and aggressive, which is better. someone else i think might be a good choice is the dolphins' current DC, paul pasqualoni. he's doing well with virtually no talent to speak of and has coached both sides of the ball. he was syracuse's head coach the last time they were good ('91-'04) and developed jason witten into the talent he currently is.
i'd still prefer an unknown who could be great over a someone who's known to be mediocre.
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mooch only won in SF with a team that had already been successful. he's essentially the west coast barry switzer.Actually, Mooch replaced Seifert, who was the west coast Switzer. That dude rode Walshes coat tails and players (see how he did in CAR). SF hasn't sniffed the playoffs since he left either.
I mean Mooch got an average of 5 wins a season out of DET. I don't know how they win 1 game a season the last few years (I know, they managed to get 7 some how last season).
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i'd still prefer an unknown who could be great over a someone who's known to be mediocre.
Palmer, Davis, Crennel.......
what do those names all have in common? they essentially fit the bill of your sentance above.
And those believed to be mediocre at one time - BB and Haslett (the job he did in NO and doing in STL-wow) are two who were considered that after their first stint. Sometimes it just doesn't work the first time for guys. They learn and grow after the fact. Then again, you get guys like Tomlin, Winsenhunt, Mike Smith, and Harbough who had no HC experience that pan out. Picking a NFL coach is like the NFL draft, a lot of times it's a crap shoot.
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