Pioli and Ferentz?
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Ferentz may be one of the best offensive line coaches in football. But, I'm not overly impressed after that. I know it isn't very easy to recruit into Iowa, but there offensive scheme is very basic and he doesn't play a real attacking defense.
He's sort of bland.
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Obviously the GM and coach should get along, and if Pioli is going to be the GM, it's important to bring in his guy, otherwise you're just going to get three years of head-butting followed by another complete rebuild. That said, I'm very uneasy about Ferentz. Again, Robert Gallery is his greatest achievement at Iowa.
McDaniels sounds good, but he could very easy fall victim to "Belle of the Ball" syndrome (see Rod Chudzinski, Jason Garrett, etc.)--it's always appealing to have the young, energetic, photogenic, whatever adjective you want to apply, assistant coach to be the face of the franchise, but what does the pretty boy do when the team loses two in a row? What does he do when Edwards drops three passes in a row? What does he do when Winslow says that he's not getting the ball enough?
Think about a guy like Lane Kiffin. Obviously as a Vols fan I hope he turns out great, but what abilities has he shown as a head coach other than calling timeouts at the end of a game, blaming his boss for problems, and hiring relatives as assistant coaches. Can he develop a QB? Can he convince a group of 18-22 year olds that they can hang with Alabama and Florida? Can he convince himself that they can hang with Alabama and Florida? Can he convince anyone that he isn't the coach of just half of the team--that is, is there anyone who thinks that he's going to disagree with anything his dad does, much less pull rank on him?
Dennis
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Ferentz may be one of the best offensive line coaches in football. But, I'm not overly impressed after that. I know it isn't very easy to recruit into Iowa, but there offensive scheme is very basic and he doesn't play a real attacking defense.
He's sort of bland.
Ferentz may be one of the best offensive line coaches in football. But, I'm not overly impressed after that. I know it isn't very easy to recruit into Iowa, but there offensive scheme is very basic and he doesn't play a real attacking defense.
He's sort of bland.
And now, unfortunately, he appears to be the clear frontrunner.
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It's not as if he has top flight players to go with that middle of the road record at Iowa. He has a respectable record considering his recruiting disadvantages.
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The one thing I'll throw out. . . some coaches are good in the NFL and bad in college. Some are great in college and bad in the NFL. We've seen both sides of that coin. Perhaps Ferentz might be one of the "Good in the NFL, no so much in Colleg" types. He had success in the NFL, and certainly left everyone with a good impression. He's done somewhat mediocre in College. Maybe the NFL is his Niche?
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The one thing I'll throw out. . . some coaches are good in the NFL and bad in college. Some are great in college and bad in the NFL. We've seen both sides of that coin. Perhaps Ferentz might be one of the "Good in the NFL, no so much in Colleg" types. He had success in the NFL, and certainly left everyone with a good impression. He's done somewhat mediocre in College. Maybe the NFL is his Niche?
The one thing I'll throw out. . . some coaches are good in the NFL and bad in college. Some are great in college and bad in the NFL. We've seen both sides of that coin. Perhaps Ferentz might be one of the "Good in the NFL, no so much in Colleg" types. He had success in the NFL, and certainly left everyone with a good impression. He's done somewhat mediocre in College. Maybe the NFL is his Niche?
I freakin hope so for everyone's sake....
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Wow I guess he should be going undefeated at Iowa? even though his teams play OSU, Michigan, Penn State every year? Even though he has a severe recruitment disadvantage? Not only does he have to recruit against other big ten teams, he has to recruit against the big 12.
He's coached Iowa to two big ten co-championships with players that weren't good enough tobe drafted in the early rounds
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The one thing I'll throw out. . . some coaches are good in the NFL and bad in college. Some are great in college and bad in the NFL. We've seen both sides of that coin. Perhaps Ferentz might be one of the "Good in the NFL, no so much in Colleg" types. He had success in the NFL, and certainly left everyone with a good impression. He's done somewhat mediocre in College. Maybe the NFL is his Niche?
The one thing I'll throw out. . . some coaches are good in the NFL and bad in college. Some are great in college and bad in the NFL. We've seen both sides of that coin. Perhaps Ferentz might be one of the "Good in the NFL, no so much in Colleg" types. He had success in the NFL, and certainly left everyone with a good impression. He's done somewhat mediocre in College. Maybe the NFL is his Niche?
True (see Davis, Butch). That said, That's a pretty hook to hang your hat on...sure, I'm 16 games over .500 in ten years--and have lost five games three of the past four years (with one game left in a four-loss season this year)--but hey, you can't expect much when recruiting in Iowa. And besides, a lot of mediocre college coaches have been really good in the pros. That's all well and good, but none of that proves anything with regards to Ferentz. Sometimes a coach of a mediocre team is mediocre himself.
Dennis
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Wow I guess he should be going undefeated at Iowa? even though his teams play OSU, Michigan, Penn State every year? Even though he has a severe recruitment disadvantage? Not only does he have to recruit against other big ten teams, he has to recruit against the big 12.
He's coached Iowa to two big ten co-championships with players that weren't good enough tobe drafted in the early rounds
Wow I guess he should be going undefeated at Iowa? even though his teams play OSU, Michigan, Penn State every year? Even though he has a severe recruitment disadvantage? Not only does he have to recruit against other big ten teams, he has to recruit against the big 12.
He's coached Iowa to two big ten co-championships with players that weren't good enough tobe drafted in the early rounds
Good points! But you have to understand why promoting a college coach scares me a bit...
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Wow I guess he should be going undefeated at Iowa? even though his teams play OSU, Michigan, Penn State every year? Even though he has a severe recruitment disadvantage? Not only does he have to recruit against other big ten teams, he has to recruit against the big 12.
He's coached Iowa to two big ten co-championships with players that weren't good enough tobe drafted in the early rounds
Good points! But you have to understand why promoting a college coach scares me a bit...
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Maybe it's simply Lerner not spending what's needed ?
Save on HC but spend on GM ? Ferentz not on anyone's radar probably means he's not expensive either, so if Piloi is, this could be Lerner's way to provide more offer to Piloi, therefore he's not having to dig any deeper.
In any event, with ferentz I feel we'd have to have too much faith in the managing and allow less in coaching.
Isn't that sort of what we just got done with ?
Not having a great feeling about this combo and 2009 season.
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I've made my reservations about Ferentz known, but if he gets the job, it's not necessarily a matter of Lerner being cheap. Apart from Cowher, who exactly is the candidate that would require driving a truck full of money to his door? Besides, as John Harbaugh, Tony Sparano, and Mike Smith showed this year, the sexy/expensive pick is not necessarily the right one to get the team turned around.
Dennis
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Maybe it's simply Lerner not spending what's needed ?
Save on HC but spend on GM ? Ferentz not on anyone's radar probably means he's not expensive either, so if Piloi is, this could be Lerner's way to provide more offer to Piloi, therefore he's not having to dig any deeper.
In any event, with ferentz I feel we'd have to have too much faith in the managing and allow less in coaching.
Isn't that sort of what we just got done with ?
Not having a great feeling about this combo and 2009 season.
Maybe it's simply Lerner not spending what's needed ?
Save on HC but spend on GM ? Ferentz not on anyone's radar probably means he's not expensive either, so if Piloi is, this could be Lerner's way to provide more offer to Piloi, therefore he's not having to dig any deeper.
In any event, with ferentz I feel we'd have to have too much faith in the managing and allow less in coaching.
Isn't that sort of what we just got done with ?
Not having a great feeling about this combo and 2009 season.
I'd say that Ferentz would cost more then the coordinators they intend to interview so I don't think it's about saving money. It will be Pioli's choice. No matter who he picks as HC, it is about your staff. My problem would be who would Ferentz bring in as coordinators. What kind of NFL contacts does he have.
Personally, I don't like it, but Ferentz is the report that is coming out of Boston, not here. It was just announced that the Browns will interview Mangini for the HC job. Also, Lerner said that McDaniel will get an interview as will Schwartz.
I don't see Ferentz as the front runner......................I hope.
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Lerner is worth Billions -- as in multiples of one billion dollars. He doesn't need to skimp, and I don't think that's the case here.
It's not like Ferentz is a young up and comer. He'll be 54 when the season starts. If we're going to hire an older guy, Shanahan or Marty would do wonders for our team.
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Interesting:
Browns push for Scott Pioli would include Kirk Ferentz
Ron Borges By Ron Borges
Tuesday, December 30, 2008 - Updated 2m ago
Cleveland Browns owner Randy Lerner isn’t prepared to be turned down a second time in his quest to find a savior for his football franchise, according to a league source familiar with his effort to hire New England Patriots [team stats] personnel director Scott Pioli.
According to the source, Lerner was not pleased when former Pittsburgh Steelers head coach Bill Cowher spurned his advances and so he is prepared to make what was described as a “huge” financial offer to Pioli that would include not only millions, but more importantly full control of the organization and the funds necessary to bring in Pioli’s first choice as head coach, Iowa’s Kirk Ferentz.
Although it has been widely speculated that Pioli might try to create a package deal that would include young Patriots offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels as his head coach, that is not the case. Pioli favors Ferentz, with whom he first worked under Bill Belichick when both were with the Browns 15 years ago. Ferentz survived the move to Baltimore and was the Ravens assistant head coach/offensive line coach before leaving to take over the Iowa program in 1998.
Ferentz began his career at the University of Connecticut, later coached locally at Worcester Academy (where he also taught English literature for two years), and was the head coach at Maine before leaving for the NFL. He has had success rebuilding Iowa’s program, but has suffered through several down years of late, drawing the ire of disgruntled alumni before this season began. The Hawkeyes went 8-4 and will face South Carolina on New Year’s Day in the Outback Bowl, an improvement on 2007’s 6-6 season.
Pioli is also reportedly on the short list in Kansas City, but does not appear to be the leading candidate of owner Clint Hunt, son of Chiefs founder Lamar Hunt, who passed away earlier this year. Hunt is reportedly on the lookout for a young and less-well-known front office executive like Thomas Dimitroff, who left the Patriots’ personnel department a year ago and transformed the luckless Atlanta Falcons into a playoff team in one year.
Hunt is searching for someone willing to work with club president and salary cap guru Denny Thum. Thum has been with the Chiefs for 34 years and was recently installed as team president and COO to replace departed Carl Peterson. Although Thum would not have final say over football matters it is likely Hunt would insist he be in the mix when decisions are made, a scenario that is not believed to be to Pioli’s liking. It is possible that Thum could move exclusively to the business side of the team, but his long-time presence with the Chiefs and association with the departed Peterson would make such a scenario less than likely for Pioli.
As hot a commodity as Pioli is at the moment, his situation may in the end boil down to Cleveland or nothing. Thum is in place in Kansas City and Tom Lewand and Martin Mayhew were mysteriously given promotions in Detroit at the end of a 0-16 season, so there is really only one job out there that would offer him the full control of football operations he desires.
Lewand was recently named Lions club president and Mayhew was promoted to general manager despite the fact both were with the team far longer than departed head coach Rod Marinelli, who inherited them as well as Matt Millen and an already bad situation upon arriving three years ago. If Pioli were to look at Detroit, he would be able to add a new head coach but where would he sit? Certainly not below Lewand, who has been with the Lions for 12 years, a stretch in which they’ve been a sorry excuse for a franchise while the Patriots were winning three super Bowls and going to four.
So it seems if Pioli really wants to finally take over his own NFL franchise his best chance to have the situation he believes is necessary to win - which is to control the entire football operation - is with Cleveland or bust. Considering that the Browns are willing to do it, and willing to allow Ferentz to come in as head coach, it would appear Pioli either ends up there or back in Foxboro in short order.
It basically says Pioli is ours for the taking...but it likely means we get Ferentz as the HC (not McDaniels).
I don't know much about Ferentz, or his ties in the coaching community, so have no idea what that would mean for the OC/DC positions.
Interesting:
It basically says Pioli is ours for the taking...but it likely means we get Ferentz as the HC (not McDaniels).
I don't know much about Ferentz, or his ties in the coaching community, so have no idea what that would mean for the OC/DC positions.
Hopefully, this will make you feel a little better.
McDaniels has never coached a rebuilding team while Ferentz was on the Belichick staff here in the 90s that transitioned into an 11-5 team. Ferentz was our oline coach and then he was Steinbach's college coach. Iowa has turned out a few good men: Dallas Clark, Eric Steinbach, Bob Sanders, and Mike Goff. That says they were coached up for success to me.
The reason Charlie Weis was replaceable was because EVERYONE on BB's staff is replaceable by the next guy in line. That staff in NE repeats situational football EVERY day so someone else will step up to the luxury of Tom Brady, Wes Welker and Randy Moss if McDaniels leaves. Meanwhile Charlie Weis after either Brady - found out coaching wasn't anywhere near as easy as it is when he has TOP talent. I don't want another Coordinator getting Head Coach culture shock.
Just remember - nobody on this planet thought Miami and Atlanta were heading for the immediate turnaround with the no name new Head Coaches.
- Tom F. (I'm more interested in a GM that can bring in MORE draft picks and have us stockpiled with depth to make Head Coaching a little more doable here)
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