Browns Defense Will Dramatically Improve - Major Reason
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You'll see. Corners are basically the WRs of the defense, heavily dependent on pass rush like WRs are heavily dependent on playing with Manning or Rodgers (!). They're both just really dependent. If you rattle the pocket and shrink the window, suddenly you have better corners than you thought.
The league has made it so hard to be a "shutdown corner." Every five years or so, a really good one comes along but it doesn't seem to add up to all that much. Revis and the Jets never made it to the Super Bowl and fell of quickly, partially because they never had a pass rush or a great quarterback and those are the real building blocks now.
As I mentioned the other day, one of the key reasons you want to have a really good athlete at Free Safety -- and why I advocated for it so hard and long on this board -- is that when the pressure is put on the QB, and he feels it, you want to be able to take advantage of the mistakes he may make via throwing inaccurately and thus pick off the pass. Ed Reed was the master of this, an intimidator.
Last year, for instance, we saw how rattled Weeden got against the Ravens at times as Reed, even in the twilight of his career, got into Weden's head, more say than Suggs did. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Is Gipson good enough to be a speedy, savvy, FS in the mold of an Ed Reed? That's questionable. But even more concerning is that if Gipson gets hurt we don't have the athletes at that position to do an adequate job back there, at least in my view.
Another thought: to this day I maintain the Browns would have been in two Super Bowls back in the mid 80s if safety Don Rogers hadn't died of an overdose the night before his wedding. Rogers was the kind of intimidating, athletic safety I'm talking about. He had made some key INTs in his rookie season when the Browns made the playoffs and was on his way to becoming all pro. His replacement was slow and not as athletic and that really hurt the Browns against the Broncos. .
Skeptical2013 said:
As I mentioned the other day, one of the key reasons you want to have a really good athlete at Free Safety -- and why I advocated for it so hard and long on this board -- is that when the pressure is put on the QB, and he feels it, you want to be able to take advantage of the mistakes he may make via throwing inaccurately and thus pick off the pass. Ed Reed was the master of this, an intimidator.
Last year, for instance, we saw how rattled Weeden got against the Ravens at times as Reed, even in the twilight of his career, got into Weden's head, more say than Suggs did. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Is Gipson good enough to be a speedy, savvy, FS in the mold of an Ed Reed? That's questionable.
Yes, Gipson is going to be considered a Hall of Fame safety the minute he steps on to the field.....or maybe he will be a speedy savvy Pro Bowl FS....or maybe he will just be a good FS....or maybe just an average FS.....we don't know. But we think that we do know is that he will be better than what we had there before.
But even more concerning is that if Gipson gets hurt we don't have the athletes at that position to do an adequate job back there, at least in my view.
There are 704 starting players in the NFL on offense and defense. All of them have their jobs because they are supposedly better than the backups.
If the backups were so good, they would be starters. So, no shit Sherlock....it would be expected that there would be a dropoff is a backup has to play. Welcome to the NFFL.
Another thought: to this day I maintain the Browns would have been in two Super Bowls back in the mid 80s if safety Don Rogers hadn't died of an overdose the night before his wedding. Rogers was the kind of intimidating, athletic safety I'm talking about. He had made some key INTs in his rookie season when the Browns made the playoffs and was on his way to becoming all pro. His replacement was slow and not as athletic and that really hurt the Browns against the Broncos. .
Total speculation. I too perhaps would like to think that. But it isn't worth it to do so.
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And we still do.
Mingo has yet to do anything against an NFL line. Let him play before you start calling him "dominant".
Practice what you preach. Let Gipson start playing before you start calling him "bust".
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I'm tired, though, of all the talk about the past. The Rams had several losing seasons, and then they
hit the bigtime. I'm also tired of talking about the former Browns coaches that drafted poorly, and tried to
fit square pegs into their round system, and vice versa. An aggressive team that makes mistakes is a team
that will be far closer to winning several games, than a "read and react" bs team that dwells in mediocrity.
And this Browns coaching staff knows how to utilize the players per their strengths. And that will
set the players free to enjoy the game.
Big, huge difference I see this coming season.
I'm tired, though, of all the talk about the past. The Rams had several losing seasons, and then they
hit the bigtime. I'm also tired of talking about the former Browns coaches that drafted poorly, and tried to
fit square pegs into their round system, and vice versa. An aggressive team that makes mistakes is a team
that will be far closer to winning several games, than a "read and react" bs team that dwells in mediocrity.
And this Browns coaching staff knows how to utilize the players per their strengths. And that will
set the players free to enjoy the game.
Big, huge difference I see this coming season.
I do agree with you that the coaching staff will do a much better job of capitalizing on player strengths. That should translate to better performance, but maybe not quite good enough to improve the won-loss record much.
You mention the Rams. Keep an eye on them. With their fine drafting et al, including the addition of super rocket Tavon Austin, the Rams offense will go to a new level and their defense will be much improved thanks to smart drafting the past two years. And as Tavon Austin helps transform the Rams into a playoff contender, think of the fact that the Browns could have drafted Austin instead of Mingo. I'll be watching that closely this year.
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And we still do.
Mingo has yet to do anything against an NFL line. Let him play before you start calling him "dominant".
Practice what you preach. Let Gipson start playing before you start calling him "bust".
Practice what you preach. Let Gipson start playing before you start calling him "bust".
Gipson only started three games last season. Even if he winds up being a decent NFL player, he still has a long learning curve in front of him. Playing free safety in the NFL requires smart decision making, and that often only comes from experience.
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More good news: Sheard was standing up on 6 of his 7 sacks last year, which is why we saw him in the two-point more down the stretch. He's simply better that way which bodes well for his transition.
http://www.draftbrowns.com/2013/05/browns-film-room-jabaal-sheard/
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Well, we can always say the proof is in the pudding but we can't table ALL talk until then. We'd go mad!
My optimism is as much about the unified vision of the organization as anything: Attack aggressively with the pass early in games, take first half leads, force the other team to keep up, get after the passer. Better, analytics-loving Lombardi even put numbers to it, talking about winning teams, how much they pass in the first half, and how much it means to win the first half.
Obviously, everything matters but the real keys to that plan is to have great quarterback play and great individual pass rushers. The former is obvious, the latter is about getting after the passer without blitzes that expose coverage to smart quarterbacks. I always associate it with Manning-Freeney (and Mathis) and Rodgers-Clay. Giants elevated in two championship runs with a hot QB and a fierce pass rush. The year the Saints won, Will Smith was a Pro Bowler with 11 or 12 sacks. Steelers won when the combo of Ben and James Harrison was strong. Not so much as Harrison faded.
I also like the talk about "Team Building," the new NFL catchphrase. I've bitched for years that you can win in April but lose in September by not realizing how to structure your team and allocate assets. Best example: Draft a corner really high. Draftnicks just love them some corners. No team has drafted corners in or just outside of the top 10 more than Buffalo in the past five years. Buffalo. As in, a consistently bad team lacking a franchise quarterback.
The other recent teams: Browns, Cards, Cowboys. Drafting corners gets you a high grade but they don't change fortunes because they can't have that kind of impact since the Ty Law rules. And three of those four teams lacked a franchise quarterback when they drafted a corner in the top 10. I find it fascinating to look at where really good teams find their corners: Steelers, Ravens, Seahawks, Packers, Niners, and so on. Teams that get after the passer find guys like Taylor, Lewis, Webb, Sherman, Hayward, and Culliver and turn them into really good cover guys.
For me, drafting corners or running backs too high is a little out of whack. On a perfectly built team with a plan, you want your quarterback, left tackle, and primary pass rusher to be the highest paid players on the team. You put your highest assets against those three spots, including draft picks.
the real keys to that plan is to have great quarterback play and great individual pass rushers.
For me, drafting corners or running backs too high is a little out of whack. On a perfectly built team with a plan, you want your quarterback, left tackle, and primary pass rusher to be the highest paid players on the team. You put your highest assets against those three spots, including draft picks.
It's all about the QB and the OL on offense. Great QB's make their WR's great - every time. WR's are shiny hood ornaments that do not change anything by themselves. Jerry Rice joined a team that already won the NFL but whose leading receiver was a RB.. if he was drafted by the Raiders, he wouldn't have been the jerry rice of WR's.
On D, if your DL dominates, you win.
Here is an explanation including historical win% correlation and here is the 2012 stat list.
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And we still do.
Mingo has yet to do anything against an NFL line. Let him play before you start calling him "dominant".
Practice what you preach. Let Gipson start playing before you start calling him "bust".
Practice what you preach. Let Gipson start playing before you start calling him "bust".
I never said he was a bust. I said he's done nothing to deserve the starting job.
You act like he didn't play last year.
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Practice what you preach. Let Gipson start playing before you start calling him "bust".
Gipson only started three games last season. Even if he winds up being a decent NFL player, he still has a long learning curve in front of him. Playing free safety in the NFL requires smart decision making, and that often only comes from experience.
Skeptical2013 said:
Gipson only started three games last season. Even if he winds up being a decent NFL player, he still has a long learning curve in front of him. Playing free safety in the NFL requires smart decision making, and that often only comes from experience.
If that is your attitude, then only veterans should ever play....yet, how do those veterans ever get experience? By playing when they were young.
We had an "experienced veteran" in Usama Young. He sucked. So now the team wants to go with the seemingly better, though younger player.
In case you didn't notice, the Browns are on a youth kick. They have exactly 3 players on this roster currently 30 or older;
Rashad Butler 30
Jason Campbell 31
Shayne Graham K 35
So, clearly, a play having a lot of experience is not a priority of this team.
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More good news: Sheard was standing up on 6 of his 7 sacks last year, which is why we saw him in the two-point more down the stretch. He's simply better that way which bodes well for his transition.
http://www.draftbrowns.com/2013/05/browns-film-room-jabaal-sheard/
More good news: Sheard was standing up on 6 of his 7 sacks last year, which is why we saw him in the two-point more down the stretch. He's simply better that way which bodes well for his transition.
http://www.draftbrowns.com/2013/05/browns-film-room-jabaal-sheard/
Sheard is a quality talent. Really glad we kept him.
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Skeptical2013 said:
Gipson only started three games last season. Even if he winds up being a decent NFL player, he still has a long learning curve in front of him. Playing free safety in the NFL requires smart decision making, and that often only comes from experience.
If that is your attitude, then only veterans should ever play....yet, how do those veterans ever get experience? By playing when they were young.
We had an "experienced veteran" in Usama Young. He sucked. So now the team wants to go with the seemingly better, though younger player.
In case you didn't notice, the Browns are on a youth kick. They have exactly 3 players on this roster currently 30 or older;
Rashad Butler 30
Jason Campbell 31
Shayne Graham K 35
So, clearly, a play having a lot of experience is not a priority of this team.
If that is your attitude, then only veterans should ever play....yet, how do those veterans ever get experience? By playing when they were young.
We had an "experienced veteran" in Usama Young. He sucked. So now the team wants to go with the seemingly better, though younger player.
In case you didn't notice, the Browns are on a youth kick. They have exactly 3 players on this roster currently 30 or older;
Rashad Butler 30
Jason Campbell 31
Shayne Graham K 35
So, clearly, a play having a lot of experience is not a priority of this team.
I agree, but what I am saying is that expect Gipson to make his share of mistakes this year, and that wil hurt the Browns defense. I'm rooting for Gipson. I'm especially rooting for him to stay healthy because his back up is inadequate. Bademosi wasn't even a big impact player in college but he has some speed, is smart, and like the Browns, I am intrigued with him as a developmental project at safety. But to expect him to step in if Gispon gets hurt and play well this year -- well, that's a stretch I think.
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the real keys to that plan is to have great quarterback play and great individual pass rushers.
For me, drafting corners or running backs too high is a little out of whack. On a perfectly built team with a plan, you want your quarterback, left tackle, and primary pass rusher to be the highest paid players on the team. You put your highest assets against those three spots, including draft picks.
It's all about the QB and the OL on offense. Great QB's make their WR's great - every time. WR's are shiny hood ornaments that do not change anything by themselves. Jerry Rice joined a team that already won the NFL but whose leading receiver was a RB.. if he was drafted by the Raiders, he wouldn't have been the jerry rice of WR's.
On D, if your DL dominates, you win.
Here is an explanation including historical win% correlation and here is the 2012 stat list.
It's all about the QB and the OL on offense. Great QB's make their WR's great - every time. WR's are shiny hood ornaments that do not change anything by themselves. Jerry Rice joined a team that already won the NFL but whose leading receiver was a RB.. if he was drafted by the Raiders, he wouldn't have been the jerry rice of WR's.
On D, if your DL dominates, you win.
Here is an explanation including historical win% correlation and here is the 2012 stat list.
I don't know. Sometimes that is true, like in the case of Aaron Rodgers. The reverse is true too. I think AJ Green in Cincy makes Andy Dalton look better than he is. Megatron makes his QB look good, too.
Then look at other situations: Joe Montana was great, but I do believe Jerry Rice would have been great with an NFL average QB.
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If that is your attitude, then only veterans should ever play....yet, how do those veterans ever get experience? By playing when they were young.
We had an "experienced veteran" in Usama Young. He sucked. So now the team wants to go with the seemingly better, though younger player.
In case you didn't notice, the Browns are on a youth kick. They have exactly 3 players on this roster currently 30 or older;
Rashad Butler 30
Jason Campbell 31
Shayne Graham K 35
So, clearly, a play having a lot of experience is not a priority of this team.
I agree, but what I am saying is that expect Gipson to make his share of mistakes this year, and that wil hurt the Browns defense. I'm rooting for Gipson. I'm especially rooting for him to stay healthy because his back up is inadequate. Bademosi wasn't even a big impact player in college but he has some speed, is smart, and like the Browns, I am intrigued with him as a developmental project at safety. But to expect him to step in if Gispon gets hurt and play well this year -- well, that's a stretch I think.
Skeptical2013 said:
I agree, but what I am saying is that expect Gipson to make his share of mistakes this year, and that wil hurt the Browns defense.
Well, again, we had a guy with experience...UY...who sucked....and FYI, guys with 10 years in the league can make a lot of mistakes too. So, still, it is better to go with the younger, more talented player, who might be prone to some mistakes than the older guy you know can't hack it.
I'm rooting for Gipson. I'm especially rooting for him to stay healthy because his back up is inadequate. Bademosi wasn't even a big impact player in college but he has some speed, is smart, and like the Browns, I am intrigued with him as a developmental project at safety. But to expect him to step in if Gispon gets hurt and play well this year -- well, that's a stretch I think.
I expect Bademosi to be active on special teams and maybe in the nickel/dime packages.
I expect every single Browns starting player to be better than their backups.
No matter what the position QB/RB/WR/OL/DL/LB/DB the starters are supposed to be better than the backups, that is why they are the starters.
And here is another clue for you, Captain Obvious: this is football, guys are gonna get hurt, backups are gonna see some playing time.
HELLO!
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When you're looking at what wins in today's league, here's something interesting Daniel Jeremiah just dropped: Two teams with a lot of talent have finished outside of the playoffs the past two seasons, KC and Tampa Bay. They're also the only teams to finish bottom five in sacks for each of those two years.
And Tampa Bay was the best run defense in the league by every measure (yards, YPC) last season. Which added up to a whole lot of nothin'.
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When you're looking at what wins in today's league, here's something interesting Daniel Jeremiah just dropped: Two teams with a lot of talent have finished outside of the playoffs the past two seasons, KC and Tampa Bay. They're also the only teams to finish bottom five in sacks for each of those two years.
And Tampa Bay was the best run defense in the league by every measure (yards, YPC) last season. Which added up to a whole lot of nothin'.
When you're looking at what wins in today's league, here's something interesting Daniel Jeremiah just dropped: Two teams with a lot of talent have finished outside of the playoffs the past two seasons, KC and Tampa Bay. They're also the only teams to finish bottom five in sacks for each of those two years.
And Tampa Bay was the best run defense in the league by every measure (yards, YPC) last season. Which added up to a whole lot of nothin'.
And the Chiefs had 5 or 6 players on their defense make the Pro Bowl.
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When you're looking at what wins in today's league, here's something interesting Daniel Jeremiah just dropped: Two teams with a lot of talent have finished outside of the playoffs the past two seasons, KC and Tampa Bay. They're also the only teams to finish bottom five in sacks for each of those two years.
And Tampa Bay was the best run defense in the league by every measure (yards, YPC) last season. Which added up to a whole lot of nothin'.
When you're looking at what wins in today's league, here's something interesting Daniel Jeremiah just dropped: Two teams with a lot of talent have finished outside of the playoffs the past two seasons, KC and Tampa Bay. They're also the only teams to finish bottom five in sacks for each of those two years.
And Tampa Bay was the best run defense in the league by every measure (yards, YPC) last season. Which added up to a whole lot of nothin'.
I maintain: it takes ELEVEN GOOD players to have a good defense, not seven.
Re Tampa Bay, I guess you didn't notice that they invested an enormous amount of money to upgrade their secondary, which in their view was a major reason they missed the playoffs last year!
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Skeptical2013 said:
I agree, but what I am saying is that expect Gipson to make his share of mistakes this year, and that wil hurt the Browns defense.
Well, again, we had a guy with experience...UY...who sucked....and FYI, guys with 10 years in the league can make a lot of mistakes too. So, still, it is better to go with the younger, more talented player, who might be prone to some mistakes than the older guy you know can't hack it.
I'm rooting for Gipson. I'm especially rooting for him to stay healthy because his back up is inadequate. Bademosi wasn't even a big impact player in college but he has some speed, is smart, and like the Browns, I am intrigued with him as a developmental project at safety. But to expect him to step in if Gispon gets hurt and play well this year -- well, that's a stretch I think.
I expect Bademosi to be active on special teams and maybe in the nickel/dime packages.
I expect every single Browns starting player to be better than their backups.
No matter what the position QB/RB/WR/OL/DL/LB/DB the starters are supposed to be better than the backups, that is why they are the starters.
And here is another clue for you, Captain Obvious: this is football, guys are gonna get hurt, backups are gonna see some playing time.
HELLO!
Skeptical2013 said:
I agree, but what I am saying is that expect Gipson to make his share of mistakes this year, and that wil hurt the Browns defense.
Well, again, we had a guy with experience...UY...who sucked....and FYI, guys with 10 years in the league can make a lot of mistakes too. So, still, it is better to go with the younger, more talented player, who might be prone to some mistakes than the older guy you know can't hack it.
I'm rooting for Gipson. I'm especially rooting for him to stay healthy because his back up is inadequate. Bademosi wasn't even a big impact player in college but he has some speed, is smart, and like the Browns, I am intrigued with him as a developmental project at safety. But to expect him to step in if Gispon gets hurt and play well this year -- well, that's a stretch I think.
I expect Bademosi to be active on special teams and maybe in the nickel/dime packages.
I expect every single Browns starting player to be better than their backups.
No matter what the position QB/RB/WR/OL/DL/LB/DB the starters are supposed to be better than the backups, that is why they are the starters.
And here is another clue for you, Captain Obvious: this is football, guys are gonna get hurt, backups are gonna see some playing time.
HELLO!
HELLO to you and because guys get hurt and backups will start a fair amount that is why I am so upset Lombardi didn't use the 4th and 5th round picks to upgrade the secondary! Thanks for supporting my argument!
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Skeptical2013 said:
I agree, but what I am saying is that expect Gipson to make his share of mistakes this year, and that wil hurt the Browns defense.
Well, again, we had a guy with experience...UY...who sucked....and FYI, guys with 10 years in the league can make a lot of mistakes too. So, still, it is better to go with the younger, more talented player, who might be prone to some mistakes than the older guy you know can't hack it.
I'm rooting for Gipson. I'm especially rooting for him to stay healthy because his back up is inadequate. Bademosi wasn't even a big impact player in college but he has some speed, is smart, and like the Browns, I am intrigued with him as a developmental project at safety. But to expect him to step in if Gispon gets hurt and play well this year -- well, that's a stretch I think.
I expect Bademosi to be active on special teams and maybe in the nickel/dime packages.
I expect every single Browns starting player to be better than their backups.
No matter what the position QB/RB/WR/OL/DL/LB/DB the starters are supposed to be better than the backups, that is why they are the starters.
And here is another clue for you, Captain Obvious: this is football, guys are gonna get hurt, backups are gonna see some playing time.
HELLO!
HELLO to you and because guys get hurt and backups will start a fair amount that is why I am so upset Lombardi didn't use the 4th and 5th round picks to upgrade the secondary! Thanks for supporting my argument!
Skeptical2013 said:
HELLO to you and because guys get hurt and backups will start a fair amount that is why I am so upset Lombardi didn't use the 4th and 5th round picks to upgrade the secondary! Thanks for supporting my argument!
The only support you are getting is probably from your bra.
Here's another clue for you: no one cares if you are upset.
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