A case for Chris Simms
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And a very capable backup if he doesn't beat Quinn out. Was a warrior with the Bucs, sat for two years after blowing out his spleen. I think he was a victim of the complexity of Gruden's schemes and obscenely long terminology coming from Texas's simple terminology. When he got the chance lead the Bucs to the playoffs and is only in his 6th year.....total upside and if quinn turns out to be good....nice trade bait in couple years! Leftwich's delivery is horrendously long and he is SLOW! I think Simms is the very best backup out there!
And a very capable backup if he doesn't beat Quinn out. Was a warrior with the Bucs, sat for two years after blowing out his spleen. I think he was a victim of the complexity of Gruden's schemes and obscenely long terminology coming from Texas's simple terminology. When he got the chance lead the Bucs to the playoffs and is only in his 6th year.....total upside and if quinn turns out to be good....nice trade bait in couple years! Leftwich's delivery is horrendously long and he is SLOW! I think Simms is the very best backup out there!
Chris Simms played at Texas before the terminology was simplified. He couldn't beat out the Major and then was GIVEN the starting job. He made a career for Roy Williams of Oklahoma with the "Superman Play". He finally imploded with four turnovers in the Big 12 Championship game and Major came in and rallied the team running out of time at the end. Major then followed it up with a record 473 yard, 4 TD performance in the Holiday Bowl.
Make no mistake about it. Chris Simms has been over-rated since he was in diapers (and yes, I did see every game he played in Austin). I do, however, applaud him for some growth as a pro and the toughness he showed when he ruptured his spleen but splenectomy doesn't make you an NFL QB.
I have to rest at the bottom line however and that is that this guy couldn't beat out Bruce Gradkowski and Brian Griese.
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oldcow1945 said:
If a career back up that couldn't beat out Brad Johnson or Bruce Gradkowski or Brian Greise, could come in to Cleveland and beat out Quinn, you may as well cut Quinn now.
Hey d bag....He was the starter until he freakin RUPTURED his spleen for pete's sake! What planet are you on!
C'mon Solon, do you seriously think he could come in here and beat Quinn out? There isn't a snowball's chance in hell of that happening.
I'm not sure why you think the guy is a quality QB.
Try reading again!!!! Did I say he could beat out quinn??? I explained why I thought he could be good....geesh!!! He is the best back-up out there IMO....no one close with prime ahead of him!!!
Hey d bag.
Hey d bag?
Well, I see having a debate with Solon is no longer worth my while.
There is nothing wrong with disagreeing. But it's obvious you can't do it without making it personal. Never did I once attack you personally. Only with the idea of Simms beating out Quinn for the starting job.
It doesn't take long for a lot of people to show what kind of person they are.
The reason I love this board is the intelligence is higher than so many boards. The guys and girls like you are few and far between. But you sir, are an exception.
When I say he was benched after the second game, I meant in totality. I meant he left and was never back again. Never off the bench to start again....Which would never happen with a true starter unless it's a Tom brady situation. TB never had a QB and even after Simms healed they wanted no part of him.
None the less, You said Simms would be a guy that may even beat Quinn out....I think I read it well. As I said before, If that happens you may as well cut Quinn now.
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@hiwaygal said:
ummm...from your original post:Sure seems to me that you implied he could.
You obviously missed the thread stating as competition to Quinn....If he can't beat out Quinn great...he'll be good trade bait later...title= A case for Chriss Simms as competition for Quinn...do you see anywhere in the thread where I state Simms will beat out Quinn??? NO!
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Hey d bag.
Hey d bag?
Well, I see having a debate with Solon is no longer worth my while.
There is nothing wrong with disagreeing. But it's obvious you can't do it without making it personal. Never did I once attack you personally. Only with the idea of Simms beating out Quinn for the starting job.
It doesn't take long for a lot of people to show what kind of person they are.
The reason I love this board is the intelligence is higher than so many boards. The guys and girls like you are few and far between. But you sir, are an exception.
When I say he was benched after the second game, I meant in totality. I meant he left and was never back again. Never off the bench to start again....Which would never happen with a true starter unless it's a Tom brady situation. TB never had a QB and even after Simms healed they wanted no part of him.
None the less, You said Simms would be a guy that may even beat Quinn out....I think I read it well. As I said before, If that happens you may as well cut Quinn now.
oldcow1945 said:
Hey d bag?Well, I see having a debate with Solon is no longer worth my while.
There is nothing wrong with disagreeing. But it's obvious you can't do it without making it personal. Never did I once attack you personally. Only with the idea of Simms beating out Quinn for the starting job.
It doesn't take long for a lot of people to show what kind of person they are.
The reason I love this board is the intelligence is higher than so many boards. The guys and girls like you are few and far between. But you sir, are an exception.
When I say he was benched after the second game, I meant in totality. I meant he left and was never back again. Never off the bench to start again....Which would never happen with a true starter unless it's a Tom brady situation. TB never had a QB and even after Simms healed they wanted no part of him.
None the less, You said Simms would be a guy that may even beat Quinn out....I think I read it well. As I said before, If that happens you may as well cut Quinn now.
You didn't debate..... you threw completely false info about him not beating out other QB's when he in FACT was the starter and got them to the playoffs as a starter then busted his spleen and hasn't played since! What debate?
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Solon...You questioned Quinns ability to hang on to the job if Simms came aboard when you said if he didn't beat out Quinn.
Most people here know Quinn is the best ever and his farts smell like brownies in the oven, so to even throw out such a statement will keep you out of the board inner circle.
I know where you were coming from....don't worry about it.
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@shepwrite said:
Suggesting that Simms could beat out Quinn is clearly throwing in the towel on your first round franchise quarterback before he even gets a chance to prove himself, right? Anybody encouraged by that notion?You're up bright and early....don't usually see you here until around 10.....errr...7 am where you live.
I don't think he was really saying that and throwing a towel on anything.
If anything all it says is Quinn still has question marks...and I don't think it unfair to pose that possibility.
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I like Boston...been there for many meetings over the years...though it can be a bit cold this time of year.
I won't argue the commit deal...and touched on that in another thread you probably just read.
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@shepwrite said:
I'm in Boston this week. Beautiful day, actually.Nah, it's fackin' cold.
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@shepwrite said:
Suggesting that Simms could beat out Quinn is clearly throwing in the towel on your first round franchise quarterback before he even gets a chance to prove himself, right? Anybody encouraged by that notion?Not necessarily...presumably Quinn could, theoretically, be beaten out. I mean, it might take getting Jesus to come out of retirement, but there is a possibility.
The Browns have cut Dorsey, and will probably trade Anderson. Although I hate going out on a limb, I would put the odds at about 55-60% that they look to sign or trade for another QB on the roster before the season starts. I know, it's like ordering a hamburger when the waiter's aready bringing you a filet mignon, but a lot of teams like to have two QBs on the roster (even though none of them have Quinn, so it's a bit of an unfair comparison).
I like the idea of bringing in a #2 QB who could be a #1--even if that ain't Simms. Otherwise, are you suggesting that the Browns bring in a #2 who sucks, so as not to admit even the possibility that they might need him? Who would that be? Bring Dorsey back? Mike Pagel? Stephen Hawking?
Dennis
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Stephen Hawking?
LOL....he would understand the playbook for sure....though he might have a hard time calling out plays and wouldn't be very mobile.
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Yeah, you're right; it's not that bad.
[resuming morning crankiness]
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Stephen Hawking?
LOL....he would understand the playbook for sure....though he might have a hard time calling out plays and wouldn't be very mobile.
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He would be a great backup.
If Quinn implodes for some reason he would be servicable as a starter until smoeone else could be found. They guy played half a game with a ruptured spleen... and almost pulled out a comeback victory against the Panthers.
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He would be a great backup.
If Quinn implodes for some reason he would be servicable as a starter until smoeone else could be found. They guy played half a game with a ruptured spleen... and almost pulled out a comeback victory against the Panthers.
He would be a great backup.
If Quinn implodes for some reason he would be servicable as a starter until smoeone else could be found. They guy played half a game with a ruptured spleen... and almost pulled out a comeback victory against the Panthers.
All i'M SAYING IS.... i WANT A CAPABLE BACKUP...I f I have to watch the talent level of Dorsey ever again will be too soon...I'm not sold on Quinn like most on this board....the dude has zero Nfl resume to date...3 games and quarter won't get you a cup of coffee...He may turn out great and all for it... but what happens if he gets hurt or just plain sheots the bed??? Gimmie Simms, hell if you twist hard enough I'll take grossman.
hate to say it to all you...pink shirt #10 wearer's..................
Our best move may even be keeping DA
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Here are two QB's career stats in the NFL in their three most active years:
QB A: 2004: 5 games, 42-73 (57.5%), 467 yards, 1 TD, 3 INT (64.1 QB Rating)
2005: 11 games, 191-313 (61.0%), 2,035 yards, 10 TD, 7 INT (81.4 QB Rating)
2006: 3 games, 58-106 (54.7%), 585 yards, 1 TD, 7 INT (46.3 QB Rating)
Career Stats: 19 games 291-492 (59.1%), 3,087 yards, 12 TD, 17 INT (71.2 QB Rating)
QB B: 2006: 5 games, 66-117 (56.4%), 793 yards, 5 TD, 8 INT (63.1 QB Rating)
2007: 16 games, 298-527 (56.5%), 3787 yards, 29 TD, 19 INT (82.5 QB Rating)
2008: 10 games, 142-283 (50.2%), 1615 yards, 9 TD, 8 INT (66.5 QB Rating)
Career Stats: 31 games, 506-927 (54.6%), 43 TD, 35 INT (75.1 QB Rating)
QB A is Chris Simms. QB B is Derek Anderson.
So, aside from the fact that he got hurt once and kept playing, what about Simms' career makes him an appealing candidate?
Dennis
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AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
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AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
I agree that he might be a good backup, but your post implies competition for Quinn and 'if he can't beat him out'. It's really quite simple to read what you wrote.
If that isn't what you meant, then perhaps you should work on delivering the message properly, instead of attacking anyone who disagrees with you on the basis of what you wrote.
Learn to deliver the message properly and grow up. You'd be surprised how far it may take you.
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AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
Pedigree is useless, unless you're a Manning...which QBs in the league right now have dads who played in the NFL? Brady? Roethliisberger?
The great mentor--I'm assuming you mean Gruden--was so impressed with his upside that he cut him, after which there wasn't exactly a race to see who could sign him the fastest. Tennessee picked him up, then cut him to sign a punter. Again, no rush to sign him. Where's the upside? Why are there rumors about teams being interested in trading for Anderson, when they can get Simms for nothing?
At this point, I absolutely would say to hang on to DA rather than sign Simms as the backup. However, the best case scenario is to wait and see who else becomes available, see what happens in the draft and into June...trust me, if the team wants Simms, he's going to be available whenever they decide to bring someone in.
Dennis
And yes, I know I misspelled a name in the post...it was intentional to avoid that Retarded "masking" program.
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oldcow1945 said:
Hey d bag?Well, I see having a debate with Solon is no longer worth my while.
There is nothing wrong with disagreeing. But it's obvious you can't do it without making it personal. Never did I once attack you personally. Only with the idea of Simms beating out Quinn for the starting job.
It doesn't take long for a lot of people to show what kind of person they are.
The reason I love this board is the intelligence is higher than so many boards. The guys and girls like you are few and far between. But you sir, are an exception.
When I say he was benched after the second game, I meant in totality. I meant he left and was never back again. Never off the bench to start again....Which would never happen with a true starter unless it's a Tom brady situation. TB never had a QB and even after Simms healed they wanted no part of him.
None the less, You said Simms would be a guy that may even beat Quinn out....I think I read it well. As I said before, If that happens you may as well cut Quinn now.
You didn't debate..... you threw completely false info about him not beating out other QB's when he in FACT was the starter and got them to the playoffs as a starter then busted his spleen and hasn't played since! What debate?
You didn't debate..... you threw completely false info about him not beating out other QB's when he in FACT was the starter and got them to the playoffs as a starter then busted his spleen and hasn't played since! What debate?
The information I put out is correct.
In 2003 he was the Bucs last pick of the 3rd round and was third on the depth chart the entire season behin Brad Johnson and Shaun King.
In 2004 he was again the third string Qb behind Johnson and Brian Griese.
In 2005 he was 2nd on the depth chart behind Griese and ahead of Luke McCown
Griese got hurt and Simms played in 10 games that year.
He then started the first two games of 2006, looked horrible, was then hurt and has never been a starter since.
In about 5 years of active duty he has started 12 games....All but two of them due to injury to the starter Brian Griese.
How did I not state facts? He obvioulsy spent the first three years not being able to beat out a variety of Qb's...Brad Johnson, Shaun King and Brian Griese.
His move up to the starting spot for 10 games in 2005 was due to Griese's injury. Not because the Bucs thought he was the best QB on the roster.
You are right though....There is no debate when the facts are written down in the history books.
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AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
AS backup what doesn't? He's taken his team to the playoffs, has pedigree, has a great mentor, knows what it takes , is young with good upside. who do you want dency? whose your Choice ? want to keep DA? you want leftwich? How about Kyle Boller?
Actually, I would rather see J.P. Losman as a backup. He is younger, healthier, more mobile, has much more experience starting. Has thrown 33 Td's to Simms 17 and has a higher career qb rating. The only year the Bills allowed him to start all 16 games he threw 19 TD's and had a 85 Qb rating for a bad 7-9 Bills team..
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