Trubisky
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It's like trying to plug a leak with a q tip. Not going to help with this qb class
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I do like going back through my phone's notes and seeing what I was thinking back then.
I found these to be pretty relevant to today:
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No fucking qb pick till after 2nd round. No matter who we pick they will not help the team.
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I don't think a qb this will do shit for us this year. I do not want draft a mallet type this year who might be a potential future back up. Too deep in this year's draft on defense
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Interesting question for Trubs' campers... especially those who find Kess' arm strength to be "wanting".
Kess' pass velocity at the 2016 Combine was 55 mph.
Trubs' pass velocity at the 2017? 55 mph...
No concerns?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I'm starting to think that Browns MIGHT trade up to get Trubisky IF he falls past #4. I could see the Titans wanting to trade back to #12 and accumulate more picks, as they appear to be an up and coming team that is building the correct way. Trading up from 12 to 5 won't cost as much as people think either because I don't think there will be that much competition. If you're trading up for someone like an Andrew Luck, than yeah, that's going to cost you BIG TIME. Nobody puts Trubisky in that same category, so it wouldn't surprise me at all to see either the Titans or Jets to try and trade down a bit. The Jets are in total rebuild mode, and they just cut a lot of players that were getting older and played well for them for a long time. They want to get younger and they want to acquire picks...similar to us last year.
So what would it take to move up from 12 to 6? Again, I don't think it's going to be THAT expensive. I think the #52, a 4th rounder, and a 2018 2nd rounder gets the deal done. The Jets know they can get a very good prospect at 12, plus they get two more second rounders and a 4th. Does it work in the antiquated "Jimmy Johnson" points system? No, I don't think it does, but again, I don't really think it's going to cost us THAT much in terms of picks. I don't remember the exact deal, but remember when the Dolphins moved up in the first round to take Dion Jordan? I don't remember them giving up THAT much (I'm too lazy to look up the details).
So, the Jets make the deal, and that puts us at #6. We then take the #1 QB on our board, who we all believe is Mitchell Trubisky. We still have the #33 pick that we can use on a DB/Safety, and this draft just happens to be quite deep in that area. This way we get the "Once every ten year player" (according to Charlie Casserly) in Myles Garrett, we get our #1 QB in Mitchell Trubisky, and we take someone like Budda Baker, Safety, from Washington.
*mic drop*
EDIT: I looked up the details for the Dion Jordan trade, and it went like this: In 2013, the Dolphins were picking 12 in the first round. They traded with the Oakland Raiders to move all the way up to NUMBER THREE and they took Dion Jordan. They only gave up their 2013 2nd round pick. That's it. Not two first rounders, not three second rounders, not the whole enchilada. They gave up ONE PICK to move up to #3. I'm not saying we'll get THAT sweet of a deal, but I also maintain that it won't cost us the future either. In this scenario, the Fins went up to 3 from 12. In my scenario, I'm predicting the Browns move up from 12 to 5 or even 6. It can work, and I think there's a VERY good chance it happens. The ONLY way it doesn't happen is if we make the deal for Jimmy Garapolo. Before you groan, you should know the Patriots front office refused to discount the possibility, and they wouldn't comment on the situation. Status quo for them and all teams, but they could've shot it down, and they didn't. Believe me when I say the Patriots WON'T want to sit out the first two days of the draft. Not when they can get in on the action with a backup player on their roster.
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The team wanting to trade up for Tribusky is Buffalo and they are ahead of us at #10. The billionaire owner didn't go and visit him just for a day out, the 49ers would love to trade down, I expect that to happen.
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What a steal for Miami that was, jiggins. That'd be awesome
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Interesting question for Trubs' campers... especially those who find Kess' arm strength to be "wanting".
Kess' pass velocity at the 2016 Combine was 55 mph.
Trubs' pass velocity at the 2017? 55 mph...
No concerns?
Interesting question for Trubs' campers... especially those who find Kess' arm strength to be "wanting".
Kess' pass velocity at the 2016 Combine was 55 mph.
Trubs' pass velocity at the 2017? 55 mph...
No concerns?
Interesting because when you watch them throw, MTs passes zing out there, where Kessler's kind of just seem like lobs.
Are we just being deceived by Kessler's passes? 55 mph is actually a very good speed. Watson's 49 mph is considered disconcerting.
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What a steal for Miami that was, jiggins. That'd be awesome
Steal? Not really. Using the JJ chart, the difference between #5 (Titans) and us @ #12 is 400 points. We give them back their #52 = 380. Throw in a future 5th rounder, and DONE. I've pointed out the 49ers #2 overall is out of reach, short of a Goff\Wentz sell the ranch deal. If the Jets really want Trubs, the jump from #6 to #2 is far less costly, and flopping picks with the Titans - even less.
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Interesting question for Trubs' campers... especially those who find Kess' arm strength to be "wanting".
Kess' pass velocity at the 2016 Combine was 55 mph.
Trubs' pass velocity at the 2017? 55 mph...
No concerns?
Interesting because when you watch them throw, MTs passes zing out there, where Kessler's kind of just seem like lobs.
Are we just being deceived by Kessler's passes? 55 mph is actually a very good speed. Watson's 49 mph is considered disconcerting.
Interesting because when you watch them throw, MTs passes zing out there, where Kessler's kind of just seem like lobs.
Are we just being deceived by Kessler's passes? 55 mph is actually a very good speed. Watson's 49 mph is considered disconcerting.
I watched some USC highlights. Kessler can get it downfield in a hurry if he has time.
That is the one thing he didn't have a whole lot of.. Time..
I am excited to see what he is capable of behind a revamped Oline(barring any injuries, of course..)
He did throw some lobbers up there, but at times he's shown he can sling it in there..
I think Cleveland needs to take Myles @ 1, OJ Howard @ 12, JuJu Smith-Schuster @ 33. Best DBs available @ 52 and 65..
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This is all true, but don't forget the Jets just drafted Hackenberg last year in the 2nd round at #51 overall. In a year with a "down QB class" and a very strong defensive class, do you guys really think the Jets would use such a high draft pick on a QB? That would mean they don't have very much faith in Hackenberg. I just don't see it happening...not at pick #6. They can get a blue chip prospect at 6, or even trade down to get more assets. They are completely rebuilding, as evidenced by letting go Nick Mangold, Brandon Marshall, and others. If they absolutely love Mitchell Trubisky, could they draft him? Sure they could, and they could also take Mahomes, Watson, or even Kizer if they liked him the most. Truth is, the Jets need talent, and while there are no such things as "sure fire studs", I think the Jets do the smart thing and take the best overall player on their board OR trade down for more assets.
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What a steal for Miami that was, jiggins. That'd be awesome
Steal? Not really. Using the JJ chart, the difference between #5 (Titans) and us @ #12 is 400 points. We give them back their #52 = 380. Throw in a future 5th rounder, and DONE. I've pointed out the 49ers #2 overall is out of reach, short of a Goff\Wentz sell the ranch deal. If the Jets really want Trubs, the jump from #6 to #2 is far less costly, and flopping picks with the Titans - even less.
Steal? Not really. Using the JJ chart, the difference between #5 (Titans) and us @ #12 is 400 points. We give them back their #52 = 380. Throw in a future 5th rounder, and DONE. I've pointed out the 49ers #2 overall is out of reach, short of a Goff\Wentz sell the ranch deal. If the Jets really want Trubs, the jump from #6 to #2 is far less costly, and flopping picks with the Titans - even less.
True, but in trading up we want to use our guy's chart, Meers, not JJ's.
JJ's is where we start discussions when we trade down.
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What a steal for Miami that was, jiggins. That'd be awesome
Steal? Not really. Using the JJ chart, the difference between #5 (Titans) and us @ #12 is 400 points. We give them back their #52 = 380. Throw in a future 5th rounder, and DONE. I've pointed out the 49ers #2 overall is out of reach, short of a Goff\Wentz sell the ranch deal. If the Jets really want Trubs, the jump from #6 to #2 is far less costly, and flopping picks with the Titans - even less.
Steal? Not really. Using the JJ chart, the difference between #5 (Titans) and us @ #12 is 400 points. We give them back their #52 = 380. Throw in a future 5th rounder, and DONE. I've pointed out the 49ers #2 overall is out of reach, short of a Goff\Wentz sell the ranch deal. If the Jets really want Trubs, the jump from #6 to #2 is far less costly, and flopping picks with the Titans - even less.
I said the Miami desk, which was just a second rounder to move up 10 spots.
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Just in case we forget that this is the time of year where everyone is an HOF. Check out this pre-draft analysis of the 2011 qb prospects...yeah, enough said.
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Just in case we forget that this is the time of year where everyone is an HOF. Check out this pre-draft analysis of the 2011 qb prospects...yeah, enough said.
Just in case we forget that this is the time of year where everyone is an HOF. Check out this pre-draft analysis of the 2011 qb prospects...yeah, enough said.
If you think that's bad... http://walterfootball.com/draft2013QB.php
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Lord have mercy...those lists scare the CRAP out of me. I'm guessing we could find a couple of years where we could find the opposite? Maybe? POSSIBLY?
This is where the logic of "using the #1 pick on a QB" somewhat comes into play. If we feel there is only ONE guy in this QB class that has what it takes to be "the guy", then we have to pass on Myles Garrett and take the QB. Passing on the next Von Miller might get you fired, but passing on the next franchise QB...will DEFINITELY get you fired. We're basically held hostage by one position, year after year, and we won't be a serious threat to ANYBODY until we have a QB. That being said, if our brain trust doesn't feel that there's a guy in the draft who can be the Cleveland Browns QB, we have to take Garrett and don't think twice.
The whole thing just sucks. If we have a QB ranked #1 on our board and we DON'T GET HIM, can you imagine the fallout? It wouldn't be so bad if we didn't pass on Carson Wentz, who either may or may not be a capable starter. We don't know for sure, but he did show SOME promising aspects to his game...especially for a rookie (do I need to remind you of the first game of the season? How much did THAT suck?) We don't seem to want to trade for someone like McCarron or Garopolo, and I think the most likely scenario is for the Browns to draft Myles Garrett, and then try to trade up to grab our #1 QB...whoever that is (Probably Mitchell).
Don't get me wrong, I HATE trading up to the early part of the first round. I want to draft players, not trade away picks. If we can make the deal happen that doesn't cost us the damn farm, I'm all for it. Think about it. We could get our dominant pass rushing prospect at 1, move up to take our QB, and then add some secondary help in the coming rounds with whatever pick we have left. I seriously doubt we trade BOTH our second rounders this year. The best news? Whoever we draft at QB won't have the pressure of coming in and starting right away. I very much doubt that he will be able to beat out Cody Kessler or Brock Osweiler. Is it possible? Of course it is, but I would think the odds are against it. And even if Cody gets injured again, the new guy STILL doesn't have to play because our backup took two different teams to the playoffs two years in a row (although with KILLER defenses, but whatever).
If we don't like any of the QB's enough to trade up for or simply take #1, then I'm completely fine with taking a stab at one either in the 2nd or even 3rd rounds, and going into the season with Cody and Brock. We could take Myles and best player available at 12, and still have both our second rounders as well. In fact, there's a large part of my brain that actually thinks this is the way to go. Maybe Dobbs can be the guy after some seasoning? He's smart, athletic, and has a legendary work ethic. Maybe it's time for the BROWNS to find their Dak Prescott. If we don't use draft picks to move up for a QB, we're going to have a chance to add FOUR very good players this year. It's fun to think about. If we're still terrible, well then there's always next year, and I'm guessing 2018 will supply better QB's.
Me = officially excited.
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jiggins, step away from the caffeine... You're constructing yourself into quandaries that do not need to exist.
Start with the easy part... Wentz. We don't know any more about his potential than we did a year ago. Yes, he started well against "a weak opponent" (how weak we painfully learned over the next 16 weeks), but he suffered as the book on him grew through the season. Nine of his 14 INTs came in the second half of the season. And his numbers fell against two of three division opponents the second time they saw him.
IF we have a QB #1 on our board, then we take him at #1, unless we know we can maneuver to get him later either by trading the #1 or tabbing MG and getting the QB later... maybe as late as 12... maybe later. It all depends on who that "top QB" might be. If it's anyone, but Trubs, then wouldn't you feel a little better, even good, about him being there at least at 12?
IF we love a QB, but love MG more, then the above still applies.
IF we really like a QB, but love MG, then we have to be prepared to take some risk that we won't land the QB. If we don't, I doubt we'll ever know who we didn't land.
Go with your brain... go with your "hate"... try decaf...
~7.4 days to go...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I might take the Titans deal if it was really a possibility. But I'd be surprised if we did. And if we didn't help pissed off or you're going to be if Trubisky falls to 12, just in case the Jets want one of the other also-rans, or below assuming the Browns didn't really want him?
WSS
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I might take the Titans deal if it was really a possibility. But I'd be surprised if we did. And if we didn't help pissed off or you're going to be if Trubisky falls to 12, just in case the Jets want one of the other also-rans, or below assuming the Browns didn't really want him?
WSS
I might take the Titans deal if it was really a possibility. But I'd be surprised if we did. And if we didn't help pissed off or you're going to be if Trubisky falls to 12, just in case the Jets want one of the other also-rans, or below assuming the Browns didn't really want him?
??? Decoder ring is in the shop for repair...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196
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