Kizer
-
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
"Huegottabelieve"/"Baby Steps"/"Trust me on this one"/"Hopefully will lead to success" https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2017/08/27/browns-rookie-quarterback-kizer-will-start-opener/105032476/ about paragraph 5..Hue"I think "It(Hue?)"will forward him the ability to run the offense as we move forward(?),which HOPEFULLY will lead to success" Edit--Does Hue reel in Kizer now after Ravens? HOPEFULLY>>>
-
Mud, really, funny ass post. You go through the draft, preseason and 2 shit games, blasting me................. only to come in here and throw up into your own bush, admitting that what I have been saying since 1999 is the problem with the Browns. If your skilled players cannot challenge the opposing D, they stay home..........they ignore ALL YOUR PLAY CALLING..................they eliminate the need for you to have an offensive plan or play book. Opposing defenses have TWO SCHEMES against the Browns.
Jam the LIne
Don't double cover unless ony a couple guys run deep patterns.
Yawn again. Only problem is a lot of times, the Ravens weren't rushing 8- they didn't have to. Because as Mud pointed out, and I've said when you weren't paying attention- Kizer was getting sacked waiting for our lousy WRs to get open. Well it's T-Minus 24 hours for Gordon to get out of rehab jail, we'll see what happens there. FYI, bang on Coleman all you want, but about every pre-draft publication had him as the best WR prospect in that draft. FWIW, I didn't like that multiple trade down either- I wanted Carson Wentz.
I suppose you didn't bother to look at the DBN breakdown of every one of those 5 turnovers. Please notice the guy feebly attempting to get by Joe Thomas was an epic FAIL. Yeah- you can blame the qb. Both on one of the interceptions or the strip sack our GREAT offensive line gave Kizer plenty of time. In the case of one of the Ints, 4.5 seconds to be exact. So golly gee, your not so astute observation that Kizer hold the ball too long happens to be correct. The one in the endzone follows Hoorta's astute observation that Kizer isn't very accurate. He had Higgins open for a TD, and threw the ball 5 feet behind him. HIs first int was a poorly thrown ball to a wide open Duke Johnson for good measure. Hogan's Heroes was feeling it, and threw his interception almost 10 yards short into triple coverage. So do the math genius. Those three plays cost the Browns 13 points at least- and considering the Ravens scored a last minute TD off of Hogan's turnover- I can make a case based on a make\miss scenario the Browns might actually have won that game.
So repeat after me- YOU DON'T WIN GAMES IN THE NFL IF YOU TURN THE BALL OVER 5 TIMES
& LOL, OL doesn't make a difference? Toooo easy. According to Pro Football Focus, Hoyer's two games are second only to Andy Dalton of the Cincinnati Bengals in terms of awfulness, but at least Dalton has the excuse of playing behind one of the worst offensive lines in the league this season (31 total sacks, hits and hurries allowed, fifth-most). Bungles OL - Whitworth and Zeitler = suckage + potential to get your QB killed. Now what was that about 11-5?
Yawn again. Only problem is a lot of times, the Ravens weren't rushing 8- they didn't have to. Because as Mud pointed out, and I've said when you weren't paying attention- Kizer was getting sacked waiting for our lousy WRs to get open. Well it's T-Minus 24 hours for Gordon to get out of rehab jail, we'll see what happens there. FYI, bang on Coleman all you want, but about every pre-draft publication had him as the best WR prospect in that draft. FWIW, I didn't like that multiple trade down either- I wanted Carson Wentz.
I suppose you didn't bother to look at the DBN breakdown of every one of those 5 turnovers. Please notice the guy feebly attempting to get by Joe Thomas was an epic FAIL. Yeah- you can blame the qb. Both on one of the interceptions or the strip sack our GREAT offensive line gave Kizer plenty of time. In the case of one of the Ints, 4.5 seconds to be exact. So golly gee, your not so astute observation that Kizer hold the ball too long happens to be correct. The one in the endzone follows Hoorta's astute observation that Kizer isn't very accurate. He had Higgins open for a TD, and threw the ball 5 feet behind him. HIs first int was a poorly thrown ball to a wide open Duke Johnson for good measure. Hogan's Heroes was feeling it, and threw his interception almost 10 yards short into triple coverage. So do the math genius. Those three plays cost the Browns 13 points at least- and considering the Ravens scored a last minute TD off of Hogan's turnover- I can make a case based on a make\miss scenario the Browns might actually have won that game.
So repeat after me- YOU DON'T WIN GAMES IN THE NFL IF YOU TURN THE BALL OVER 5 TIMES
& LOL, OL doesn't make a difference? Toooo easy. According to Pro Football Focus, Hoyer's two games are second only to Andy Dalton of the Cincinnati Bengals in terms of awfulness, but at least Dalton has the excuse of playing behind one of the worst offensive lines in the league this season (31 total sacks, hits and hurries allowed, fifth-most). Bungles OL - Whitworth and Zeitler = suckage + potential to get your QB killed. Now what was that about 11-5?
I never said the Ravens or anyone else rushed 8. Of course they don't have to.... KIZER BLOWS HUE JACKSON BLOWS. THE BROWNS HAVE NO SKILLED PLAYERS.
What I said was, the Defense stays home, they don't bite on play fakes.....FIVE MEN CANNOT BLOCK 8. The offensive line is next to fucking meaningless. The Browns have NO SKILLED PLAYERS.
Colts win....Bengals Win
Enjoy your fucking all time high NFL paid OL. Means NOTHING.
-
Vanilla? What? Haven't you seen all the motion and movement Hue incorporates.....and all the trick plays that he constantly incorporates.....all of which has brought us so much success?
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....
I don't think it's meant to 'fool' anyone. It's more to see 'who' moves with the players. To see if it tips the D's hand to some degree.
Ya know what I really hated in our past offenses? It's when we set up at the LOS and the D makes changes to their alignment (adjusting to what they see from us)...and we do NOTHING. We snap the ball and they stuff us.
The same with our D. The offense would see our alignment, the QB would bark out some signals, the offense would realign...and our D would do nothing. Then they'd run the play and succeed against our D.
I'm not a fan of 'trick' plays. It usually means putting guys in uncharacteristic positions and asking them to do things that they don't normally do...while the guys that normally DO do those things are doing things that THEY don't normally do. Usually we just trick ourselves.
-
Vanilla? What? Haven't you seen all the motion and movement Hue incorporates.....and all the trick plays that he constantly incorporates.....all of which has brought us so much success?
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
and then run 3 fly routes and sometimes a deep curl.... INNOVATIVE!!!....GENIUS!!!
-
@boo-fagley said:
Its true
Bens career is slipping away with only 1 super bowl to show for it.
What is slipping away is your fucking pea brain. Ben has played in 3 Superbowls. He has 2 wins and one loss. He is a HOF lock.
Tom Flugel was giving Phil Sewage and Romeo the Doughnut manscapes and chanting "In Sewage We Trust" when the Browns passed on Ben.
The Steelers are so much a better franchise than the Browns, and this is ALL TIME, not just since 1999, it is sickening. As the stats Stinks pointed out, since the AFL-NFL merger, and this is the real start of the modern era of the NFL, the browns have been a joke. Worse however, are Browns fans. Browns fans are actually convinced that they understand football better than anyone else. Browns fans believe that what Cleveland does is cutting edge and that people like me are just too uneducated to see the vision.
Yeah...............the vision..................DO NOT PARTICIPATE IN ACQUIRING PLAYMAKERS..........................Great fucking vision. How is that working out for you dickheads?
Tom Flugel was giving Phil Sewage and Romeo the Doughnut manscapes and chanting "In Sewage We Trust" when the Browns passed on Ben.
I'm glad you stopped tea-bagging your Terry Bradshaw poster long enough to notice. I LOVED winning 10 games in 2007. Savage and Romeo made you disappear like a Houdini rabbit for an entire season. What's not to adore?
And yes, I was very happy we didn't draft a serial rapist to be our franchise QB. Not much different than I felt about us avoiding your idea of Paxton Lynch as a franchise QB. Rumor has it, your boy Lynch is almost as smart as a pet rock.
-
Tom Flugel was giving Phil Sewage and Romeo the Doughnut manscapes and chanting "In Sewage We Trust" when the Browns passed on Ben.
I'm glad you stopped tea-bagging your Terry Bradshaw poster long enough to notice. I LOVED winning 10 games in 2007. Savage and Romeo made you disappear like a Houdini rabbit for an entire season. What's not to adore?
And yes, I was very happy we didn't draft a serial rapist to be our franchise QB. Not much different than I felt about us avoiding your idea of Paxton Lynch as a franchise QB. Rumor has it, your boy Lynch is almost as smart as a pet rock.
-
Kevin Hogan's former Pac 12 rival (Jared Goff) reminds us it takes longer than 2 games for a young QB to emerge on a rebuilding team. The Rams prolly used Case Keenum more to prevent the ruin of Goff than any intended long term plan for Keenum. Last week, Kevin Hogan looked like he could be up to the task of giving us something far better than Case Keenum offers anyone. Hogan might have had the best training camp and preseason of any of our QBs while the deep ball accuracy of Kizer diverted attention away from it.
He is 6'3" and came out of pro style offense in comparison to a soph QB deciding to depart from Notre Dame's Chaotic sandlot spread. It's not that I don't want to give Kizer a chance; but some of these sacks he's taking in the pocket holding on to the ball forever has me feeling like he's not ready yet. About half of our 7 sacks vrs Pitt were from holding onto the ball way too long.
Is it possible Kizer just had a bad game? Absolutely! That said, I'd like to think if Kevin Hogan offered us something better than body by Migraine headache - we keep him in on a day Kizer was producing more turnovers than the local bakery. I'm not a hater - I'm just seeing why Kizer's college coach said "he's not ready" more than I was willing to during the preseason. I don't see what the hurry to ruin this kid is while we are sentenced to an Arena Football caliber WR Corps. If Kosar wasn't ready to start until somewhere between week 5 and 7 as a rookie - what makes Kizer ready? The timing patterned deep ball to an area instead of reading progressions against preseason opponents that didn't game plan or film study him? I don't think it would be a bad move to sit the would be college junior for a guy who looks more ready to succeed at a pro style offense at this time. I've been wrong before though.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
It is a main reason that he is being questioned in his decision making. He got a year of grace last year because things were so bad. But with a few games last year....and both games this year his play calling can come in for some serious questioning.
A parallel could be if Marty Schottenheimer had put in BK in his first game and started having him throw constant bombs as if he was Daryl Lamonica. That is NOT the way to groom a rookie QB. Hue is doing the opposite of Marty.
-
Kevin Hogan's former Pac 12 rival (Jared Goff) reminds us it takes longer than 2 games for a young QB to emerge on a rebuilding team. The Rams prolly used Case Keenum more to prevent the ruin of Goff than any intended long term plan for Keenum. Last week, Kevin Hogan looked like he could be up to the task of giving us something far better than Case Keenum offers anyone. Hogan might have had the best training camp and preseason of any of our QBs while the deep ball accuracy of Kizer diverted attention away from it.
He is 6'3" and came out of pro style offense in comparison to a soph QB deciding to depart from Notre Dame's Chaotic sandlot spread. It's not that I don't want to give Kizer a chance; but some of these sacks he's taking in the pocket holding on to the ball forever has me feeling like he's not ready yet. About half of our 7 sacks vrs Pitt were from holding onto the ball way too long.
Is it possible Kizer just had a bad game? Absolutely! That said, I'd like to think if Kevin Hogan offered us something better than body by Migraine headache - we keep him in on a day Kizer was producing more turnovers than the local bakery. I'm not a hater - I'm just seeing why Kizer's college coach said "he's not ready" more than I was willing to during the preseason. I don't see what the hurry to ruin this kid is while we are sentenced to an Arena Football caliber WR Corps. If Kosar wasn't ready to start until somewhere between week 5 and 7 as a rookie - what makes Kizer ready? The timing patterned deep ball to an area instead of reading progressions against preseason opponents that didn't game plan or film study him? I don't think it would be a bad move to sit the would be college junior for a guy who looks more ready to succeed at a pro style offense at this time. I've been wrong before though.
Hogan might have had the best training camp and preseason of any of our QBs while the deep ball accuracy of Kizer diverted attention away from it.
I don't see what the hurry to ruin this kid is while we are sentenced to an Arena Football caliber WR Corps. I don't think it would be a bad move to sit the would be college junior for a guy who looks more ready to succeed at a pro style offense at this time.
Agreed.....
After telling us(repeatedly) that they would not rush him.....they did exactly that, while pretending that he actually beat out the other guys... .....and they are rushing him, with little to no support to boot....no running attack or WR's, along with a fledging OL is not the formula to "develop" a young QB.....It's a formula to fail and/or create a shell shocked, deer in the headlights QB......
I hope he rebounds this week and has a good game.....another performance like last week and we might start seeing confidence issues start to develop with this one....
-
Hogan might have had the best training camp and preseason of any of our QBs while the deep ball accuracy of Kizer diverted attention away from it.
I don't see what the hurry to ruin this kid is while we are sentenced to an Arena Football caliber WR Corps. I don't think it would be a bad move to sit the would be college junior for a guy who looks more ready to succeed at a pro style offense at this time.
Agreed.....
After telling us(repeatedly) that they would not rush him.....they did exactly that, while pretending that he actually beat out the other guys... .....and they are rushing him, with little to no support to boot....no running attack or WR's, along with a fledging OL is not the formula to "develop" a young QB.....It's a formula to fail and/or create a shell shocked, deer in the headlights QB......
I hope he rebounds this week and has a good game.....another performance like last week and we might start seeing confidence issues start to develop with this one....
I hope he rebounds this week and has a good game.....another performance like last week and we might start seeing confidence issues start to develop with this one....
If Hue does not Boner this up?...Leslie,Higgins,Duke & Dayes should have a nice day..Colts will more than likely throw most their keys at Crow imo..
-
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
A lot of Hue's "complex" shifts are designed to prompt Defensive adjustments that reveal coverages... that is a from of simplification.
EDIT: Reading one more post would have saved me some time...
I don't think it's meant to 'fool' anyone. It's more to see 'who' moves with the players. To see if it tips the D's hand to some degree.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Hogan might have had the best training camp and preseason of any of our QBs while the deep ball accuracy of Kizer diverted attention away from it.
I don't see what the hurry to ruin this kid is while we are sentenced to an Arena Football caliber WR Corps. I don't think it would be a bad move to sit the would be college junior for a guy who looks more ready to succeed at a pro style offense at this time.
Agreed.....
After telling us(repeatedly) that they would not rush him.....they did exactly that, while pretending that he actually beat out the other guys... .....and they are rushing him, with little to no support to boot....no running attack or WR's, along with a fledging OL is not the formula to "develop" a young QB.....It's a formula to fail and/or create a shell shocked, deer in the headlights QB......
I hope he rebounds this week and has a good game.....another performance like last week and we might start seeing confidence issues start to develop with this one....
After telling us(repeatedly) that they would not rush him.....they did exactly that, while pretending that he actually beat out the other guys...
Just not what I saw.
Kizer cleared the basic hurdles of working under Center and delivering the play calls to the huddle. By all accounts Goff struggles with those are what kept him out of the line up and in "the plan". But once Goff was competent with the basics, he started.
As for beating out others... he did... at least in executing Hue's Offense the way he want's it executed, i.e., deep shots. Plus IIRC he came out of Week 3 with the best stats in the QB room and against ever increasing competition from Week 1 thru Week 3.
Lastly, I can't see Hogan making a difference in either game in 2017 to date. Do you? Does anyone?
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
How long do we play Kizer in Indy?
What if he's struggling and looks distressed?
What if he can't find clearly open guys?
What about throws that are erratic passes? ie. passes into the dirt or out of bounds to open receivers?
How many interceptions will you tolerate?
What about holding the ball and staring down wide receivers?
How about interceptions?
I'm just curious because according to Hue and some of you guys it doesn't matter, the kid could shit himself and you'd still want to trot him out there.
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
After telling us(repeatedly) that they would not rush him.....they did exactly that, while pretending that he actually beat out the other guys...
Just not what I saw.
Kizer cleared the basic hurdles of working under Center and delivering the play calls to the huddle. By all accounts Goff struggles with those are what kept him out of the line up and in "the plan". But once Goff was competent with the basics, he started.
As for beating out others... he did... at least in executing Hue's Offense the way he want's it executed, i.e., deep shots. Plus IIRC he came out of Week 3 with the best stats in the QB room and against ever increasing competition from Week 1 thru Week 3.
Lastly, I can't see Hogan making a difference in either game in 2017 to date. Do you? Does anyone?
-
Trick plays??......I see excessive motion before plays(along with delay of game penalties)......Hues idea of a trick play is to move a bunch of guys, pre snap.....stupid shit that fools no one.....how about some creative "plays" Hue?.....how about some PA?.....how about plays that help your rookie team succeed?.....how about using the best tools you have....like 2 good RB's.....instead of leaning HEAVILY on your rookie QB and pathetic WR corps.....??????????????????????????????????????
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
It really is puzzling. Hue decides to start a very young, not terribly experienced rookie at QB but doesn't seem to do much to make it easier for him.
If you're trying to decide whether to roll with Kizer or to draft a QB high, you're going to throw everything you can at him. Sit back, see what he digests and if he can show progress.
-
How long do we play Kizer in Indy?
What if he's struggling and looks distressed?
What if he can't find clearly open guys?
What about throws that are erratic passes? ie. passes into the dirt or out of bounds to open receivers?
How many interceptions will you tolerate?
What about holding the ball and staring down wide receivers?
How about interceptions?
I'm just curious because according to Hue and some of you guys it doesn't matter, the kid could shit himself and you'd still want to trot him out there.
-
How long do we play Kizer in Indy?
What if he's struggling and looks distressed?
What if he can't find clearly open guys?
What about throws that are erratic passes? ie. passes into the dirt or out of bounds to open receivers?
How many interceptions will you tolerate?
What about holding the ball and staring down wide receivers?
How about interceptions?
I'm just curious because according to Hue and some of you guys it doesn't matter, the kid could shit himself and you'd still want to trot him out there.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login