Kiser not the reason folks.
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I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster.
He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
Two things that will define you: Your determination when you have nothing. Your attitude when you have everything. - Mike McCartney -
I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster.
He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster.
He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
Damn! Talk about locking on your primary read. Brady hits the other totally uncovered guy for an easy first down.
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And has progressed alot from the first 3 weeks of the season. And it seems like he's self tutored. No Offense coordinator, head coach, or veteran qb to bounch Sheet off of when the defense is on the field. TBO I was expecting Johnny Manziel vs Cincy every week out but he's been a nice surprise and more durable than any browns qb in recent memory. How easily he could have started every game this year but Hue is the "qb whisperer". Honestly at this point if hue says he's not the guy I'm locking the kid in to the future of this team. That's how much I don't trust Jackson anymore. I have no doubt in my mind Jackson manipulates and tanks players, plays, and games till he gets what he wants.
Thank you.
I don't know if Kizer will ever be a decent starting QB in the NFL.
I do know that he was drafted by most likely the WORST team he could have been drafted by. He had no business leaving school early, and he gets drafted by a team that, of course, decides to pair him with no veteran QB on a team where the HC is also the OC (denying him time on the sideline to talk with his OC because his OC is also bumbling his way through being a HC) and start him from Day 1 with an abysmal collection of WRs to throw to.
The Browns set Kizer up to fail. The Process completely ignored the most important position on the roster for two seasons.
How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
The Browns set Kizer up to fail. The Process completely ignored the most important position on the roster for two seasons.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
What responsibility should we put on QB coach David Lee for Kizer's constant choking....and failure to learn from his mistakes?
I like him a lot better than Sammy...... not even close.
You like him a lot better than Sammy who?
I believe he's referring to Sammy Hagar since you mentioned David Lee.
I believe he's referring to Sammy Hagar since you mentioned David Lee.
OK....I get it. Actually a very good one that went over my head. Kudos on that.
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I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster.
He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster. He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
Damn! Talk about locking on your primary read. Brady hits the other totally uncovered guy for an easy first down.
Sorry, guys.... not a matter of "speed" or "locking on".
This is a designed one-step drop from the gun. That means it is a quick pass. That means you go with where your pre-snap read tells you to go unless you pick something at the snap. There is no time to survey... no time to go thru your progressions. It's a one and done play.
Here's the pre-snap look. Note that there's is an LB shaded to Devalve, a DB crossing over him and a Safety pointing at him. Is that your primary? Njoku is the proper read here... but things change.
Here's the look immediately following the snap. The LB is blitzing. The DB is rotating to Duke. The Safety is still pointing. If a QB sees this action he goes to his "hot read", Devalve. Kizer is looking to catch the snap... as he should be and does not see the blitz coming. The LB has timed his move well.
And here is what Kizer sees when he turns to his pre-snap read... a TE about to cross the face of his coverage and be NFL Open.
It is not that Kizer is blameless here. I saw a couple things I did not like in this play.
- First, that he crouches so low to receive the snap. What ever chance he might have at 6'4 to glimpse the blitz coming at the snap was wiped out by crouching so low. At 5'9 Duke reacted very quickly to the 2nd blitzer, but he wasn't having to catch the snap. I need to see if this crouching is an every shotgun thing.
- Second, he is still phucking patting the ball. This is a critical 0.3 or 0.4 seconds lost and the shorter the pass, the more critical the loss. Aided by the pat the near DE almost batted down the pass. The DB definitely benefited by even the slight delay.
- Third, and this is as likely on Hue as it is on Kizer, the snap came with 1 second on the play clock. Why the big deal? If you watched the SNF game, BLT @ PTG, then you saw a critical situation late where Ben barked out a count and got the Ravens D to tip their hand. Then with 9 seconds left he adjusted his protection and the play worked. When have we ever seen Kizer with the time to do this?
So there are points to critique, but, guys, let's pick the right ones.
Oh... and it looked to me like the DB interfered with Njoku... very cleverly I might add. We all know how the Backjudge looks to see if the off arm hooks the receiver (usually around the waist) while the front arm reaches to bat down the ball? It's easy to see that back arm if it hooks. Well in this play the DB did the opposite grabbing Njoku's left arm and side with his left (front) arm, which the Backjudge could not see, while bringing his visible right arm over the top. Close play, but the grab was definitely before the ball arrived.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
The Browns set Kizer up to fail. The Process completely ignored the most important position on the roster for two seasons.
How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
Well "i think" dutch's point is that drafting kizer was essentially still ignoring the position. Taking a project flyer in the 2nd on a kid who's own college coach told the nfl "now dont u go out and do it now, dont u do it"....prob isnt being serious about addressing the situation.
I personally am still ok with the pick, if he had worked out...if he didnt have these yips that will never leave him.....that could have been nice for us. Its time to go get a #1 tho
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How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
Well "i think" dutch's point is that drafting kizer was essentially still ignoring the position. Taking a project flyer in the 2nd on a kid who's own college coach told the nfl "now dont u go out and do it now, dont u do it"....prob isnt being serious about addressing the situation.
I personally am still ok with the pick, if he had worked out...if he didnt have these yips that will never leave him.....that could have been nice for us. Its time to go get a #1 tho
Well "i think" dutch's point is that drafting kizer was essentially still ignoring the position. Taking a project flyer in the 2nd on a kid who's own college coach told the nfl "now dont u go out and do it now, dont u do it"....prob isnt being serious about addressing the situation.
I personally am still ok with the pick, if he had worked out...if he didnt have these yips that will never leave him.....that could have been nice for us. Its time to go get a #1 tho
Absolutely agree that was the intended point, but since I disagree with the point and his intent was not reflected in his post...
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I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster. He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
Damn! Talk about locking on your primary read. Brady hits the other totally uncovered guy for an easy first down.
Sorry, guys.... not a matter of "speed" or "locking on".
This is a designed one-step drop from the gun. That means it is a quick pass. That means you go with where your pre-snap read tells you to go unless you pick something at the snap. There is no time to survey... no time to go thru your progressions. It's a one and done play.
Here's the pre-snap look. Note that there's is an LB shaded to Devalve, a DB crossing over him and a Safety pointing at him. Is that your primary? Njoku is the proper read here... but things change.
Here's the look immediately following the snap. The LB is blitzing. The DB is rotating to Duke. The Safety is still pointing. If a QB sees this action he goes to his "hot read", Devalve. Kizer is looking to catch the snap... as he should be and does not see the blitz coming. The LB has timed his move well.
And here is what Kizer sees when he turns to his pre-snap read... a TE about to cross the face of his coverage and be NFL Open.
It is not that Kizer is blameless here. I saw a couple things I did not like in this play.
- First, that he crouches so low to receive the snap. What ever chance he might have at 6'4 to glimpse the blitz coming at the snap was wiped out by crouching so low. At 5'9 Duke reacted very quickly to the 2nd blitzer, but he wasn't having to catch the snap. I need to see if this crouching is an every shotgun thing.
- Second, he is still phucking patting the ball. This is a critical 0.3 or 0.4 seconds lost and the shorter the pass, the more critical the loss. Aided by the pat the near DE almost batted down the pass. The DB definitely benefited by even the slight delay.
- Third, and this is as likely on Hue as it is on Kizer, the snap came with 1 second on the play clock. Why the big deal? If you watched the SNF game, BLT @ PTG, then you saw a critical situation late where Ben barked out a count and got the Ravens D to tip their hand. Then with 9 seconds left he adjusted his protection and the play worked. When have we ever seen Kizer with the time to do this?
So there are points to critique, but, guys, let's pick the right ones.
Oh... and it looked to me like the DB interfered with Njoku... very cleverly I might add. We all know how the Backjudge looks to see if the off arm hooks the receiver (usually around the waist) while the front arm reaches to bat down the ball? It's easy to see that back arm if it hooks. Well in this play the DB did the opposite grabbing Njoku's left arm and side with his left (front) arm, which the Backjudge could not see, while bringing his visible right arm over the top. Close play, but the grab was definitely before the ball arrived.
Sorry, guys.... not a matter of "speed" or "locking on".
This is a designed one-step drop from the gun. That means it is a quick pass. That means you go with where your pre-snap read tells you to go unless you pick something at the snap. There is not time to survey... to go thru your progressions.
Here's the pre-snap look. Note that there's is an LB shaded to Devalve, a DB crossing over him and a Safety pointing at him. Is that your primary? Njoku is the proper read here... but things change.
Here's the look immediately following the snap. The LB is blitzing. The DB is rotating to Duke. The Safety is still pointing. If a QB sees this action he goes to his "hot read", Devalve. Kizer is looking to catch the snap... as he should be and does not see the blitz coming. The LB has timed his move well.
And here is what Kizer sees when he turns to his pre-snap read... a TE about to cross the face of his coverage and be NFL Open.
It is not that Kizer is blameless here. I saw a couple things I did not like in this play.
- First, that he crouches so low to receive the snap. What ever chance he might have at 6'4 to glimpse the blitz coming at the snap was wiped out by crouching so low. At 5'9 Duke reacted very quickly to the 2nd blitzer, but he wasn't having to catch the snap. I need to see if this crouching is an every shotgun thing.
- Second, he is still phucking patting the ball. This is a critical 0.3 or 0.4 seconds lost and the shorter the pass, the more critical the loss. Aided by the pat the near DE almost batted down the pass. The DB definitely benefited by even the slight delay.
- Third, and this is as likely on Hue as it is on Kizer, the snap came with 1 second on the play clock. Why the big deal? If you watched the SNF game, BLT @ PTG, then you saw a critical situation late where Ben barked out a count and got the Ravens D to tip their hand. Then with 9 seconds left he adjusted his protection and the play worked. When have we ever seen Kizer with the time to do this?
So there are points to critique, but, guys, let's pick the right ones.
Oh... and it looked to me like the DB interfered with Njoku... very cleverly I might add. We all know how the Backjudge looks to see if the off arm hooks the receiver (usually around the waist) while the front arm reaches to bat down the ball? It's easy to see that back arm if it hooks. Well in this play the DB did the opposite grabbing Njoku's left arm and side with his left (front) arm, which the Backjudge could not see, while bringing his visible right arm over the top. Close play, but the grab was definitely before the ball arrived.
Thats the kind of knowledgeable analysis this board needs a sht ton more of. Id like to see ur take on that last throw....what did kizer see? Or think he saw whatever.
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Sorry, guys.... not a matter of "speed" or "locking on".
This is a designed one-step drop from the gun. That means it is a quick pass. That means you go with where your pre-snap read tells you to go unless you pick something at the snap. There is not time to survey... to go thru your progressions.
Here's the pre-snap look. Note that there's is an LB shaded to Devalve, a DB crossing over him and a Safety pointing at him. Is that your primary? Njoku is the proper read here... but things change.
Here's the look immediately following the snap. The LB is blitzing. The DB is rotating to Duke. The Safety is still pointing. If a QB sees this action he goes to his "hot read", Devalve. Kizer is looking to catch the snap... as he should be and does not see the blitz coming. The LB has timed his move well.
And here is what Kizer sees when he turns to his pre-snap read... a TE about to cross the face of his coverage and be NFL Open.
It is not that Kizer is blameless here. I saw a couple things I did not like in this play.
- First, that he crouches so low to receive the snap. What ever chance he might have at 6'4 to glimpse the blitz coming at the snap was wiped out by crouching so low. At 5'9 Duke reacted very quickly to the 2nd blitzer, but he wasn't having to catch the snap. I need to see if this crouching is an every shotgun thing.
- Second, he is still phucking patting the ball. This is a critical 0.3 or 0.4 seconds lost and the shorter the pass, the more critical the loss. Aided by the pat the near DE almost batted down the pass. The DB definitely benefited by even the slight delay.
- Third, and this is as likely on Hue as it is on Kizer, the snap came with 1 second on the play clock. Why the big deal? If you watched the SNF game, BLT @ PTG, then you saw a critical situation late where Ben barked out a count and got the Ravens D to tip their hand. Then with 9 seconds left he adjusted his protection and the play worked. When have we ever seen Kizer with the time to do this?
So there are points to critique, but, guys, let's pick the right ones.
Oh... and it looked to me like the DB interfered with Njoku... very cleverly I might add. We all know how the Backjudge looks to see if the off arm hooks the receiver (usually around the waist) while the front arm reaches to bat down the ball? It's easy to see that back arm if it hooks. Well in this play the DB did the opposite grabbing Njoku's left arm and side with his left (front) arm, which the Backjudge could not see, while bringing his visible right arm over the top. Close play, but the grab was definitely before the ball arrived.
Thats the kind of knowledgeable analysis this board needs a sht ton more of. Id like to see ur take on that last throw....what did kizer see? Or think he saw whatever.
Thats the kind of knowledgeable analysis this board needs a sht ton more of. Id like to see ur take on that last throw....what did kizer see? Or think he saw whatever.
You're not going to like the answer because I've read it on another thread but I'll let Tour answer.
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I'm not going to rag on Kizer too much, he's still a kid and the best QB on the roster. He's still a little slow finding the open receiver.
Damn! Talk about locking on your primary read. Brady hits the other totally uncovered guy for an easy first down.
Sorry, guys.... not a matter of "speed" or "locking on".
This is a designed one-step drop from the gun. That means it is a quick pass. That means you go with where your pre-snap read tells you to go unless you pick something at the snap. There is no time to survey... no time to go thru your progressions. It's a one and done play.
Here's the pre-snap look. Note that there's is an LB shaded to Devalve, a DB crossing over him and a Safety pointing at him. Is that your primary? Njoku is the proper read here... but things change.
Here's the look immediately following the snap. The LB is blitzing. The DB is rotating to Duke. The Safety is still pointing. If a QB sees this action he goes to his "hot read", Devalve. Kizer is looking to catch the snap... as he should be and does not see the blitz coming. The LB has timed his move well.
And here is what Kizer sees when he turns to his pre-snap read... a TE about to cross the face of his coverage and be NFL Open.
It is not that Kizer is blameless here. I saw a couple things I did not like in this play.
- First, that he crouches so low to receive the snap. What ever chance he might have at 6'4 to glimpse the blitz coming at the snap was wiped out by crouching so low. At 5'9 Duke reacted very quickly to the 2nd blitzer, but he wasn't having to catch the snap. I need to see if this crouching is an every shotgun thing.
- Second, he is still phucking patting the ball. This is a critical 0.3 or 0.4 seconds lost and the shorter the pass, the more critical the loss. Aided by the pat the near DE almost batted down the pass. The DB definitely benefited by even the slight delay.
- Third, and this is as likely on Hue as it is on Kizer, the snap came with 1 second on the play clock. Why the big deal? If you watched the SNF game, BLT @ PTG, then you saw a critical situation late where Ben barked out a count and got the Ravens D to tip their hand. Then with 9 seconds left he adjusted his protection and the play worked. When have we ever seen Kizer with the time to do this?
So there are points to critique, but, guys, let's pick the right ones.
Oh... and it looked to me like the DB interfered with Njoku... very cleverly I might add. We all know how the Backjudge looks to see if the off arm hooks the receiver (usually around the waist) while the front arm reaches to bat down the ball? It's easy to see that back arm if it hooks. Well in this play the DB did the opposite grabbing Njoku's left arm and side with his left (front) arm, which the Backjudge could not see, while bringing his visible right arm over the top. Close play, but the grab was definitely before the ball arrived.
Sorry, guys.... not a matter of "speed" or "locking on".
This is a designed one-step drop from the gun. That means it is a quick pass. That means you go with where your pre-snap read tells you to go unless you pick something at the snap. There is no time to survey... no time to go thru your progressions. It's a one and done play.
Here's the pre-snap look. Note that there's is an LB shaded to Devalve, a DB crossing over him and a Safety pointing at him. Is that your primary? Njoku is the proper read here... but things change.
It's the kind of play that I've seen the Seahawks run with Jimmy Graham. Now Njoku isn't on Grahams level at this point but he does fit that mold of a big, athletic, strong TE and he should be able to fend off the smaller DB. Seattle runs it a lot near the goal line and its nearly impossible to stop and this play was as well. As you say..the DB interfered with him and I still think Njoku should've caught a really well thrown ball.
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How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
The Browns set Kizer up to fail. The Process completely ignored the most important position on the roster for two seasons.
How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
Not at all.
The Process was allegedly about doing things the right way for the long term success of the Browns franchise. Nothing the Browns did concerning the QB position in these last two seasons has put them an iota closer to long term success.
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How to contradict yourself in two consecutive sentences
by Dutch Oven.
Not at all.
The Process was allegedly about doing things the right way for the long term success of the Browns franchise. Nothing the Browns did concerning the QB position in these last two seasons has put them an iota closer to long term success.
Not at all.
The Process was allegedly about doing things the right way for the long term success of the Browns franchise. Nothing the Browns did concerning the QB position in these last two seasons has put them an iota closer to long term success.
Point was we drafted Kizer. Can't do that and "completely ignore" the QB position.
Thats the kind of knowledgeable analysis this board needs a sht ton more of.
Id like to see ur take on that last throw....what did kizer see? Or think he saw whatever.
Thanks... but more than knowledge it's just stopping to look. Something posted, or I think, doesn't "ring true" and I take a look. Speaking of which... I am not sure my own characterization of "one-step drop" rings true... but nothing to look at in this case... just not sure why you'd design a one-step drop from the gun...
I think my earlier reply to which Mark refers on the last throw was that I have no clue. I only know that after the play he was gesturing as if he had spotted someone fairly deep... much deeper than the throw ended up traveling because Mathews hit his right-forearm.
That said, given that he tried to launch that ball with his feet parallel to the LOS... I have serous doubt it would have gone as far as he was trying to throw it.
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@dutch-oven said:
Pettine deserved way better than he got from this organization.
Round 1 of the 2014 Browns draft is case in point.
Wasn't he elated about Gilbert?
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@dutch-oven said:
Pettine deserved way better than he got from this organization.
Round 1 of the 2014 Browns draft is case in point.
Wasn't he elated about Gilbert?
Wasn't he elated about Gilbert?
He was a head coach who probably asked Farmer to get him a big CB, because his defensive system called for it. On paper, Farmer delivered, so Pettine was probably happy.
Then he had to coach him, and probably very quickly (and from what I recall it wasn't real hard to sense Pettine's frustration with Gilbert) realized that he was given a dud.
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I think it's time to get on the Baker Mayfield train, all aboard!
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Pettine was dealt an incredibly shitty hand with those drafts.
For sure. I liked Pet and his willingness to answer an asked question without the typical coach speak...... If only he would've taken control of that defense, he may still be here.
..... ahhhh, who am I kidding, he would still be one of many ex Browns head coaches.
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https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses/939967117339910144
You're right, Kizer's the GOAT. Hue really Shmucked him on that, I'm sure he was yelling at him through the headset or something. It's also not like he continues to make these terrible mistakes despite having almost a full season under his belt. Nah, Shmuck Hue.
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Wasn't he elated about Gilbert?
He was a head coach who probably asked Farmer to get him a big CB, because his defensive system called for it. On paper, Farmer delivered, so Pettine was probably happy.
Then he had to coach him, and probably very quickly (and from what I recall it wasn't real hard to sense Pettine's frustration with Gilbert) realized that he was given a dud.
He was a head coach who probably asked Farmer to get him a big CB, because his defensive system called for it. On paper, Farmer delivered, so Pettine was probably happy.
Then he had to coach him, and probably very quickly (and from what I recall it wasn't real hard to sense Pettine's frustration with Gilbert) realized that he was given a dud.
And then Pet asked, "Ray, can I have a Center to replace Mack?"
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
In the two games with Gordon back in the lineup, Kizer has a 93.7 passer rating when targeting Gordon and a 43.6 passer rating when targeting any other WR
During the first 11 weeks of the season, Kizer’s 68.9 passer rating when kept clean ranked dead last. However, over the past three games, Kizer's 104.8 passer rating when kept clean ranks 13th.
"When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." Paul Brown
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