Josh Allen mechanics are very good.
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That ship sailed over the edge several times. I just had to get a reverse in there. Last one.
Fair enough... I've more than participated myself.
Now we just need to work on Ag...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I also do not "get" the Allen-Wentz comparisons. Despite very similar ht/wt measurements, Wentz looks much thicker to me.
Carson also came off more confident... more comfortable "in his skin" back during his Sr Bowl Week than I see Allen looking. I think this may be where teams start downgrading Allen this and Combine Week.
Back to throwing... NfL Live did a live cut in to their Sr. Bowl coverage on ESPNU (I did not know they were covering the week "live"). Here's the gist of a couple observations on Allen:
- Polian: "He looks better."
- McShay: "He's showing more touch. Everything on tape is "fastballs". He seems to be learning that he does not need to do so."
- Riddick: "Have you noticed how much better he throws the out-routes than anything inside?" Everyone: "Yes."
What I saw in Allen's Day 2 work.
- The more players that there were on the field, the worse Allen performed. The above cut in was during WR "vs air" drills. Yesterday as DBs were added thru 7-on-7 and then full squad work Allen's "touch" evaporated. To my eye he recognizes "open" late and then tries to make up time with his arm-strength.
- On one throw during the full squad session Allen did something I've never seen a QB do... as he threw he bent at his wait to his left side. It was freaking weird. There was a little DL pressure which he sidestepped left. He reset well, but then inexplicably brought his frontfoot back and "in the bucket" to his left, and then bent to the left producing some kind of weird "over-the-top-3/4-sidearm" throw. The throw sailed high and behind an open WR running a 15-yd out. I'm not feeling a lot of "cool under pressure" in his game.
- I'm not feeling a lot of "cool under pressure" in his game.
There it is in a nutshell. Exactly what I observed in watching 4 complete games of his this past season. Usually he goes "rabbit" when that happens or throws way too high. Kizer II.
EDIT: Here's the thing. I lived in Cheyenne for 5+ years and there is nothing more I would like to see than one of the Cowboys do well. But he just is not NFL caliber. I wish he was.
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- I'm not feeling a lot of "cool under pressure" in his game.
There it is in a nutshell. Exactly what I observed in watching 4 complete games of his this past season. Usually he goes "rabbit" when that happens or throws way too high. Kizer II.
EDIT: Here's the thing. I lived in Cheyenne for 5+ years and there is nothing more I would like to see than one of the Cowboys do well. But he just is not NFL caliber. I wish he was.
There it is in a nutshell. Exactly what I observed in watching 4 complete games of his this past season. Usually he goes "rabbit" when that happens or throws way too high. Kizer II.
EDIT: Here's the thing. I lived in Cheyenne for 5+ years and there is nothing more I would like to see than one of the Cowboys do well. But he just is not NFL caliber. I wish he was.
Ditto that here Ag. Consider Wyoming one of my favorite states to visit. Been on U Wyoming's campus several times. Climbed Medicine Bow Peak twice, a couple of the Tetons, and about 7 in the Wind River Range (including Gannett, ah the allure of the Highpointers Club). Cal can rag on me all he wants- like you, nothing better I'd like to see than one of the Cowboys do well in the NFL. But like you- I'm just not seeing it in Josh....
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Some yuppies never planted a seed and watched it grow into a beautiful plant. Why,you take a beet seed. It isn't pretty. Rolls around a bit crooked in yer hand. Some yuppies, why, they be figurin' to figure that that beet seed ain't gonna amount to nothin. But you take that beet side, put it in some good dirt, a little water, a touch of fertilizer, and you just watch that little seed turn into somethin beautiful.
Now, lookee here. You got yer gold beets, yer red beets, yer striped beets. You don't know by lookin what you can be agrowinwhen you draft a smart future star, and add a little great coachin, surround him with great fellow players, and he grows into a great qb. Now, he may be a red..skins qb. Or, he could be a gold qb. Now, he ain't never agonna be no sickly stinkin three rivers scum yeller, or he'll be just be a cowpie follerin some gal into a bathroom, know what I'm sayin?
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
-
Some yuppies never planted a seed and watched it grow into a beautiful plant. Why,you take a beet seed. It isn't pretty. Rolls around a bit crooked in yer hand. Some yuppies, why, they be figurin' to figure that that beet seed ain't gonna amount to nothin. But you take that beet side, put it in some good dirt, a little water, a touch of fertilizer, and you just watch that little seed turn into somethin beautiful.
Now, lookee here. You got yer gold beets, yer red beets, yer striped beets. You don't know by lookin what you can be agrowinwhen you draft a smart future star, and add a little great coachin, surround him with great fellow players, and he grows into a great qb. Now, he may be a red..skins qb. Or, he could be a gold qb. Now, he ain't never agonna be no sickly stinkin three rivers scum yeller, or he'll be just be a cowpie follerin some gal into a bathroom, know what I'm sayin?
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
Some yuppies never planted a seed and watched it grow into a beautiful plant. Why,you take a beet seed. It isn't pretty. Rolls around a bit crooked in yer hand. Some yuppies, why, they be figurin' to figure that that beet seed ain't gonna amount to nothin. But you take that beet side, put it in some good dirt, a little water, a touch of fertilizer, and you just watch that little seed turn into somethin beautiful.
Now, lookee here. You got yer gold beets, yer red beets, yer striped beets. You don't know by lookin what you can be agrowinwhen you draft a smart future star, and add a little great coachin, surround him with great fellow players, and he grows into a great qb. Now, he may be a red..skins qb. Or, he could be a gold qb. Now, he ain't never agonna be no sickly stinkin three rivers scum yeller, or he'll be just be a cowpie follerin some gal into a bathroom, know what I'm sayin?
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
Are you sure you're not eating some other kind of seed cal? It's legal south of the Wyoming border now you know.
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All I know is if you hand me a beet or a beet seed it's getting thrown the Shmuck back at you.
-
Some yuppies never planted a seed and watched it grow into a beautiful plant. Why,you take a beet seed. It isn't pretty. Rolls around a bit crooked in yer hand. Some yuppies, why, they be figurin' to figure that that beet seed ain't gonna amount to nothin. But you take that beet side, put it in some good dirt, a little water, a touch of fertilizer, and you just watch that little seed turn into somethin beautiful.
Now, lookee here. You got yer gold beets, yer red beets, yer striped beets. You don't know by lookin what you can be agrowinwhen you draft a smart future star, and add a little great coachin, surround him with great fellow players, and he grows into a great qb. Now, he may be a red..skins qb. Or, he could be a gold qb. Now, he ain't never agonna be no sickly stinkin three rivers scum yeller, or he'll be just be a cowpie follerin some gal into a bathroom, know what I'm sayin?
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
Some yuppies never planted a seed and watched it grow into a beautiful plant. Why,you take a beet seed. It isn't pretty. Rolls around a bit crooked in yer hand. Some yuppies, why, they be figurin' to figure that that beet seed ain't gonna amount to nothin. But you take that beet side, put it in some good dirt, a little water, a touch of fertilizer, and you just watch that little seed turn into somethin beautiful.
Now, lookee here. You got yer gold beets, yer red beets, yer striped beets. You don't know by lookin what you can be agrowinwhen you draft a smart future star, and add a little great coachin, surround him with great fellow players, and he grows into a great qb. Now, he may be a red..skins qb. Or, he could be a gold qb. Now, he ain't never agonna be no sickly stinkin three rivers scum yeller, or he'll be just be a cowpie follerin some gal into a bathroom, know what I'm sayin?
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
I don't like beets.
Plus, some seeds never germinate
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Beets are garbage.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
I also do not "get" the Allen-Wentz comparisons. Despite very similar ht/wt measurements, Wentz looks much thicker to me.
Carson also came off more confident... more comfortable "in his skin" back during his Sr Bowl Week than I see Allen looking. I think this may be where teams start downgrading Allen this and Combine Week.
Back to throwing... NfL Live did a live cut in to their Sr. Bowl coverage on ESPNU (I did not know they were covering the week "live"). Here's the gist of a couple observations on Allen:
- Polian: "He looks better."
- McShay: "He's showing more touch. Everything on tape is "fastballs". He seems to be learning that he does not need to do so."
- Riddick: "Have you noticed how much better he throws the out-routes than anything inside?" Everyone: "Yes."
What I saw in Allen's Day 2 work.
- The more players that there were on the field, the worse Allen performed. The above cut in was during WR "vs air" drills. Yesterday as DBs were added thru 7-on-7 and then full squad work Allen's "touch" evaporated. To my eye he recognizes "open" late and then tries to make up time with his arm-strength.
- On one throw during the full squad session Allen did something I've never seen a QB do... as he threw he bent at his wait to his left side. It was freaking weird. There was a little DL pressure which he sidestepped left. He reset well, but then inexplicably brought his frontfoot back and "in the bucket" to his left, and then bent to the left producing some kind of weird "over-the-top-3/4-sidearm" throw. The throw sailed high and behind an open WR running a 15-yd out. I'm not feeling a lot of "cool under pressure" in his game.
- On one throw during the full squad session Allen did something I've never seen a QB do... as he threw he bent at his wait to his left side. It was freaking weird. There was a little DL pressure which he sidestepped left. He reset well, but then inexplicably brought his frontfoot back and "in the bucket" to his left, and then bent to the left producing some kind of weird "over-the-top-3/4-sidearm" throw. The throw sailed high and behind an open WR running a 15-yd out. I'm not feeling a lot of "cool under pressure" in his game.
Sounds Weeden-ish.
-
Beets are garbage.
Beets are garbage.
I like beets.
-
Some yuppies never planted a seed and watched it grow into a beautiful plant. Why,you take a beet seed. It isn't pretty. Rolls around a bit crooked in yer hand. Some yuppies, why, they be figurin' to figure that that beet seed ain't gonna amount to nothin. But you take that beet side, put it in some good dirt, a little water, a touch of fertilizer, and you just watch that little seed turn into somethin beautiful.
Now, lookee here. You got yer gold beets, yer red beets, yer striped beets. You don't know by lookin what you can be agrowinwhen you draft a smart future star, and add a little great coachin, surround him with great fellow players, and he grows into a great qb. Now, he may be a red..skins qb. Or, he could be a gold qb. Now, he ain't never agonna be no sickly stinkin three rivers scum yeller, or he'll be just be a cowpie follerin some gal into a bathroom, know what I'm sayin?
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
You don't take a seed (project QB) with the first overall pick in the draft. That player needs to be a star from day one. If we have someone better who can start for a few weeks, that's fine but that first overall pick better be ready to go quickly.
-
You just gotta see the beet in the future. Some can't do nothin but see the seed. The rest of us - we see the full growed beet. Now, you just gotta have a good seed to grow. You gotta have that qb that you figure will grow. Ain't no qb gonna grow into a right fine qb in the NFL, if'n he ain't got the vision to see the field, and at least enough character to stay on it.
End of story, fellers. Some of us see what he can be after he grows into an NFL qb; some can only see the seed. That's pretty much all thar is to it.
You don't take a seed (project QB) with the first overall pick in the draft. That player needs to be a star from day one. If we have someone better who can start for a few weeks, that's fine but that first overall pick better be ready to go quickly.
You don't take a seed (project QB) with the first overall pick in the draft. That player needs to be a star from day one. If we have someone better who can start for a few weeks, that's fine but that first overall pick better be ready to go quickly.
DraftScouts.com.....which, for some reason Tour thinks is invalid...probably because they disagree with him somewhat, have Allen rated as a late 3rd, early 4th round talent. The other 5.....Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph are all rated as 1st round or early 2d round talents.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospect-rankings/quarterbacks/
But, in their Mock...they do have Allen being taken 15th.
(Browns take Darnold #1, Rosen #2 to Giants.....and they have Rudolph going #29 to the Steelers)
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You don't take a seed (project QB) with the first overall pick in the draft. That player needs to be a star from day one. If we have someone better who can start for a few weeks, that's fine but that first overall pick better be ready to go quickly.
DraftScouts.com.....which, for some reason Tour thinks is invalid...probably because they disagree with him somewhat, have Allen rated as a late 3rd, early 4th round talent. The other 5.....Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph are all rated as 1st round or early 2d round talents.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospect-rankings/quarterbacks/
But, in their Mock...they do have Allen being taken 15th.
(Browns take Darnold #1, Rosen #2 to Giants.....and they have Rudolph going #29 to the Steelers)
DraftScouts.com.....which, for some reason Tour thinks is invalid...probably because they disagree with him somewhat, have Allen rated as a late 3rd, early 4th round talent. The other 5.....Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph are all rated as 1st round or early 2d round talents.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospect-rankings/quarterbacks/
But, in their Mock...they do have Allen being taken 15th.
That's because to quote Brian Billick "need is a terrible evaluator of a quarterback". A team that needs one will reach for a project like Allen. Just like the Browns did with Weeden, Quinn, Manziel, etc etc etc.
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DraftScouts.com.....which, for some reason Tour thinks is invalid...probably because they disagree with him somewhat, have Allen rated as a late 3rd, early 4th round talent. The other 5.....Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph are all rated as 1st round or early 2d round talents.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospect-rankings/quarterbacks/
But, in their Mock...they do have Allen being taken 15th.
That's because to quote Brian Billick "need is a terrible evaluator of a quarterback". A team that needs one will reach for a project like Allen. Just like the Browns did with Weeden, Quinn, Manziel, etc etc etc.
That's because to quote Brian Billick "need is a terrible evaluator of a quarterback". A team that needs one will reach for a project like Allen. Just like the Browns did with Weeden, Quinn, Manziel, etc etc etc.
And...in theory.....per that Draftscout report..they go along with what you say. NONE or only 1 of those QBs is actually Top Ten Talent. So....by their estimation, apparently....any QB taken above the 10 pick can likely be considered overdrafting.....for need. Per them....we should be taking the likes of Chubb, Derwin James, Fitzpatrick, Roquon Smith...even Barkley...rather than a QB at either 1 or 4.
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That's because to quote Brian Billick "need is a terrible evaluator of a quarterback". A team that needs one will reach for a project like Allen. Just like the Browns did with Weeden, Quinn, Manziel, etc etc etc.
And...in theory.....per that Draftscout report..they go along with what you say. NONE or only 1 of those QBs is actually Top Ten Talent. So....by their estimation, apparently....any QB taken above the 10 pick can likely be considered overdrafting.....for need. Per them....we should be taking the likes of Chubb, Derwin James, Fitzpatrick, Roquon Smith...even Barkley...rather than a QB at either 1 or 4.
And...in theory.....per that Draftscout report..they go along with what you say. NONE or only 1 of those QBs is actually Top Ten Talent. So....by their estimation, apparently....any QB taken above the 10 pick can likely be considered overdrafting.....for need. Per them....we should be taking the likes of Chubb, Derwin James, Fitzpatrick, Roquon Smith...even Barkley...rather than a QB at either 1 or 4.
True Gip, the players mentioned may be better prospects at their positions than the QBs, but no position affects the game more than the QB. It's why they're always over drafted. I won't bother to look it up, but I'd bet both Trubisky and Mahomes would be considered huge reaches based on their Draftscout rankings last year.
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And...in theory.....per that Draftscout report..they go along with what you say. NONE or only 1 of those QBs is actually Top Ten Talent. So....by their estimation, apparently....any QB taken above the 10 pick can likely be considered overdrafting.....for need. Per them....we should be taking the likes of Chubb, Derwin James, Fitzpatrick, Roquon Smith...even Barkley...rather than a QB at either 1 or 4.
True Gip, the players mentioned may be better prospects at their positions than the QBs, but no position affects the game more than the QB. It's why they're always over drafted. I won't bother to look it up, but I'd bet both Trubisky and Mahomes would be considered huge reaches based on their Draftscout rankings last year.
True Gip, the players mentioned may be better prospects at their positions than the QBs, but no position affects the game more than the QB. It's why they're always over drafted. I won't bother to look it up, but I'd bet both Trubisky and Mahomes would be considered huge reaches based on their Draftscout rankings last year.
Can't seem to find where he was as overall prospect....but MT was rated the #1 QB by them.
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You don't take a seed (project QB) with the first overall pick in the draft. That player needs to be a star from day one. If we have someone better who can start for a few weeks, that's fine but that first overall pick better be ready to go quickly.
DraftScouts.com.....which, for some reason Tour thinks is invalid...probably because they disagree with him somewhat, have Allen rated as a late 3rd, early 4th round talent. The other 5.....Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Jackson, Rudolph are all rated as 1st round or early 2d round talents.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospect-rankings/quarterbacks/
But, in their Mock...they do have Allen being taken 15th.
(Browns take Darnold #1, Rosen #2 to Giants.....and they have Rudolph going #29 to the Steelers)
- Did cal just play the "hick card?"
- And, h, Jackson Hole is one of the favorite places I've ever visited... absolutely gorgeous.
DraftScouts.com.....which, for some reason Tour thinks is invalid...probably because they disagree with him somewhat...
lol... makes a false comment about my view of DraftScout and then posts a link to CBS.
Try to keep up...
CBS has historically been "powered by DraftScout" (ring a bell?) apparently no longer is... at least it's not to this point.
For the record and comparison here is a link to the DraftScout "Top 750" where QBs hold two of the top three spots and three of the top eight.
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/members/ratings/top750.php?draftyear=2018&sortby=rateall&order=ASC
Do the lists look to be interchangeable? Which more closer resembles the other major lists that have been published?
And...in theory.....per that Draftscout report..they go along with what you say. NONE or only 1 of those QBs is actually Top Ten Talent. So....by their estimation, apparently....any QB taken above the 10 pick can likely be considered overdrafting.....for need. Per them....we should be taking the likes of Chubb, Derwin James, Fitzpatrick, Roquon Smith...even Barkley...rather than a QB at either 1 or 4.
Ignorant is the only word for this post. Rankings... even when attributed to the correct source... are never as rigid as 1-2-3. Teams cluster players of similar talent levels and then assuming there are no "red flags" they let need, fit, and positional importance break ties.
Only question is how willful is the ignorance on display.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Saw the 7 on 7 INT and it was.... not good. The trend with Allen is that when he misses (and he does so quite often) he misses high. That just gives far too many opportunities for world class athletes to get their hands on the ball.
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ol... makes a false comment about my view of DraftScout and then posts a link to CBS.
Try to keep up...
CBS has historically been "powered by DraftScout" (ring a bell?) apparently no longer is... at least it's not to this point.
Well...if I got false information.....then I got it from you. You disparaged DraftScout on more than one occasion.
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And...in theory.....per that Draftscout report..they go along with what you say. NONE or only 1 of those QBs is actually Top Ten Talent. So....by their estimation, apparently....any QB taken above the 10 pick can likely be considered overdrafting.....for need. Per them....we should be taking the likes of Chubb, Derwin James, Fitzpatrick, Roquon Smith...even Barkley...rather than a QB at either 1 or 4.
Ignorant is the only word for this post. Rankings... even when attributed to the correct source... are never as rigid as 1-2-3. Teams cluster players of similar talent levels and then assuming there are no "red flags" they let need, fit, and positional importance break ties.
Only question is how willful is the ignorance on display.
The only thing ignorant is your ignorant...useless, wrong reply. I stated an factual theory: IF a scouting source..no matter who it is....has no QB rated nearly as good as other position players.....then, IN THEORY, if several QBs are taken over those more highly rated other position players...then it CAN be stated that those QBs were overdrafted.
This is really a pretty simple theory....Not sure why you cannot discern it as it not particularly nuanced. And the fact that "position importance" is in there is obvious....QBs are by far given preference because of positional importance. That is central to the theory.
FACT: CBS (you can go flog your pecker over whether they are tied in with Draft Scouts or not)....had 9 players rated better than ANY QB.
IF in fact 2-3-4 QBs are drafted in like the Top 5....The are being overdrafted. Other, better rated players (by that particular scouting service) are being bypassed in order to draft a QB.
Again....your only apparent objection seems to be that you disagree with the rankings of particular scouting service. But, you have to remember, that you....Tour2ma...are not a part of the fuycking equation...no matter how much you want to insert yourself into it.
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