2018 QB Class
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Having a good college completion percentage does not guarantee success in the NFL. But having a bad one in college is a surefire guarantee that you will fail in the pros. Completion percentage doesn't tend to go up when the windows get smaller.
Brady, Brees and Farve all improved. All will be 1st ballot HOFers.
Yeah, but Im comparing Josh Allen to the best. Yup, exactly!
Brady, Brees and Farve all improved. All will be 1st ballot HOFers.
Yeah, but Im comparing Josh Allen to the best. Yup, exactly!
They did the same with Jamarcus Russell.
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What goes around, comes around. God Bless Ya !
I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
What goes around, comes around. God Bless Ya !
I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
This is what I don't understand. It's not like we didn't just watch an entire season of Josh Kizer...I mean Deshone Allen....no..I mean..whatever...they're the same guy with the same inaccuracy issues. One is white...one is black. I'm sure they're both extremely nice guys and will work hard and try really hard and want to be the QB that turns around the Browns franchise. But neither one of them is good enough to do it.
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I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
This is what I don't understand. It's not like we didn't just watch an entire season of Josh Kizer...I mean Deshone Allen....no..I mean..whatever...they're the same guy with the same inaccuracy issues. One is white...one is black. I'm sure they're both extremely nice guys and will work hard and try really hard and want to be the QB that turns around the Browns franchise. But neither one of them is good enough to do it.
This is what I don't understand. It's not like we didn't just watch an entire season of Josh Kizer...I mean Deshone Allen....no..I mean..whatever...they're the same guy with the same inaccuracy issues. One is white...one is black. I'm sure they're both extremely nice guys and will work hard and try really hard and want to be the QB that turns around the Browns franchise. But neither one of them is good enough to do it.
And Kizer was taken with, what, the 52nd overall pick? There's people on this board that are suggesting the Browns use the #1 or #4 overall pick on a project like Allen.
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What goes around, comes around. God Bless Ya !
I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
That's dumb. Kizer doesn't love the game, has no fire and only looks at one third of the field, on every play. It's all he can do. He has serious limitations that I don't see with Allen. I never once said he was a finished product. Aaron Rodgers wasn't a finished product. Your and hoorta's josh rosenbum isn't a top three - despite his glowing stats. He's a prick who doesn't fit the lockerroom or the community. And your Darnold guy - all those fumbles? how the heck hard is it to teach fundamentals to him? and the throwing motion - I've seen better throwing motions by shot putters.
I'm actually wondering - I watched the State Farm college all-star competition, and rosenbum won the accuracy contest by two seconds. But on the long moving throws, he completely missed the target once, and hit the very bottom of the other one.
Mike White hit both - nailed both of them - hit the bullseye flat out on one. His two years at W. Kentucky - he had the very high completion percentages, very strong arm, can also run. He's 6'4", 225 .....I don't see the great advantage of Mayfield over White - I wouldn't blame the Browns if they trade out of that top pick, draft Minkah, and later draft an immediate starter/dramatic impact player (not a qb), and draft Mike White with their first pick in the second round. White is really, really impressive.
after the combine, I won't be too surprised if he was gone in the late first round.
If all you can do is talk about Kizer, you are missing the boat. Have a nice daisies.
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Having a good college completion percentage does not guarantee success in the NFL. But having a bad one in college is a surefire guarantee that you will fail in the pros. Completion percentage doesn't tend to go up when the windows get smaller.
Brady, Brees and Farve all improved. All will be 1st ballot HOFers.
Yeah, but Im comparing Josh Allen to the best. Yup, exactly!
Brady, Brees and Farve all improved. All will be 1st ballot HOFers.
Yeah, but Im comparing Josh Allen to the best. Yup, exactly!
So you are comparing Allen to the exceptions and not the vast majority who wash out because their accuracy in college blows?
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I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
That's dumb. Kizer doesn't love the game, has no fire and only looks at one third of the field, on every play. It's all he can do. He has serious limitations that I don't see with Allen. I never once said he was a finished product. Aaron Rodgers wasn't a finished product. Your and hoorta's josh rosenbum isn't a top three - despite his glowing stats. He's a prick who doesn't fit the lockerroom or the community. And your Darnold guy - all those fumbles? how the heck hard is it to teach fundamentals to him? and the throwing motion - I've seen better throwing motions by shot putters.
I'm actually wondering - I watched the State Farm college all-star competition, and rosenbum won the accuracy contest by two seconds. But on the long moving throws, he completely missed the target once, and hit the very bottom of the other one.
Mike White hit both - nailed both of them - hit the bullseye flat out on one. His two years at W. Kentucky - he had the very high completion percentages, very strong arm, can also run. He's 6'4", 225 .....I don't see the great advantage of Mayfield over White - I wouldn't blame the Browns if they trade out of that top pick, draft Minkah, and later draft an immediate starter/dramatic impact player (not a qb), and draft Mike White with their first pick in the second round. White is really, really impressive.
after the combine, I won't be too surprised if he was gone in the late first round.
If all you can do is talk about Kizer, you are missing the boat. Have a nice daisies.
That's dumb. Kizer doesn't love the game, has no fire and only looks at one third of the field, on every play. It's all he can do. He has serious limitations that I don't see with Allen.
You have zero basis to say that about Kizer, unless you've been breaking down all-22 film. NO clue either that he doesn't love the game. A good percentage of us guys think Allen is plenty limited too.
I never once said he was a finished product. Aaron Rodgers wasn't a finished product. Your and hoorta's josh rosenbum isn't a top three - despite his glowing stats. He's a prick who doesn't fit the lockerroom or the community.
I haven't had Rosen as my #1 in quite a while, short attention span. Too bad you think Rosen has character issues, I'm more worried about his durability. As to a "finished product" why should we take a raw project like Allen high in the draft? Because he just might, maybe improve his accuracy 10 points higher?
And your Darnold guy - all those fumbles? how the heck hard is it to teach fundamentals to him? and the throwing motion - I've seen better throwing motions by shot putters.
Ball security is more easily taught than accuracy.
I'm actually wondering - I watched the State Farm college all-star competition, and rosenbum won the accuracy contest by two seconds. But on the long moving throws, he completely missed the target once, and hit the very bottom of the other one.
Mike White hit both - nailed both of them - hit the bullseye flat out on one. His two years at W. Kentucky - he had the very high completion percentages, very strong arm, can also run. He's 6'4", 225 .....I don't see the great advantage of Mayfield over White - I wouldn't blame the Browns if they trade out of that top pick, draft Minkah, and later draft an immediate starter/dramatic impact player (not a qb), and draft Mike White with their first pick in the second round. White is really, really impressive.
Then I suggest an appointment with your eye doctor. 90%+ probability the Browns are drafting a QB at #1, and it won't be Mike White.
after the combine, I won't be too surprised if he was gone in the late first round.
If all you can do is talk about Kizer, you are missing the boat. Have a nice daisies.
Seems all you want to do is talk how great a prospect Allen is. Now you think Mike White is a great prospect? Remember a guy called "Trick Shot" Tanney?
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again, Mike White was more accurate than your rosenbum in that all star competition. Do you know who Dorsey is,
one who can't handle the truth?
Report: WKU's Mike White 'a favorite' of John Dorsey - CBSSports.com
Jan 22, 2018 - Western Kentucky quarterback Mike White (6-foot-4, 225) is a favorite of Cleveland Browns General Manager John Dorsey according to DraftAnalyst.com. "After breaking down the WKU film this past weekend, I was incredibly impressed by White's poise, patience, accuracy and overall awareness. I'm told .
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truth is, I believe the Browns may draft Mayfield at one, and forget paying gigantic salaries to a veteran, unless
McCarron is a fa. Allen will need a year at least before he starts. I honestly think Mayfield has so much "IT" factor, he
could actually start his first year.
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truth is, I believe the Browns may draft Mayfield at one, and forget paying gigantic salaries to a veteran, unless
McCarron is a fa. Allen will need a year at least before he starts. I honestly think Mayfield has so much "IT" factor, he
could actually start his first year.
truth is, I believe the Browns may draft Mayfield at one, and forget paying gigantic salaries to a veteran, unless
McCarron is a fa. Allen will need a year at least before he starts. I honestly think Mayfield has so much "IT" factor, he
could actually start his first year.
With the so called "competition" he will face from our current QB room, you could start for the Browns cal.
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I said I didn't think Josh Allen is a top 3 QB - still don't.
If you want a QB that is over 6'4" that can also run, that has a strong arm but isn't accurate - we already have that guy (DeShone Kizer). And he wasn't drafted within the 1st 4 picks of the draft. That said, he threw a lot more than 16 TD passes against better corners in his last year of college football.
That's dumb. Kizer doesn't love the game, has no fire and only looks at one third of the field, on every play. It's all he can do. He has serious limitations that I don't see with Allen. I never once said he was a finished product. Aaron Rodgers wasn't a finished product. Your and hoorta's josh rosenbum isn't a top three - despite his glowing stats. He's a prick who doesn't fit the lockerroom or the community. And your Darnold guy - all those fumbles? how the heck hard is it to teach fundamentals to him? and the throwing motion - I've seen better throwing motions by shot putters.
I'm actually wondering - I watched the State Farm college all-star competition, and rosenbum won the accuracy contest by two seconds. But on the long moving throws, he completely missed the target once, and hit the very bottom of the other one.
Mike White hit both - nailed both of them - hit the bullseye flat out on one. His two years at W. Kentucky - he had the very high completion percentages, very strong arm, can also run. He's 6'4", 225 .....I don't see the great advantage of Mayfield over White - I wouldn't blame the Browns if they trade out of that top pick, draft Minkah, and later draft an immediate starter/dramatic impact player (not a qb), and draft Mike White with their first pick in the second round. White is really, really impressive.
after the combine, I won't be too surprised if he was gone in the late first round.
If all you can do is talk about Kizer, you are missing the boat. Have a nice daisies.
If all you can do is talk about Kizer, you are missing the boat. Have a nice daisies.
It really slam dunks how little of him you've seen. I already posted his 6 games against the bigger DI schools on his schedule and he didn't throw more than 1 TD pass in any of them and usually had just as many or more INTs while his completion % left a lot to be desired. Here's 3 of those bigger DI schools Allen faced again and pay particular attention to TD:INT ratio, comp % and how well Allen kept up with the scoring pace:
Iowa 24 Wyoming 3 23 of 40 174 yds 0 TD 2 INT
Oregon 49 Wyoming 13 9 of 24 64 yds 0 TD 1 INT
Boise State 24 Wyoming 14 12 of 27 131 yds 1 TD 2 INT
In comparison, Darnold BEAT the Big 10 Champions as a Freshman and he won the Pac 12 Championship as a soph. No wonder why you hate him too now. Yeah, there's correctable flaws but no show stoppers.
Allen performed exactly like Kizer except Kizer threw more TDs against that kind of competition as a soph and junior. I've never seen Kizer as a kid that didn't LOVE the game. I've seen Kizer as a QB in over his head where his multiple mistakes didn't give him the chance to show us he's LOVING the results and REALLY excited. When his coach says he put an impressive amount of time in the film room preparing for games - I don't question his LOVE for the game nearly as much as his talent. When he DID make plays - he looked very excited about it. Your faves aren't the guys that LOVE football. There's nothing slam dunking top 3 QB prospect in only 16 TDs in 1 season against junior varsity corners.
You did all the same things with Charlie Frye that you're doing with Josh Allen. We got all of the he's a TERRIFIC KID that LOVES football stuff you could post. He was the perfect QB you invented in your mind like you're doing this year. In the end, he didn't have it.
And what's with your need to assign everybody as Rosen fans? People know my faves are Mayfield and Darnold. Hoorta likes Mayfield too - and you know that. The majority of draft analysts, not to be confused with Mary Kay Cabot, seem to have Rosen rated within the top 3 QBs of this draft. Mayfield, Darnold and Rosen are the types of QBs a team will trade up for at #3 or #4 in lieu of a QB with consistency and accuracy issues. While we're at it, how many QBs that had consistency and accuracy issues in college showed up, found the NFL way easier and performed way better than they did in college?
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If all you can do is talk about Kizer, you are missing the boat. Have a nice daisies.
It really slam dunks how little of him you've seen. I already posted his 6 games against the bigger DI schools on his schedule and he didn't throw more than 1 TD pass in any of them and usually had just as many or more INTs while his completion % left a lot to be desired. Here's 3 of those bigger DI schools Allen faced again and pay particular attention to TD:INT ratio, comp % and how well Allen kept up with the scoring pace:
Iowa 24 Wyoming 3 23 of 40 174 yds 0 TD 2 INT
Oregon 49 Wyoming 13 9 of 24 64 yds 0 TD 1 INT
Boise State 24 Wyoming 14 12 of 27 131 yds 1 TD 2 INT
In comparison, Darnold BEAT the Big 10 Champions as a Freshman and he won the Pac 12 Championship as a soph. No wonder why you hate him too now. Yeah, there's correctable flaws but no show stoppers.
Allen performed exactly like Kizer except Kizer threw more TDs against that kind of competition as a soph and junior. I've never seen Kizer as a kid that didn't LOVE the game. I've seen Kizer as a QB in over his head where his multiple mistakes didn't give him the chance to show us he's LOVING the results and REALLY excited. When his coach says he put an impressive amount of time in the film room preparing for games - I don't question his LOVE for the game nearly as much as his talent. When he DID make plays - he looked very excited about it. Your faves aren't the guys that LOVE football. There's nothing slam dunking top 3 QB prospect in only 16 TDs in 1 season against junior varsity corners.
You did all the same things with Charlie Frye that you're doing with Josh Allen. We got all of the he's a TERRIFIC KID that LOVES football stuff you could post. He was the perfect QB you invented in your mind like you're doing this year. In the end, he didn't have it.
And what's with your need to assign everybody as Rosen fans? People know my faves are Mayfield and Darnold. Hoorta likes Mayfield too - and you know that. The majority of draft analysts, not to be confused with Mary Kay Cabot, seem to have Rosen rated within the top 3 QBs of this draft. Mayfield, Darnold and Rosen are the types of QBs a team will trade up for at #3 or #4 in lieu of a QB with consistency and accuracy issues. While we're at it, how many QBs that had consistency and accuracy issues in college showed up, found the NFL way easier and performed way better than they did in college?
While we're at it, how many QBs that had consistency and accuracy issues in college showed up, found the NFL way easier and performed way better than they did in college?
Intelligent questions are not allowed. You have likely earned yourself a valuable nickname now you Rosey f'r.
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Brady, Brees and Farve all improved. All will be 1st ballot HOFers.
Yeah, but Im comparing Josh Allen to the best. Yup, exactly!
So you are comparing Allen to the exceptions and not the vast majority who wash out because their accuracy in college blows?
So you are comparing Allen to the exceptions and not the vast majority who wash out because their accuracy in college blows?
Why cant Allen be the exception?
He is not Kizer. Allen was forced to run in what people call a pro style offense at Wyoming. NFL offenses dont want the QB to expose themselves to hits like a RB. A RBs lifespan is short in the NFL Vick, RG3 and others tried bucking the trend and you saw the result. Allen is by no means a finished product and needs work. You dont want a guy who goes from starting in college to staring in the pros day 1 anyway. Thats a trainwreck waiting to happen.
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So you are comparing Allen to the exceptions and not the vast majority who wash out because their accuracy in college blows?
Why cant Allen be the exception?
He is not Kizer. Allen was forced to run in what people call a pro style offense at Wyoming. NFL offenses dont want the QB to expose themselves to hits like a RB. A RBs lifespan is short in the NFL Vick, RG3 and others tried bucking the trend and you saw the result. Allen is by no means a finished product and needs work. You dont want a guy who goes from starting in college to staring in the pros day 1 anyway. Thats a trainwreck waiting to happen.
Why cant Allen be the exception?
That's not really the type of decision process you want to risk a struggling franchise on.
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Why cant Allen be the exception?
That's not really the type of decision process you want to risk a struggling franchise on.
That's not really the type of decision process you want to risk a struggling franchise on.
This is assuming you land Cousins, draft Barkley and develop Allen.
The Browns are instantly relevant in the AFCN.
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This is assuming you land Cousins, draft Barkley and develop Allen.
The Browns are instantly relevant in the AFCN.
Even slightly above average QB play makes this team relevant. But the instantly part will have nothing to do with Allen... and most likely Barkley as well.
I don't understand the obsession with this kid other than his size. Just watching him side by side with other QB's and his senior bowl stuff is pretty telling.
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well, as I've said before - everything that can be said, HAS been said about all this qb draft stuff. The Browns need to start winning now, so it seems that Mayfield has the magic in him to start far faster than the others. It could be Mayfield, and whoever else the second pick would be - I keep thinking it's Minkah - but FA.... suppose they sign Tremaine Johnson, fa, cb? That would shake up the draft a bit.
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well, as I've said before - everything that can be said, HAS been said about all this qb draft stuff. The Browns need to start winning now, so it seems that Mayfield has the magic in him to start far faster than the others. It could be Mayfield, and whoever else the second pick would be - I keep thinking it's Minkah - but FA.... suppose they sign Tremaine Johnson, fa, cb? That would shake up the draft a bit.
well, as I've said before - everything that can be said, HAS been said about all this qb draft stuff. The Browns need to start winning now, so it seems that Mayfield has the magic in him to start far faster than the others. It could be Mayfield, and whoever else the second pick would be - I keep thinking it's Minkah - but FA.... suppose they sign Tremaine Johnson, fa, cb? That would shake up the draft a bit.
No, what the Browns need to do is build a solid and young foundation for sustained success.
Quite literally the "win now, excite the fanbase, sell tickets RAH RAH RAH" is EXACTLY why we ended up with Johnny HateCrime.
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So you are comparing Allen to the exceptions and not the vast majority who wash out because their accuracy in college blows?
Why cant Allen be the exception?
He is not Kizer. Allen was forced to run in what people call a pro style offense at Wyoming. NFL offenses dont want the QB to expose themselves to hits like a RB. A RBs lifespan is short in the NFL Vick, RG3 and others tried bucking the trend and you saw the result. Allen is by no means a finished product and needs work. You dont want a guy who goes from starting in college to staring in the pros day 1 anyway. Thats a trainwreck waiting to happen.
Why cant Allen be the exception?
He is not Kizer. Allen was forced to run in what people call a pro style offense at Wyoming. NFL offenses dont want the QB to expose themselves to hits like a RB. A RBs lifespan is short in the NFL Vick, RG3 and others tried bucking the trend and you saw the result. Allen is by no means a finished product and needs work. You dont want a guy who goes from starting in college to staring in the pros day 1 anyway. Thats a trainwreck waiting to happen.
Agreed. Allen could be the exception, just like Mayfield could (and I think will) be the exception for 6' qbs. But my POV is our #1 and #4 picks are Mercedes\BMW picks. Would you go to a BMW dealer and plunk down $70,000 on a car that "needs work"? If we were picking in the 12-20 range, I'd have a different opinion.
That's not really the type of decision process you want to risk a struggling franchise on.
What really worries me is our "Quarterback Whisperer" Hue is going to tell Dorsey- "I can fix him". Just like RG III, LOL.
This is assuming you land Cousins, draft Barkley and develop Allen.
The Browns are instantly relevant in the AFCN.
I'll steal what Tia just posted "Quite literally the "win now, excite the fanbase, sell tickets RAH RAH RAH" I want long term success, not a flash in the pan.
Saw a report giving the Browns around a 10% chance of landing Cousins. It will depend if he values $$$$ over winning. Regarding "developing" Allen- hell of a risk. He may have an Elway ceiling- he also has a Christian Ponder floor if the accuracy issues can't be fixed. 56% doesn't cut it in the NFL anymore.
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well, as I've said before - everything that can be said, HAS been said about all this qb draft stuff. The Browns need to start winning now, so it seems that Mayfield has the magic in him to start far faster than the others. It could be Mayfield, and whoever else the second pick would be - I keep thinking it's Minkah - but FA.... suppose they sign Tremaine Johnson, fa, cb? That would shake up the draft a bit.
No, what the Browns need to do is build a solid and young foundation for sustained success.
Quite literally the "win now, excite the fanbase, sell tickets RAH RAH RAH" is EXACTLY why we ended up with Johnny HateCrime.
No, what the Browns need to do is build a solid and young foundation for sustained success.
Quite literally the "win now, excite the fanbase, sell tickets RAH RAH RAH" is EXACTLY why we ended up with Johnny HateCrime.
you can do both, they are not mutually exclusive unless you don't have much talent. The Browns have some serious talent, they just have four positions that must get fixed to be able to win. If you look at the scores of games, it isn't like they get beaten 55-3, 48-6 every week. They are a lot closer than that - and a great draft could fix what needs fixed. Which is, FS, QB, CB, WR
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