Barkley at #1?
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You can't make this stuff up.... here's an awesome read.
Saquon Barkley on potentially being No. 1 pick in NFL draft: 'Why not? It would be cool'
Gentry Estes, Louisville Courier Journal Published 7:20 p.m. ET March 7, 2018USA TODAY Sports' Nate Davis explains that the player most likely to go No. 1 in this hyped quarterback draft class isn't a quarterback. USA TODAY Sports
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(Photo: Gentry Estes/Louisville Courier Journal)
Last week couldn't have gone much better for Penn State running back Saquon Barkley, who dropped jaws with his workout at the NFL scouting combine.
But this week hasn't been too bad so far either.
Barkley, who some are now projecting as the No. 1 pick in next month's NFL draft, was at the Galt House Hotel in Louisville for Wednesday night banquet honoring him as this past season's Paul Hornung Award.
In doing so, Barkley sat alongside two of football's all-time great running backs in Hornung himself and Jim Brown, the event's featured speaker.
"I'm trying to keep calm up here and keep calm right now, but I started sweating," Barkley said prior to the event. "Not many people can say that they had a conversation with Jim Brown. It hit me he actually knew who I was. That just was a special moment."
Barkley is fresh off a combine performance that impressed so much that most NFL mock drafts now have him going at least at the No. 2 spot. Some even have him going No. 1 overall to the Cleveland Browns.
"I mean, why not? It would be cool," Barkley said of potentially going No. 1 ahead of a touted crop of quarterback prospects this year. "It would be a fun experience to be No. 1. But it doesn't matter if I go No. 1, if I go seventh, if I go the last pick. It's not going to change me. My mindset is going to stay the same."
"If he doesn't go No. 1," said Hornung, sitting beside Barkley, "somebody's nuts — whoever has that shot — not to take this kid. If he's not No. 1, he's going to be the second pick."
At the NFL combine, Barkley's totals included a 4.4-second 40-yard sprint, 29 bench press reps and a vertical jump of 41 inches.
"The combine was fun," Barkley said. "I wanted to do a little better in some categories, but I can't complain. I think I did really good on the field. The best part I think I did was the interviews with the coaches, and that's the most important part."
And while he might not go No. 1, there's not another draft prospect receiving the kind of praise that Barkley is enjoying.
NFL.com's draft profile of Barkley lists Barry Sanders as his player comparison and includes this quote from an anonymous NFL general manager: "You don't screw up the special ones when you are a talent evaluator. This guy is special. Any concerns you file on him just feels like nitpicking to fill out the report."
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From left to right: Paul Hornung, Saquon Barkley, James Franklin, Jim Brown. (Photo: Gentry Estes/Louisville Courier Journal)
Barkley ran for at least 1,076 yards in each of his three seasons at Penn State. In 2017, he averaged 5.9 yards per carry, ran for 18 touchdowns, caught 54 passes for 632 yards and returning two kickoffs for a touchdown.
That's how you end up in Louisville receiving the Hornung Award, which goes to the most versatile player in college football.
"This is special," Barkley said. "Being a running back and being mentioned in the same category and winning an award that's represented by (Hornung) is just another class in itself.
"And you've got Jim Brown, who you could say is the greatest football player of all time, the greatest running back of all time. And not only the things he did on the football field. The impact he had in the community, he's somebody you admire as an athlete and somebody you aspire to be."
Gentry Estes: 502-582-4205; [email protected]; Twitter: @Gentry_Estes. Support strong local journalism by subscribing today: www.courier-journal.com/gentrye
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I dont think anyone thinks Tyrod is the future.
I also don't think the Browns are in win now mode. Yes I am sure they want to win, but I believe the plan is to set themselves up for the future.
The Browns are not going from no wins to the Super Bowl.
You have a warped reality on #1 quarterback. Just because they are drafted 1st (or anywhere in 1st) doesn't mean they have to start day one. NO TEAM IN HISTORY is drafting a player for Day 1, they are doing it for the future. Hmm, probably the top 3 QB in the league are Brady, Rodgers, Brees. You know what they have in common besides Super Bowl champions? They didn't start Day 1. They DEVELOPED.
I get it, you want Saquon. You have said it about 967 times. But don't try to use a false narrative to try and prove your point. A LOT of these QBs who start day one flame out, why? Because they aren't ready, haven't developed, and dont have the team around them to achieve success.
Do you know what all those QB's also have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall.
If you are picking #1 and taking a QB, he better be ready day 1.
Do you know what all those QB's also have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall.
If you are picking #1 and taking a QB, he better be ready day 1.
Hue already said- all goes well the QB we draft is sitting probably for most, if not all of 2018.
And I've told you this around 5 times already- What do Jim Brown, Emmett Smith, Walter Payton, and Barry Sanders all have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall either. You've already got Saquon fitted for a Gold Jacket before he's ever played a down in the NFL.
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Do you know what all those QB's also have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall.
If you are picking #1 and taking a QB, he better be ready day 1.
Hue already said- all goes well the QB we draft is sitting probably for most, if not all of 2018.
And I've told you this around 5 times already- What do Jim Brown, Emmett Smith, Walter Payton, and Barry Sanders all have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall either. You've already got Saquon fitted for a Gold Jacket before he's ever played a down in the NFL.
Hue already said- all goes well the QB we draft is sitting probably for most, if not all of 2018.
And I've told you this around 5 times already- What do Jim Brown, Emmett Smith, Walter Payton, and Barry Sanders all have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall either. You've already got Saquon fitted for a Gold Jacket before he's ever played a down in the NFL.
Not true- no Gold Jackets... only Superbowl rings.
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Right back to the old adage that just because a player was drafted high that does not make him worth the draft pick.
Would you give the Browns a 2nd for Kizer? Thats what he cost the Browns so he must be worth it by your logic.
No of course not, you know why? I HAVE SEEN HIM PLAY IN THE NFL. Superman hasn't played a down and he's worth #1, being fitted for a good jacket, 10 suber rings, and building a house for all his awards.
Yea, REAL SMART to talk him up that much.
You know why they aren't drafted THAT high? Because the league has changed, they have the shortest career, and you can get similar production later.
You know why they aren't drafted THAT high? Because the league has changed, they have the shortest career, and you can get similar production later.
Please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 1999. That's why there's a t-shirt mocking all the guys that couldn't survive the QB gig in Cleveland. There's so many names on that sucker you can't buy a size smaller than Tent. The worst part of it all is we wasted the entire career of a HOF caliber Left Tackle that put forth a Pro Bowl effort for 10 consecutive years protecting the blind side of QB under incompetent FOs.
Understanding Bernie Kosar was a supplemental draft pick, when is the last time we aced the QB position in round 1 of the NFL draft? Today, I keep hearing we can't draft A running back first because we have to draft A quarterback first. Poe isn't saying he wants A running back - he's saying he wants Barkley because he thinks he's the best football player in the draft. The irony is that a lot of people jumping all over his opinion are pretty reluctant to announce THE QB by name as well as the part about why he's the better solution.
Since you mentioned the league has changed, what makes a blazing fast 230 lb RB that caught 54 passes for 632 yards (almost 12 ypc) and 3 TDs on top of 1251 yards rushing at 5.9 ypc and 18 TDs just a dime a dozen? This is also supposed to be a deep QB draft where many scouts and draft analysts see equivalent values in the top 3-4 QB prospects.
Do you know what team had the biggest record improvement in the entire NFL last year? It was Jacksonville. They sucked so bad in 2016 that their horrible record earned them the right to draft #4 overall. After drafting RB Leonard Fournette at #4 overall (and losing their best WR to IR) they suddenly made it all the way to the AFC Championship Game. To get there, they beat Pittsburgh 45-42. There's other teams with promising first round RBs like the LA Rams (Gurley) and Dallas Cowboys (Zeke). In all 3 cases, the RBs helped their young QBs qualify for a post season.
After the QB position - what skill position touches the ball most frequently? There was a time we never lost sight of this. Then again here's parts of the tradition reminding us why we shouldn't: Jim Brown, Leroy Kelly, Greg Pruitt, Mike Pruitt, Kevin Mack, Earnest Byner, Leroy Hoard. We also had other RBs to complement them like: Bobby Mitchell, Calvin Hill, Herman Fontenot, Cleo Miller, Curtis Dickey, Eric Metcalf, etc... Just in case people think football has changed so much, our RB position combined for 122 receptions in 1986 when we went 12-4. That was Lindy Infante's first year here as OC (hard to believe that was 32 years ago already).
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
Hue already said- all goes well the QB we draft is sitting probably for most, if not all of 2018.
And I've told you this around 5 times already- What do Jim Brown, Emmett Smith, Walter Payton, and Barry Sanders all have in common? None of them were drafted #1 overall either. You've already got Saquon fitted for a Gold Jacket before he's ever played a down in the NFL.
Not true- no Gold Jackets... only Superbowl rings.
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Nope.
You've been guaranteeing that the Browns will take him #1 overall.
When called out to back it up, you backtrack so fast you'd make Usain Bolt proud.
Not surprising, coming from you.
Bullship, farts under the covers. I never backtrack.
Kevin Hogan is going to push Taylor to play his best. Hogan has something to prove and I'm sure he has a chip on his shoulder after last year.
Josh Gordon, everyone doubted, all but a few said he'd never play another snap, even fewer said he'd play in Cleveland.
And Saquon Barkley was born to be Cleveland next star Runningback.
Bullship, farts under the covers. I never backtrack.
Kevin Hogan is going to push Taylor to play his best. Hogan has something to prove and I'm sure he has a chip on his shoulder after last year.
Josh Gordon, everyone doubted, all but a few said he'd never play another snap, even fewer said he'd play in Cleveland.
And Saquon Barkley was born to be Cleveland next star Runningback.
So are you more comfortable being described as a blowhard, troll or coward?
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Bullship, farts under the covers. I never backtrack.
Kevin Hogan is going to push Taylor to play his best. Hogan has something to prove and I'm sure he has a chip on his shoulder after last year.
Josh Gordon, everyone doubted, all but a few said he'd never play another snap, even fewer said he'd play in Cleveland.
And Saquon Barkley was born to be Cleveland next star Runningback.
So are you more comfortable being described as a blowhard, troll or coward?
So are you more comfortable being described as a blowhard, troll or coward?
FWIW, it looks like the NFL Channel is undressing Barkley with their lenses at times. Dutch, at least you will present WHO your obvious choice of #1 overall is to combat the Barkley Love POE-tion.
In my case, I'm playing musical QBs with which guy I'd like among 3 guys meaning I'm undecided enough to say I think Barkley has less concerns than any of them for a #1 overall while I'm guaranteed to get one of those QBs with only 2 picks between 1 and 4 anyway. I feel like it's way easier for my to say Barkley is the best player in this draft than it is for me to say Darnold is the best player in this draft. Another guy who's talent is really growing on me - doesn't have much room for too many more concussions. As we know, once guys start getting those they have a tendency to frequent a player more frequently. I'm seeing my favorite QB being talked about as being possibly available as late as 5 or 6 overall.
Anyone saying the draft is too deep at RB to go RB #1 overall isn't allowing themselves to look at how many way Barkley is ideal for a pro passing game. There's some that are very raw for the passing game while their body weights don't lend themselves to a big work load. For example, when Duke Johnson had a full work load at the U - he racked up quite the injury history splainign why we don't use him up to temptation level. While I enjoyed the 3rd round stories of RBs last year - there's still first round stories of RBs like Fournette, Gurley and Elliott helping young NFL QBs reach playoffs. Not to mention, Philly gave Troy Aikman 2 "welcome to the NFL concussions" before he had Emmitt Smith to lean on. If a RB looks special enough - to help our footspeed needs, TD volume, reception volume, and ability to score from anywhere on the field - why close our eyes on this just because so many other drafts before haven't offered such a temptation at #1 overall?
Again, to all those worrying about the shelf life of an NFL RB - take a look at the shelf life of a QB in Cleveland or just take inventory of the names on the t-shirt.
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The Colts may very well trade down a bit as they have multiple needs and someone may want to jump up for a QB (as someone does that almost every year). We, of course, have multiple needs...but we have multiple 2nd round picks.
I don't understand how anyone can think that we're drafting a RB at #1 overall....but then, I can't figure out flat-earther's either.
The Colts have no RB. They will take Barkley at 3 and say thank you Dorsey.
Which QB should go 1? He is sitting on his a$$ in 2018.
The Colts have no RB. They will take Barkley at 3 and say thank you Dorsey.
Which QB should go 1? He is sitting on his a$$ in 2018.
1) and the Colts can give him Trent Richardson's locker.
2a) whichever QB Dorsey & Co. thinks best fits the Browns.
2b) that's what you DO with a rookie QB....but we're in the cat-bird's seat because we can pick a really good player at #4 to contribute right away.
(called having your cake and eating it too)
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You know why they aren't drafted THAT high? Because the league has changed, they have the shortest career, and you can get similar production later.
Please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 1999. That's why there's a t-shirt mocking all the guys that couldn't survive the QB gig in Cleveland. There's so many names on that sucker you can't buy a size smaller than Tent. The worst part of it all is we wasted the entire career of a HOF caliber Left Tackle that put forth a Pro Bowl effort for 10 consecutive years protecting the blind side of QB under incompetent FOs.
Understanding Bernie Kosar was a supplemental draft pick, when is the last time we aced the QB position in round 1 of the NFL draft? Today, I keep hearing we can't draft A running back first because we have to draft A quarterback first. Poe isn't saying he wants A running back - he's saying he wants Barkley because he thinks he's the best football player in the draft. The irony is that a lot of people jumping all over his opinion are pretty reluctant to announce THE QB by name as well as the part about why he's the better solution.
Since you mentioned the league has changed, what makes a blazing fast 230 lb RB that caught 54 passes for 632 yards (almost 12 ypc) and 3 TDs on top of 1251 yards rushing at 5.9 ypc and 18 TDs just a dime a dozen? This is also supposed to be a deep QB draft where many scouts and draft analysts see equivalent values in the top 3-4 QB prospects.
Do you know what team had the biggest record improvement in the entire NFL last year? It was Jacksonville. They sucked so bad in 2016 that their horrible record earned them the right to draft #4 overall. After drafting RB Leonard Fournette at #4 overall (and losing their best WR to IR) they suddenly made it all the way to the AFC Championship Game. To get there, they beat Pittsburgh 45-42. There's other teams with promising first round RBs like the LA Rams (Gurley) and Dallas Cowboys (Zeke). In all 3 cases, the RBs helped their young QBs qualify for a post season.
After the QB position - what skill position touches the ball most frequently? There was a time we never lost sight of this. Then again here's parts of the tradition reminding us why we shouldn't: Jim Brown, Leroy Kelly, Greg Pruitt, Mike Pruitt, Kevin Mack, Earnest Byner, Leroy Hoard. We also had other RBs to complement them like: Bobby Mitchell, Calvin Hill, Herman Fontenot, Cleo Miller, Curtis Dickey, Eric Metcalf, etc... Just in case people think football has changed so much, our RB position combined for 122 receptions in 1986 when we went 12-4. That was Lindy Infante's first year here as OC (hard to believe that was 32 years ago already).
Please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 1999. That's why there's a t-shirt mocking all the guys that couldn't survive the QB gig in Cleveland. There's so many names on that sucker you can't buy a size smaller than Tent. The worst part of it all is we wasted the entire career of a HOF caliber Left Tackle that put forth a Pro Bowl effort for 10 consecutive years protecting the blind side of QB under incompetent FOs.
Understanding Bernie Kosar was a supplemental draft pick, when is the last time we aced the QB position in round 1 of the NFL draft? Today, I keep hearing we can't draft A running back first because we have to draft A quarterback first. Poe isn't saying he wants A running back - he's saying he wants Barkley because he thinks he's the best football player in the draft. The irony is that a lot of people jumping all over his opinion are pretty reluctant to announce THE QB by name as well as the part about why he's the better solution.
Since you mentioned the league has changed, what makes a blazing fast 230 lb RB that caught 54 passes for 632 yards (almost 12 ypc) and 3 TDs on top of 1251 yards rushing at 5.9 ypc and 18 TDs just a dime a dozen? This is also supposed to be a deep QB draft where many scouts and draft analysts see equivalent values in the top 3-4 QB prospects.
Do you know what team had the biggest record improvement in the entire NFL last year? It was Jacksonville. They sucked so bad in 2016 that their horrible record earned them the right to draft #4 overall. After drafting RB Leonard Fournette at #4 overall (and losing their best WR to IR) they suddenly made it all the way to the AFC Championship Game. To get there, they beat Pittsburgh 45-42. There's other teams with promising first round RBs like the LA Rams (Gurley) and Dallas Cowboys (Zeke). In all 3 cases, the RBs helped their young QBs qualify for a post season.
After the QB position - what skill position touches the ball most frequently? There was a time we never lost sight of this. Then again here's parts of the tradition reminding us why we shouldn't: Jim Brown, Leroy Kelly, Greg Pruitt, Mike Pruitt, Kevin Mack, Earnest Byner, Leroy Hoard. We also had other RBs to complement them like: Bobby Mitchell, Calvin Hill, Herman Fontenot, Cleo Miller, Curtis Dickey, Eric Metcalf, etc... Just in case people think football has changed so much, our RB position combined for 122 receptions in 1986 when we went 12-4. That was Lindy Infante's first year here as OC (hard to believe that was 32 years ago already).
Please go back and find a post where I said the Browns shouldn't draft Barkley? What I have said all along is that the kid has flaws that some dont want to admit. But the biggest thing I have said is that Po talk on him is WAY overboard.
But since you bring up the Jags, you are saying Fournette was the main reason? Then exactly why did they have a better record without him last year? It couldn't have been that the other players developed, and got healthy, along with other additions? It also partly because Bortles played better.
Whether you want to admit it or not, the game has changed. You can use some kind of stat to try to think it hasn't changed, but everything from philosophy and formations have changed.
There is no doubt about it that Barkley is a spectacular athlete and good football player. That certainly doesn't mean he will be the best player ever. And it is funny you bring up his receptions, as I believe earlier in this very thread I broke that down, but whatever.
You will not find anywhere where I have said he won't be good or isn't the best RB in the draft. Let's just say for the sake of argument say he will have same impact as Todd Gurley (offensive player of year). How did Gurley do last year without a QB?
And are you saying that a QB that plays in Cleveland has a short career or a short career in Cleveland? Because I can think of 3 off top of my head still in league. ALL running backs have shorter careers because of the punishment they take. Best running back last 10 years or so would be Adrian Peterson? He has hit a wall at 30. 90% hit that wall around 30.
Again, I am NOT saying he won't be good. What I AM saying is that the Browns NEED to find their QB to achieve their ultimate goal in the future. And people who are on the Saquon #1 bandwagon say then get your QB at #4. They say you will still get a great QB there. Then somewhere else it's that these QBs aren't great. All I will say is that while maybe not the BEST, you can find comparable production later in draft at RB every year, and usually not at QB.
So I will make a deal with any Saquon #1 person. Nothing that anyone says is going to change your mind, which is fine. So ANYONE on that wagon, if a QB (any of the top 4) turns out to be great, then I dont want to hear the whining and moaning "well we had #1 pick, we could have had him".
Deal?
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I figured out the Browns 2018 master plan last night.
They are not just shooting for 6 - 8 wins. Dorsey and Haslam are going for the Division Crown and this time its for real. Cleveland will take Barkley at 1 shocking the NFL draft world because everybody had them taking a QB. Then at 4, they can go QB Allen or DL Chubb or CB Fitzpatrick or even OL with Thomas retired.
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For the record, I did not visit this site prior to forming my opinion. I have been in camp Barkley for weeks when these guys loved Darnold.
This is how you win now Kids.
Cleveland Browns: Saquon Barkley, RB, Penn State
A quarterback appears to be the most popular choice, but it doesn't make logical sense to take a signal-caller at No. 1 overall, given that Cleveland has the fourth-overall selection as well. It makes zero sense to go quarterback, because if the Browns take Saquon Barkley, they're guaranteed to land two of Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen, Josh Allen or Baker Mayfield at No. 4. Barkley, meanwhile, could be gone by then. He is the best player in this class, and he has a legitimate chance to be chosen second overall. He's drawn comparisons to Marshall Faulk, and he's unlikely to get past the Colts at No. 3 overall, barring a trade.
Besides, there's no consensus top player at the position. Darnold had a down year. Rosen has said that he doesn't want to play for the Browns. There have been rumors linking the Browns to Josh Allen, but he could be taken at No. 4.
I mocked a quarterback to the Browns last week, but based on conversations I had with people I trust who have Browns information, I believe Barkley will be in Cleveland next year.
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Follow @walterfootball for updates. Also, you can Support Us on Patreon here!
Read more: http://walterfootball.com/draft2018.php#ixzz5A10B7JjpCleveland Browns: Josh Allen, QB, Wyoming
This is exactly why the Browns should pick Saquon Barkley first overall. Some people don't understand the concept of selecting a running back first overall, but it's the most logical thing to do. Barkley is the best player in this draft, and Cleveland has this pick to work with. If the Browns didn't possess this choice, they'd have to go quarterback at No. 1, but under the circumstances, they'd be guaranteed to have two of Sam Darnold, Josh Rosen, Josh Allen and Baker Mayfield available. None of the quarterbacks stick out, really, so it's not like there's a must-have prospect at the position.
The Browns have been linked to every quarterback not named Rosen. Allen has the biggest arm in this class, and he makes sense for Todd Haley's offense. Allen has to really work on his accuracy, mechanics and field vision, but he has top-five overall physical talent.
Pick change; previously Denzel Ward, CB
Read more: http://walterfootball.com/draft2018.php#ixzz5A11qnEfy -
Please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 1999. That's why there's a t-shirt mocking all the guys that couldn't survive the QB gig in Cleveland. There's so many names on that sucker you can't buy a size smaller than Tent. The worst part of it all is we wasted the entire career of a HOF caliber Left Tackle that put forth a Pro Bowl effort for 10 consecutive years protecting the blind side of QB under incompetent FOs.
Understanding Bernie Kosar was a supplemental draft pick, when is the last time we aced the QB position in round 1 of the NFL draft? Today, I keep hearing we can't draft A running back first because we have to draft A quarterback first. Poe isn't saying he wants A running back - he's saying he wants Barkley because he thinks he's the best football player in the draft. The irony is that a lot of people jumping all over his opinion are pretty reluctant to announce THE QB by name as well as the part about why he's the better solution.
Since you mentioned the league has changed, what makes a blazing fast 230 lb RB that caught 54 passes for 632 yards (almost 12 ypc) and 3 TDs on top of 1251 yards rushing at 5.9 ypc and 18 TDs just a dime a dozen? This is also supposed to be a deep QB draft where many scouts and draft analysts see equivalent values in the top 3-4 QB prospects.
Do you know what team had the biggest record improvement in the entire NFL last year? It was Jacksonville. They sucked so bad in 2016 that their horrible record earned them the right to draft #4 overall. After drafting RB Leonard Fournette at #4 overall (and losing their best WR to IR) they suddenly made it all the way to the AFC Championship Game. To get there, they beat Pittsburgh 45-42. There's other teams with promising first round RBs like the LA Rams (Gurley) and Dallas Cowboys (Zeke). In all 3 cases, the RBs helped their young QBs qualify for a post season.
After the QB position - what skill position touches the ball most frequently? There was a time we never lost sight of this. Then again here's parts of the tradition reminding us why we shouldn't: Jim Brown, Leroy Kelly, Greg Pruitt, Mike Pruitt, Kevin Mack, Earnest Byner, Leroy Hoard. We also had other RBs to complement them like: Bobby Mitchell, Calvin Hill, Herman Fontenot, Cleo Miller, Curtis Dickey, Eric Metcalf, etc... Just in case people think football has changed so much, our RB position combined for 122 receptions in 1986 when we went 12-4. That was Lindy Infante's first year here as OC (hard to believe that was 32 years ago already).
Please go back and find a post where I said the Browns shouldn't draft Barkley? What I have said all along is that the kid has flaws that some dont want to admit. But the biggest thing I have said is that Po talk on him is WAY overboard.
But since you bring up the Jags, you are saying Fournette was the main reason? Then exactly why did they have a better record without him last year? It couldn't have been that the other players developed, and got healthy, along with other additions? It also partly because Bortles played better.
Whether you want to admit it or not, the game has changed. You can use some kind of stat to try to think it hasn't changed, but everything from philosophy and formations have changed.
There is no doubt about it that Barkley is a spectacular athlete and good football player. That certainly doesn't mean he will be the best player ever. And it is funny you bring up his receptions, as I believe earlier in this very thread I broke that down, but whatever.
You will not find anywhere where I have said he won't be good or isn't the best RB in the draft. Let's just say for the sake of argument say he will have same impact as Todd Gurley (offensive player of year). How did Gurley do last year without a QB?
And are you saying that a QB that plays in Cleveland has a short career or a short career in Cleveland? Because I can think of 3 off top of my head still in league. ALL running backs have shorter careers because of the punishment they take. Best running back last 10 years or so would be Adrian Peterson? He has hit a wall at 30. 90% hit that wall around 30.
Again, I am NOT saying he won't be good. What I AM saying is that the Browns NEED to find their QB to achieve their ultimate goal in the future. And people who are on the Saquon #1 bandwagon say then get your QB at #4. They say you will still get a great QB there. Then somewhere else it's that these QBs aren't great. All I will say is that while maybe not the BEST, you can find comparable production later in draft at RB every year, and usually not at QB.
So I will make a deal with any Saquon #1 person. Nothing that anyone says is going to change your mind, which is fine. So ANYONE on that wagon, if a QB (any of the top 4) turns out to be great, then I dont want to hear the whining and moaning "well we had #1 pick, we could have had him".
Deal?
Please go back and find a post where I said the Browns shouldn't draft Barkley? What I have said all along is that the kid has flaws that some dont want to admit. But the biggest thing I have said is that Po talk on him is WAY overboard.
But since you bring up the Jags, you are saying Fournette was the main reason? Then exactly why did they have a better record without him last year? It couldn't have been that the other players developed, and got healthy, along with other additions? It also partly because Bortles played better.
Whether you want to admit it or not, the game has changed. You can use some kind of stat to try to think it hasn't changed, but everything from philosophy and formations have changed.
There is no doubt about it that Barkley is a spectacular athlete and good football player. That certainly doesn't mean he will be the best player ever. And it is funny you bring up his receptions, as I believe earlier in this very thread I broke that down, but whatever.
You will not find anywhere where I have said he won't be good or isn't the best RB in the draft. Let's just say for the sake of argument say he will have same impact as Todd Gurley (offensive player of year). How did Gurley do last year without a QB?
And are you saying that a QB that plays in Cleveland has a short career or a short career in Cleveland? Because I can think of 3 off top of my head still in league. ALL running backs have shorter careers because of the punishment they take. Best running back last 10 years or so would be Adrian Peterson? He has hit a wall at 30. 90% hit that wall around 30.
Again, I am NOT saying he won't be good. What I AM saying is that the Browns NEED to find their QB to achieve their ultimate goal in the future. And people who are on the Saquon #1 bandwagon say then get your QB at #4. They say you will still get a great QB there. Then somewhere else it's that these QBs aren't great. All I will say is that while maybe not the BEST, you can find comparable production later in draft at RB every year, and usually not at QB.
So I will make a deal with any Saquon #1 person. Nothing that anyone says is going to change your mind, which is fine. So ANYONE on that wagon, if a QB (any of the top 4) turns out to be great, then I dont want to hear the whining and moaning "well we had #1 pick, we could have had him".
Deal?
This is a message board that welcomes passion from a fanbase that hasn't exactly been spoiled here since the year we lost our football team to Ratville. By challenging differences of opinions with some of the regulars in here - there's a contingent of guys that slowly, methodically opened my mind to a QB like Rosen from a crotchety old man like me. It's fun to try to open minds on people not willing to give Tyrod Taylor a chance for instance. This doesn't have to be the in your face make enemies arguments we see on here in the Josh Allen threads or even the Barkley threads. If there was an obvious #1 QB emerging - we'd be seeing a lot of people posting the NAME of the QB rather than the position for #1 overall. Since there's suddenly 3-4 QBs that appear to be really close - while a few of them have more concerns than perhaps Barkley or Chubb there will not be a consensus of people behind just 1 QB.
You're never going to find a consensus in a world that welcomes freedom of opinion, freedom of speech (although that can get really overrated when one mixes moonshine with Pottymouth Shaekspeare). I'll make a deal with you - if you stop pretending pick #4 overall is 3 rounds as opposed to only have 2 picks between #1 and #4 - I promise I won't pretend I know more than the experienced John Dorsey if he should take Chubb or Barkley first.
I'm saying Jax had the biggest change in record the year they drafted Fournette. He was a huge help to time of possession and moving the ball the same year Bortles lost his go-to WR Robinson. In the process, the defense was well rested with fresh legs. If you need to pretend Fournette wasn't an impact to that offense and Bortles was an impressive leader prior to 2017 - there's no way I can stop you. I'm saying the about face on the offensive side of the ball was more than a coincidence when I'm watching them beat Pittsburgh twice and get to the AFC Championship for beating them 45-42.
You never did answer my question/challenge - please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 99. There's a t-shirt out there reminding us of this reality like I said. Which of these QBs were drafted as high as #4 overall? Tom Brady?, Russell Wilson?, Aaron Rodgers?, Drew Brees?, Ben Roethlisberger?, Jimmy Garoppolo?, Dak Prescott?, Kirk Cousins?, Case Keenum?, Nick Foles?, Derek Carr?, DeShaun Watson?... How many different drafts is that telling us they don't run out of great QBs before the 4th pick?
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Please go back and find a post where I said the Browns shouldn't draft Barkley? What I have said all along is that the kid has flaws that some dont want to admit. But the biggest thing I have said is that Po talk on him is WAY overboard.
But since you bring up the Jags, you are saying Fournette was the main reason? Then exactly why did they have a better record without him last year? It couldn't have been that the other players developed, and got healthy, along with other additions? It also partly because Bortles played better.
Whether you want to admit it or not, the game has changed. You can use some kind of stat to try to think it hasn't changed, but everything from philosophy and formations have changed.
There is no doubt about it that Barkley is a spectacular athlete and good football player. That certainly doesn't mean he will be the best player ever. And it is funny you bring up his receptions, as I believe earlier in this very thread I broke that down, but whatever.
You will not find anywhere where I have said he won't be good or isn't the best RB in the draft. Let's just say for the sake of argument say he will have same impact as Todd Gurley (offensive player of year). How did Gurley do last year without a QB?
And are you saying that a QB that plays in Cleveland has a short career or a short career in Cleveland? Because I can think of 3 off top of my head still in league. ALL running backs have shorter careers because of the punishment they take. Best running back last 10 years or so would be Adrian Peterson? He has hit a wall at 30. 90% hit that wall around 30.
Again, I am NOT saying he won't be good. What I AM saying is that the Browns NEED to find their QB to achieve their ultimate goal in the future. And people who are on the Saquon #1 bandwagon say then get your QB at #4. They say you will still get a great QB there. Then somewhere else it's that these QBs aren't great. All I will say is that while maybe not the BEST, you can find comparable production later in draft at RB every year, and usually not at QB.
So I will make a deal with any Saquon #1 person. Nothing that anyone says is going to change your mind, which is fine. So ANYONE on that wagon, if a QB (any of the top 4) turns out to be great, then I dont want to hear the whining and moaning "well we had #1 pick, we could have had him".
Deal?
This is a message board that welcomes passion from a fanbase that hasn't exactly been spoiled here since the year we lost our football team to Ratville. By challenging differences of opinions with some of the regulars in here - there's a contingent of guys that slowly, methodically opened my mind to a QB like Rosen from a crotchety old man like me. It's fun to try to open minds on people not willing to give Tyrod Taylor a chance for instance. This doesn't have to be the in your face make enemies arguments we see on here in the Josh Allen threads or even the Barkley threads. If there was an obvious #1 QB emerging - we'd be seeing a lot of people posting the NAME of the QB rather than the position for #1 overall. Since there's suddenly 3-4 QBs that appear to be really close - while a few of them have more concerns than perhaps Barkley or Chubb there will not be a consensus of people behind just 1 QB.
You're never going to find a consensus in a world that welcomes freedom of opinion, freedom of speech (although that can get really overrated when one mixes moonshine with Pottymouth Shaekspeare). I'll make a deal with you - if you stop pretending pick #4 overall is 3 rounds as opposed to only have 2 picks between #1 and #4 - I promise I won't pretend I know more than the experienced John Dorsey if he should take Chubb or Barkley first.
I'm saying Jax had the biggest change in record the year they drafted Fournette. He was a huge help to time of possession and moving the ball the same year Bortles lost his go-to WR Robinson. In the process, the defense was well rested with fresh legs. If you need to pretend Fournette wasn't an impact to that offense and Bortles was an impressive leader prior to 2017 - there's no way I can stop you. I'm saying the about face on the offensive side of the ball was more than a coincidence when I'm watching them beat Pittsburgh twice and get to the AFC Championship for beating them 45-42.
You never did answer my question/challenge - please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 99. There's a t-shirt out there reminding us of this reality like I said. Which of these QBs were drafted as high as #4 overall? Tom Brady?, Russell Wilson?, Aaron Rodgers?, Drew Brees?, Ben Roethlisberger?, Jimmy Garoppolo?, Dak Prescott?, Kirk Cousins?, Case Keenum?, Nick Foles?, Derek Carr?, DeShaun Watson?... How many different drafts is that telling us they don't run out of great QBs before the 4th pick?
This is a message board that welcomes passion from a fanbase that hasn't exactly been spoiled here since the year we lost our football team to Ratville. By challenging differences of opinions with some of the regulars in here - there's a contingent of guys that slowly, methodically opened my mind to a QB like Rosen from a crotchety old man like me. It's fun to try to open minds on people not willing to give Tyrod Taylor a chance for instance. This doesn't have to be the in your face make enemies arguments we see on here in the Josh Allen threads or even the Barkley threads. If there was an obvious #1 QB emerging - we'd be seeing a lot of people posting the NAME of the QB rather than the position for #1 overall. Since there's suddenly 3-4 QBs that appear to be really close - while a few of them have more concerns than perhaps Barkley or Chubb there will not be a consensus of people behind just 1 QB.
You're never going to find a consensus in a world that welcomes freedom of opinion, freedom of speech (although that can get really overrated when one mixes moonshine with Pottymouth Shaekspeare). I'll make a deal with you - if you stop pretending pick #4 overall is 3 rounds as opposed to only have 2 picks between #1 and #4 - I promise I won't pretend I know more than the experienced John Dorsey if he should take Chubb or Barkley first.
I'm saying Jax had the biggest change in record the year they drafted Fournette. He was a huge help to time of possession and moving the ball the same year Bortles lost his go-to WR Robinson. In the process, the defense was well rested with fresh legs. If you need to pretend Fournette wasn't an impact to that offense and Bortles was an impressive leader prior to 2017 - there's no way I can stop you. I'm saying the about face on the offensive side of the ball was more than a coincidence when I'm watching them beat Pittsburgh twice and get to the AFC Championship for beating them 45-42.
You never did answer my question/challenge - please show me a shorter career in the NFL than playing QB in Cleveland since 99. There's a t-shirt out there reminding us of this reality like I said. Which of these QBs were drafted as high as #4 overall? Tom Brady?, Russell Wilson?, Aaron Rodgers?, Drew Brees?, Ben Roethlisberger?, Jimmy Garoppolo?, Dak Prescott?, Kirk Cousins?, Case Keenum?, Nick Foles?, Derek Carr?, DeShaun Watson?... How many different drafts is that telling us they don't run out of great QBs before the 4th pick?
Well obviously you can pull some names of people not drafted in 1st round. It's pointless because the same can be done for EVERY position. It shows that there are things that can't be measured. It's just human nature, but people are only going to use something to help their argument.
There are plenty of examples of players playing a shorter time. That doesn't prove ANYRHING, just like saying Weeden is still in the league. What does it prove other than the Browns have been very bad.
I dont act like it's 3 rounds in between. But if you are being honest, if they chose to get their QB at 4, then there is a possibility it's their 3rd QB. That doesn't mean he would be bad, it doesn't mean he won't be the best of the bunch. It means that it COULD be their 3rd ranked guy. And a recent example of the 3rd guy is Paxton Lynch.
Obviously though, you seem to have missed the point. I dont care who they take and where. And I don't expect everyone to agree. But it will be sickening to see someone that says Barkley #1 or someone else #1 to then come back and whine and moan, WE SHOULD HAVE TAKEN THAT GUY.
Meaning, if you like Barkley there stick to it. Dont complain down the road and say the team was stupid and should have taken someone else
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After the Jets trade up Barkley at 1 is now a more distant possibility
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What is that price? And how far down would they go. And who would trade up? And for what? A QB? Barkley? Chubb?
TBD Gip, no idea at this point how low, and it depends on who is doing the trading up what the asking price is going to be. Let's see. Broncos, Jets, and Bills are the likely trade up partners. Nobody is trading up for a position player- it's going to be for a quarterback. Draft value chart says the Broncos would only need to give up a second, and maybe a 4th. Jets a little more. The Bills would have to give up at least both first rounders, and one of their second round picks or a future first.
IMHO Arizona flat out won't have the ammo to make a move to #3, short of trading Peterson, their first and second, and a future first.
TBD Gip, no idea at this point how low, and it depends on who is doing the trading up what the asking price is going to be. Let's see. Broncos, Jets, and Bills are the likely trade up partners. Nobody is trading up for a position player- it's going to be for a quarterback. Draft value chart says the Broncos would only need to give up a second, and maybe a 4th. Jets a little more. The Bills would have to give up at least both first rounders, and one of their second round picks or a future first.
IMHO Arizona flat out won't have the ammo to make a move to #3, short of trading Peterson, their first and second, and a future first.
Well, now we know...it is the Jets who made the trade.
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On another thread I posted a video that consisted of 12 hours of snoring.
Basically....that is what this thread is.
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Saquon Barkley played in 38 college football games.
He failed to get to 100 yards rushing in 23 of them.
(61%) -
Saquon Barkley played in 38 college football games.
He failed to get to 100 yards rushing in 23 of them.
(61%) -
"rings" = "Jackets"
Same same
Jim Plunkett disagrees with that statement.
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All this talk about winning Super Bowls with Brandon Jacobs and Blount is nice.
All you need is a Tom Brady or Eli Manning at QB and any scrap heap RB will do. No problem finding QBs like those guys. The Browns have Taylor and are in win now mode with the way Dorsey is wheeling and dealing. The Colts will take Barkley at 3 if the Browns pass on him.
The Colts will take Barkley at 3 if the Browns pass on him.
Care to reconsider? Seems the Colts weren't interested in hanging around at #3 for that possibility.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196
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