POLL: When will Baker start?
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domcooch's thread got merged and now I've got Phoolie all over my shoes...
... I hate it when that happens.
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domcooch's thread got merged and now I've got Phoolie all over my shoes...
... I hate it when that happens.
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What happens in camp if Baker is clearly better than Tie Rod?
I am not stirring up schidt here, BUT.............if we are to believe anything about Mayfield, he is a balls-to-the-wall fighter. So what happens if he shows all the other QBs up? Does he sit the bench? And if he does sit regardless of his performance, will it make him bitter? If he shows Tie Rod up, would he deserve to start? Would that be another Kizer fiasco?
The Browns have set themselves up for another QB controversy IF Mayfield shows the veteran up. Especially if Tie Rod stars and once again the Browns find themselves in Goosegg town.
What happens in camp if Baker is clearly better than Tie Rod?
I am not stirring up schidt here, BUT.............if we are to believe anything about Mayfield, he is a balls-to-the-wall fighter. So what happens if he shows all the other QBs up? Does he sit the bench? And if he does sit regardless of his performance, will it make him bitter? If he shows Tie Rod up, would he deserve to start? Would that be another Kizer fiasco?
The Browns have set themselves up for another QB controversy IF Mayfield shows the veteran up. Especially if Tie Rod stars and once again the Browns find themselves in Goosegg town.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
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What happens in camp if Baker is clearly better than Tie Rod?
I am not stirring up schidt here, BUT.............if we are to believe anything about Mayfield, he is a balls-to-the-wall fighter. So what happens if he shows all the other QBs up? Does he sit the bench? And if he does sit regardless of his performance, will it make him bitter? If he shows Tie Rod up, would he deserve to start? Would that be another Kizer fiasco?
The Browns have set themselves up for another QB controversy IF Mayfield shows the veteran up. Especially if Tie Rod stars and once again the Browns find themselves in Goosegg town.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
Good take with various possibilities. I would prefer Baker not start immediately, but we'll see what actually happens.
Mike
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So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
Good take with various possibilities. I would prefer Baker not start immediately, but we'll see what actually happens.
Mike
Good take with various possibilities. I would prefer Baker not start immediately, but we'll see what actually happens.
Mike
And I would prefer that Baker only takes over in games we have put away and NOT play the last few games while we are making the playoffs.
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Good take with various possibilities. I would prefer Baker not start immediately, but we'll see what actually happens.
Mike
And I would prefer that Baker only takes over in games we have put away and NOT play the last few games while we are making the playoffs.
And I would prefer that Baker only takes over in games we have put away and NOT play the last few games while we are making the playoffs.
I'm not a huge Taylor fan but if he has games so far ahead it seems he would take umbrage to the seeming disrespect right? Just to be the Devil's Advocate isn't having a top-notch nfl-caliber quarterback at the helm the entire point? No matter who it might be?
WSS
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as a fellow Hokie, I hope Tyrod lights it up and brings the Browns to the playoffs. I think the only way we'll see Mayfield is if Taylor gets hurt. I just hope we don't hear "Mayfield" chants after the first interception, it really messed up Hoyer's winning streak the last time the Browns had a first-round QB on the bench and started calling for him at the first sign of trouble. As much as I like Mayfield as a QB, I also want to see what Tyrod Taylor can do with this team and am in no hurry to throw Mayfield out there for trial by fire until he decisively earns the starting role.
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What happens in camp if Baker is clearly better than Tie Rod?
I am not stirring up schidt here, BUT.............if we are to believe anything about Mayfield, he is a balls-to-the-wall fighter. So what happens if he shows all the other QBs up? Does he sit the bench? And if he does sit regardless of his performance, will it make him bitter? If he shows Tie Rod up, would he deserve to start? Would that be another Kizer fiasco?
The Browns have set themselves up for another QB controversy IF Mayfield shows the veteran up. Especially if Tie Rod stars and once again the Browns find themselves in Goosegg town.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
As you have pointed out and added to my thoughts, Baker presents a 2018 season future that there is simply no way to predict. You know, I don't believe the football playbook is all that complicated. Honestly, not being mean but NFL players are not exactly a brilliant bunch. 2 years ago I was at a Browns event through connections with my wife's work. I learned again that 50% of all NFL playbooks are simple translations of Paul Browns playbook...something college kids are exposed to. Then, in every teams playbook there are codes/similarities if you will where perhaps 5 pass plays with slight differences are grouped together. Add to that headphone communication and plays written on the wrist band, and I don't see this as a huge, time consuming obstacle.
I keep hoping for the Dan Marino experience. Off the Bench and BOOM. I think Mayfield is that kind of a guy.
The Cleveland Browns have the hardest hit players in the NFL -
True Dat.
And PoG showed us a video of all the #1 pick QB's in recent history...and how many started week one. I think the difference here is that we knew we were taking a QB #1 overall. AND we traded for an experienced QB to start for us so that our #1 pick QB would NOT play. We have an actual plan.
As you say Ghoolie (won't call you Ghoul if you play nice), Then life happens and all bets are off. Yup, if Baker learns the playbook better than TieRod...if he practices better than TieRod...if he plays better than TieRod. But that's an awful lot of if's for a rookie QB. Kizer started last year, but like I said last year, the bar for him was low. We had inexperienced bums that he had to beat out. The bar is higher this year for Baker.
Yes, we have a trigger fingered owner who will want Baker playing if we're losing. And we have Hue who will, again this year, do anything he can to save his job...including playing Mayfield when he may not be ready.
TieRod has learned an NFL playbook before. TieRod has experienced the speed of the NFL. He's taken snaps under center, called out protections, identified blitzers, called audibles, etc. Baker needs to learn a lot of that.
I hope we win some games so that Baker can come in and take over when he has control of what he's been taught. (I can hope, right?)
I don't have a disagreement with any of this. I do believe that there is a tendency, maybe even wishful thinking every year that finally the Browns have a common sense plan in place for rearing the new QB. I have never believed this to be the case, and hence a lot of guys argue with me, and of course get the fire of Ghoolie. On the surface, it looks good. Seasoned Vet to give the new kid a stay of execution, give the Browns a chance to groom the guy for a year.... learn the nuances, learn the schemes, etc etc etc.
Do you think that's what management is hoping for? A good solid year from Tie Rod and then Baker eases into the scene?
I really don't believe that at all. I believe TieRod is nothing more than an insurance policy, a buffer if you will. Follow with me.
1) If Tie Rod plays well, we winn 6, 7,8 or more games, management wins. They look good, Baker isn't thrown to the wolves.
2) Tie Rod blows, Haslam forces his hand and play Baker. Baker amazes, Jimmy looks great. Baker blows, Jimmy blames it on Tie Rod no holding his end down.
I don't think anyone in management sees any path where Baker does not, at some point in 2018 assume ownership of the team. He has to. You can't have the #1 pick on the bench all year, then Tie Rod going 10 -6, so now, why even bring Baker in, the case could be made. There is a high probability that Tie rod Tarkenton is going to get hurt. I really believe this. I believe he was brought in as a fluffer.
We shall see.
I don't have a disagreement with any of this. I do believe that there is a tendency, maybe even wishful thinking every year that finally the Browns have a common sense plan in place for rearing the new QB. I have never believed this to be the case, and hence a lot of guys argue with me, and of course get the fire of Ghoolie. On the surface, it looks good. Seasoned Vet to give the new kid a stay of execution, give the Browns a chance to groom the guy for a year.... learn the nuances, learn the schemes, etc etc etc.
Do you think that's what management is hoping for? A good solid year from Tie Rod and then Baker eases into the scene?
I really don't believe that at all. I believe TieRod is nothing more than an insurance policy, a buffer if you will. Follow with me.
1) If Tie Rod plays well, we winn 6, 7,8 or more games, management wins. They look good, Baker isn't thrown to the wolves.
2) Tie Rod blows, Haslam forces his hand and play Baker. Baker amazes, Jimmy looks great. Baker blows, Jimmy blames it on Tie Rod no holding his end down.
I don't think anyone in management sees any path where Baker does not, at some point in 2018 assume ownership of the team. He has to. You can't have the #1 pick on the bench all year, then Tie Rod going 10 -6, so now, why even bring Baker in, the case could be made. There is a high probability that Tie rod Tarkenton is going to get hurt. I really believe this. I believe he was brought in as a fluffer.
We shall see.
I really think that's what the Browns are hoping, Taylor plays well, and Baker sits most of the year. It's why they brought in Drew Stanton- to mentor Baker, just as he has for several other top QB like Matt Stafford. It sure wasn't for his passing ability. That (sort of) frees Tyrod to concentrate on the game without having Baker breathing down his neck. I do think the Browns will be improved on offense, we actually have guys there that other teams will have to account for like Gordon, Landry, Njoku, Chubb, and Hyde. Unloading turnover machine Kizer should be worth a win or two at least.
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I don't have a disagreement with any of this. I do believe that there is a tendency, maybe even wishful thinking every year that finally the Browns have a common sense plan in place for rearing the new QB. I have never believed this to be the case, and hence a lot of guys argue with me, and of course get the fire of Ghoolie. On the surface, it looks good. Seasoned Vet to give the new kid a stay of execution, give the Browns a chance to groom the guy for a year.... learn the nuances, learn the schemes, etc etc etc.
Do you think that's what management is hoping for? A good solid year from Tie Rod and then Baker eases into the scene?
I really don't believe that at all. I believe TieRod is nothing more than an insurance policy, a buffer if you will. Follow with me.
1) If Tie Rod plays well, we winn 6, 7,8 or more games, management wins. They look good, Baker isn't thrown to the wolves.
2) Tie Rod blows, Haslam forces his hand and play Baker. Baker amazes, Jimmy looks great. Baker blows, Jimmy blames it on Tie Rod no holding his end down.
I don't think anyone in management sees any path where Baker does not, at some point in 2018 assume ownership of the team. He has to. You can't have the #1 pick on the bench all year, then Tie Rod going 10 -6, so now, why even bring Baker in, the case could be made. There is a high probability that Tie rod Tarkenton is going to get hurt. I really believe this. I believe he was brought in as a fluffer.
We shall see.
I really think that's what the Browns are hoping, Taylor plays well, and Baker sits most of the year. It's why they brought in Drew Stanton- to mentor Baker, just as he has for several other top QB like Matt Stafford. It sure wasn't for his passing ability. That (sort of) frees Tyrod to concentrate on the game without having Baker breathing down his neck. I do think the Browns will be improved on offense, we actually have guys there that other teams will have to account for like Gordon, Landry, Njoku, Chubb, and Hyde. Unloading turnover machine Kizer should be worth a win or two at least.
I really think that's what the Browns are hoping, Taylor plays well, and Baker sits most of the year. It's why they brought in Drew Stanton- to mentor Baker, just as he has for several other top QB like Matt Stafford. It sure wasn't for his passing ability. That (sort of) frees Tyrod to concentrate on the game without having Baker breathing down his neck. I do think the Browns will be improved on offense, we actually have guys there that other teams will have to account for like Gordon, Landry, Njoku, Chubb, and Hyde. Unloading turnover machine Kizer should be worth a win or two at least.
As long as it isn't TieRod injury, or pressure at 0 - 6 that brings Baker in, I am okay. That is my wish; that this time out, Baker is inserted exactly when the coaches are comfortable doing it.
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domcooch's thread got merged and now I've got Phoolie all over my shoes...
... I hate it when that happens.
domcooch's thread got merged and now I've got Phoolie all over my shoes...
... I hate it when that happens.
What you have is my foot up your asss. My thread had more interest so accordingly the boss gave me props. As Gipper said, suck it up, and I might add, quit whining. You will always have your nose up my butt, no matter what the contest.
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What happens in camp if Baker is clearly better than Tie Rod?
I am not stirring up schidt here, BUT.............if we are to believe anything about Mayfield, he is a balls-to-the-wall fighter. So what happens if he shows all the other QBs up? Does he sit the bench? And if he does sit regardless of his performance, will it make him bitter? If he shows Tie Rod up, would he deserve to start? Would that be another Kizer fiasco?
The Browns have set themselves up for another QB controversy IF Mayfield shows the veteran up. Especially if Tie Rod stars and once again the Browns find themselves in Goosegg town.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
I agree with basically everything you said until that last sentence. If Taylor can just manage to be an extremely average NFL QB- we could find ourselves in the playoff hunt. We were in a dozen games the last two year right up until the end... and that was with some of the worst QB play the NFL has ever seen. There is NO WAY we don't compete for the division if Taylor plays pretty well. With our blooming defense of speed and power, our playmakers on offense and our usually above average special teams- if we can find a guy that isn't a complete meltdown in the redzone, we could be poised for a phenomenal season- the likes of which haven't been seen since 07.
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
As you have pointed out and added to my thoughts, Baker presents a 2018 season future that there is simply no way to predict. You know, I don't believe the football playbook is all that complicated. Honestly, not being mean but NFL players are not exactly a brilliant bunch. 2 years ago I was at a Browns event through connections with my wife's work. I learned again that 50% of all NFL playbooks are simple translations of Paul Browns playbook...something college kids are exposed to. Then, in every teams playbook there are codes/similarities if you will where perhaps 5 pass plays with slight differences are grouped together. Add to that headphone communication and plays written on the wrist band, and I don't see this as a huge, time consuming obstacle.
I keep hoping for the Dan Marino experience. Off the Bench and BOOM. I think Mayfield is that kind of a guy.
You know, I don't believe the football playbook is all that complicated. Honestly, not being mean but NFL players are not exactly a brilliant bunch.
lol......there IS that.
Still though...the NFL will be new to him. As will the bigger playbook...and the QB has to learn all of the skill positions jobs/routes.....as well as read the D pre-snap...and audible (if allowed). Now obviously all 3 QB's are learning new playbooks...but Taylor and Stanton have learned them before and are experienced in the league. They'll all have to learn their new crop of receivers and develop a timing chemistry with them. But Mayfield will be mired mostly with the 3rd stringers and will not really be able to build that chemistry with the ones.
Unloading turnover machine Kizer should be worth a win or two at least.
I still feel for that poor kid. He never should have had to play in his rookie year. He was quite young. BUT...he came to a team with the worst QB's and receivers combination in the league. Not to mention Hue, the QB bungler. May God bless him in Green Bay.
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
You know, I don't believe the football playbook is all that complicated. Honestly, not being mean but NFL players are not exactly a brilliant bunch.
lol......there IS that.
Still though...the NFL will be new to him. As will the bigger playbook...and the QB has to learn all of the skill positions jobs/routes.....as well as read the D pre-snap...and audible (if allowed). Now obviously all 3 QB's are learning new playbooks...but Taylor and Stanton have learned them before and are experienced in the league. They'll all have to learn their new crop of receivers and develop a timing chemistry with them. But Mayfield will be mired mostly with the 3rd stringers and will not really be able to build that chemistry with the ones.
Unloading turnover machine Kizer should be worth a win or two at least.
I still feel for that poor kid. He never should have had to play in his rookie year. He was quite young. BUT...he came to a team with the worst QB's and receivers combination in the league. Not to mention Hue, the QB bungler. May God bless him in Green Bay.
lol......there IS that.
Still though...the NFL will be new to him. As will the bigger playbook...and the QB has to learn all of the skill positions jobs/routes.....as well as read the D pre-snap...and audible (if allowed). Now obviously all 3 QB's are learning new playbooks...but Taylor and Stanton have learned them before and are experienced in the league. They'll all have to learn their new crop of receivers and develop a timing chemistry with them. But Mayfield will be mired mostly with the 3rd stringers and will not really be able to build that chemistry with the ones.
I still feel for that poor kid. He never should have had to play in his rookie year. He was quite young. BUT...he came to a team with the worst QB's and receivers combination in the league. Not to mention Hue, the QB bungler. May God bless him in Green Bay.
With a new Rogers deal looming, Kizer will not see the field for a very long time.
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lol......there IS that.
Still though...the NFL will be new to him. As will the bigger playbook...and the QB has to learn all of the skill positions jobs/routes.....as well as read the D pre-snap...and audible (if allowed). Now obviously all 3 QB's are learning new playbooks...but Taylor and Stanton have learned them before and are experienced in the league. They'll all have to learn their new crop of receivers and develop a timing chemistry with them. But Mayfield will be mired mostly with the 3rd stringers and will not really be able to build that chemistry with the ones.
I still feel for that poor kid. He never should have had to play in his rookie year. He was quite young. BUT...he came to a team with the worst QB's and receivers combination in the league. Not to mention Hue, the QB bungler. May God bless him in Green Bay.
With a new Rogers deal looming, Kizer will not see the field for a very long time.
With a new Rogers deal looming, Kizer will not see the field for a very long time. If ever...
In response to Orion, Kizer may turn out well- and I wish him the best. But we never should have drafted him in the first place. He was mediocre at best at ND, and he continued on the way with the Browns.
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Tyrod played 10 teams last season that are on our schedule this season. Tyrod was 6-5 with playing his most productive passing games twice against the Jets (285 2TD,224 2TD). The only other team (on are schedule)Tyrod surpassed 200 yards was TB-268-1TD. @Car,@Atl.,@Cinn.,Oak,Saints-Peterman played,@LAC & at KC? Tyrod had a low of 125 yards. at Car.. Tyrod was still throwing for less than 183 yards since Car. game..Tyrod is certainly the Game Manager..now with No Shady McCoy to feed the ball to either. But looks like Tyrod has far more passing weapons to throw it around with here. Once Haley gets off all the underneath routes & actually takes some shots down field? .. that's when Tyrod could keep Mayfield as the next MaHolmes warming up for next season..stay tuned
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With a new Rogers deal looming, Kizer will not see the field for a very long time. If ever...
In response to Orion, Kizer may turn out well- and I wish him the best. But we never should have drafted him in the first place. He was mediocre at best at ND, and he continued on the way with the Browns.
In response to Orion, Kizer may turn out well- and I wish him the best. But we never should have drafted him in the first place. He was mediocre at best at ND, and he continued on the way with the Browns.
You are very correct. He should have stayed in college another year.
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So....this is interesting and not totally unprecedented. What we need to remember is that Baker is used to being 3rd string and then winning the starting gig relatively quickly. This is a guy who lives and loves football, and he will study and train until he can't do anymore. Baker isn't somebody who will slack off or be unprepared. He's obviously going to struggle with the size and complexity of the playbook, and of course learning how to call plays and be under center will be foreign to him. It will definitely take some time. The difference between Baker and somebody like Johnny is that Baker will probably sleep with the playbook under his pillow. I can see him standing in front of the mirror practicing calling out complicated plays. THAT'S who he is.
There are a few answers to your question. Believe it or not, we could actually TRADE Tyrod Taylor. Tyrod is a playoff QB who is 28. A prime asset. If Baker essentially explodes onto the scene, and does so relatively fast, we may give Tyrod the chance to play somewhere else by trading him to a team that suffers a QB injury in camp, or some other similar situation. I believe this scenario to be EXTREMELY unlikely, but it's possible.
Basically, we want to be very cautious with Baker, but we also can't keep him benched if he's the better option. Don't forget, the players see practice every day. They will know who is better, and they will want the guy who gives them the best chance to win and make plays. If Tyrod is playing too conservatively and our playmakers aren't getting the opportunities....there could be some grumbling. Again, I VERY much doubt this happens, as veterans much prefer veteran qb's. I don't see us trading a 3rd rounder for Tyrod only to bench him. He's going to play and probably play pretty well, like he usually does.
The thing to watch is Baker in the preseason. How does he do in the 3rd game? The first 2 are always kind of a mess. The 4th is usually a joke. The 3rd is when teams play their best players for the longest. If Baker looks prepared, competent, and "at ease" during the 3rd game, you will hear the whispers come out. If he then lights up the useless 4th game, the whispers will get louder. If we drafted Darnold, I'd say let him sit basically all year. But we have my man Baker, and Baker is used to taking jobs. My preference is for Baker to sit at least through 10 games, maybe longer, but I can definitely envision a scenario where he plays earlier, possibly from the first game.
My best guess is that Tyrod wins the job, plays pretty well, and Baker plays the last 4-5 games after we're eliminated.
I agree with basically everything you said until that last sentence. If Taylor can just manage to be an extremely average NFL QB- we could find ourselves in the playoff hunt. We were in a dozen games the last two year right up until the end... and that was with some of the worst QB play the NFL has ever seen. There is NO WAY we don't compete for the division if Taylor plays pretty well. With our blooming defense of speed and power, our playmakers on offense and our usually above average special teams- if we can find a guy that isn't a complete meltdown in the redzone, we could be poised for a phenomenal season- the likes of which haven't been seen since 07.
I agree with basically everything you said until that last sentence. If Taylor can just manage to be an extremely average NFL QB- we could find ourselves in the playoff hunt. We were in a dozen games the last two year right up until the end... and that was with some of the worst QB play the NFL has ever seen. There is NO WAY we don't compete for the division if Taylor plays pretty well. With our blooming defense of speed and power, our playmakers on offense and our usually above average special teams- if we can find a guy that isn't a complete meltdown in the redzone, we could be poised for a phenomenal season- the likes of which haven't been seen since 07.
To be honest, I originally had a similar sentiment but deleted it because I didn't want to go over the top. Here's the problem I see...our schedule absolutely sucks. I'm not just talking about WHO we play, because analysis shows us that you can't really rely on the previous year's win-loss record. I'm talking about the setup. Playing the Steelers game 1 is a kick in the junk. Traveling 1000 miles the FOLLOWING week to another playoff team, is a bigger kick. Coming BACK home to play on Thursday is the biggest. We have the very real, and likely, possibility of being 0-2 and coming back to Cleveland to play perhaps our "easiest" game with only a few days to rest and practice. I mean, for a team that's 1-31 over 2 years, our schedule beginning just feels punitive. The Saints are a mother effer at home. We simply don't beat the Steelers, and we don't win openers. It really is the worst possible beginning scenario.
Now, not all hope is lost. We somehow fought the Steelers in game 1 last year, and that blocked punt TD was really what did us in. We need to find SOME way split those two games, and then beat the Jets to go 2-1 through 3 games. However, let's not forget the Jets somehow signed virtually every free agent in the world, so they're likely to be much better this year from a talent standpoint. Our best bet is for Darnold to win the job, and then take advantage of his rookie mistakes. I don't see this happening, but there's a chance.
If we get to something like 0-3, it's going to be another LONG season. We CAN'T have that. To your point, we were definitely in many games last year, and we need to find ways to WIN games rather than lose them. Another major concern I have is the lack of a reliable FG kicker. How many games come down to just a few points? Tyrod is VERY safe, especially in the scoring part of the field, so I expect a TON of FG opportunities, and touchdowns being somewhat elusive. That means we need them all. We can't be going for it on 4th down because we don't trust our freaking kicker. Am I making sense?
Ultimately, I desperately want you to be right. I very much want to see us competitive into December and having fun every weekend. This town is a sleeping giant, and we WANT to explode.
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You are very correct. He should have stayed in college another year.
To be honest.....a potentiall useless as he may have turned out to be, the Browns should have kept Osweiler and started him for most of the season and let Kizer ride the pine and learn. After all, they did have to pay the Big B.O. 16 mill. Better to keep and use him than just dump him....particularly when you did not have any other competent QBs on the team. And if B.O. had played like shite....like he think he may have, then they could have put Kizer in midway through the season.
The team would have been no worse off....
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