Franken
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http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124640687950076679.html
The 'Absentee' Senator
Franken wins by changing the rules.
The Minnesota Supreme Court yesterday declared Democrat Al Franken the winner of last year's disputed Senate race, and Republican incumbent Norm Coleman's gracious concession at least spares the state any further legal combat. The unfortunate lesson is that you don't need to win the vote on Election Day as long as your lawyers are creative enough to have enough new or disqualified ballots counted after the fact.
Mr. Franken trailed Mr. Coleman by 725 votes after the initial count on election night, and 215 after the first canvass. The Democrat's strategy from the start was to manipulate the recount in a way that would discover votes that could add to his total. The Franken legal team swarmed the recount, aggressively demanding that votes that had been disqualified be added to his count, while others be denied for Mr. Coleman.
But the team's real goldmine were absentee ballots, thousands of which the Franken team claimed had been mistakenly rejected. While Mr. Coleman's lawyers demanded a uniform standard for how counties should re-evaluate these rejected ballots, the Franken team ginned up an additional 1,350 absentees from Franken-leaning counties. By the time this treasure hunt ended, Mr. Franken was 312 votes up, and Mr. Coleman was left to file legal briefs.
What Mr. Franken understood was that courts would later be loathe to overrule decisions made by the canvassing board, however arbitrary those decisions were. He was right. The three-judge panel overseeing the Coleman legal challenge, and the Supreme Court that reviewed the panel's findings, in essence found that Mr. Coleman hadn't demonstrated a willful or malicious attempt on behalf of officials to deny him the election. And so they refused to reopen what had become a forbidding tangle of irregularities. Mr. Coleman didn't lose the election. He lost the fight to stop the state canvassing board from changing the vote-counting rules after the fact.
This is now the second time Republicans have been beaten in this kind of legal street fight. In 2004, Dino Rossi was ahead in the election-night count for Washington Governor against Democrat Christine Gregoire. Ms. Gregoire's team demanded the right to rifle through a list of provisional votes that hadn't been counted, setting off a hunt for "new" Gregoire votes. By the third recount, she'd discovered enough to win. This was the model for the Franken team.
Mr. Franken now goes to the Senate having effectively stolen an election. If the GOP hopes to avoid repeats, it should learn from Minnesota that modern elections don't end when voters cast their ballots. They only end after the lawyers count them.
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No surprise here. Both Party's cheat and bend whatever they can bend for their benefit.
This was an interesting piece from a mainstream media. However, it will never appear on National TV or 60 Minutes.
"God is great. Beer is good. People are crazy." -
No surprise here. Both Party's cheat and bend whatever they can bend for their benefit.
This was an interesting piece from a mainstream media. However, it will never appear on National TV or 60 Minutes.
No surprise here. Both Party's cheat and bend whatever they can bend for their benefit.
This was an interesting piece from a mainstream media. However, it will never appear on National TV or 60 Minutes.
No doubt...but those haven't been legit for many years.
The WSJ is the last great newspaper in this country and the PBS New Hour is the last legit news broadcast.
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O come on now.... Bush vs Gore..... YOU KNOW Gore should have won Florida. Both parties play hardball... sometimes your side is the loser, other times its the winner.
This was for a senatorial position, I think the republicans are still up considering they got 6 years of controlling congress and the white house out of the deal.
Redistricting Texas....... the republicans took control..... It happens.
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Franken is an embarassment. He is far worse then GWB. At least he was a real Governor. Franken is a friking clown. This is the future of the democraps? ROFLMFAO! Dems dead in 2012. Mark it down.
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O come on now.... Bush vs Gore..... YOU KNOW Gore should have won Florida. Both parties play hardball... sometimes your side is the loser, other times its the winner.
This was for a senatorial position, I think the republicans are still up considering they got 6 years of controlling congress and the white house out of the deal.
Redistricting Texas....... the republicans took control..... It happens.
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O come on now.... Bush vs Gore..... YOU KNOW Gore should have won Florida...
Ridiculous Sev. Gore tried what Franken got away with. Gore just didn't succeed in stealing the election.
Bush won every time.
This time, Franken lost, and ended up winning.
Comparing the two is not making your point.
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What is exactly "stupid" steve Wait you mean the comparison to disputed ballots/recounts/court challenges that eventually led to a supreme court hearing and ruling? O wait yes both cases had the EXACT same similarities....
Or you mean the the fact that Bush's Brother and Ms. I want to be a republican ambassador was in control of the recount/voting situation in Florida?
Maybe you missed the "sarcasm" in the statements about "knowing" one way or the other in either case who really won....
This is not about one party vs another more about the corruption of either party and how the voting system can be flawed to either parties advantage.
Whining and crying that Franken stole the election is about as silly as Whining and Crying that Bush Jr. stole the election.... Neither election was so dominant that either could claim victory so in a close situation I am just glad we have some sort of process that does not lead to violence/military action IE Honduras....
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What is exactly "stupid" steve Wait you mean the comparison to disputed ballots/recounts/court challenges that eventually led to a supreme court hearing and ruling? O wait yes both cases had the EXACT same similarities....
Or you mean the the fact that Bush's Brother and Ms. I want to be a republican ambassador was in control of the recount/voting situation in Florida?
Maybe you missed the "sarcasm" in the statements about "knowing" one way or the other in either case who really won....
This is not about one party vs another more about the corruption of either party and how the voting system can be flawed to either parties advantage.
Whining and crying that Franken stole the election is about as silly as Whining and Crying that Bush Jr. stole the election.... Neither election was so dominant that either could claim victory so in a close situation I am just glad we have some sort of process that does not lead to violence/military action IE Honduras....
Neither election was so dominant that either could claim victory so in a close situation I am just glad we have some sort of process that does not lead to violence/military action IE Honduras....
Wait 3 years when obama gets voted out.
i can see it now, Rodney King riots every major city
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Neither election was so dominant that either could claim victory so in a close situation I am just glad we have some sort of process that does not lead to violence/military action IE Honduras....
**************************************************
Obama may be a Honduras leftist pres who may have to be forcibly removed after cancelling our Constitution altogether.
That's how little I think of him as a human being.
He isn't even an American in his outlook, he's a leader of the world's leftists in our country.
He sucks.
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No surprise here. Both Party's cheat and bend whatever they can bend for their benefit.
This was an interesting piece from a mainstream media. However, it will never appear on National TV or 60 Minutes.
This was an interesting piece from a mainstream media. However, it will never appear on National TV or 60 Minutes.
It's from the WSJ editorial page, not the actual reporting side of the paper. There's a big difference.
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Franken is an embarassment. He is far worse then GWB. At least he was a real Governor. Franken is a friking clown. This is the future of the democraps? ROFLMFAO! Dems dead in 2012. Mark it down.
Franken is an embarassment. He is far worse then GWB. At least he was a real Governor. Franken is a friking clown. This is the future of the democraps? ROFLMFAO! Dems dead in 2012. Mark it down.
I wouldn't read too much into this, DieHard.
Remember that MN also elected Jesse Ventura as governor.
It is an 'odd' state and nobody believes that Franken is the future of anything.
It is what it is.
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What is exactly "stupid" steve Wait you mean the comparison to disputed ballots/recounts/court challenges that eventually led to a supreme court hearing and ruling? O wait yes both cases had the EXACT same similarities....
Or you mean the the fact that Bush's Brother and Ms. I want to be a republican ambassador was in control of the recount/voting situation in Florida?
Maybe you missed the "sarcasm" in the statements about "knowing" one way or the other in either case who really won....
This is not about one party vs another more about the corruption of either party and how the voting system can be flawed to either parties advantage.
Whining and crying that Franken stole the election is about as silly as Whining and Crying that Bush Jr. stole the election.... Neither election was so dominant that either could claim victory so in a close situation I am just glad we have some sort of process that does not lead to violence/military action IE Honduras....
What is exactly "stupid" steve Wait you mean the comparison to disputed ballots/recounts/court challenges that eventually led to a supreme court hearing and ruling? O wait yes both cases had the EXACT same similarities....
Or you mean the the fact that Bush's Brother and Ms. I want to be a republican ambassador was in control of the recount/voting situation in Florida?
Maybe you missed the "sarcasm" in the statements about "knowing" one way or the other in either case who really won....
This is not about one party vs another more about the corruption of either party and how the voting system can be flawed to either parties advantage.
Whining and crying that Franken stole the election is about as silly as Whining and Crying that Bush Jr. stole the election....
Which you guys have been doing for 9 years without any evidence.
Neither election was so dominant that either could claim victory so in a close situation I am just glad we have some sort of process that does not lead to violence/military action IE Honduras....
What is stupid is that I have no doubt Bush won Florida.
What evidence do you have otherwise?
None.
With the exception of a few most of the elections boards were Dems.
So if they are in charge of tossing a vote here and there sooner or later the count changes.
I assume Coleman won Minn and after months of dirty work voila.
I also asume the Dems in Florida were going to apply the same crooked count and after time a lotta votes would be miraculously found OR disappeared.
SC just said enough is enough.
But hey you have 60 Sev.
Time to fire up the excuse machine in earnest.
WSS
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I dont have squat Steve, you make an assumption of my party affiliation. I am a fiscal conservative first, social progressive second, military realist third.
I technically fit more toward the old GOP than toward new Dem politics. I more align with Colin Powell overall than Obama.
You dont have any evidence and neither do the dems that either party really won the florida election fairly. BOTH parties were up to shenanigans, one just happen to win out in a governor and secretary of state in influence.
I dont think Franken taking the 60th seat is as important as most might think, two dem senators are ill and their are a host of conservative dems that side with corporate america easily.
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I dont have squat Steve, you make an assumption of my party affiliation. I am a fiscal conservative first, social progressive second, military realist third.
I technically fit more toward the old GOP than toward new Dem politics. I more align with Colin Powell overall than Obama.
You dont have any evidence and neither do the dems that either party really won the florida election fairly. BOTH parties were up to shenanigans, one just happen to win out in a governor and secretary of state in influence.
I dont think Franken taking the 60th seat is as important as most might think, two dem senators are ill and their are a host of conservative dems that side with corporate america easily.
I dont have squat Steve, you make an assumption of my party affiliation. I am a fiscal conservative first, social progressive second, military realist third.
I make the assumption from your last years worth of posts. And the reality that you voted for the least fiscally conservative candidate in decades.
I technically fit more toward the old GOP than toward new Dem politics. I more align with Colin Powell overall than Obama.
Don't buy it. See above.
You dont have any evidence and neither do the dems that either party really won the florida election fairly.
Yes we do.
Bush won and the dems griped.
Pue and simple. What "dirty tricks" do you claim?
Hell if you want to play word games you can't "prove" Obama won fairly.
BOTH parties were up to shenanigans, one just happen to win out in a governor and secretary of state in influence.
I dont think Franken taking the 60th seat is as important as most might think, two dem senators are ill and their are a host of conservative dems that side with corporate america easily.
And we hate corporate America because...?
WSS
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you can buy whatever you want, I have and run multiple small/medium size business. Taxes affect me a TON
I served active duty and truly understand how violent the world really is and the need for smart military presence.
My problem is with Healthcare which for me is based on My morals and outlook on social standards, I happen to believe in balance in most aspects in life which also leads me to believe in being as envirementally balanced as I can be.
I have children and dont believe I need to live in such a way that can hurt their future. Koreans by culture are VERY conservative fiscally and socially.
I just happen to believe that it is my duty to contribute as much as i can to those who do not have as much. I believe I have a moral imperative to lead by example.
I am not a "christian" by any measure but that does not mean I am not socially conservative, just because I dont believe in judging others and enforcing my beliefs on others again does not mean I am not socially conservative.
My children at 10-11 still dont get to play ANY violent video games, they go with me to donate and give back to charity organizations. I have been called to task for being too strict on my children. They call EVERY stranger or non family Maam and Sir.
I dont like this defecit spending at all and extremely worried about inflation, I also worry about the added debt load and how this will affect our currency/etc...
I just dont see very many other options when we faced almost certain economic collapse when Obama was elected.
My posts on Bush Jr. was driven because he was SO UNLIKE his father and quite frankly my belief that if you cant run a business you are NOT qualified to be POTUS. I did not like Clinton, I liked Perot and Bush SR..... I really respect Mccain but Palin was too much like Bush for me.
You can try to pigeon hole me all you like.... good luck with that.
I am going to refuse to open up the Bush vs Gore Florida debacle because quite frankly there is loads of arguments and facts on BOTH sides that BOTH were up to no good and trying to influence the situation one way or the other. I do believe that Gore would and should have won Florida but it does not matter anymore.
Funny thing is that I HATE the welfare system as it is and think it needs to be massively adjusted to TEMPORARILY help, just like Unemployment which RUNS out.
I hate Affirmative action..... for all kinds of reason. I think it cheapens Minorities and lessens accomplishments of others like me who WORK HARD and earn it scholastically and professionally. I think its reverse racism and waters down our education system.
I dont like NEOCON's because I think their ideology is too mixed up with Religous mumbo jumbo and military interventionism to preempt POSSIBLE threats is quite frankly STUPID. That does not mean I am a liberal.
I just happen to believe in a Secular government and I dont care what other people do or who they do it with... its not my job to judge them.
So call me a "lib" or a "dem" or "left" leaning which is completely not true if you want because of my positions on specific platforms. Its not accurate but if it makes you feel like you analyzed my posts and now can discern my social/financial/political leanings go ahead.
I suggest you stay in Music because your analytic skills need some work.
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Perhaps, then, Sev, you might grow a little into yourself, and allow us to have different viewpoints on issues,
and NOT PIGEONHOLE us as "neocons", too.
But, with most liberals, what they believe in, is trying to coerce others into actually having to DO what THEY believe in.
"Don't tread on me" gotta find myself some of those bumper stickers...
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Perhaps, then, Sev, you might grow a little into yourself, and allow us to have different viewpoints on issues,
and NOT PIGEONHOLE us as "neocons", too.
But, with most liberals, what they believe in, is trying to coerce others into actually having to DO what THEY believe in.
"Don't tread on me" gotta find myself some of those bumper stickers...
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