Baker Mayfield

Browns149

@calfoxwc said:

I hadn't realized that. Seems dumb alright. The Packers defense is better with the pass, pretty poor vs the run..... I'm starting to think the Browns coaches are out-coaching themselves amid all the problems this year.

It does seem whatever game plan they come up with doesn’t get the job done at crunch time

Neo

@hish747 said:

Landry slipped because he tried to stop in his tracks to get back to an under thrown ball. It's 100% on Baker.

I know the resident football geniuses will blast me for this, but it seems like Landry was supposed to come back to the ball or at least Baker thought his was going to come back to the ball. Troy Aikman even Landry wasn't looking for the ball or didn't appear to be.

I even acknowledged Baker played like trash. But I stand firm this was not on Baker.

tiamat63

@dutch-oven said:

Watching the highlights of the Cardinals vs Colts game (I don't have NFL Network so I missed the game last night) and saw that Carson Wentz had a good game, so out of curiosity I looked up his stats for this season, because I hadn't really heard much how he's doing..

Wentz, who was given up for dead, has 25 touchdowns passes compared to 6 interceptions, and a QB rating of 96.4 in 2021.

I wonder if the Eagles wish they still had him... and while I'm not the biggest Baker fan, the Browns better make 100% sure they upgrade from him before making a change at the QB position.

Wentz is also the beneficiary of one of the best running games in the NFL. He isn't asked to shoulder much of the offense beyond what he is capable of.

Sounds familiar?

Browns149

@neo said:

I know the resident football geniuses will blast me for this, but it seems like Landry was supposed to come back to the ball or at least Baker thought his was going to come back to the ball. Troy Aikman even Landry wasn't looking for the ball or didn't appear to be.

I even acknowledged Baker played like trash. But I stand firm this was not on Baker.

If you watch the video, Landry puts up his hand, as he’s running into a deep wide area, he looks back and the ball is way under thrown. Obviously they were not on the same page, but when a receiver puts his hand up, and the QB is looking at him, most times that means throw it deep

Dutch Oven

@neo said:

I know the resident football geniuses will blast me for this, but it seems like Landry was supposed to come back to the ball or at least Baker thought his was going to come back to the ball. Troy Aikman even Landry wasn't looking for the ball or didn't appear to be.

I even acknowledged Baker played like trash. But I stand firm this was not on Baker.

You don't come back into an open spot in a zone defense.

You throw the ball to your receiver past the first level but before the second level. As been pointed out numerous times, Baker does not do a great job of anticipating windows or anticipating his receivers breaking open vs man-to-man. He doesn't lead receivers as much as he throws at them.

tiamat63

@dutch-oven said:

You don't come back into an open spot in a zone defense.

I'm going to stop you right there, that isn't ALWAYS* accurate.

The half field sprint out Baker was running can be one such a case. Ultimately we won't know until the All-22 comes out and somebody (who are we kidding? Likely it'll be me) goes back over it several times.

jiggins7919

@dutch-oven said:

You don't come back into an open spot in a zone defense.

You throw the ball to your receiver past the first level but before the second level. As been pointed out numerous times, Baker does not do a great job of anticipating windows or anticipating his receivers breaking open vs man-to-man. He doesn't lead receivers as much as he throws at them.

Baker was supposed to throw it over the top, as there was no over the top help. Could've been a TD, but obviously we all know Baker can't throw TD passes over 3 yards. Landry expected it to be over the top, which is why he was so shocked that the ball was a comeback and he fell on his ass. Again, nobody over the top. Fail.

Dutch Oven

@tiamat63 said:

I'm going to stop you right there, that isn't ALWAYS* accurate.

The half field sprint out Baker was running can be one such a case. Ultimately we won't know until the All-22 comes out and somebody (who are we kidding? Likely it'll be me) goes back over it several times.

I meant on that play, where Landry is jetting down the sidelines.

To think he's going to run past a defender, past the open area, and into the second level, stop on a dime, and come back to the open area on that specific play IMO isn't real likely. If Baker wanted to hit him in that open area, then hit him on the run past level one but before level two.

Neo

Did anyone else notice DPJ was wide open on that play?

Bob806

@berniesuperbowl2 said:

. But the Browns absolutely have to see what it would take for Rodgers, R. Wilson, or D. Watson. We're not winning a Super Bowl with Baker, ever.

I'm speculating that Wilson is on the decline. He, like Baker this season had/has injury problems. He also has DK Metcalf, Lockett. Not much happening with that offense. And yes, Wilson is a winner and proven commodity, I just wonder if a change of scenery sparks him, or has he lost the fire that made him great?

Rodgers, wouldn't shock me if he left GB, but to come here I doubt it. Browns would have to really break the bank- doesn't seem like something Berry & DePodesta would do.

Watson's situation is so unsettled. Anywhere he lands would be a potential PR nightmare, and his contract is sky high. I read somewhere, I think on profootballtalk.com that legal stuff with him would begin in late January/February. Once that settles, then he & his agent start a plan for him...hopefully it won't be an orchestrated " I'm going to _____" like OBJ, but I can see it happening.

ATOM

@bob806 said:

I'm speculating that Wilson is on the decline. He, like Baker this season had/has injury problems. He also has DK Metcalf, Lockett. Not much happening with that offense. And yes, Wilson is a winner and proven commodity, I just wonder if a change of scenery sparks him, or has he lost the fire that made him great?

Wilson had his best years when he had a strong running game and a good D, sound familiar ? and would be a huge up grade over baker

Kvoethe

..needs to go

Bob806

@atom said:

Wilson had his best years when he had a strong running game and a good D, sound familiar ? and would be a huge up grade over baker

As long as he's motivated & healthy yes, a huge upgrade.

calfoxwc

from watching the beginning of the ratbirds vs bengals game just now....

the ratbirds lost both starting qbs, signed some guy that has been with

13 different teams......

put him on the field, and HE throws right down the field to wide open Bateman, wide open Andrews, wide open Brown, open Bateman, ....etc for a TD.

Bateman, and Brown were all first round draft picks. Andrews, TE, 3rd round. and Sammy Watkins was a first round draft pick.

So, apprently, it doesn't matter who the qb is for the ratbirds....

just sayin......

BTW, the Bucs lost wr's Godwin and Evans to injury - and and Antonio Brown was still finishing suspension.... the Bucs lost 9-0.

hoorta

@neo said:

Did anyone else notice DPJ was wide open on that play?

Yeah, that's been well documented with one read Baker. He was rolling out, and already had his mind made up where he was going with the ball. I pointed out in a different game he went deep into double coverage, and on the other side of the field he had either Hooper or Njoku with no one within 10 yards of them for a walk in touchdown.

tiamat63

@calfoxwc said:

from watching the beginning of the ratbirds vs bengals game just now....

You only watched the opening drive then and proceeded to shut your eyes immediately after.

See how Josh Johnson has been playing since when the Cincy defense isn't exchanging yards for time?

He's at 47% since that drive.

jbluhm86

Browns already picked up Baker's 5th year option, so he's locked in as starting QB next year, whether we like it or not Berry and co. have the philosophy of building through the draft, so unless the Browns get an amazing sweetheart deal from another team, picking up an established QB like Rodgers or Wilson is highly unlikely due to the cost. Best course of action would be to draft a QB in this year's draft and let him sit for a year to assimilate the system. Then, if Baker doesn't improve next year, the Browns can cut bait cleanly and have a QB who's firmly established in their system. There really isn't a blue-chipper in this year's QB class, but I could see the Browns using a 2nd rounder on a QB like Riddle from UC.

calfoxwc

@tiamat63 said:

You only watched the opening drive then and proceeded to shut your eyes immediately after.

See how Josh Johnson has been playing since when the Cincy defense isn't exchanging yards for time?

He's at 47% since that drive.

So, I fell asleep. lol. Good call... dammit. Great food. My Wife told me how it ended. Now, We'll see the Chiefs play without Kelce and how it goes. Great Christmas food leftovers! And my own recipe pumpkin pie .... is way too good.

Browns149

If Desaun Watson isn’t in jail, he is who the Browns need to go after. He is actually 5 months younger then Baker

And he is a proven, pro bowl player. With MVP potential.
Plus he is already signed to a contract, that by next year, will be team friendly

Unsympathetic

@bob806 said:

I'm speculating that Wilson is on the decline. He, like Baker this season had/has injury problems

At zero moments in Wilson's entire career has he had an OL as good as the worst one the Browns trotted out in the last 3 seasons. Even in Hawks one title season they were bottom-10 in OL [even though that crew was the most expensive OL] and the last few years Seattle has spent proving the thing we've said for years throughout this forum --- spending lots on QB/WR and having a Ghoolie OL [nothing] does not a SB win.

Yes, we don't have WR.. that's what a draft and targeted FA can fix quick enough.. but we do have [and hopefully can continue to have] everything else with a Wilson.