(1) Paxton Lynch-nfl body, + athleticism, + arm talent, good production, played in offense that despite being a spread has NFL/WCO passing concepts (same offense as Andy Dalton)

(2) Connor Cook-nfl body, decent athleticism, decent arm talent, very good production, played in true NFL offense

(3) Carson Wentz-nfl body, + athleticism, good arm talent, good production, played in a true NFL offense BUT played with a decided schematic and organization advantage over competition

(4) Jared Goff-needs to bulk up, decent athleticism, decent arm talent, top production, played in a spread air raid offense and will have to transition into NFL offense

(5) Brandon Allen-smaller frame, average athleticism, average arm, good production, played in true NFL offense

I am excited to see what a healthy Griffin can do with a HC and coaching staff that believes in him. Griffin's greatest downfall in Washington was the fact that the front office hired a HC that wasn't committed to him.

From what I've seen watching literally every snap of Griffin's career, he remains one of the most talented QB I've every seen.

He has exceptional arm talent that can throw to all levels of the field with a flick of the wrist, he has a quick release, he's accurate. He's a good ball handler, excellent throwing on the run and can adlib to throw downfield.

However he's still learning how to execute a rhythm drop back west coast passing offense. He came from a spread-zone read offense at Baylor and as a rookie played in a Pistol read-option offense. It wasn't until his 3rd season with Jay Gruden did he play in an exclusively west coast passing offense and he was only given 5 games before being benched, only 2 which were actually bad.

When Griffin understands the play concept and where to go with the ball he's not just good he's incredible.

Some of his flaws. When he's unsure/doesn't trust what he sees he holds the ball and looks uncomfortable in the pocket and takes sacks. Surprisingly despite all Griffin's athleticism he has little to no "juke" to his running style you rarely seem him even attempt to make a defender miss. He's a straight line runner that needs to improve at avoiding contact.

I think right now, if Griffin were to be plugged into an offense like the Bills he could put up equal to if not better numbers then Tyrod Taylor. Or if inserted into an offense like the Chiefs he could put up similar numbers to Alex Smith and quickly surpass his level production.

@tour2ma said:

I hate this shit! How about first we let a QB show us he is worth building an O around?

What do you hate and why do you hate it?

Oh,this must be the part where we ignore Griffin's actual stats and replace them with empty rhstoric and pretend like he hasn't shown his talent. Am I right?

The perception of Griffin is much worse then the actual production....but perception is reality anymore.

Good pick up, expecially if they build offense around him. But really the best thing that can happy for everyone is Josh Gordon to reinstated.

I'll try to keep this short. But it does require some preamble before I get to the point.

Full disclosure I'm a Washington Redskins fan but also a fan of the NFL.
Huge football fan, both college and NFL.
I started watching A&M b/c of their offense with Jerrod Johnson then Ryan Tannehill then Manziel.

Draftnerd too.
I think you guys had a good draft one of my favorite prospects with ILB Christian Kirksey who imho has a skillset that rivals 1st round pick Ryan Shazier. And stole Terrence West local kid(Baltimore) out of Towson University.

As a Redskin's fan I have some knowledge of Kyle's offense.(if you're interested)
.

I'm posting because I have a some questions that imho require a local perspective.

Being a Redskin's fan an enduring the circus that went on last year I know how the national media can get a story wrong.

So, I was hoping to find out the local perception of how your owner and front office are handling Manziel.

Cheers to a (hopefully) good season.

@the-gipper said:

.......I am not sure how you may have misinterpreted that to think I was jumping into your shit. I just wasn't buying any of your premises.

Me neither, lol...

@the-gipper said:

...So get the fuck over it. No one gives a shit about what the view from outside looks like. This is fucking Cleveland, not some pusswad city.

@tour2ma said:

Local view varies with the individual's temperature due to JM fever....

But, yes, there are noobs that need to stfu.

Your is the closest to a reply that I've received.

But still don't know a thing about how Browns fans feel about how their 1st round QB is being handled by their current regime.

@the-gipper said:

I don't think any of that shit means a cabbage fart...

Sweet!

Oh, wait let me guess....your the internet tough guy huh? That's your schtick right? Amiright or amiright? Lol, what a joke.

@the-cysko-kid said:

The national media is nothing more than a circus that would do anything they can to disrupt the browns training camps and turn the whole off season into a farce. The browns are doing the right thing by telling them to hit the bricks.

@the-gipper said:

No, we think that the National Media are idiots and have no clue how a coaching staff or front office need to handle a football team....and for the most part I think we are right. They are just whining because they didn't get full access. Too bad.

Right, right. Like I said, I'm well aware of the national media when it comes to the local team. My post wasn't about whether or not the national media is allowed to cover Manziel.

I was hoping to find out the local perception of how your owner and front office are handling Manziel.

From the outside it looks pretty shoddy.

(a) can't keep things in-house

( over reacting to Manziel 'celebrity' by telling him to 'act like a back-up' and '...this isn't hollywood' etc

seem to be going out of their way to show that Manziel is 'substantially behind' Hoyer

It seems like the front office is creating the spotlight they are trying to quell.

It seems as if Haslam and Farmer are media noobs that need to stfu.

Just wondering what the local view is on Manziel's handling by the front office.

First and foremost I'm a Washington Redskins fan and overall fan of the NFL.

^^Full disclosure^^

I live in Baltimore.

But, I am also a huge football fan. I watch some college and a ton of the NFL w/ NFL package on Direct TV.

I started watching A&M b/c of their offense with Jerrod Johnson then Ryan Tannehill then Manziel.

I am also a fan of Terrence West ofTowson and local Bmore kid.

I'm also a draftnerd and you guys got one of my favorite prospects with ILB Christian Kirksey who imho has a skillset that rivals 1st round pick Ryan Shazier.

As a Redskin's fan I have some knowledge of Kyle's offense.

I came to this board to keep tabs on Manziel.

The national media is turning your Front Office's handling of Manziel into a joke.

And wanted to find out if this is true at the local level.

Being a Redskin's fan I'm well aware of how local and national perceptions can be very different.

Just wanted to get the skinny.

Cheers to a (hopefully) good season.

It depends on the QB and whether or not Anthony has lost his speed.

I am a Washington Redskins fan.

So I witness Armstrong come on from out of no where in 2010 playing with McNabb iirc lead the leage in ypc.

44 catches 871yard 19.8 ypc

But 2011 Rex Grossman comes in and some other WRs and he got pushed down the depth chart and moved on the next year.

@choco said:

wrt 3 rookies being weedens benefit? lets just say colt had a bunch of rookies too....and he sucked. point being, you dont depend on rookies. you hope....but it seems many are expecting things from these kids before even stepping on the field. cart before the horse, methinks.

You know what?

I deserve the condescension in your reply.

I did not know that Bevell called the plays for the Vikes after 2006.

Which completely changes my opinion of Childress a playcaller.

I was clearly wrong on that point, not to mention being a jack arse about it.

My point was Weeden will have weapons that Colt McCoy did not which is quite obvious.

Now whether they pan out is another story.

But clearly 1st round pick/2nd round picks are drafted to make an immediate impact.

Dude, we're talking about Trent Richardson here.

And Schwartz was a 2nd rounder IIRC and 2nd round OL are expected to make an immediate impact.

@choco said:

Lol....3 of those poibts are rookies....the other has only ever called plays one year of his career. Shurmur is more senior in that regard.

lol, i'm scratching my head as to what your point is....because the players I mentioned are rookies they can't help the Browns offense?

Your second point is flat out incorrect.

Brad Childress has not only called plays for more then 1 season he has more experience in coaching (even as a HC) then Pat Shurmur.

Get your facts straight.

Maybe Brandon Weeden will be much superior to Colt...he will need to be, because if they have another do nothing offense, then who will get the blame? A rookie QB/RB or the coach/GM/Pres.

Brandon Weeden has a lot going for him that Colt did not:

o Trent Richardson 'nuff said

o Brad Childress as OC instead of Pat Shurmur

o Mitchell Schwartz

o Josh Gordon

What do you guys think is gonna happen to McCoy?

Trade? Release?

I bet he ends up on the Packers, I remember McCarthy liked him coming out of the draft.

@wrrebel said:

The difference is Bradford has the ideal arm and size for the nfl..

So, if McCoy had what you perceive to be ideal arm and nfl size you would be okay with not drafting Weeden and keeping him as your starter?

Also, if Bradford has the ideal arm and size why hasn't he been significantly more productive then McCoy thus far in their careers?

I am a visiting Redskins fan.

I'm just curious about how Browns fans feel about Colt McCoy and Mike Holmgren.

From the outside looking in it seems like McCoy had potential but only produced to the level of the talent around and scheme around him.

And thanks to Holmgren/Shurmur the talent and the coaching wasn't very good.

And now it seems like they're tieing their lack of success around Colt McCoy's neck to shift the blame away from themselves.

I find the differing perceptions between Colt McCoy and Sam Bradford interesting.

Other then McCoy playing in a much more difficult division their career production this far has been similar if not identical.

Yet McCoy is getting the axe as a starter and Bradford is entering this seasonn as the unquestioned starter.

Must be good to be a 1st round pick and benefit from being perceived as a franchise QB.