Apparently the owner agreed with you and attributed all that poor attitude to the HC........and quite possibly the HC deserved some of the blame for that........but then do did the GM/Prez/asst. coaches/players.

Yep

@naplesbrowns420 said: Actually Gipper, I think I know you. You went on that game-bus to Miami, right? I was the dude badgering the bus driver to stop at the gas station on the way back so I could keep throwing beer down the hatch. No, sorry, that was not me. I am from NE Ohio. Zombo lives in Naples.

It is a bit like asking a single guy why he doesnt try for Kate Perry since she is also single currently .....

Does anyone really believe that our offense could have did anything with it if we had gotten the ball back with 2 minutes left, no time outs and pat shurmur on the sideline? Taylor made a huge mistake regardless and he knows it, and no amount of team compassion and comforting is going change how this kid feels about his miscue and we all have to chalk it up as a hard learned rookie lesson, considering taylor has not been penalized much this year for being a rookie speaks for itself and he has learned about the hard count and what not to do, this will be beneficial over time and its better he experienced it in a useless game during a bad season than later next year in an important game with meaning .. Get over it, Holmgren has no intent of firing shurmur or heckert.. And randy lerner could care less either way..

@navysteve_browns4life said: You really gotta hand it to Shurmur for that clock management at the end of the half. Just when I've typifying seen it all. This team never ceases to amaze me! So simple, a cave man could do it

There you go McCoy! Just keep your eyes on one receiver!

It has to be pretty frustrating as a player to see your team with 4th and a yard, or less, and see the punt team trot out. It's only a division game...it's only Baltimore... Baltimore had two fourth downs in the first quarter and what did they do? They went for it of course. They showed Harbaugh next to the special teams coach and he asked him if he wanted the punt team out there. The look Jim gave his coach was one of like, "Are you serious?". Much like when I asked my Dad to borrow money... Pittsburgh had four 4th and shorts against KC last weekend and did they punt? Heck No! That sends a message! Your players and the players on Cleveland want the game in their hands and go down fighting. Not punt the ball way from Baltimore's own 42 yd line with less than yd to pick up the first. No wonder Hillis is pissed!!!

@navysteve_browns4life said: Turning the corner? Gimme a break! We can't even put one in the endzone against a 1-7 team... Well they are better than your Average 1-7 team. IMHO. You guys just need some Weapons. I dont think its Blow it up time.

@choco said: a FG would have never been necessary if murmur actually possessed a sac.... THIS!

@choco said: i get all that mikey....but the power of hindsight has proved that burning the cap on all those "playmakers" would not have been a worthwhile investment. would you feel any better having made those moves and we still be 3-4? i say this because many of our problems now are not a direct result of a lack of talent. having expensive guys on this roster is not gonna make shurmur a more effective coach, isn't gonna fix poor game planning, or make the offense less predictable. its not gonna make noodles suddenly a franchise QB, read the field better, or start throwing the ball better. the problems we face are growing pains of a new system and poor coaching/teaching of that new system. all the talent in the world will not make shurmur a good coach...only time can help there. I addressed "Noodles" in another thread and why you've seen fall off from him and little to nothing from our WR's. I figured not having an off season would've hurt us. As should all of you. The poor game planning is a direct result of no off season. That's the first step of every season is to evaluate talent in the off season. That's helps with game planning which includes play calling. In order to have an effective play caller on the sidelines he needs to know what personnel he can use in a given set. If you have a bunch of possession receivers throwing down field is gonna be like ice skating up hill. If you have all speed and no possession guys third and long is gonna be rough unless you got some receivers that can make the entire defense miss. I see where a lot of you guys are coming from some think it's a FA thing (has something to do with it). Others think it's coaching and play calling (product of no off season with a complex offense and the D is holding it down seeing how much they're on the field). It's a combination of a lot of things fellas. I said in the beginning of the season it was gonna be vanilla this year unless the whole offense clicked right off the rip. They didn't and we're below .500 again. Do I like it...hell no. But will this change next season...I think that it can and that it should. The best way to go about this is...if anything fellas...root for us because we're the underdogs. If we win be satisfied with the win...we all know we're not dropping any 50 burgers anytime this season so be satisfied with a win ugly or not. If we battle a good team...and don't get stomped...grumble and be pissed but move on to next week. I know this is frustrating but these kids are playing hard and that's something we haven't seen in a long time. I know they played hard for Mangini too but I mean before that. This is a good group on this board and I think good things are going to happen but not with knee jerk reactions.

I agree: Hillis, McCoy and maybe Moore.

Homotron said: I obviously meant choked you stupid xxxx. Please scour my other posts for misspelled words. You'll be looking for a while. As for the other people that have replied since I last have are concerned. I at no point downplayed the Steeler organizations involvement in Ben. However it's equally ignorant to claim that some of the main reasons he's good is because of Bill Cowher and the Steeler defense. It's simply not true. Sure the defense is a great asset but the defense isn't leading the team to victory in the 4th quarter. The defense isn't making the game saving plays to put us in the lead. Just as Cowher's involvement with Ben all things considered would likely be listed under "minimal". As I said before Ken Anderson had a much greater hand. Yes Ben is a product of the Steelers but to imply that he isn't his own man and ridiculously skilled is short sited and equally bias. I also think more Steeler fans than you think would take Ben. I know my primary Steeler board would because as I've said 10 times already Manning wouldn't have survived behind our offensive line. Period. "OH but he knows the defenses before the defense does, he's Peyton Manning" lol Of course,Most Stooler fans are blinded by Piss and black lenses like you...

Playmakers my loyal family! Mangini has done a great job w/ a certain type of player playing for us, but it's not enough. I'm pointing out the fact that we need some real NFL speed at impact positions. As of now, we don't.

@navysteve_browns4life said:This was absolutely the worst 60 minutes of football I've seen. no disrespect Navy Steve, but if you really mean that then you haven't seen much football lol. i think you were probably just fired up when you wrote that. when you still have needs at multiple positions and have banged-up starters all over your gonna see that. CLE without Cribbs is like PGH without Troy P., sad but true. @navysteve_browns4life said:WTF Daboll? WTF Mangini? WTF Offense? WTF Defense? WTF CLEVELAND!!! don't forget WTF Specials!! they played like shit too.

I already posted something about Wright on another thread. But I would love to see him benched for a game or 2. He gives up way to many catches and scores.

Quitting ? No. That is just how much talent we have on the offense and the fact that our reliable players are having injury bugs is not helping either. If Wallace and Hillis were healthy, this game would have been much closer for all you know.