@rich4eagle said:

Sony good to here from you. Please call because I lost your phone number in my accident. I liked some of your post. Yes in toto the Browns stink. That is mostly remnants of Savage. Not sure if Mangini sucks or has potential, he inherited the biggest mismanagement I have ever seen in football in Savage. yet Savage was saluted for three years as really really building the team. I got hammered on three sites for wanting him gone three months into his debacle. Our guy, the monitors Riffer, was adulating how great Savage was.

The "In Savage WE Trust" flag was flying high while I called him Sewage which he was

I lilke the idea of not having players who are 35 and with a 100 pounds of blubber or head cases..............Mangini and worked some of those issues

The biggest issue I have with what you just said is Quinn.........he stinks and is a loser........and not two long ago you quipped he was better than sliced bread

Are you admitting you blew if big time on Quinn..............I hope so cause he sucks ........anyway, you are still one of the best football guys I know

Merry Christmas Rich, I will contact you

I admit Brady Quinn is not a NFL starting quarterback.......he is terrible

Quinn has won 2 games in his career as a starter and he is yet to throw for 100 yards in each of his 2 victories

I was wrong about Quinn I thought he would be good but after last season I came to admit I was wrong about Quinn, this guy is a loser

Quinn has had 1 good game this season against Detroit, against San Diego he put up some yards in garbage time, he did nothing aginst the Steelers or Chiefs

People must realize the most important thing in the WCO is accuracy by the quarterback and Quinn does not have it

The starting quarterback for the Browns in 2010 is not on the Browns roster today

Rich we have no offensive playmakers and you have people wanting to draft defense again....uh uh uh

Btw, I told you last year Mangini is terrible....Here is the thing with Mangini he can coach but you are not going to win many games with a guy like Mangini

after he is fired by the Browns Mangini will never get another head coaching job in the NFL

@flugel said:

Very good points!

IMO, the difference between Parcells taking over 1-15 vrs Holmgren taking over this team is in the response the Head Coach is getting from his players as the season went from halfway point toward the end. There's improvement, momentum, a winning streak and we even beat Pittsburgh for the first time in the last 13 tries. Not only that, but we did all this after some key players were injured and/or traded even in spite of some shakey QBing. If the 2nd half of the season went like the first half of the season - I think Holmgren would arrive at the same no-brainer Parcells arrived with changing Head Coaches. Alo, I'm actually enjoying what I'm seeing from this team.

Do you want to know what has never waivered this year? Discipline in the form of how infrequently we're penalized. It's so much better than recent years where it felt like it was always either first 1st and 15 or 1st and 20. Not only that but I don't think I've ever seen out punt teams pinning opponents inside their 10 yard line as much as I have seen this year. We've done that most recently without Dave Zastudil. If that's not enough, our return game is second to none.

I can't even begin to tell you HOW MUCH a young player like Rubin has improved from last year to this year. He used to stand straight up at the snap and lose position. NOW he's playing with great leverage and doing a nice job on the nose. That's coaching. How about backups stepping or guys playing new positions while we don't see any dropoff?

I've been impressed at what Mangini has done with the deck he was dealt. It's easy to forget we only had 5 draft picks in 2008 and we were only slated for 4 draft picks in 2009. If you look at how many 2008 starters we have starting at this time on offense here you go:

1. Joe Thomas

2. Eric Steinbach

3. Lawrence Vickers

If we look at 2008 starts on defense starting now - here you be:

1. Wimbley

2. Williams

3. Wright

4. McDonald

Out of 22 starters from 2008, there's only a continuity sum of 7 remaining today. Just when you think it couldn't get even more bizaare, our starting place kicker and punter were/are out for extended periods.

Speaking of good scouts, I'm looking forward to reading all your goodies about the top prospects from now until the draft. You spoiled us last year with countless video clips and informative articles. There won't be a shortage of things to talk about now that we're already into the Bowl Season.

- Tom F.

Flugels, Here is where I disagree with you, You say you like the way the team is playing for Mangini, did you ever think that some of these guys are playing for jobs next year with the Browns and for other NFL teams to get a look at them

There is no pressure on this team to win we have been out of the playoff picture so long ago its much easier to play/win when there is no pressure to win

You speak of Mangini and the draft choices he got us, Tom our draft STUNK, we traded out of the #5 spot bypassed numerous playmakers such as Harvin, Maclin, Clay Mathews ect who could have helped this year while we selected a Center, I don't think you ever select a center in the 1st round, Veikune has not got on the field, Robiske has been a BUST he has done nothing, looking at the draft Tom what did we get that makes you so excited? MoMass and Mack?

Tom there were guys late in the season who only saw the field because of injuries, Moore the tight end only was promoted from the practice squad because of injuries, same with Bernard and a few other players, otherwise we would have seen more of tiptoe Jamal at running back, and Royal at tight end, Mangini never gave these young guys a chance because he wanted to, he only played them because of injuries

You talk of the 11 draft picks this year, most of the 11 draft choices are 5th and 6th round picks, so how many contributions do you really expect us to get? you seem to think Mangini got us all these extra picks where we can net top prospects whereas we got a bunch of 5th and 6th round picks.

On defense we still can't stop the run, we still can't stop the pass

People say I don't want to tear it down and start over again....Tell me what are we tearing down and starting over?

Do you call wins agains a bad Steeler team, and wins against the Chiefs and maybe a bad Raider team and that win against the Bills progress by Mangini or has he likes to sell people its a process have you forgot its a 16 game season and for the first 12 games we STUNK and tell me what team have we defeated with a winning record?

Do you realize our starting QB (Quinn) until he was injured has won 2 NFL games as a starter and not throw for over 100 yards in each of his 2 victories

Lets hope Holmgren comes and builds this team the correct way because we don't have anything to tear down and start over.

@alo said:

A year ago, we were talking about how the Savage-Crennel experiment failed because there was a disconnect between the players brought in and the ones desired by the head coach.

Now, people here think it'd be desirable to have Holmgren and/or his chosen GM drafting 3-4 personnel for Mangini, something they've likely got little experience doing. Similarly, Mangini would be asked to oversee a WCO or, like Crennel, give up all of his authority on the offensive side of the ball.

Do we really want to go back to the Crennel-Savage situation? Are you all confident that Mangini and Holmgren both are great & magnanimous football guys, to the point that they can make a management structure that screwed up the previous regime work?

It seems like we're unlearning the lessons of 2005-2008. And I'm not sure we should expect Holmgren to wipe clean his memory bank as well: he's already said that the existence of factions in Seattle - people who were already there before him vs. people he brought in - affected the quality of his 1999 draft class.

I'm not sure he'll want to repeat that by having his OC calling for WCO playmakers, while Mangini is screaming that a certain player is a perfect fit for a defensive scheme Holmgren isn't intimately familiar with. Absent some luck, which the Browns haven't had much of as of late, that seems like a recipe for disaster.

Alo, I agree 100% what you are saying, what I don't understand is people talking about keeping Mangini as though they forgot the first 12 games of the season when we did not look like a NFL team on offense, then we beat the Steelers in terrible conditions and a terrible Chiefs team and now we should give Mangini another season I just don't get. I seem to think with the pressure off to win its alot easier to win past 2 games and also we beat a Steelers team that lost to the Chiefs, Raiders and Bears...this is not a good Steeler team and a Chiefs team we needed 2 Cribbs returns for TD's or we lose.

You make a great point about Holmgren and Mangini being totally different, if you wanted things to remain the same with Mangini, then why hire Holmgren?

I would like to see Holmgren clean house with everything associated with the losing culture and bring in his own people and finally we will have a offense to be excited about since Chuds 1 good year.

How is Holmgren going to be able to get players for a guy like Mangini who does not run a WCO or 4-3 defense both things that Holmgren is most experienced with. I just don't see the 2 working together as a good match

@earl34 said:

From NFL.com....certainly, there is enough speculation that Mangini and Holmgren are NOT mutually exclusive

Lets hope if Holmgren agrees to take the job that Mangini and his entire staff is shown the door

Bye Bye Mangini and your terrible assistants

Seems to me we should set our expectations higher than beating the Steelers for Mangini to stay, has everyone forgot how this team has looked in losing 11 games before we beat the Steelers? I have seen some High Schools with much better offenses and schemes on offense than Mangini's 2009 version.

We play 2 bad teams in the Chiefs and Raiders and a very average Jags team to close the season so even going 3-0 or 2-1 is not enough for me to want to see Mangini return. The way I see things we beat a Steeler team that lost to the Raiders and Chiefs, and a poor Buffalo team thats already fired there head coach so beating the Raiders and Chiefs and maybe the Jags does not convince me that Mangini should get another year. No Browns team has been more brutal to watch than this season, for most of the season we looked like a division 2 college team on offense and thats all on Mangini.

The other thing that bothers me is guys like Evan Moore, Jennings, Bernard the only reason we are seeing these guys is because of injuries, if not for injuries Mangini would still be running Lewis, Royal and other veteran like the stiffs we got from the Jets who have contributed nothing on the field this season.

I think its sad that the best linebacker we have playing is Roth who we picked up off waivers, and Trusnik a guy who never played anything but special teams for the Jets.

@rambro said:

Hi Guys,

As a Rams fan, I definitely feel your pain over another tough season. My question deals with Brady Quinn and what you think the Browns organization would accept in trade for him. Although I realize that he's no Dan Fouts, I find it hard to believe that he's terrible either. Despite it being difficult to grade Quinn (considering the O-line play, lack of a running game, and no WR's), I think that Mangini wants to dump him. And after the mid-season benching, I don't believe that Quinn can fully trust him either.

Like the Browns, I feel as though the Rams can provide him with a maturing O-line for protection. But unlike the Browns, I believe that our running game has the potential to open things up for him more than what he's seen during his tenure with Cleveland. Although I'll take more, I'm only looking for solid - not great, but solid QB play out of Quinn.

What would be your reaction to the Rams offering up a 4th rounder for Quinn?

I will answer your question in 2 ways:

1. If any GM would trade a high draft choice for Brady Quinn with the idea of Quinn becoming a starter it would not be a wise move.

2. Browns fans have continued to say Quinn has had only 10 starts and needs more time, how many starts do you have to give a guy to show that he is not the quarterback to lead your team. I have seen nothing in Quinn to convince me he will be anything but a backup QB in the NFL

BQ has very poor accuracy, is afraid to throw the ball downfield more than 15 yards and his accuracy past 15 yards is terrible, if we wish to continue to be a losing team then continue to play Quinn and hope he becomes a decent QB, me I have seen enough of BQ to see he is nothing more than a career NFL backup QB. IMO the Browns starting QB for 2010 is not currently on the roster.

I keep hearing everyone so excited that we have 11 draft picks in the 2010 draft, while its good to have this many picks we have only 4 first day picks which are one pick in rounds one and two and 2 picks in round 3. The remaining picks are all late round picks so how does everyone feel with just 4 first day picks that this draft is going to turn this team around.

Most teams are fortunate to get 2 starters from each draft and in the Browns case with only 4 first day picks and the way we have drafted and with the way Mangini drafted last season I don't see much help from 11 draft picks, yea the 1st and 2nd round picks should come and contribute immediately but with most 3rd round picks you are looking at projects or backup players and the percentage of players that make a impact after being selected in the 3rd round is not very high and the remaining 7 picks are all late round picks we might get 1 or 2 players who contribute but how much can you expect from guys taken in the 4th, 5th or 6th rounds.

This team has too many holes and this draft alone won't fill all the needs we have, as we stand today we don't have one offensive playmaker on this team so unless we plan on being active in free agency I just don't see it happening for a few years and Btw how many free agents do you really believe want to play for Mangini if he's the coach or come into this situation. We still need a new RG, RT, RB, WR, OLB, CB, S and QB thats 8 new starters and I doubt that because of his contract Steinbach is back next year which means we need a LG.

I know many people will disagree but if we could get a 1st round pick for Shaun Rogers he should be traded this offseason, we are terrible againt the run with Rogers so how bad will we be without him if we can upgrade at the linebacker positions, by the time the Browns are ready to win consistantly how much will Rogers have left.

@kosar_for_president said:

Good point. They were talking about this on the radio the other day. Mangini is the true GM. Which might be why our team sucks so bad. Dude needs to concentrate on the field and who is going to replace Daboll. I seriously want to punch Daboll in his face.

Taxi!

The only reason Daboll is the offensive coordinator is because

1. Mangini can tell him what to do, keep things conservative, The Jets offense was the same boring offense under Mangini, Mangini would like to win every game 13-10

2. No experience offensive coordinator will work for Mangini

Now you and I and all the fans can see that Daboll is terrible why can't Lerner and Mangini see this?

@solon16 said:

wow...nice with the name calling...good to speak with you too. we have bombed 10 str8 years on the draft....this year zero difference...never ever take a center in the first round...he may be great but onother huge mistake. I see nothing, absolutely nothing about our second rounders to say it isn't a complete busted draft. I hope I'm wrong....doubt it highly

Solon, you will never win arguing with some people here,we have zero players on offense and we passed up offensive playmakers to trade down to select a center, we got out of this draft a receiver who can't get separation (Robiske) a college defensive end moved to lb, a raw rookie Massaquoi trying to be a number 1 receiver and a center and folks are calling this a great draft.

Also all this talk about we got 11 draft picks, do people actually realize that most of these 11 draft picks in 2010 are late round draft choices so tell me how are these draft picks taken in the 4th, 5th and 6 rounds going to offer much help to this team.

We have a offense that looks like some pee wee football team, we have a inept offense that struggles to score 10 points a game and I see people hear saying lets draft defense in the first 3 rounds, guess what if you can't score points I don't care how good your defense is you won't win, no defense is going to shutout teams every week and in the AFC North you have Rothlisberger, Palmer and Flacco so you better be able to score some points because all 3 of those teams will score points

@alendor said:

seing as it seems that mangini was lucky not to lose his job too. i doubt lerner would promote him.

Looking at the way things just happened it seems like Lerner is believing all the crap Mangini is feeding him

Can anyone answer this question, When Kokinis was hired from the Ravens I thought he could only come to the Browns if was given complete control of the 53 man roster and the draft along with final say in trades, with the title of GM which makes this a promotion from his duties with the Ravens, if thats the case how will the Browns get away without action from the NFL if proven as it seems that Kokinis actually had no power and that he was just given a title of GM to get him to leave the Ravens.

Might the NFL be looking at fining the Browns for doing something like this.

Seems all the power has been with Mangini and Kokinis was just a puppet for Mangini.

Dawgfanforever88 said:

Honestly, look at the jets that team is not without talent, and mangini did pretty well 2 out of the 3 years he was there.(a lot better then what Rex Ryan is doing imo) He is not a bad coach he has just been left with crap on this team and now he is fixing it, give him time. The first problem mangini has is the talent level on this team the second and most brutal is the media they talk and talk and talk and fill your head with all there crappy opinions, and you know what they don't matter really they're just mad that they are locked out from all the good info they used to get from Phil savage and romeo. The media will shut up when we start winning (see: Bill Belichick and the New England patriots) and the wins will come trust me. Just be patient guys I know its rough right now, and for the love of god don't listen to idiot jets fans.

You say when we win, what makes you believe with Mangini we will win? I just want to know why you have so much confidence in Mangini

Just last year we had a team many felt was on the brink of being a playoff contender, Mangini came in and got rid of 2 playmakers in Edwards and Winslow, while true they did not want to be here, but why was neither replaced with playmakers?, we had the #5 pick in the entire draft yet we continued to trade down to get a freakin center, now I understand you needed help on the oline, but knowing you wanted to get rid of Edwards or he was not going to resign with us why not trade down and get one of the many playmakers available in the draft a Harvin, Maclin, Nicks type player, in round 2 we draft 2 wide receivers, we all know it takes most rookie receivers a few years to adapt to the NFL game, I could see drafting one receiver but not 2 when this team needed a running back and pass catching tight end neither of which was addressed in the draft (Shonn Green looked pretty good yesterday)now look at all the ex jets we brought in, none of them have really made any type of impact, are you telling me the money we spent on those ex Jets could not have went to get a better RT than St.Clair or better guard than Womack, what about on defense where we all saw Mcdonald having problems giving up big plays last year and we bring in ex Jets in Hank Poteat and corey Ivey, or at LB we could not have done better than barton and Bowens?

The blame IMO lies with Mangini because these are his guys, the guys he wanted, there is no excuse for not having a veteran wide receiver on this team someone better than Mike Fuerry or a better tight end than Royal, the draft IMO did not address the needs, are you going to tell me drafting a project in Veikune or a specials team player in Maiva was a better option than getting a running back or CB or pass rushing LB.

We trade Braylon, now I don't have a problem with trading Braylon my problem is getting a slot receiver and a specials team linebacker in return, once again we get rid of a playmaker and don't add another playmaker this is all on Mangini

What about Jerome Harrison something has to be wrong, the guy can't get more carriers than over the hill Jamal Lewis, 2 coaching staffs now have decided that harrison is not good enough to start yet we don't draft a running back

IMO Mangini has done more to hurt this team than to improve this team, and I don't see anything in the future to make me believe that all of a sudden things are going to change for the good with Mangini, so we have 11 draft picks of the 11 realistically how many will actually contribute2-3 maybe the remaing that make the team will be depth we will be lucky to get 2-3 starters out of the draft and this team will need more than 2-3 new starters

@gips said:

It cant get worse because the browns invisible meddling owner who refuses to sell despite being hated is the one at fault and will likely leave his new lapdog coach/GM in place...im just telling you guys right now this franchise is as good as dead...this club has a really bad reputation from the top down and we cant attract creative winning coaches or proven GMs because winners cant be lapdogs..and now with mangenuises new smart guy bully boy contract blunders and disputes agents arent going to deal this club good players without big huge cap smacking upfront gaurantees for their clients...this club has no class and the players themselves wont want to be here so we are becoming a minor league farm team..we are the new nfl europe..people need to wake up before its to late...again...

The people of cleveland and browns fans everywhere deserve better than this shit...our once proud history deserves better as well..

These are the guys mangini wanted and as the article states things are as bad as a franchise can get, the draft and a few free agents won't fix this mess that mangin has created

I say that lerner needs to admit he made a huge mistake with Mangini and get rid of this guy, I as a fan don't see things improving anytime soon, as you stated what free agent would want to come here unless he is greatly overpaid and it seems like not many players in the league would be thrilled about playing for Mangini, same with trying to get experienced coaches to come here.

I believe the reason we are seeing Daboll is because this is a guy that Mangin can control and he has a fear of hiring a experienced offensive coordinator who knows what he's doing because Mangini might not be able to control him.

There is some talent on this team, this team should be better than a expansion team, Mangini has destoyed this team in a effort to prove he is smarter than everyone, Mangini is making Ted Stepien look smart

I keep hearing the excuses of give Mangini 3 years, lets build thru the draft, we got 11 draft picks in 2010.....blah blah blah

People say we don't have the talent...Somewhat true

We have no playmakers..True...Guess who got rid of the playmakers we had and did not replace them? Eric Mangini

Why did our GM not sign any veteran playmakers such as a running back or wide receiver? Because Mangini is really the GM he calls all the shots

Now I took a look at the Miami Dolphins of 2007 and the Miami Dolphins of 2008 who made the playoffs, well its amazing what a guy like Bill Parcels who knows what he's doing compared to someone who thinks he is a genius like Mangini

The 2007 Dolphins team had Cleo Lemon, Trent Green and John Beck as there quarterbacks...all terrible, the leading rushers were Ronnie Brown and Jesse Chatman with Brown leading the team in rushing with 602 yards, the leading receiver was Marty Booker with 602 yards and 1 touchdown.

So what does Bill Parcels does, he adds Chad Pennington, signs Ricky Williams drafts Davonne Bess, Tedd Ginn develops into a NFL receiver (coaching) gets a pass catching tight end in Anthony Fassono signs some veteran FA offensive lineman adds a few role players to his defense and BAM the Dolphins are a playoff team

So my question if the Dolphins can go from 1-15 and make a few changes why do the Browns go backwards instead of going forward

Btw, With all these draft picks coming how many of these guys do we really expect to contribute and be starters next year, look around the league after the 3rd round how many draft picks are anything more than specials teams players and I think we have added quite a few of these type of guys already.

Would be nice if we could get some free agents that were not ex jets who can actually contribute

Looks like all we got from the Jets were a bunch of guys who are nothing more than stop gap or backup players

Watching this team is like watching a expansion team

@dawgtracker said:

Compare the browns offensive starters to the bengals starters. How many of the browns would play for the bengals right now? IF the number is less than six talent is the biggest issue. MoMass and Robo will become good but they don't compare to the bengals receivers right now.

Would we have a better offense with the Warrior and Edwards? Probably, but neither of them wanted to be here. You can't build a team with your leaders being malcontents

OK I will say that only Steinbach and Joe Thomas would start for the Bengals but no NFL team should look like this on offense

Brian Daboll should be calling plays as much as you or I, I can call 2 runs up the middle and pass on 3rd down

This team looks like a expansion team

Have you ever seen a offense this bad in Pro Football? I guess that comes from running so many laps in training camp

@nw-ohio-brownie said:

Sony,

With all due respect, what the hell are you trying to say?

You say that this team has "so many holes" that there's no way that a draft can "fix this team." You are making the claim that this team is terrible, yet want to blame Mangini for it. Huh?

Sony, Vince Lombardi as head coach with Bill Belichick calling the D and Bill Walsh calling the O couldn't make this current team a playoff threat. They. Have. No. Talent.

I agree with you about Daboll. I have my doubts, too. But what "established" OC could we have had? The only ones I can think of are the guys who are currently out of football with TV gigs (Mariucci, Gruden, etc.) and they would have no interest in committing career suicide by putting their future into the hands of DA or an unproven BQ.

Goodness, Mangini has coached six games. SIX. In every game we have played teams with superior talent. Every single one. And I have news for you. We will be playing teams with superior talent every week until we run into Kansas City.

I understand your frustration. I'm with you there. But for crying out loud, Mangini is the least of our concerns right now.

Yes there are hole on this team but tell me who is the person that created these holes....That my friend is Mangini

This team has some talent but the talent is not being utilized correctly, examples tell me why we have to watch Jamal tip toe every week to gain 2 yards?

Who is responsible for the Floyd Womacks and John St. Clair?

Who brought in all these ex Jet players who have made little to no contributions to this team

Daboll is here because Mangini can control him, Mangini wants a power running game Ha Ha Ha, and to control the clock, only thing we don't have the players for the type of team and offense Mangini wants to run, everybody got on RAC but if I had a choice today I would rather have RAC, at least until injuries crippled the team last year we were in games this year we are toast midway into the 3rd quarter.

Look at the players we have given away and got nothing in return, thats all on Mangini

What about last years draft makes you think Mangini is going to turn this team around thru the draft, we have a top 5 pick and trade it away for a extra pick in round 2, a center and 6th round draft choice that a joke just like this team has become

Also its not like we are losing playing a bunch of kids, we are losing playing veterans like Barton, Coleman, Bowens, Elam, Robaire Smith, Pool, Rogers,Wimbley I don't see any rookes getting torched on defense and the oline is all veterans the only position we are young at is wide receivers and look at the routes called for the receivers I don't care who the receivers are they are not being put in the position to succeed and thats this coaching staff, I thought the staff with RAC was bad but this is just ridiculous. and I won't get started on the quarterbacks

We have a offense that can't score unless its on a return I have seen some High School offenses look better than the Browns

People this is the NFL and these guys are paid professionals, this team looks like a expansion team.

This offense is NOT NFL CALIBER...It looks like a High School offense and I can't believe these players are that bad, these are guys that were star players in High School and College this is all on this coaching staff.

We have a inexperienced offensive coordinator who is handpicked by Mangini so that Mangini can control him, Mangini would not hire a experienced OC because he has fears the OC would not run a offense to Mangini's liking.

Eric Mangini is a control freak who has destroyed this team, everyone here wanted Romeo gone, now I would bet most would want Romeo back after watching this crap that Mangini puts on the field every week.

I know it won't happen but if Randy Lerner knew anything about how the NFL is run he would can this entire coaching staff at the end of the season

People keep saying give Mangini a chance and lets see what he does with the draft, this team has so many holes how do people really think the draft can fix this mess, out of a good draft if you get 2 starters you are lucky and after the 2nd round its a crap shot so it does not matter who we draft the draft is not going to fix this team. Knowing Mangini if he is here we will most likely trade down again a draft a few specials team standouts in college.

I have no confidence in this regime and I was anti Eric Mangini when he was hired and he has shown me NOTHING but being a control freak, we don't even have a true GM all Kokinis is, is a puppet for Mangini and does what Mangini tells him to do.

Tell me what free agents other than ex Jets would want to come here with this pathetic of a team

I hear people make the excuse that Mangini had 2 winning season with the Jets, his first season playing a 4th place schedule ( Like the Browns in 2007) Mangini went 10-6, the next season he went 4-12 playing a real schedule and then last year the front office spent close to 80 Million signing free agent and getting Brett Farve and the great Mangini CHOKED down the stretch, so tell me Mangini fans what has this SNITCH ever done but snitch on Bill Belichek.

@cardinalmaniac said:

Someone earlier in this thread said a 2nd rounder and a 2011 1st rounder for Cribbs.

You guys will be lucky to get a 4th rounder for him IMO. MAYBE a team is silly enough and gives up a 3rd rounder.

I like Cribbs and he's one of the best return men in the game right now....but no one is going to give up as much as you guys probably think he's worth.

This is another example of Browns fans overrating a player

Cribbs is a specials team player with at best 3 years left the way he plays the game

People here call him a playmaker and the best player on the team, the guy was terrible as a wide receiver and yes he is a great kick returner but no team would give you a 2nd rounder for a guy who returns kicks and is a gunner on the coverage units.

This tells you everything about the Browns when your supposed best player is a kick returner

I am so tired of people saying Cribbs can do this and that and put him in the WildDawg, Cribbs is only good in space and on gimmick plays, when he is in the backfield the plays don't work because the defense knows what plays he is running from the shotgun, Cribbs is a guy you can use 4-5 times per game in specialty packages, this is not a guy you give up a 1st or 2nd round pick for, maybe a team looking for that last piece might offer a 3rd round pick.

Tell me the last kick returner traded for a 1st or 2nd round pick, this is the NFL not fantasy football people

@playgroundlegend said:

Here this website might be a helpful tool to see who is available:

http://www.kffl.com/static/nfl/features/fr...Team&y=2010

As far as who I would target as GM, Anquan Boldin's contract might be up for grabs at the end of this year, and he is built like an AFC North receiver. He has great hands, runs great routes, and breaks tackles. He is like a Josh Cribbs who can catch and run routes actually. At 6-1 217 he has alot of bulk and VERY strong hands, a good verticle and is hard to bring down. He is alot like hines ward, only Boldin doesnt have the homo grin. Plus, he is a huge threat for YAC.

Secondly, I'd also make a run at the Cardinals Steve Breaston, he's FAST, and would stretch the field. He is imho the best slot reciever in the league, and could be a #2 on any other team.

Thirdly I would like to make a trade, we lack a power back, davis and harrison are great new quick burst filled backs but we need someone who can put the hurt on these defenders to weaken them up. I would make a move to Acquire MArion Barber from the Dallas Cowboys, I'd offer a second round pick and David Barton.

1. Hire a head coach thats not a dictator and who is offensive minded( No more Ex Patriots)

2. Get a GM thats not hand picked by the head coach ( Thought Butch Davis was the last coach who would have final say on everything)

3. Get rid of the 3-4 defense, move D'Qwell Jackson to weak side linebacker and play Veikune at MLB, move Corey Williams to DT with Shaun Rogers

4. Find 2 pass rushing DE's and a outside LB and realize Wimbley is a BUST ( Aaron Kampman from Green Bay)

5. Draft a FS who is a ball hawk and playmaker ( Eric Berry-Tenn) Get rid of Brodney Pool

6. Put Jerome Harrison at RB at for once see what he can do ( They also said D'Angelo Williams was too small)

7. Sign a veteran cornerback and Veteran possession receiver ( Malcom Floyd-Chargers), James Avant-Eagles

8. Draft a right guard and right tackle

9. Get a receiving Tight End

10. Trade for Kevin Kolb or draft a quarterback

11. Stop trading for Ex Jet players who are not very good

Veteran to cut loose: Eric Barton, Kenyon Coleman, Hank Poteat, Mike Furrey, Brodney Pool, Brady Quinn, Jamal Lewis, Robert Royal, Hank Fraley, Pork Chop Womack, John St.Clair, Robaire Smith, Nick Sorenson

@shepwrite said:

I would've loved to get Rey and put him next to the NFL's leading tackler. They're both really good.

Dude, Sony... really? You think those players are what makes Denver's defense great? Two of them were there last year and the other is 47 years old.

Two words: Mike Nolan.

Shep, Why do you think Pittsburgh defense and Baltimore defense is so good, Troy Palamalu and Ed Reed

With Brain Dawkins playing saftey for the Broncos he covers up a lot of mistakes others make and Dumvervill with 8 sacks is a terror off the edge and DJ Williams is having a career year with the Broncos

Mike Nolan is a good D-Coordinator but I have to ask you what did he do the the 49ers defense?

Also Rey is playing strongside outside linebacker in the Bengals 4-3 defense, I don't know about you Shep but I always thought DQ Jackson would be a beast if we went to a 4-3 and we played Jackson at right outside linebacker, I just feel he is too small to play strongside inside linebacker in a 3-4

Masters said:

What's wrong with that statement? Telling someone to watch the games instead of looking at the stat sheet, then comparing stat sheet numbers?

As JADBF noted, Rey Rey has had his wow plays, just like at USC, but just like at USC, he ends up out of position more often than he makes an impact. For a guy that would make a big difference against the run, didn't CLE just run for over 100 yards against him?

Curry is playing way better than Rey Rey at this point.

Masters, what games have you watched? You really believe that Curry is playing much better than Rey then I don't know what you have been watching

I watched Curry the last 2 weeks against the Bears and Colts and he did not do very much

Curry 22 tackles, 1 sack and 1 Forced fumble, 0 passes defended compared to Rey 19 tackles 2 forced fumbles and 1 sack, 1 pass defended you call that playing much better, one guy Curry taken 4th in the draft the other Rey taken in the 2nd round

Has Curry changed that Seahawk defense much? Did curry make a difference against the Bears and Colts? did'nt think so, and curry is playing weakside linebacker which is more of a playmaking position since you are not playing over the tight end like Rey has to, also Rey has made the Bengals defense better much more than Curry has done in Seattle.

Your comments about Cleveland getting over 100 yards, look and see how many of those yards went over the left side and tell me how many times Rey was out of position and over running plays, now look at the last 2 games of Seattle and tell me how many time Curry over ran plays or was handled one on one by the left tackle as he was rushing the QB and for Curry's so called excellent against the pass, watch what Cutler and Manning did to him in pass coverage.

But then guys here had Aaron Curry ready for the Hall of Fame after 1 season in the NFL

Btw, Brian Cushing looks pretty good in Houston.......33 tackles so far 3 passes defended, another guy draft guru's said was a 2 down linebacker