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Cardinals release WR DeAndre Hopkins

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  • @syd said:

    ummm he hasn't played yet this year

    For us when he was here ding dong... All he did was bitch and get hurt...

    @nickers said:

    For us when he was here ding dong... All he did was bitch and get hurt...

    no shit but gumby was talking about obj getting paid by the ravens,not us

  • sydS syd

    @nickers said:

    For us when he was here ding dong... All he did was bitch and get hurt...

    no shit but gumby was talking about obj getting paid by the ravens,not us

    @syd said:

    no shit but gumby was talking about obj getting paid by the ravens,not us

    Good for him.. He's gone you dip shit!

  • Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

  • Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

  • Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    I think Njoku has some talent.. He's not complete garbage.. The problem with Njoku is he does not go the extra mile..  He's reached whatever ceiling he has... We still don't have a real tight end on this team.. Id rather have Steve Heiden instead of this tool... At least Heiden worked his ass off... This guy coasts a lot.. He drops easy passes and has lapses in concentration.. It's just who he is

  • @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    I think Njoku has some talent.. He's not complete garbage.. The problem with Njoku is he does not go the extra mile..  He's reached whatever ceiling he has... We still don't have a real tight end on this team.. Id rather have Steve Heiden instead of this tool... At least Heiden worked his ass off... This guy coasts a lot.. He drops easy passes and has lapses in concentration.. It's just who he is

    @nickers said:

    I think Njoku has some talent.. He's not complete garbage.. The problem with Njoku is he does not go the extra mile..  He's reached whatever ceiling he has... We still don't have a real tight end on this team.. Id rather have Steve Heiden instead of this tool... At least Heiden worked his ass off... This guy coasts a lot.. He drops easy passes and has lapses in concentration.. It's just who he is

    I am not saying he is garbage.  He is an average, run of the mill TE who is paid and treated like he is elite.  Just on the list of Browns TE's, obviously Ozzie is at the top.  Joke falls somewhere in there with Heiden, Aaron Shea and Harry Holt.  They were all decent enough, but weren't sitting at the top of the TE pay scale.

  • Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    Yeah, I think we're pretty close to being on the same page.  Like I said about Njoku, I'm somewhere between stupid and stubborn thinking he can finally deliver the receiving production he was drafted to add.  So far, I'm just Linus in the pumpkin patch with that...

    As for Hopkins, even though we've added some young newbies that I'm excited about in the last 2 years (Tillman, Bell and hoping all the positive buzz about Moore is true) - there's NO substitute for the PROVEN success he's had in this league (and with Watson in particular).  Wanting him to join us doesn't mean I think all of the additions will fail.  I just think the combination of him and Cooper sharpens our prongs of attack in the passing game.

    If it doesn't happen, it'll be fun to see what the newbies can do.  

  • Hopkins was suspended the first 6 games of last season because he tested positive for PED's

    This will continue to happen more [not less] moving forward as the body breaks down.. I can't stomach paying cap and cash to a guy who risks his availability for the team ingesting random stuff. 

    "Supplements" have always been a question mark of actual content; "I Took A Supplement Named Happy Candy" is not an excuse or an explanation.  The fact that the supplement market isn't regulated does in fact mean that the customer's first assumption should be that the words regarding the ingredients are 100% lies. If you think capitalists don't lie to you, you are the ideal sucker.

  • Hopkins was suspended the first 6 games of last season because he tested positive for PED's

    This will continue to happen more [not less] moving forward as the body breaks down.. I can't stomach paying cap and cash to a guy who risks his availability for the team ingesting random stuff. 

    "Supplements" have always been a question mark of actual content; "I Took A Supplement Named Happy Candy" is not an excuse or an explanation.  The fact that the supplement market isn't regulated does in fact mean that the customer's first assumption should be that the words regarding the ingredients are 100% lies. If you think capitalists don't lie to you, you are the ideal sucker.

    @unsympathetic said:

    Hopkins was suspended the first 6 games of last season because he tested positive for PED's

    This will continue to happen more [not less] moving forward as the body breaks down.. I can't stomach paying cap and cash to a guy who risks his availability for the team ingesting random stuff. 

    "Supplements" have always been a question mark of actual content; "I Took A Supplement Named Happy Candy" is not an excuse or an explanation.  The fact that the supplement market isn't regulated does in fact mean that the customer's first assumption should be that the words regarding the ingredients are 100% lies. If you think capitalists don't lie to you, you are the ideal sucker.

    The guy got injured and went on IR the season before he had tested positive.  Unfortunately, this doesn't surprise me that an NFL player coming off injury resorted to PEDs to expedite his return to normal.  Will Fuller did the same thing coming off injury and he tested positive.  There probably would be more guys testing positive if the testing wasn't just a random population.  To your point though - nobody picked up Fuller last year.  I pointed that out to someone last year when people were mentioning him as a possibility to add.   I think he was closer to his end than Hopkins is today; but Hopkins is 31 so I could be very wrong about that.

    Good news for you is the Browns won't over-exert themselves to try to sign him...

  • @syd said:

    no shit but gumby was talking about obj getting paid by the ravens,not us

    Good for him.. He's gone you dip shit!

    @nickers said:

    Good for him.. He's gone you dip shit!

    you really are mental 

  • sydS syd

    @nickers said:

    Good for him.. He's gone you dip shit!

    you really are mental 

    @syd said:

    you really are mental 

    LOL says the town drunk...

  • @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

    @sdbacker80 said:

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

    Yes and yes.

    The Browns can't extend everyone, and while Watson's MAMMOTH contract IMO is going to look fairly run-of-the-mill in a season or so for a starting QB, eventually some decent players are going to have to go elsewhere to get their second contract. Tillman was drafted to replace DPJ. 

    I think the Browns need to think about how much longer they will keep Cooper around, so getting some of the younger players reps is important. 

  • @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    I think Njoku has some talent.. He's not complete garbage.. The problem with Njoku is he does not go the extra mile..  He's reached whatever ceiling he has... We still don't have a real tight end on this team.. Id rather have Steve Heiden instead of this tool... At least Heiden worked his ass off... This guy coasts a lot.. He drops easy passes and has lapses in concentration.. It's just who he is

    @nickers said:

    I think Njoku has some talent.. He's not complete garbage.. The problem with Njoku is he does not go the extra mile..  He's reached whatever ceiling he has... We still don't have a real tight end on this team.. Id rather have Steve Heiden instead of this tool... At least Heiden worked his ass off... This guy coasts a lot.. He drops easy passes and has lapses in concentration.. It's just who he is

    I was worried you were getting soft in those 1st 2 sentences before you settled in and delivered.  Then you added in Steve Heiden for good measure.  

    You approached that like Mel's Kiper with rougher edges and a little more accuracy.   Well done!  

  • For reference.  Not listed is Felton...nor Weston who's listed as Reserve/Retired.  -  How many WR's do we keep after cuts?  (there's not a whole lot of room for anyone else)

    Amari Cooper   2    WR    6-1    211    28    9    Alabama

    Donovan Peoples-Jones   11    WR    6-2    204    24    4    Michigan

    Elijah Moore   8    WR    5-10    180    23    3    Mississippi

    Cedric Tillman   89    WR    6-3    215    23    R    Tennessee

    Marquise Goodwin   19    WR    5-9    185    32    10    Texas

    David Bell   18    WR    6-1    212    22    2    Purdue

    ---

    Anthony Schwartz   10    WR    6-0    186    22    3    Auburn

    Jakeem Grant Sr.   9    WR    5-6    170    30    8    Texas Tech

    Michael Woods II   12    WR    6-1    204    23    2    Oklahoma

    Mike Harley Jr.   82    WR    5-10    180    25    1    Miami (Fla.)

    Daylen Baldwin   17    WR    6-2    212    23    1    Michigan

    Jaelon Darden   16    WR    5-8    175    24    3    North Texas

  • @nickers said:

    I think Njoku has some talent.. He's not complete garbage.. The problem with Njoku is he does not go the extra mile..  He's reached whatever ceiling he has... We still don't have a real tight end on this team.. Id rather have Steve Heiden instead of this tool... At least Heiden worked his ass off... This guy coasts a lot.. He drops easy passes and has lapses in concentration.. It's just who he is

    I was worried you were getting soft in those 1st 2 sentences before you settled in and delivered.  Then you added in Steve Heiden for good measure.  

    You approached that like Mel's Kiper with rougher edges and a little more accuracy.   Well done!  

    @flugel said:

    I was worried you were getting soft in those 1st 2 sentences before you settled in and delivered.  Then you added in Steve Heiden for good measure.  

    You approached that like Mel's Kiper with rougher edges and a little more accuracy.   Well done!  

    I just gave what I thought was a brutally honest assessment.. As Bill once said... "I can only go by what I see..." I mean in one vein.. I can appreciate the physical specimen Njoku is.. But to me... He's a slacker who underachieves , and tries to make it on ability alone... That's just not good enough IMHO.. Then I remember guys like Milt Morin. Then guys like Scott Gailbraith who tried really hard.. Although Milt Morin was the best thing we had until Ozzie came along... And Morin was really good.. I would be thankful for a Morin type but in todays NFL TE framework if that makes sense...

  • @ballpeen said:

    Well Flugs, I mentioned Njoku because he is still around.  I have never been a big fan.  One of the most overrated players in browns history, IMO.

    And to be fair to others points, if we sign Hopkins, welcome aboard.  And it could make some sense.  

    I don't think we are going to be interested in signing DPJ to another contract.  Tillman or Bell seem slotted as his replacement.  If Hopkins is signed, it would open up trade possibilities and ship DPJ for some sort of return.

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

    @sdbacker80 said:

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

    This wouldn't really be new with Hopkins when we've already done it with Jarvis Landry, OBJ and Amari Cooper at the expense of growing pains with draftees on their rookie salary capped 1st contracts.  Even at TE, we brought Austin Hooper here which cut into some of the development for Harrison Bryant.  We not only brought Jack Conklin here; but we extended his contract this year.  At Center, a 2020 draftee Nick Harris got injured and veteran Ethan Pocic from Seattle earned the starting job

    We're doing it on defense too.  Za'Darius Smith, Dalvin Tomlinson, Anthony Walker, Juan Thornhill are just some of the veterans that will be playing ahead of draftees this FO drafted.

    A lot of this seems like a blend of bad drafting and poor coaching making us look to higher paid veterans from other teams that have limited cap space as a result.

  • @sdbacker80 said:

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

    This wouldn't really be new with Hopkins when we've already done it with Jarvis Landry, OBJ and Amari Cooper at the expense of growing pains with draftees on their rookie salary capped 1st contracts.  Even at TE, we brought Austin Hooper here which cut into some of the development for Harrison Bryant.  We not only brought Jack Conklin here; but we extended his contract this year.  At Center, a 2020 draftee Nick Harris got injured and veteran Ethan Pocic from Seattle earned the starting job

    We're doing it on defense too.  Za'Darius Smith, Dalvin Tomlinson, Anthony Walker, Juan Thornhill are just some of the veterans that will be playing ahead of draftees this FO drafted.

    A lot of this seems like a blend of bad drafting and poor coaching making us look to higher paid veterans from other teams that have limited cap space as a result.

    @flugel said:

    This wouldn't really be new with Hopkins when we've already done it with Jarvis Landry, OBJ and Amari Cooper at the expense of growing pains with draftees on their rookie salary capped 1st contracts.  Even at TE, we brought Austin Hooper here which cut into some of the development for Harrison Bryant.  We not only brought Jack Conklin here; but we extended his contract this year.  At Center, a 2020 draftee Nick Harris got injured and veteran Ethan Pocic from Seattle earned the starting job

    We're doing it on defense too.  Za'Darius Smith, Dalvin Tomlinson, Anthony Walker, Juan Thornhill are just some of the veterans that will be playing ahead of draftees this FO drafted.

    A lot of this seems like a blend of bad drafting and poor coaching making us look to higher paid veterans from other teams that have limited cap space as a result.

    And that falls squarely on AB... He's not all that bad,.. But he's not all that great and has a tough time letting go of failed players like Schwartz and Greedy.. In Greedy's defense.. He gets injured a lot.. But at some point you have to accept hes basically a car that runs like a lemon... When you have a lemon.. by your own motivation you replace said lemon.

  • @sdbacker80 said:

    The Tillman pick is/was DPJ insurance when he’s on another team in 2024.  DPJ is the kind of luxury you can’t afford when we really have to start making cap conscious decisions.

    I like where you are going with the Hopkins signing and then shipping DPJ.   We aren’t loaded with draft capital in 2024.  Adding Hopkins to this room - how do you develop Bell or Tillman…Bell especially in Year 2 he needs physical reps. 

    This wouldn't really be new with Hopkins when we've already done it with Jarvis Landry, OBJ and Amari Cooper at the expense of growing pains with draftees on their rookie salary capped 1st contracts.  Even at TE, we brought Austin Hooper here which cut into some of the development for Harrison Bryant.  We not only brought Jack Conklin here; but we extended his contract this year.  At Center, a 2020 draftee Nick Harris got injured and veteran Ethan Pocic from Seattle earned the starting job

    We're doing it on defense too.  Za'Darius Smith, Dalvin Tomlinson, Anthony Walker, Juan Thornhill are just some of the veterans that will be playing ahead of draftees this FO drafted.

    A lot of this seems like a blend of bad drafting and poor coaching making us look to higher paid veterans from other teams that have limited cap space as a result.

    @flugel said:

    This wouldn't really be new with Hopkins when we've already done it with Jarvis Landry, OBJ and Amari Cooper at the expense of growing pains with draftees on their rookie salary capped 1st contracts.  Even at TE, we brought Austin Hooper here which cut into some of the development for Harrison Bryant.  We not only brought Jack Conklin here; but we extended his contract this year.  At Center, a 2020 draftee Nick Harris got injured and veteran Ethan Pocic from Seattle earned the starting job

    We're doing it on defense too.  Za'Darius Smith, Dalvin Tomlinson, Anthony Walker, Juan Thornhill are just some of the veterans that will be playing ahead of draftees this FO drafted.

    A lot of this seems like a blend of bad drafting and poor coaching making us look to higher paid veterans from other teams that have limited cap space as a result.

    I don't know about that.  I think all teams start to blend in veterans as the team gets better.

    I won't say our drafting has been great, but it hasn't been bad.  As for development, I have never really bought in to that.  In a win now league, teams can't develop players.  Add in that most of these guys have been developed.  Unlike other sports where you take some 18 year old and stick them in a G league or minor league, football doesn't do that.  College football is a players developmental league.  When they hit the NFL they better be ready to play.

    Playing is the best form of development, and in the NFL, they don' play.  It isn't realistic to expect a NFL coach to mold and develop a player who isn't ready to play.

  • Good morning read from insider Albert Breer

    "I think we get one of two conclusions.

    Either Hopkins finds someone to pay up and takes the bag. Or,

    he takes less to chase a ring with Kansas City or Buffalo, with

    the idea that putting together a full, healthy 2023 could burnish his legacy and perhaps set up one last payday next March."

    https://www.si.com/nfl/2023/05/30/inside-deandre-hopkins-release-options-bills-chiefs

  • @flugel said:

    This wouldn't really be new with Hopkins when we've already done it with Jarvis Landry, OBJ and Amari Cooper at the expense of growing pains with draftees on their rookie salary capped 1st contracts.  Even at TE, we brought Austin Hooper here which cut into some of the development for Harrison Bryant.  We not only brought Jack Conklin here; but we extended his contract this year.  At Center, a 2020 draftee Nick Harris got injured and veteran Ethan Pocic from Seattle earned the starting job

    We're doing it on defense too.  Za'Darius Smith, Dalvin Tomlinson, Anthony Walker, Juan Thornhill are just some of the veterans that will be playing ahead of draftees this FO drafted.

    A lot of this seems like a blend of bad drafting and poor coaching making us look to higher paid veterans from other teams that have limited cap space as a result.

    I don't know about that.  I think all teams start to blend in veterans as the team gets better.

    I won't say our drafting has been great, but it hasn't been bad.  As for development, I have never really bought in to that.  In a win now league, teams can't develop players.  Add in that most of these guys have been developed.  Unlike other sports where you take some 18 year old and stick them in a G league or minor league, football doesn't do that.  College football is a players developmental league.  When they hit the NFL they better be ready to play.

    Playing is the best form of development, and in the NFL, they don' play.  It isn't realistic to expect a NFL coach to mold and develop a player who isn't ready to play.

    @ballpeen said:

    I don't know about that.  I think all teams start to blend in veterans as the team gets better.

    I won't say our drafting has been great, but it hasn't been bad.  As for development, I have never really bought in to that.  In a win now league, teams can't develop players.  Add in that most of these guys have been developed.  Unlike other sports where you take some 18 year old and stick them in a G league or minor league, football doesn't do that.  College football is a players developmental league.  When they hit the NFL they better be ready to play.

    Playing is the best form of development, and in the NFL, they don' play.  It isn't realistic to expect a NFL coach to mold and develop a player who isn't ready to play.

    While the league has been "win now" there's always been teams like the Browns, Jets, Texans, Lions and even the Bears that haven't had great ownerships and FOs to be up to the challenge of winning now.  How many more episodes of the sequel do we need to watch to understand this?  Isn't this why AB ended up in  "save my ass'" mode whether it's fair or not?   With his ass on the line - he's leaning heavily on veterans that have been developed on other teams as we've seen in trades and FA acquisitions.  If someone here had the balls to DRAFT Watson or even Patrick Mahomes when the Browns had the 1st pick overall with a 1-15 record 1 year before they went passive aggressive for Baker Mayfield at #1 overall - we wouldn't have needed to give up so many 1st round picks and the salary would have had the rookie salary cap restriction on the 1st contract.  No guts - no glory.  Unfortunately for AB - he inherited that situation.  This off season seemed like the 1st time our collective group on this board seamed really happy with his off-season efforts and we all seemed pretty happy with how AB drafted this year.  Ironically, when AB and Stefanski had their least pressure to "win now" they went 11-5 in their 1st year together with a playoff win.  Their winning percentages decreased in each season thereafter.  With all of the money $ spent on veterans the last 2 years - we're at a "win now" or the FO and/or the Head Coach are gone.  I can't lie though - I like their effort this year.  

    It's very realistic to expect the coaching staff to develop young players for the NFL game whether they're projected to start immediately or within a year or 2 (and in years past - even longer).  We've had a undrafted guy that played some really good LT for us on the last playoff team we had in the 90s. He joined the team in 1988 out of Western Carolina, started at RT in 1990 and switched to LT in 1991 where he stayed until the team moved. He became a fan favorite here. At 1 point, his OL coach here was Kirk Ferentz.  The same guy that became the HC for the Iowa Hawkeyes in the Big 10 and won consistently in spite of the recruiting attraction of cornfields and farm land. Anyway, Tony Jones ended up starting at LT for the Super Champion Denver Broncos.  Meanwhile, we Orland Brown Sr (Zeus) was also and undrafted OT that finished the final 7 games on our 94 playoff team as the starting RT.   Both Tackles were undrafted.  While I agree today's game expedites the need to have them ready quicker - it's not like there's always an obvious LT ready to dominate like Joe Thomas falling on our lap at #3 overall.  Our current LT (drafted at #10 overall) who played RT at Alabama - is lucky to have one of the best OL coaches in the league.  However, he's still struggling so his development is ongoing. 

    We both agree experience is very important.  Wyatt Teller only started the last 7 games of his 1st year filling in at LG in Buffalo because the starter went on IR. When that starter was projected to get his starting job back the next season - guess who became available to the Browns?  Wyatt Teller who would end up moving to RG and fill our biggest weakness at the time.  The same Austin Corbett that Cleveland drafted at #33 overall (before drafting Nick Chubb a few slots later) wasn't the emerge quickly kind of guy the Browns expected him to be.  Consequently he left here with a lot of criticism from the fanbase fair or not.  He went to another team before going to the LA Rams and starting at RG for the Super Bowl Champions.  The more experience and development he got - the more he was ready for such a role.  Having said that, I don't think he's even with the Rams any more. 

    Do I need to remind anyone what injury volumes have done to some of our teams that looked good on paper before training camp in the past?  Young guys need to be ready at all times....  This is Cleveland so giddy up and get after it if your number is called!!!