95 Browns Season
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This makes me want to start crying. Saddest shit I have watched since the first time I watched Simon Burtch. The only thing that makes me feel good is the fact that I have been seeing a lot of current players tweeting about the show. Maybe now they will finally understand a little bit about what happened and play with some fucking passion.
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I have it on dvr, on the fence on watching it.
I was 15 when this happened. I remember my dad bought me a six pack, lowered his tailgait, and said "son, don't.worry about your mom."
Modell....................
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Well, let's say this. I do have much more respect for Belichick and what they were trying to do in Cleveland. I thought it was really well done and appreciate the inside footage of the staff as they were trying to work through the season.
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Well, let's say this. I do have much more respect for Belichick and what they were trying to do in Cleveland. I thought it was really well done and appreciate the inside footage of the staff as they were trying to work through the season.
Well, let's say this. I do have much more respect for Belichick and what they were trying to do in Cleveland. I thought it was really well done and appreciate the inside footage of the staff as they were trying to work through the season.
I didn't see it. Don't get NFL network....but...our next HC may come from that staff: Nick Saban.
I still say he is wasting his time in college at this point.
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Watched it last night on DVR after the debates(what a joke they were
)... Sigh... what could have been! 
So to those in Baltimore, New England, and any other football program such as the college programs in Alabama and Iowa that has reaped the benefits of success from these disciples of the Bellichick tree, at the expense of Cleveland and it's loyal fans, who now have had to put up with this pathetic shit of losing for 13 years....
YOU'RE WELCOME!!!!!
Signed Cleveland Browns fans!
BTW did anybody hear Bernie Kosar on 850 during drive time yesterday? If you did, then you know what I'm talking about, and it should infuriate you even more!
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Well, let's say this. I do have much more respect for Belichick and what they were trying to do in Cleveland. I thought it was really well done and appreciate the inside footage of the staff as they were trying to work through the season.
I didn't see it. Don't get NFL network....but...our next HC may come from that staff: Nick Saban.
I still say he is wasting his time in college at this point.
I didn't see it. Don't get NFL network....but...our next HC may come from that staff: Nick Saban.
I still say he is wasting his time in college at this point.
I don't know if he would trade his power & influence over college kids over getting an NFL team and dealing with the headaches, but who knows...
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Saban will go down as one of the greatest college coaches ever...it's easy for him now...kids just want to go to Alabama for the chance at the title... he has even said it has become much easier recruiting since he doesn't have to talk up the program like he used to... he is set his family is set...he could be there like joe pa was. He is not a risk taker, he would not trade in a sure thing, a great thing, a perfect thing for a chance to make a few thousand people smile in the bitter north...Now Kirk Ferentz may...but im guessing no.
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i watched and thought it was very well done. and to anyone that said belichik is an asshole....is an asshole. we had some great coaches and staff. the piece actually dealt with the team being built and the history of the coaches before and after. not so much on the move itself.
there were 2 people that stood out to me to be half insane and that was saban (looked like a nervous wreck bouncing up and down at the meetings...) and kokinos's kid. where they find this dude in line at the methadon clinic? geez. must be nice to have a powerful dad. just ask pat shurmur.
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i watched and thought it was very well done. and to anyone that said belichik is an asshole....is an asshole. we had some great coaches and staff. the piece actually dealt with the team being built and the history of the coaches before and after. not so much on the move itself.
there were 2 people that stood out to me to be half insane and that was saban (looked like a nervous wreck bouncing up and down at the meetings...) and kokinos's kid. where they find this dude in line at the methadon clinic? geez. must be nice to have a powerful dad. just ask pat shurmur.
i watched and thought it was very well done. and to anyone that said belichik is an asshole....is an asshole. we had some great coaches and staff. the piece actually dealt with the team being built and the history of the coaches before and after. not so much on the move itself.
there were 2 people that stood out to me to be half insane and that was saban (looked like a nervous wreck bouncing up and down at the meetings...) and kokinos's kid. where they find this dude in line at the methadon clinic? geez. must be nice to have a powerful dad. just ask pat shurmur.
I was probably one of the few Browns fans who liked Belichick back in the day. Even though I didn't like how he handled the Bernie situation. At any rate, I do think the piece was well done. It brought back a lot painful memories, as well as a lot of anger, and finally just sadness. It pisses me off to know what might have been! To top it when the Browns were returning, they dangled Bernie Kosar in front of us. Well, Bernie stated yesterday on 850 that the reason that there was a disconnect with Lerner, Policy, and Bernie was because Bernie recommended that Belichick be hired to coach the new Browns! So even with the move, there was a chance to make this shit right, right from the start! It was for that reason that they threw Kosar under the bus! Can you imagine how the course of history over the past 13 years could have changed had Lerner and Policy listened to Bernie?
Instead, we have been dealt a turd sandwich since 1999! Damn! I can't wait for Haslam to come in here and turn this shit around! -
Watched it last night on DVR after the debates(what a joke they were
)... Sigh... what could have been! So to those in Baltimore, New England, and any other football program such as the college programs in Alabama and Iowa that has reaped the benefits of success from these disciples of the Bellichick tree, at the expense of Cleveland and it's loyal fans, who now have had to put up with this pathetic shit of losing for 13 years....
YOU'RE WELCOME!!!!!
Signed Cleveland Browns fans!
BTW did anybody hear Bernie Kosar on 850 during drive time yesterday? If you did, then you know what I'm talking about, and it should infuriate you even more!
Watched it last night on DVR after the debates(what a joke they were
)... Sigh... what could have been! So to those in Baltimore, New England, and any other football program such as the college programs in Alabama and Iowa that has reaped the benefits of success from these disciples of the Bellichick tree, at the expense of Cleveland and it's loyal fans, who now have had to put up with this pathetic shit of losing for 13 years....
YOU'RE WELCOME!!!!!
Signed Cleveland Browns fans!
BTW did anybody hear Bernie Kosar on 850 during drive time yesterday? If you did, then you know what I'm talking about, and it should infuriate you even more!
Who has reaped the benefit of the Belichick tree, other than Belichick himself? Most of his "disciples" have been failures...at the NFL level. Weis, Josh McDaniels, even Saban in his Miami stint. And as far as I am concerned the Browns fans have SUFFERED under Belichick knockoffs Crennell and Mangini.
Sorry, but the Belichick tree has been the tree of the poisonous fruit.
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Watched it last night on DVR after the debates(what a joke they were
)... Sigh... what could have been! So to those in Baltimore, New England, and any other football program such as the college programs in Alabama and Iowa that has reaped the benefits of success from these disciples of the Bellichick tree, at the expense of Cleveland and it's loyal fans, who now have had to put up with this pathetic shit of losing for 13 years....
YOU'RE WELCOME!!!!!
Signed Cleveland Browns fans!
BTW did anybody hear Bernie Kosar on 850 during drive time yesterday? If you did, then you know what I'm talking about, and it should infuriate you even more!
Who has reaped the benefit of the Belichick tree, other than Belichick himself? Most of his "disciples" have been failures...at the NFL level. Weis, Josh McDaniels, even Saban in his Miami stint. And as far as I am concerned the Browns fans have SUFFERED under Belichick knockoffs Crennell and Mangini.
Sorry, but the Belichick tree has been the tree of the poisonous fruit.
Who has reaped the benefit of the Belichick tree, other than Belichick himself? Most of his "disciples" have been failures...at the NFL level. Weis, Josh McDaniels, even Saban in his Miami stint. And as far as I am concerned the Browns fans have SUFFERED under Belichick knockoffs Crennell and Mangini.
Sorry, but the Belichick tree has been the tree of the poisonous fruit.
Nevertheless, had the Browns not moved, and with that combination, the team would have been in the GOD DAMN Super Bowl! As for Saban, he's doing quite well at Alabama. I don't think he loses any sleep over his stint with the Dolphins.
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This is just a subset of the Paul Brown tree.
Other subsets include the Don Shula branch, the Chuck Noll Branch (Fox, Dungy, Lovie Smith, Tomlin), the Weeb Ewbank branch(Chuck Knox, Buddy Ryan, Jeff Fisher, Rex Ryan), the Bill Arsbarger branch (Schottenheimer, Cowher) The Ray Perkins branch (Parcells, Coughlin, Payton, Belichick, Sparano) and on and on.
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Who has reaped the benefit of the Belichick tree, other than Belichick himself? Most of his "disciples" have been failures...at the NFL level. Weis, Josh McDaniels, even Saban in his Miami stint. And as far as I am concerned the Browns fans have SUFFERED under Belichick knockoffs Crennell and Mangini.
Sorry, but the Belichick tree has been the tree of the poisonous fruit.
Nevertheless, had the Browns not moved, and with that combination, the team would have been in the GOD DAMN Super Bowl! As for Saban, he's doing quite well at Alabama. I don't think he loses any sleep over his stint with the Dolphins.
Nevertheless, had the Browns not moved, and with that combination, the team would have been in the GOD DAMN Super Bowl! As for Saban, he's doing quite well at Alabama. I don't think he loses any sleep over his stint with the Dolphins.
Sure, at this point everything is cushy, cozy, easy, peasy, lemon squeezy for him. He has to exert little effort...i..e. he is unchallenged.
And as for me, I think less of him for it.
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There is valid argument to say that the coaching success that Bill Belichick has enjoyed can be boiled down to two words:
Tom Brady
The year before, with Drew Bledsoe at QB, the Pats were a 5-11 team with BB as HC. Brady came in in early 2001 and the rest is history. What we obviously don't know is whether or not BB could have been as successful an HC without TB.
(question: when Brady retires do you think BB also calls it quits?)
And, to be a little sacriligeous here, in an earlier age, you could also question the success of Paul Brown. His success is mostly tied up into the presence of Otto Graham. When OG left in the 1956 season the Browns fell apart.
OG returned in 1957 and the Browns again went to the NFL title game. But OG retired again after '57 and the Browns under PB never again made the NFL title game. Not again til 1964 and 1965 with Blanton Collier as coach.
I am not questioning PBs credentials, its just that like with Belichick and Brady, the success of a coach is often so intertwined with a star QB. Bill Walsh never won without Montana.
An obvious exception is: Joe Gibbs, three Super Bowl titles with 3 different QBs.
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It's crazy seeing how many people were involved with the Browns organization. Not even the well known head coaches, but people like Thomas Dimitroff, Mike Tannenbaum and Scott Pioli.
That was an absolute stellar staff.
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There is valid argument to say that the coaching success that Bill Belichick has enjoyed can be boiled down to two words:
Tom Brady
The year before, with Drew Bledsoe at QB, the Pats were a 5-11 team with BB as HC. Brady came in in early 2001 and the rest is history. What we obviously don't know is whether or not BB could have been as successful an HC without TB.
(question: when Brady retires do you think BB also calls it quits?)
And, to be a little sacriligeous here, in an earlier age, you could also question the success of Paul Brown. His success is mostly tied up into the presence of Otto Graham. When OG left in the 1956 season the Browns fell apart.
OG returned in 1957 and the Browns again went to the NFL title game. But OG retired again after '57 and the Browns under PB never again made the NFL title game. Not again til 1964 and 1965 with Blanton Collier as coach.
I am not questioning PBs credentials, its just that like with Belichick and Brady, the success of a coach is often so intertwined with a star QB. Bill Walsh never won without Montana.
An obvious exception is: Joe Gibbs, three Super Bowl titles with 3 different QBs.
There is valid argument to say that the coaching success that Bill Belichick has enjoyed can be boiled down to two words:
Tom Brady
The year before, with Drew Bledsoe at QB, the Pats were a 5-11 team with BB as HC. Brady came in in early 2001 and the rest is history. What we obviously don't know is whether or not BB could have been as successful an HC without TB.
(question: when Brady retires do you think BB also calls it quits?)
And, to be a little sacriligeous here, in an earlier age, you could also question the success of Paul Brown. His success is mostly tied up into the presence of Otto Graham. When OG left in the 1956 season the Browns fell apart.
OG returned in 1957 and the Browns again went to the NFL title game. But OG retired again after '57 and the Browns under PB never again made the NFL title game. Not again til 1964 and 1965 with Blanton Collier as coach.
I am not questioning PBs credentials, its just that like with Belichick and Brady, the success of a coach is often so intertwined with a star QB. Bill Walsh never won without Montana.
An obvious exception is: Joe Gibbs, three Super Bowl titles with 3 different QBs.
While I was a Belichik hater when he was here, I have come to the realization that the guy is maybe the best HC...ever....period. It sucks that he didn't show it when he was here. Well, maybe he did, but some of us were just too stupid with loyalty to our players to see it. Does the QB make the HC, or does the HC make the QB? Maybe Brady would have never been successful without Belichik. Remember how he transformed Testeverde into a very good QB? Intercepteverde was a huge failure until he played under Parcells and Belichik. Yeah....I hated the day he cut Kosar, and claimed "diminished skills", which was true, by the way. I understand now, that he had to have complete control of the team to move forward, and Kosar was not cooperating, due to differences in philosophies. He really had to get rid of Bernie, Slaughter, and the others that didn't respect his methods. He didn't really do anything to deserve the respect of the fans, players, and media, though. He talked down to the media, and this is why he was not liked. He learned from his time here, and has made the best of it. I really can't hate the guy any longer.
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There is valid argument to say that the coaching success that Bill Belichick has enjoyed can be boiled down to two words:
Tom Brady
The year before, with Drew Bledsoe at QB, the Pats were a 5-11 team with BB as HC. Brady came in in early 2001 and the rest is history. What we obviously don't know is whether or not BB could have been as successful an HC without TB.
(question: when Brady retires do you think BB also calls it quits?)
And, to be a little sacriligeous here, in an earlier age, you could also question the success of Paul Brown. His success is mostly tied up into the presence of Otto Graham. When OG left in the 1956 season the Browns fell apart.
OG returned in 1957 and the Browns again went to the NFL title game. But OG retired again after '57 and the Browns under PB never again made the NFL title game. Not again til 1964 and 1965 with Blanton Collier as coach.
I am not questioning PBs credentials, its just that like with Belichick and Brady, the success of a coach is often so intertwined with a star QB. Bill Walsh never won without Montana.
An obvious exception is: Joe Gibbs, three Super Bowl titles with 3 different QBs.
While I was a Belichik hater when he was here, I have come to the realization that the guy is maybe the best HC...ever....period. It sucks that he didn't show it when he was here. Well, maybe he did, but some of us were just too stupid with loyalty to our players to see it. Does the QB make the HC, or does the HC make the QB? Maybe Brady would have never been successful without Belichik. Remember how he transformed Testeverde into a very good QB? Intercepteverde was a huge failure until he played under Parcells and Belichik. Yeah....I hated the day he cut Kosar, and claimed "diminished skills", which was true, by the way. I understand now, that he had to have complete control of the team to move forward, and Kosar was not cooperating, due to differences in philosophies. He really had to get rid of Bernie, Slaughter, and the others that didn't respect his methods. He didn't really do anything to deserve the respect of the fans, players, and media, though. He talked down to the media, and this is why he was not liked. He learned from his time here, and has made the best of it. I really can't hate the guy any longer.
While I was a Belichik hater when he was here, I have come to the realization that the guy is maybe the best HC...ever....period. It sucks that he didn't show it when he was here. Well, maybe he did, but some of us were just too stupid with loyalty to our players to see it. Does the QB make the HC, or does the HC make the QB? Maybe Brady would have never been successful without Belichik. Remember how he transformed Testeverde into a very good QB? Intercepteverde was a huge failure until he played under Parcells and Belichik. Yeah....I hated the day he cut Kosar, and claimed "diminished skills", which was true, by the way. I understand now, that he had to have complete control of the team to move forward, and Kosar was not cooperating, due to differences in philosophies. He really had to get rid of Bernie, Slaughter, and the others that didn't respect his methods. He didn't really do anything to deserve the respect of the fans, players, and media, though. He talked down to the media, and this is why he was not liked. He learned from his time here, and has made the best of it. I really can't hate the guy any longer.
Well, the Kosar thing had happened a couple of years earlier, and he did have the Browns in the playoffs in 1994, and things weren't going bad in 1995 until Modell pulled the rug out from under him. Had none of that happened and BB had stayed here coaching things may have gotten a lot better with the Brown winning and BB finally becoming a human being. (Though it is far to difficult to second guess).
But I am completing divorcing BBs Cleveland time to ask if his coaching creds are not due to his reliance on a superior QB. It seems like he is still doing quite well with all the different personell changes he has made over the years, and change of styles. Nevertheless, he has still always had that security blanket to rely on...Mr. Brady.
Without TB perhaps the Pats go splat. They didn't the first time he lost a year to injury. They went 11-5 with Matt Cassell. But who knows what would go if it happened again.
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