Laurinatis, Curry not participating in Senior Bowl
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Wow, what a dud of a game. (East vs West)
I just looked at the box score and I'm not even sure the East team showed up to play.
Wow, what a dud of a game.
I just looked at the box score and I'm not even sure the East team showed up to play.
I know he has the game wrong. He's refering to the East-West Shrine game. But as far as that all star game, I thought it was one of the best East-West Shrine games I've seen.
Plus, if you watch one of these games for pure entertainment purposes you are going to be very disappointed. These games are interesting only if you want to watch certain prospects. For that reason I loved that game yesterday.
For me the fun part is to use the DVR and watch plays in slow mo while isolating on various players.
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Laryngitis has nothing to worry about. Some poorly-managed team will buy into the hype and over-reach for him by a friggin' mile, just to see him become a serviceable (at best) LB in the NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE (copyright Ron Jaworski.)
I just pray to God that it isn't us.
Coaches from other teams usually know their business and are not in the business of "Hyping" players. Two years in a row 11 coaches in the Big Ten voted this guy as the Big Ten's best defensive player. That alone says so much. The people who's job it is to teach football has said two years in a row that this guy is the best at that trade.
Saying what his future will be is anyone's guess and can be dabated until he goes out proves someone right or wrong.
But to say that it just hype that has got him all these awards and generally known as one of the top, if not the top MLB in the game is ridiculous.
I like him as a Will Linebacker in a 4-3 cover two type of defense. His speed which will run below 4.5 at the combines, cover skills, ability to move laterally as well as any LB and good hands (9INT's in college) will make him a good LB in the right system.
I think too often people judge him purely on what they see on TV. They don't break down tape like college and NFL coaches do. They don't take into consideration the system in which he was used in college as NFL coaches will.
I watched the Michigan game over and over and isolated on him. It was one of the greatest games I have ever seen played by a linebacker. His explosion and pursuit was something special.
oldcow1945 said:
I like him as a Will Linebacker in a 4-3 cover two type of defense. His speed which will run below 4.5 at the combines, cover skills, ability to move laterally as well as any LB and good hands (9INT's in college) will make him a good LB in the right system.I think too often people judge him purely on what they see on TV. They don't break down tape like college and NFL coaches do. They don't take into consideration the system in which he was used in college as NFL coaches will.
I watched the Michigan game over and over and isolated on him. It was one of the greatest games I have ever seen played by a linebacker. His explosion and pursuit was something special.
I think he's more of a 4.6 guy, though he may run sub-4.5 on OSU's crazy fast track.
And I somewhat agree with your analysis of his play. OLB in Tampa 2 could be a position where he'll flourish. But like Lance Briggs, people will say he's just a product of the system.
Still, there are worse things than drafting a semi-productive linebacker who won't make a lot of mental mistakes.
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If people have illussions of Lauranitis being Ray Lewis, then he'll be flop. If the expectaion is of him to be a solid starting LB for 10-12, he's probably gonna live up to that.
Masters said:
If people have illussions of Lauranitis being Ray Lewis, then he'll be flop. If the expectaion is of him to be a solid starting LB for 10-12, he's probably gonna live up to that.Right. There is only one Ray Lewis.
I don't even think JL is a middle guy. I think he's a future Will LB because he is wonderful in open space and a great tackler.
His weakness is shedding blockers. Not good for a Mike or Sam.
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Or he could become a 5th rounder if he gets hurt....for every reason they make sense, they don't make sense for as many reasons.
If you can move up, you can move down.
First round locks should avoid these games.
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Or he could become a 5th rounder if he gets hurt....for every reason they make sense, they don't make sense for as many reasons.
If you can move up, you can move down.
First round locks should avoid these games.
Or he could become a 5th rounder if he gets hurt....for every reason they make sense, they don't make sense for as many reasons.
Or he could get hurt during the arduous pre-Combine training, as Wisconsin CB Jack Ikegwuonu did last year. But I don't think players are going to stop trying to shave that hundredth of a second off their 40 times.
Basically, the whole draft process is about being getting as much possible money as you can. If Rey's got a chance to double his (and his agent's) earnings, he's going to go for it.
After all, how many players are going to buy, "You shouldn't play because you might suck"?
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oldcow1945 said:
I like him as a Will Linebacker in a 4-3 cover two type of defense. His speed which will run below 4.5 at the combines, cover skills, ability to move laterally as well as any LB and good hands (9INT's in college) will make him a good LB in the right system.I think too often people judge him purely on what they see on TV. They don't break down tape like college and NFL coaches do. They don't take into consideration the system in which he was used in college as NFL coaches will.
I watched the Michigan game over and over and isolated on him. It was one of the greatest games I have ever seen played by a linebacker. His explosion and pursuit was something special.
I think he's more of a 4.6 guy, though he may run sub-4.5 on OSU's crazy fast track.
And I somewhat agree with your analysis of his play. OLB in Tampa 2 could be a position where he'll flourish. But like Lance Briggs, people will say he's just a product of the system.
Still, there are worse things than drafting a semi-productive linebacker who won't make a lot of mental mistakes.
Aloysius said:
I think he's more of a 4.6 guy, though he may run sub-4.5 on OSU's crazy fast track.And I somewhat agree with your analysis of his play. OLB in Tampa 2 could be a position where he'll flourish. But like Lance Briggs, people will say he's just a product of the system.
Still, there are worse things than drafting a semi-productive linebacker who won't make a lot of mental mistakes.
I'm sorry. You are right. If he was running a sub 4.5 he'd truly be a freak.
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Who knows? It could happen.
A.J. Hawk ran a 4.47 on OSU's fast track (though he ran a 4.59 at the Combine).
I'm guessing Malcolm Jenkins is going to run in the low-mid 4.3's at his pro day. Anything slower than that would actually be a disappointment.
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After all, how many players are going to buy, "You shouldn't play because you might suck"?
Come on Al....I never said that. The closest was they might have a bad week or bad game. Look at Daniels yesterday....I didn't see the game, but by all accounts on here is he sure hurt any chance he had of gaining or holding some draft position.
Sure it is about money......but sometimes protecting your position makes you just as much as bettering your position....think about it and you will get the point.
These guys and their agents study things just as much as teams do...they have an idea who is going to draft what....Rey isn't going up to #1 in the draft....and probably isn't falling lower than 12....so then they look at how high they might go with a great showing...if it isn't high enough to justify the gamble of how far they might fall...it isn't worth it.
If the potential gain isn't worth the potential risk....and it's my money....I know which way I go every time.
Think of it as a stock...if the best you can gain is say 10%, and the risk is you might lose 80%....you can say what you want...I know how you are going to conduct your affairs....I don't think you are dumb if you need a little clue.
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Sure, I was being a little facetious there. But what I don't think you're getting is that the money at the top of the draft is so significant that it justifies risking a draft stock slide. If a guy like Maualuga's got a chance of moving from 12 to 8, he should take it.
Let's actually look at the numbers. Using the '08 contracts, a move from 12 to 8 would amount to going from $2.46M/year to $4.76M - a 93.5% dollar increase. If he goes from 12 to 7 ($6.7M), his money increases 172%.
What happens if he falls? Well, the money towards the bottom of the 1st does follow a consistent negative slope. The last pick of the 1st Round, Kenny Phillips, actually received $2.3M/year, only $0.16M/year less than the 12th pick.
To counter for that, let's assume Maualuga slides to somewhere in the mid-20's of the 1st. If you average out the last 12 picks of the 1st Round (picks 20-31), you get $2.16M - only a 12% drop from the per year $ at pick #12.
So the possibility of jumping 4-5 picks clearly justifies risking a 10-15 pick drop.
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Just acknowledge it is far easier to drop then it is to rise...especially for a guy near the the top.
You are putting his basement in the 20's.
It is far easier for a guy like that to drop in to the 100's than it is to go up to #1.
You have to consider how far down a person could go....McGahee was a exception. Sever injuries usually drop top players pretty far.
So... we can split the difference...say he dropped to 50 or so...work the numbers then.
The risk doesn't pay.....and apparently he feels the same.
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Just acknowledge it is far easier to drop then it is to rise...especially for a guy near the the top.
You are putting his basement in the 20's.
It is far easier for a guy like that to drop in to the 100's than it is to go up to #1.
You have to consider how far down a person could go....McGahee was a exception. Sever injuries usually drop top players pretty far.
So... we can split the difference...say he dropped to 50 or so...work the numbers then.
The risk doesn't pay.....and apparently he feels the same.
Just acknowledge it is far easier to drop then it is to rise...especially for a guy near the the top.
You are putting his basement in the 20's.
Never said it's his basement. But you have to deal with likely scenarios. Forecasting based on a patella tendon tear is pretty hard. I mean, how high would the likelihood of that happening have to be for him to give up on the chance to make an additional $15-18M?
And can you give me some names of guys who went to the Senior Bowl projected to be taken in the early teens who had their draft stocks slide? Off the top of my head, I can't think of any. On the other hand, Sedrick Ellis ('08), Amobi Okoye ('07), and D'Brickashaw Ferguson ('06) all elevated themselves into or higher into the top 10 with great Senior Bowl week performances.
It is far easier for a guy like that to drop in to the 100's than it is to go up to #1.
Um, okay...but we were talking about the possibly of him rising 4 draft spots vs. the possibility of dropping 15.
So... we can split the difference...say he dropped to 50 or so...work the numbers then.
I'll let you do your own research. I'm content that the analysis I've put forward is how actual agents & players look at things. Otherwise, Maualuga wouldn't be participating.
The risk doesn't pay.....and apparently he feels the same.
Last I checked, Maualuga is playing. Laurinaitis is the one who declined an invitation.
My whole analysis, based on the premise that Rey could make it into the top 10, likely doesn't apply to Laurinaitis. But I'm still inclined to believe that he should have accepted the invitation.
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Doh!!
Either way...it doesn't always pay, nor does it pay to get into discussions with you after a few too many beverages and being ticked we are 1 of 5 teams not to go to the Bowl.
I do think it doesn't pay for many to play in these games, and back to my first point....these games are from a bygone era...I don't think they are all that important for top players. They are best for 3rd rounders and below.
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09drunk.gif
Fair enough. But three guys in the past three years have made their way up or into the top 10 based on solid Senior Bowl week performances.
Those guys didn't make a mistake. And if Maualuga plays well enough that Jack Del Rio decides he has to take him at 8, I doubt Rey Rey will think he made a mistake either.
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Fair enough here as well....though I don't think Rey was going to drop to 12 anyway...that seems kind of far to me....my impression is he is a top 10 pick type player.....maybe not top 5.....but even then he is a player you give more than fleeting consideration.
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Well, you'd like to think the Senior Bowl is relevant...
but Ngata fizzled at the Senior Bowl, and still is doing fine with the dirty rotten stupid stinkin ratbirds....
But, apparently, the Senior Bowl doesn't have much relevance at all... I came across the 1999 Senior Bowl roster,
just for fun.
Donovan McNabb ! and.... not many players who ever made their mark in the NFL...
(HEY, there's Lennie Friedman of the Browns !)
SENIOR BOWL 1999 ROSTER
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North
QB-- Donovan McNabb, Syracuse
QB-- Joe Germaine, Ohio State
RB-- Mike Cloud, Boston College
RB-- Autry Denson, Notre Dame
RB-- Devin West, Missouri
RB-- Joel Makovicka, Nebraska
RB-- Rob Konrad, Syracuse
WR-- Darrin Chiaverini, Colorado
WR-- Torry Holt, N.C. State
WR-- Dee Miller, Ohio State
WR-- Craig Yeast, Kentucky
WR-- Darran Hall, Colorado State
WR-- Tai Streets, Michigan
WR-- Kevin Johnson, Syracuse
TE-- Jim Kleinsasser, North Dakota
TE-- Cuncho Brown, Penn State
OL-- Grey Ruegamer, Arizona State
OL-- Luke Petitgout, Notre Dame
OL-- Mike Rosenthal, Notre Dame
OL-- Jeremy Offutt, Oklahoma State
OL-- Floyd Wedderburn, Penn State
OL-- Lennie Friedman, Duke
OL-- Tony Coats, Washington
OL-- Doug Brzezinski, Boston College
OL-- L.J. Shelton, Eastern Michigan
OL-- Anthony Cesario, Colorado State
DL-- Joey Porter, Colorado State
DL-- Chad Kelsay, Nebraska
DL-- Lamar King, Saginaw Valley
DL-- Tom Burke, Wisconsin
DL-- Mike Rucker, Nebraska
DL-- Aaron Smith, Northern Colorado
DL-- Jared DeVries, Iowa
DL-- John Thornton, West Virginia
DL-- Kelly Gregg, Oklahoma
DL-- Jason Wiltz, Nebraska
LB-- Kory Minor, Notre Dame
LB-- Hannibal Navies, Colorado
LB-- Matt Hughes, Iowa
LB-- Eric Barton, Maryland
LB-- Gary Stills, West Virginia
LB-- Barry Gardner, Northwestern
DB-- Daylon McCutcheon, USC
DB-- Eric Edwards, Oregon
DB-- Damon Moore, Ohio State
DB-- Charles Fisher, West Virginia
DB-- Marquis Smith, California
DB-- Ty Talton, Northern Iowa
DB-- Marcus Washington, Colorado
K-- Martin Gramatica, Kansas State
P-- Scott Shields, Weber State
South
QB-- Shaun King, Tulane
QB-- Scott Covington, Miami
QB-- Cade McNown, UCLA
RB-- Kevin Faulk, LSU
RB-- Brian Shay, Emporia State
RB-- James Johnson, Mississippi State
RB-- Terry Jackson, Florida
RB-- Shawn Bryson, Tennessee
WR-- Karsten Bailey, Auburn
WR-- Quincy Jackson, Alabama
WR-- Na Brown, North Carolina
WR-- Jeremaine Copeland, Tennessee
WR-- Travis McGriff, Florida
WR-- Peerless Price, Tennessee
WR-- Troy Edwards, Louisiana Tech
TE-- Larry Brown, Georgia
TE-- Reggie Kelly, Mississippi State
OL-- Derrick Fletcher, Baylor
OL-- Jamar Nesbit, South Carolina
OL-- Zach Piller, Florida
OL-- Chris Terry, Georgia
OL-- Randy Thomas, Mississippi State
OL-- Todd McClure, LSU
OL-- Jason Gamble, Clemson
OL-- Rex Tucker, Texas A&M
OL-- Brandon Burlsworth, Arkansas
OL-- Cameron Spikes, Texas A&M
OL-- Jay Humphrey, Texas
DL-- Montae Reagor, Texas Tech
DL-- Antonio Dingle, Virginia
DL-- Tony Bryant, Florida State
DL-- Adrian Dingle, Clemson
DL-- Ebenezer Ekuban, North Carolina
DL-- Charles Dorsey, Auburn
DL-- Anthony McFarland, LSU
DL-- Russell Davis, North Carolina
DL-- Marcus Spriggs, Troy State
LB-- Dat Nguyen, Texas A&M
LB-- Keith Newman, North Carolina
LB-- Al Wilson, Tennessee
LB-- Mike Peterson, Florida
LB-- Lamont Green, Florida State
LB-- Rod Coleman, East Carolina
LB-- Johnny Rutledge, Florida
DB-- Kelvin Sigler, Alabama
DB-- Tony George, Florida
DB-- Antwan Edwards, Clemson
DB-- Jacoby Rhinehart, SMU
DB-- Chris Cummings, LSU
DB-- Fernando Bryant, Alabama
DB-- Dexter Jackson, Florida State
DB-- Steve Johnson, Tennessee
DB-- Rich Coady, Texas A&M
K-- Chris Sailer, UCLA
K-- Brad Palazzo, Tulane
P-- Daniel Pope, Alabama
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Well, you'd like to think the Senior Bowl is relevant...
but Ngata fizzled at the Senior Bowl, and still is doing fine with the dirty rotten stupid stinkin ratbirds....
But, apparently, the Senior Bowl doesn't have much relevance at all... I came across the 1999 Senior Bowl roster,
just for fun.
Donovan McNabb ! and.... not many players who ever made their mark in the NFL...
(HEY, there's Lennie Friedman of the Browns !)
SENIOR BOWL 1999 ROSTER
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
North
QB-- Donovan McNabb, Syracuse
QB-- Joe Germaine, Ohio State
RB-- Mike Cloud, Boston College
RB-- Autry Denson, Notre Dame
RB-- Devin West, Missouri
RB-- Joel Makovicka, Nebraska
RB-- Rob Konrad, Syracuse
WR-- Darrin Chiaverini, Colorado
WR-- Torry Holt, N.C. State
WR-- Dee Miller, Ohio State
WR-- Craig Yeast, Kentucky
WR-- Darran Hall, Colorado State
WR-- Tai Streets, Michigan
WR-- Kevin Johnson, Syracuse
TE-- Jim Kleinsasser, North Dakota
TE-- Cuncho Brown, Penn State
OL-- Grey Ruegamer, Arizona State
OL-- Luke Petitgout, Notre Dame
OL-- Mike Rosenthal, Notre Dame
OL-- Jeremy Offutt, Oklahoma State
OL-- Floyd Wedderburn, Penn State
OL-- Lennie Friedman, Duke
OL-- Tony Coats, Washington
OL-- Doug Brzezinski, Boston College
OL-- L.J. Shelton, Eastern Michigan
OL-- Anthony Cesario, Colorado State
DL-- Joey Porter, Colorado State
DL-- Chad Kelsay, Nebraska
DL-- Lamar King, Saginaw Valley
DL-- Tom Burke, Wisconsin
DL-- Mike Rucker, Nebraska
DL-- Aaron Smith, Northern Colorado
DL-- Jared DeVries, Iowa
DL-- John Thornton, West Virginia
DL-- Kelly Gregg, Oklahoma
DL-- Jason Wiltz, Nebraska
LB-- Kory Minor, Notre Dame
LB-- Hannibal Navies, Colorado
LB-- Matt Hughes, Iowa
LB-- Eric Barton, Maryland
LB-- Gary Stills, West Virginia
LB-- Barry Gardner, Northwestern
DB-- Daylon McCutcheon, USC
DB-- Eric Edwards, Oregon
DB-- Damon Moore, Ohio State
DB-- Charles Fisher, West Virginia
DB-- Marquis Smith, California
DB-- Ty Talton, Northern Iowa
DB-- Marcus Washington, Colorado
K-- Martin Gramatica, Kansas State
P-- Scott Shields, Weber State
South
QB-- Shaun King, Tulane
QB-- Scott Covington, Miami
QB-- Cade McNown, UCLA
RB-- Kevin Faulk, LSU
RB-- Brian Shay, Emporia State
RB-- James Johnson, Mississippi State
RB-- Terry Jackson, Florida
RB-- Shawn Bryson, Tennessee
WR-- Karsten Bailey, Auburn
WR-- Quincy Jackson, Alabama
WR-- Na Brown, North Carolina
WR-- Jeremaine Copeland, Tennessee
WR-- Travis McGriff, Florida
WR-- Peerless Price, Tennessee
WR-- Troy Edwards, Louisiana Tech
TE-- Larry Brown, Georgia
TE-- Reggie Kelly, Mississippi State
OL-- Derrick Fletcher, Baylor
OL-- Jamar Nesbit, South Carolina
OL-- Zach Piller, Florida
OL-- Chris Terry, Georgia
OL-- Randy Thomas, Mississippi State
OL-- Todd McClure, LSU
OL-- Jason Gamble, Clemson
OL-- Rex Tucker, Texas A&M
OL-- Brandon Burlsworth, Arkansas
OL-- Cameron Spikes, Texas A&M
OL-- Jay Humphrey, Texas
DL-- Montae Reagor, Texas Tech
DL-- Antonio Dingle, Virginia
DL-- Tony Bryant, Florida State
DL-- Adrian Dingle, Clemson
DL-- Ebenezer Ekuban, North Carolina
DL-- Charles Dorsey, Auburn
DL-- Anthony McFarland, LSU
DL-- Russell Davis, North Carolina
DL-- Marcus Spriggs, Troy State
LB-- Dat Nguyen, Texas A&M
LB-- Keith Newman, North Carolina
LB-- Al Wilson, Tennessee
LB-- Mike Peterson, Florida
LB-- Lamont Green, Florida State
LB-- Rod Coleman, East Carolina
LB-- Johnny Rutledge, Florida
DB-- Kelvin Sigler, Alabama
DB-- Tony George, Florida
DB-- Antwan Edwards, Clemson
DB-- Jacoby Rhinehart, SMU
DB-- Chris Cummings, LSU
DB-- Fernando Bryant, Alabama
DB-- Dexter Jackson, Florida State
DB-- Steve Johnson, Tennessee
DB-- Rich Coady, Texas A&M
K-- Chris Sailer, UCLA
K-- Brad Palazzo, Tulane
P-- Daniel Pope, Alabama
Well, you'd like to think the Senior Bowl is relevant...
but Ngata fizzled at the Senior Bowl, and still is doing fine with the dirty rotten stupid stinkin ratbirds....
Ngata declared as a junior because he wanted to pay for some ill family members' medical treatment. He didn't play in the Senior Bowl.
But, apparently, the Senior Bowl doesn't have much relevance at all... I came across the 1999 Senior Bowl roster,
just for fun.
Donovan McNabb ! and.... not many players who ever made their mark in the NFL...
(HEY, there's Lennie Friedman of the Browns !)
I love the talent on those rosters. Here's a shorter list of guys who've made an impact in the NFL:
- Torry Holt - Hall of Fame receiver
- Joey Porter - elite pass-rusher
- Aaron Smith - phenomenal 3-4 DE
- Kelly Gregg - very good NT for the Ravens
- Mike Rucker - 55.5 career sacks
- Eric Barton - 119 tackles last year
- Jamar Nesbit - starting OG for close to 10 years
- Mike Peterson - 1000 career tackles, 19.5 sacks
- Al Wilson - 712 career tackles, 21.5 sacks
- Kevin Johnson - was a decent receiver for us
- L.J. Shelton - semi-decent NFL RT
- Jim Kleinsasser - utility FB-TE's been in the league for a while
- Luke Petitgout - was the Giants' left tackle until his body gave out
- Ebenezer Ekuban - 36.5 career sacks
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You're right, I meant Ngata for Oregon in their -bowl game-. same idea. But it's a far longer list than those you mentioned. cherry picking. there are a ton of those who never made much of a difference at all, or even made it to the NFL, as far as I know.
As usual, you quibble and miss the point.
But yours and Stan's guy, Joe Jermaine, is indicative of the senior bowl being just another game
where some make it, some don't.
Not much relevance.
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