Crabtree?
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I believe with all my heart BE isn't coming back after 09 season....no chance IMO. So No you can't pass him up....but BE is playing for his future contract next year and will have a great year...cause he is about the money and endorsements, imo. I believe crabtree will be gone b4 we pick!
I'm not too sure I believe Braylon will walk, though I do believe it definitely depends on the team's performance this season. The better the team as a unit plays, the more games we win, the happier BE is. Shouldn't be that way, but it is what it is.
This, I do agree with though.
I believe crabtree will be gone b4 we pick!
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I would find it very, very hard to pass up on Crabtree.
I don't agree with those who say that WR is not a need. How reliable is Stallworth? Braylon "Buk Buk B'Gawk" Edwards is entering the last year of his rookie deal (5 years, $40 million). How reliable is he to stop dropping balls and what's he gonna cost to keep around if Mangini decides to go that route?
If Bray is too chicken shit to lay himself out for the Browns, why should Lerner lay out $8m per year for Bray to cluck all over the field?
I say trade Bray to Seattle for their 2009 3rd (or 2nd) rounder and 2010 1st rounder...get something for him while you still can.
-Al
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Just one more reason I'm hoping the Cards win the Super Bowl. If Larry Fitz has a big game (he'll have to for a W) Crabtree is no longer on the board at 5, thanks to the copycat league. We wont have to worry about it.
But, tough call indeed.
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Can anyone remember the last time we picked "Best Player Available" ?
cause I honestly can't I mean we've F'd up our # 1 so many times that going "BPA"
may make the most sense regardless of need.
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Al, I would LOVE to trade BE to SEA for a 1 and a 2, but why would they do that with Crabtree sitting right there for them to take this year?
mz. said:
Al, I would LOVE to trade BE to SEA for a 1 and a 2, but why would they do that with Crabtree sitting right there for them to take this year?Yea, that's a very good question and I don't think I can really answer that except to say that Crabtree has a bigger learning curve to go through. Bray is still young, yet an experienced veteran.
It would take some naivete on Seattle's part to go for it. They gave up a 1st to NE for Branch a few years ago, so it's hard to see that happening.
Even if we can't trade BE, I would still find it very, very hard to pass up Crabtree if he's there at #5.
-Al
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Can anyone remember the last time we picked "Best Player Available" ?
cause I honestly can't I mean we've F'd up our # 1 so many times that going "BPA"
may make the most sense regardless of need.
Can anyone remember the last time we picked "Best Player Available" ?
cause I honestly can't I mean we've F'd up our # 1 so many times that going "BPA"
may make the most sense regardless of need.
I kinda felt like the Joe Thomas pick was a great combo of Best Player Available coupled with a glaring need. I was ecstatic with that pick and I'm still happy with it. Here's hoping we do at least that well with our Number 5 in April.
Doug
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mz. said:
Al, I would LOVE to trade BE to SEA for a 1 and a 2, but why would they do that with Crabtree sitting right there for them to take this year?Yea, that's a very good question and I don't think I can really answer that except to say that Crabtree has a bigger learning curve to go through. Bray is still young, yet an experienced veteran.
It would take some naivete on Seattle's part to go for it. They gave up a 1st to NE for Branch a few years ago, so it's hard to see that happening.
Even if we can't trade BE, I would still find it very, very hard to pass up Crabtree if he's there at #5.
-Al
Even if we can't trade BE, I would still find it very, very hard to pass up Crabtree if he's there at #5.
I like Curry, I don't hate guys like Orakpo, Brown and even Maualuga, but Crabtree might be the highest impact player of any of the guys in this draft, quarterbacks included.
But like Leg said, and we all suspect, he will go to SEA at 4.
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@shepwrite said:
...there are more athletes who can run and catch than there are openings.I don't know, Shep...
Why are the Browns always selecting the guys who can run but can't catch?
From Dennis Northcutt to Andre Davis to Quincy Morgan. The only guy that could catch was Kevin Johnson, but he couldn't run...
-Al
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@shepwrite said:
I'd probably wait until round two and add a free agent, too.And herein lies the problem with picking in the top 5. Too many fcuking choices.
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IMO...the two best non qb players in this draft are Crabtree and Andre Smith...if either one falls to our slot, we need to be ready to select him or answer the phones, because they will be ringing.
You would be stupid to not select them or not trade down.
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Personally I straight up Trade edwards for Anquan Bolden cause he isn't going to be back with Cards after 09' either....pay Boldin what you'd pay edwards and get rid of the michigan whinny puossy
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A great offensive line,especially in our division can give average skill players a chance to be above average.
Paul Brown always believed you go for the home run hitter,but lately we can't seem to find one that can
bat above the Mendoza.
Also keep this in mind,who ever we draft at #5 will more than likely hold out,be late for camp,pi$$off the
new coach and have to play catch up all preseason!
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would crabtree improve our offense? yes, without a doubt.
the question we have to ask is what makes crabtree a great receiver. is it his speed? is he incredibly physical? is it his size? is he shifty, agile, hard to contain? leaping ability? ability to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown? does he run great routes?
a true number one receiver needs to run superior routes, be able to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown, and have at least one of the other qualities; he needs to either be a great leaper, have great size, be ridiculously physical, have great size, be shifty and hard to contain or have truly elite speed.
i haven't watched crabtree play a lot, so i'm looking for some input. what makes him great?
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would crabtree improve our offense? yes, without a doubt.
the question we have to ask is what makes crabtree a great receiver. is it his speed? is he incredibly physical? is it his size? is he shifty, agile, hard to contain? leaping ability? ability to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown? does he run great routes?
a true number one receiver needs to run superior routes, be able to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown, and have at least one of the other qualities; he needs to either be a great leaper, have great size, be ridiculously physical, have great size, be shifty and hard to contain or have truly elite speed.
i haven't watched crabtree play a lot, so i'm looking for some input. what makes him great?
would crabtree improve our offense? yes, without a doubt.
the question we have to ask is what makes crabtree a great receiver. is it his speed? is he incredibly physical? is it his size? is he shifty, agile, hard to contain? leaping ability? ability to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown? does he run great routes?
a true number one receiver needs to run superior routes, be able to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown, and have at least one of the other qualities; he needs to either be a great leaper, have great size, be ridiculously physical, have great size, be shifty and hard to contain or have truly elite speed.
i haven't watched crabtree play a lot, so i'm looking for some input. what makes him great?
Well, Crabtree does all the above. Great route runner, speed, has great size and is very physical. Also, great hands and something like a 41" vertical leep. Best of all, he has great character and is a very grounded individual. A WR without a big ego, almost unthinkable.
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I watch teams like the Steelers and I see them pick the best player available, not for need. They always seem to be picking the highest rated player on their board. Noted that these teams aren't usually picking in the top 10, but they don't usually pick for need.
I reason I started this thread is because NFL teams are torn on this concept. I believe this is a league with a salary cap, free agency and teams have a good amount of turnover every year.
IMO, I think you can take the best player available and can suppliment position needs through FA. Also once you get past the first round where their may be super impact type players, then you have a combination of best player available with an eye toward needs. If you need a LB and in the second round your high person on the board is a DT but two people away is a solid LB and they grade out about the same, then you take the LB.
Your opinions are very insightful because I have a problem passing on a guy that is rated way higher then the next guy on my board because of a need. If a guy like Ray Lewis in on the board with Crabtree and they are rated very close to each other, then I take the need, but I just don't think there is a defensive player who rates close to Crabtree.
BTW, Seattle has greater needs then a WR. Are they going to pick for greatest need or best player available?
Personally I believe we are in the position we are in because we have historically drafted for need and passed on the best players available. One word..................Wimbley and look at what we passed on.
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Brown's are picking at #5 and Crabtree is still on the board. Most draft analysts say he may be the best player in the draft. He may be one of the few immediate impact players on the board. By impact, I mean a guy that can impact the number or W's and L's a team ends with.
Larry Fitzgerald type impact player. A player with great character and all the tools.
He's not a need for the Browns, who definately need defense, but he is a game changer. Can you afford to pass on him?
Receivers like this (great talent and small egos) don't come along very often and Edwards certainly hasn't shown he is a #1. Also, I can very easily see Edwards walking after this contract is up.
Curry is a solid LB and should be a very good fit. But, can you pass on a star for solid?
IMO, you take Crabtree. He is a definate #1 receiver and Edwards hasn't shown he can be that dependable #1 guy. Crabtree would also make Edwards a better receiver (he doesn't want to be regarded as a #2) and better option because he wouldn't get doubled all the time. How dynamic for Quinn...... Crabtree, Edwards and JJ or Cribbs in the slot and Winslow or Rucker at TE.
Also gives you some trade options without hurting the offense.
As far as defense, how about a guy like Barton and another FA to help solidify that unit. Some new blood and a new scheme can make that unit decent, not great. Picking Curry won't make it great either.
IMO, when the best player in the draft is there (need or not) you got to take him. You have Free Agency and also other picks in the draft for needs. You have some trade options to get additional picks also.
I see Fitzgerald and Boldin and slobber on myself thinking what Crabtree and Edwards would do to defenses. When I imagine Curry on defense I don't see that a team would have to game plan for him. No disrespect, Curry should be a very solid ILB in the 3-4. But..................................Crabtree, wow.
Brown's are picking at #5 and Crabtree is still on the board. Most draft analysts say he may be the best player in the draft. He may be one of the few immediate impact players on the board. By impact, I mean a guy that can impact the number or W's and L's a team ends with.
Larry Fitzgerald type impact player. A player with great character and all the tools.
He's not a need for the Browns, who definately need defense, but he is a game changer. Can you afford to pass on him?
Receivers like this (great talent and small egos) don't come along very often and Edwards certainly hasn't shown he is a #1. Also, I can very easily see Edwards walking after this contract is up.
Curry is a solid LB and should be a very good fit. But, can you pass on a star for solid?
IMO, you take Crabtree. He is a definate #1 receiver and Edwards hasn't shown he can be that dependable #1 guy. Crabtree would also make Edwards a better receiver (he doesn't want to be regarded as a #2) and better option because he wouldn't get doubled all the time. How dynamic for Quinn...... Crabtree, Edwards and JJ or Cribbs in the slot and Winslow or Rucker at TE.
Also gives you some trade options without hurting the offense.
As far as defense, how about a guy like Barton and another FA to help solidify that unit. Some new blood and a new scheme can make that unit decent, not great. Picking Curry won't make it great either.
IMO, when the best player in the draft is there (need or not) you got to take him. You have Free Agency and also other picks in the draft for needs. You have some trade options to get additional picks also.
I see Fitzgerald and Boldin and slobber on myself thinking what Crabtree and Edwards would do to defenses. When I imagine Curry on defense I don't see that a team would have to game plan for him. No disrespect, Curry should be a very solid ILB in the 3-4. But..................................Crabtree, wow.
Great Post Y-town, we agree on something
You are correct that Crabtree IMO will be a special player (Great) and if I am drafting I take a player like Crabtree with a chance to be great over a guy like Curry who will be a solid pro IMO but not a game changing type player which is what we need, and the only guys I see in this draft that are game changing players are Crabtree, Harvin and Maclin and # 5 is too early to take Maclin or Harvin
You are 100% correct what you say about Curry who I believe will be a good solid player but not a great player and really how much better are we going to improve on defense with just adding Curry when we require at least 2 pass rushers from the outside linebacker positions.
Barton I feel is too slow though he is solid and a run stuffer, he might be a good choice to use as a 1st-2nd down linebacker, but I believe this team needs to add speed on defense as we are a very slow defense at LB and DB
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would crabtree improve our offense? yes, without a doubt.
the question we have to ask is what makes crabtree a great receiver. is it his speed? is he incredibly physical? is it his size? is he shifty, agile, hard to contain? leaping ability? ability to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown? does he run great routes?
a true number one receiver needs to run superior routes, be able to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown, and have at least one of the other qualities; he needs to either be a great leaper, have great size, be ridiculously physical, have great size, be shifty and hard to contain or have truly elite speed.
i haven't watched crabtree play a lot, so i'm looking for some input. what makes him great?
a true number one receiver needs to run superior routes, be able to adjust to the ball and catch it no matter where it's thrown, and have at least one of the other qualities; he needs to either be a great leaper, have great size, be ridiculously physical, have great size, be shifty and hard to contain or have truly elite speed.
i haven't watched crabtree play a lot, so i'm looking for some input. what makes him great?
Isn't this the exact same description the "experts "use to describe Calvin Johnson?
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