Stockton Shorts Discusses Brian Hoyer
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You play a rookie who can't beat our a journeyman when you're in the midst of the playoffs?
That's not gonna fly. The kid still has time to show his stuff.
I'll tale the chance of playoffs vs the risk of losing completely.
And its easy to say you draft and play them. The browns have been doing that for 15 years. They haven't found one yet. Neither have a lot of other teams found a franchise qb.
Football is the ultimate team game. You need a good team to win. Qb is one of the most important parts. But you can win with a good d and a qb who protects the ball. Like hoyer does.
Once again all the Browns have done is taken other teams trash and tried to make them gold.
Playing Hoyer IS repeating what the Browns have done over and over.
Browns have taken 3 QBs in the first round before Manziel. Couch/Quinn/Weeden. Thats it. 3 times in 14 years.
Meanwhile Holcombe, Detmer, Dilfer, Peterson, Garcia, Gradkowksi, Campbell, Anderson, and Delhomme were all cast offs that other teams didn't want that we brought in because we thought we could win "right now"
Browns have failed to establish a plan and stick to it because they let some other teams garbage come in and disrupt the plans in an effort to sneak into the playoffs right now, and when that fails it turns into everyone being fired and having to restart.
Sound familiar?
Don't let starvation lead you to believe that a can of tuna is Thanksgiving Dinner and thats exactly what you Browns fans are doing.
Its like that experiment with kids where you stick a bowl of M&Ms in front of them and say "You can either have 1 M&M now but none after that OR if you don't eat any for 4 hours you can have all the M&Ms you want" and each time the kids eat the 1 M&M right away because kids are dumb and don't understand the concept of sacrifice for a greater goal.
Thats what the Browns have been since 1999. Brian Hoyer is once again the Browns wanting the 1 M&M now and saying "Fuck it" to the future.
Once again all the Browns have done is taken other teams trash and tried to make them gold.
Playing Hoyer IS repeating what the Browns have done over and over.
Browns have taken 3 QBs in the first round before Manziel. Couch/Quinn/Weeden. Thats it. 3 times in 14 years.
Meanwhile Holcombe, Detmer, Dilfer, Peterson, Garcia, Gradkowksi, Campbell, Anderson, and Delhomme were all cast offs that other teams didn't want that we brought in because we thought we could win "right now"
Browns have failed to establish a plan and stick to it because they let some other teams garbage come in and disrupt the plans in an effort to sneak into the playoffs right now, and when that fails it turns into everyone being fired and having to restart.
Sound familiar?
Don't let starvation lead you to believe that a can of tuna is Thanksgiving Dinner and thats exactly what you Browns fans are doing.
Its like that experiment with kids where you stick a bowl of M&Ms in front of them and say "You can either have 1 M&M now but none after that OR if you don't eat any for 4 hours you can have all the M&Ms you want" and each time the kids eat the 1 M&M right away because kids are dumb and don't understand the concept of sacrifice for a greater goal.
Thats what the Browns have been since 1999. Brian Hoyer is once again the Browns wanting the 1 M&M now and saying "Fuck it" to the future.
Based on your ongoing convoluted logic we should then have been fantastic on the three times we drafted but they sucked. You have no idea if Manziel will be good or not. There is absolutely no reason to rush him.
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Once again Hoyer is not the future.
Should be obvious to everyone by now.
You don't build a house and wait until its time to furnish it and go "Time to switch out the foundation"
You build around your QB. Find the QB then build with that QB.
Thats how you have a chance at the playoffs for 10 straight years and not just 1 year in which you have the easiest schedule in the NFL (and despite that if the playoffs were next week we wouldn't make it) -
Once again all the Browns have done is taken other teams trash and tried to make them gold.
Playing Hoyer IS repeating what the Browns have done over and over.
Browns have taken 3 QBs in the first round before Manziel. Couch/Quinn/Weeden. Thats it. 3 times in 14 years.
Meanwhile Holcombe, Detmer, Dilfer, Peterson, Garcia, Gradkowksi, Campbell, Anderson, and Delhomme were all cast offs that other teams didn't want that we brought in because we thought we could win "right now"
Browns have failed to establish a plan and stick to it because they let some other teams garbage come in and disrupt the plans in an effort to sneak into the playoffs right now, and when that fails it turns into everyone being fired and having to restart.
Sound familiar?
Don't let starvation lead you to believe that a can of tuna is Thanksgiving Dinner and thats exactly what you Browns fans are doing.
Its like that experiment with kids where you stick a bowl of M&Ms in front of them and say "You can either have 1 M&M now but none after that OR if you don't eat any for 4 hours you can have all the M&Ms you want" and each time the kids eat the 1 M&M right away because kids are dumb and don't understand the concept of sacrifice for a greater goal.
Thats what the Browns have been since 1999. Brian Hoyer is once again the Browns wanting the 1 M&M now and saying "Fuck it" to the future.
Based on your ongoing convoluted logic we should then have been fantastic on the three times we drafted but they sucked. You have no idea if Manziel will be good or not. There is absolutely no reason to rush him.
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"Theres No Reason To Rush Him"
Dont you think he should get in game OTJ training? If he is our starter next year.. wouldnt it be good if he got 5-6 games under his belt so he has seen live bullets? That makes sense to me. You wouldnt want him to start off next season unprepared. It would be unfair to judge him then. Now the he would be in his second year.. people will expect more.. but its unfair to expect more if he's never played. Thats why you give him games THIS year.. so NEXT year you can get a better judgement of his play
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"Theres No Reason To Rush Him"
Dont you think he should get in game OTJ training? If he is our starter next year.. wouldnt it be good if he got 5-6 games under his belt so he has seen live bullets? That makes sense to me. You wouldnt want him to start off next season unprepared. It would be unfair to judge him then. Now the he would be in his second year.. people will expect more.. but its unfair to expect more if he's never played. Thats why you give him games THIS year.. so NEXT year you can get a better judgement of his play
"Theres No Reason To Rush Him"
Dont you think he should get in game OTJ training? If he is our starter next year.. wouldnt it be good if he got 5-6 games under his belt so he has seen live bullets? That makes sense to me. You wouldnt want him to start off next season unprepared. It would be unfair to judge him then. Now the he would be in his second year.. people will expect more.. but its unfair to expect more if he's never played. Thats why you give him games THIS year.. so NEXT year you can get a better judgement of his play
If we weren't right smack in the middle of the division crown / playoff picture, then it would be simple. No one here disagrees with this, however there is a time and a place, and at 6-4 it's neither............. I just don't see why this is so hard for some to understand?
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Once again Hoyer is not the future.
Should be obvious to everyone by now.
You don't build a house and wait until its time to furnish it and go "Time to switch out the foundation"
You build around your QB. Find the QB then build with that QB.
Thats how you have a chance at the playoffs for 10 straight years and not just 1 year in which you have the easiest schedule in the NFL (and despite that if the playoffs were next week we wouldn't make it)Once again Hoyer is not the future.
Should be obvious to everyone by now.
You don't build a house and wait until its time to furnish it and go "Time to switch out the foundation"
You build around your QB. Find the QB then build with that QB.
Thats how you have a chance at the playoffs for 10 straight years and not just 1 year in which you have the easiest schedule in the NFL (and despite that if the playoffs were next week we wouldn't make it)
Counter points... Russell Wilson, Aaron rogers, big gay Ben, tom Brady. All had great foundations, mainly a good/great d before they came in.
Its just not as easy as you're trying to make it or all NFL teams would have franchise qbs. I get your opinion but its easier said than done.
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"Theres No Reason To Rush Him"
Dont you think he should get in game OTJ training? If he is our starter next year.. wouldnt it be good if he got 5-6 games under his belt so he has seen live bullets? That makes sense to me. You wouldnt want him to start off next season unprepared. It would be unfair to judge him then. Now the he would be in his second year.. people will expect more.. but its unfair to expect more if he's never played. Thats why you give him games THIS year.. so NEXT year you can get a better judgement of his play
If we weren't right smack in the middle of the division crown / playoff picture, then it would be simple. No one here disagrees with this, however there is a time and a place, and at 6-4 it's neither............. I just don't see why this is so hard for some to understand?
If we weren't right smack in the middle of the division crown / playoff picture, then it would be simple. No one here disagrees with this, however there is a time and a place, and at 6-4 it's neither............. I just don't see why this is so hard for some to understand?
Once again, you are choosing the M&M now instead of all you want later.
This team is not Super Bowl quality. Brian Hoyer isn't the future.
Those two things are known, everything else is just a waste of time. What are you doing then? Honestly tell me. What are you going to prove if the Browns make the 6 seed and then start a 2nd year QB that has never seen the field before next year, against a 1st or 2nd in the division schedule no less. Is that how you build long term? Or even worse you resign Hoyer. Then its medocre from here until the eyes can see.
Browns have played the easiest schedule in the NFL and if the playoffs started next week the Browns would finish 10th in the conference. What more do you need to find out about this year?
I've said it since day 1, this is all a waste of time. "Oh Stockton being in the playoff hunt is a waste of time huh?" yes. Yes it is. It only goes to show how small time you people are. You care more about this team, which isn't that good, having a chance at the playoffs NOW then setting this franchise up for the future.
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"Theres No Reason To Rush Him"
Dont you think he should get in game OTJ training? If he is our starter next year.. wouldnt it be good if he got 5-6 games under his belt so he has seen live bullets? That makes sense to me. You wouldnt want him to start off next season unprepared. It would be unfair to judge him then. Now the he would be in his second year.. people will expect more.. but its unfair to expect more if he's never played. Thats why you give him games THIS year.. so NEXT year you can get a better judgement of his play
If we weren't right smack in the middle of the division crown / playoff picture, then it would be simple. No one here disagrees with this, however there is a time and a place, and at 6-4 it's neither............. I just don't see why this is so hard for some to understand?
If we weren't right smack in the middle of the division crown / playoff picture, then it would be simple. No one here disagrees with this, however there is a time and a place, and at 6-4 it's neither............. I just don't see why this is so hard for some to understand?
Exactly. Maziel is on contract for years. We are in the hunt for playoffs. NFL is a win now league. The browns are winning now more than ever. Hoyer is behind the o line, run d, and wrs of things that need fixing.
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How would one find out if Manziel is good or not?
allow him to learn the playbook and adjust to a game that he isn't acclimated to without forcing anything or stunting his growth by throwing him to the wolves. Whether manziel plays this season or not has absolutely no bearing on the 2015 draft. the Browns won't draft a new QB either way.
Brian Hoyer isn't setting the world on fire, but he is protecting the ball, something I'm not sure a 21 year old rookie is able to do. coaches dont look to what's best for next year or the year after that. Pettine will leave next year to Farmer. All the coaching staff is worried about is the next game. Coaches who don't focus all their energy on winning their next game don't hold their job very long. You should be smart enough to grab ahold of that concept, You're smart enough to forge a Mensa membership card.
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If Manziel did play the last 6 games, and did poorly - the browns wouldn't trash him and draft another 1st round QB in 2015 (Only if Stockton was the GM). It'd be nice to "see what he's got" but you don't draft a first round QB every year, like Stockton thinks you do. In other words you don't give up on a guy even if he has a poor rookie season. Do you think Jacksonville will give up on Bortles? Minny on Bridgewater? Oakland on Carr? These are higher picked guys who aren't lighting the world on fire their rookie years - the highest picked guy actually kinda sucks.
What's the benefit in "seeing what he's got." We'll have him next year. We're not going to use another 1st on a QB next year regardless.
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Once again Hoyer is not the future.
Should be obvious to everyone by now.
You don't build a house and wait until its time to furnish it and go "Time to switch out the foundation"
You build around your QB. Find the QB then build with that QB.
Thats how you have a chance at the playoffs for 10 straight years and not just 1 year in which you have the easiest schedule in the NFL (and despite that if the playoffs were next week we wouldn't make it)
Counter points... Russell Wilson, Aaron rogers, big gay Ben, tom Brady. All had great foundations, mainly a good/great d before they came in.
Its just not as easy as you're trying to make it or all NFL teams would have franchise qbs. I get your opinion but its easier said than done.
Counter points... Russell Wilson, Aaron rogers, big gay Ben, tom Brady. All had great foundations, mainly a good/great d before they came in.
Its just not as easy as you're trying to make it or all NFL teams would have franchise qbs. I get your opinion but its easier said than done.
They absolutely built around Russell Wilson. They were going to start Matt Flynn because he was Rodgers backup and had experience, but Pete Carroll said no started a mobile rookie and let him learn on the job.
The defense was rebuilt the same year, the Seahawks were 7-9 the year before. The grew together and in the 2nd year of Wilson got a Super Bowl. They weren't great before Wilson.
Same with Big Ben. They were 6-10 the year before and he took over a 2-1 team. They grew together. Super Bowl in 2nd year.
Tom Brady, they were 5-11 the year before and he took over a 0-2 team. They weren't a great team. They became great together, Super Bowl in 1st year.
Aaron Rodgers they had a team that was 13-3 the year before. Rodgers sat on the bench for 4 years. They were loaded...the first year he played they went 6-10. They stripped that team down and built around Rodgers strengths, next year 11-5 and Super Bowl in his 3rd year.
You build around your QB. This idea that all these teams were built up and these QBs were eased in, is flat wrong. You get your QB and you build the team.
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If we weren't right smack in the middle of the division crown / playoff picture, then it would be simple. No one here disagrees with this, however there is a time and a place, and at 6-4 it's neither............. I just don't see why this is so hard for some to understand?
Once again, you are choosing the M&M now instead of all you want later.
This team is not Super Bowl quality. Brian Hoyer isn't the future.
Those two things are known, everything else is just a waste of time. What are you doing then? Honestly tell me. What are you going to prove if the Browns make the 6 seed and then start a 2nd year QB that has never seen the field before next year, against a 1st or 2nd in the division schedule no less. Is that how you build long term? Or even worse you resign Hoyer. Then its medocre from here until the eyes can see.
Browns have played the easiest schedule in the NFL and if the playoffs started next week the Browns would finish 10th in the conference. What more do you need to find out about this year?
I've said it since day 1, this is all a waste of time. "Oh Stockton being in the playoff hunt is a waste of time huh?" yes. Yes it is. It only goes to show how small time you people are. You care more about this team, which isn't that good, having a chance at the playoffs NOW then setting this franchise up for the future.
Once again, you are choosing the M&M now instead of all you want later.
This team is not Super Bowl quality. Brian Hoyer isn't the future.
Those two things are known, everything else is just a waste of time. What are you doing then? Honestly tell me. What are you going to prove if the Browns make the 6 seed and then start a 2nd year QB that has never seen the field before next year, against a 1st or 2nd in the division schedule no less. Is that how you build long term? Or even worse you resign Hoyer. Then its medocre from here until the eyes can see.
Browns have played the easiest schedule in the NFL and if the playoffs started next week the Browns would finish 10th in the conference. What more do you need to find out about this year?
I've said it since day 1, this is all a waste of time. "Oh Stockton being in the playoff hunt is a waste of time huh?" yes. Yes it is. It only goes to show how small time you people are. You care more about this team, which isn't that good, having a chance at the playoffs NOW then setting this franchise up for the future.
Becuz' making the playoffs would set this franchise back 10 more years and Hoyer is the only reason we're not undefeated. Got it.
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Once again, you are choosing the M&M now instead of all you want later.
This team is not Super Bowl quality. Brian Hoyer isn't the future.
Those two things are known, everything else is just a waste of time. What are you doing then? Honestly tell me. What are you going to prove if the Browns make the 6 seed and then start a 2nd year QB that has never seen the field before next year, against a 1st or 2nd in the division schedule no less. Is that how you build long term? Or even worse you resign Hoyer. Then its medocre from here until the eyes can see.
Browns have played the easiest schedule in the NFL and if the playoffs started next week the Browns would finish 10th in the conference. What more do you need to find out about this year?
I've said it since day 1, this is all a waste of time. "Oh Stockton being in the playoff hunt is a waste of time huh?" yes. Yes it is. It only goes to show how small time you people are. You care more about this team, which isn't that good, having a chance at the playoffs NOW then setting this franchise up for the future.
Becuz' making the playoffs would set this franchise back 10 more years and Hoyer is the only reason we're not undefeated. Got it.
Becuz' making the playoffs would set this franchise back 10 more years and Hoyer is the only reason we're not undefeated. Got it.
What would happen if we didn't make the playoffs?
Would that make this year worth it? Would that justify not seeing Manziel play before you have to make a contract decision on Hoyer? Or would that mean they fucked up?
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Becuz' making the playoffs would set this franchise back 10 more years and Hoyer is the only reason we're not undefeated. Got it.
What would happen if we didn't make the playoffs?
Would that make this year worth it? Would that justify not seeing Manziel play before you have to make a contract decision on Hoyer? Or would that mean they fucked up?
What would happen if we didn't make the playoffs?
Would that make this year worth it? Would that justify not seeing Manziel play before you have to make a contract decision on Hoyer? Or would that mean they fucked up?
You're 100 percent positive that Hoyer isn't the answer and doesn't deserve starter money. How would Manziel change that? You're breaking your own logic...
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What would happen if we didn't make the playoffs?
Would that make this year worth it? Would that justify not seeing Manziel play before you have to make a contract decision on Hoyer? Or would that mean they fucked up?
You're 100 percent positive that Hoyer isn't the answer and doesn't deserve starter money. How would Manziel change that? You're breaking your own logic...
You're 100 percent positive that Hoyer isn't the answer and doesn't deserve starter money. How would Manziel change that? You're breaking your own logic...
Because I'm 100% positive that Hoyer isn't the answer and doesn't deserve starter money is why I have been saying from the start that Manziel needs to play so the Browns know what they have going forward. Also the sooner Manziel gets experience the faster he'll be good (if he's going to be good). Letting him take his lumps now sets the Browns up better for next year.
Playing Hoyer is only delaying that.
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I don't think you realize how stupid you sound by inferring that the Browns would draft a new QB one year after trading up in the first round to select a QB. Manziel could shit down the side of his leg for the last six games and they still wouldn't draft a new one.
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Counter points... Russell Wilson, Aaron rogers, big gay Ben, tom Brady. All had great foundations, mainly a good/great d before they came in.
Its just not as easy as you're trying to make it or all NFL teams would have franchise qbs. I get your opinion but its easier said than done.
They absolutely built around Russell Wilson. They were going to start Matt Flynn because he was Rodgers backup and had experience, but Pete Carroll said no started a mobile rookie and let him learn on the job.
The defense was rebuilt the same year, the Seahawks were 7-9 the year before. The grew together and in the 2nd year of Wilson got a Super Bowl. They weren't great before Wilson.
Same with Big Ben. They were 6-10 the year before and he took over a 2-1 team. They grew together. Super Bowl in 2nd year.
Tom Brady, they were 5-11 the year before and he took over a 0-2 team. They weren't a great team. They became great together, Super Bowl in 1st year.
Aaron Rodgers they had a team that was 13-3 the year before. Rodgers sat on the bench for 4 years. They were loaded...the first year he played they went 6-10. They stripped that team down and built around Rodgers strengths, next year 11-5 and Super Bowl in his 3rd year.
You build around your QB. This idea that all these teams were built up and these QBs were eased in, is flat wrong. You get your QB and you build the team.
They absolutely built around Russell Wilson. They were going to start Matt Flynn because he was Rodgers backup and had experience, but Pete Carroll said no started a mobile rookie and let him learn on the job.
The defense was rebuilt the same year, the Seahawks were 7-9 the year before. The grew together and in the 2nd year of Wilson got a Super Bowl. They weren't great before Wilson.
Same with Big Ben. They were 6-10 the year before and he took over a 2-1 team. They grew together. Super Bowl in 2nd year.
Tom Brady, they were 5-11 the year before and he took over a 0-2 team. They weren't a great team. They became great together, Super Bowl in 1st year.
Aaron Rodgers they had a team that was 13-3 the year before. Rodgers sat on the bench for 4 years. They were loaded...the first year he played they went 6-10. They stripped that team down and built around Rodgers strengths, next year 11-5 and Super Bowl in his 3rd year.
You build around your QB. This idea that all these teams were built up and these QBs were eased in, is flat wrong. You get your QB and you build the team.
Sorry but you're flat out wrong. The Seattle and Pittsburg D were both great at the time those two guys joined the team.
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They absolutely built around Russell Wilson. They were going to start Matt Flynn because he was Rodgers backup and had experience, but Pete Carroll said no started a mobile rookie and let him learn on the job.
The defense was rebuilt the same year, the Seahawks were 7-9 the year before. The grew together and in the 2nd year of Wilson got a Super Bowl. They weren't great before Wilson.
Same with Big Ben. They were 6-10 the year before and he took over a 2-1 team. They grew together. Super Bowl in 2nd year.
Tom Brady, they were 5-11 the year before and he took over a 0-2 team. They weren't a great team. They became great together, Super Bowl in 1st year.
Aaron Rodgers they had a team that was 13-3 the year before. Rodgers sat on the bench for 4 years. They were loaded...the first year he played they went 6-10. They stripped that team down and built around Rodgers strengths, next year 11-5 and Super Bowl in his 3rd year.
You build around your QB. This idea that all these teams were built up and these QBs were eased in, is flat wrong. You get your QB and you build the team.
Sorry but you're flat out wrong. The Seattle and Pittsburg D were both great at the time those two guys joined the team.
Sorry but you're flat out wrong. The Seattle and Pittsburg D were both great at the time those two guys joined the team.
As they say, there's more than one way to carve a turkey, skin a cat, bake a cake. Teams aren't all built by the same model and multiple models work and have worked.
I'm just looking forward to ATL. I don't care who's behind center, I'm going to be happy if they win...
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Is the FO just waiting to see what Hoyer can really do when Gordon comes back and spreads the D(hopefully)? Just a thought. Anyone else wondering what the FO is thinking/planning?
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Is the FO just waiting to see what Hoyer can really do when Gordon comes back and spreads the D(hopefully)? Just a thought. Anyone else wondering what the FO is thinking/planning?
Is the FO just waiting to see what Hoyer can really do when Gordon comes back and spreads the D(hopefully)? Just a thought. Anyone else wondering what the FO is thinking/planning?
From what I have heard from the FO, I think they are pretty solidly behind manziel. Hoyer can change that with a big last 6 games and a playoff appearance.
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