Who is under more pressure? Pet or Farmer?
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Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season regardless of who they bring in as a "backup" (looking more and more like Josh McCown http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000473873/article/josh-mccown-visiting-qbneedy-cleveland-browns) or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick. "They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
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Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season regardless of who they bring in as a "backup" (looking more and more like Josh McCown http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000473873/article/josh-mccown-visiting-qbneedy-cleveland-browns) or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick. "They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season regardless of who they bring in as a "backup" (looking more and more like Josh McCown http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000473873/article/josh-mccown-visiting-qbneedy-cleveland-browns) or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick. "They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
The only reason JM should start is if he is the best qb period. You don't start him for any other reason. I don't buy into some of these stories anymore. I see a good path to success the next season with the plan Pettine laid out of improving our defense into one of the best in the league. Whoever is qb will have the advantage of the Browns having one of the better O lines in the league. If the Manziel pick turns out to be a bust so be it, put it behind you and go forward, no need to fire anyone and tear down a foundation again over one mistake IMO. We know at least one of the reasons this club has not been successful since 99 has been for lack of continuity. I believe Haslam sees that. Pettine was one of the first HC in the league to get approval from the owner minutes after the last game of the season. Haslam has already shown his support for Farmer.
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Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season regardless of who they bring in as a "backup" (looking more and more like Josh McCown http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000473873/article/josh-mccown-visiting-qbneedy-cleveland-browns) or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick. "They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season.....................or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick.
"They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
I never buy into these types of statements......how does Davis know this and why would Pettine lose his job for a screwed up pick??...
I think the Browns gave him a real chance already....and, unfortunately, he failed that chance.....so they are still waiting till they think he's ready for chance #2....
Bottom line....the way things have already gone with JFF, I dont think he will make or break this FO going forward......
Haslem has spoken several times and said repeatedly that Pettine and Farmer are safe. He wouldn't do this if they were on the hot seat......
plus, I cant believe he would fire anyone due to a single bad pick.....And if he does, then he better be ready to hire a new GM every year or so....
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One of the "outs" that E.D. used is that if they start him most of the season and he still fails then they can blame it all on the "other" things that were going on with him that no one knew about. But he was adamant that he had not really been given a real fair shot like all the other rookies QB's that played this past year. I have said all along that it was not a fair shot to give him 1+ games with a Mack-less O line when even our starter who had been doing well fell apart without Mack.
We have a very good Oline, but as we showed this year we are 1 player away from being clearly crappy. We were unable to "fix" the loss of Mack.
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One of the "outs" that E.D. used is that if they start him most of the season and he still fails then they can blame it all on the "other" things that were going on with him that no one knew about. But he was adamant that he had not really been given a real fair shot like all the other rookies QB's that played this past year. I have said all along that it was not a fair shot to give him 1+ games with a Mack-less O line when even our starter who had been doing well fell apart without Mack.
We have a very good Oline, but as we showed this year we are 1 player away from being clearly crappy. We were unable to "fix" the loss of Mack.
One of the "outs" that E.D. used is that if they start him most of the season and he still fails then they can blame it all on the "other" things that were going on with him that no one knew about. But he was adamant that he had not really been given a real fair shot like all the other rookies QB's that played this past year. I have said all along that it was not a fair shot to give him 1+ games with a Mack-less O line when even our starter who had been doing well fell apart without Mack.
We have a very good Oline, but as we showed this year we are 1 player away from being clearly crappy. We were unable to "fix" the loss of Mack.
Im not going down that whole "what was fair or not with Johnny" road again......
I guess if you think playing week 14 or 15 was "his chance"........
I think he got his chance starting week 1 of training camp and he had MORE than a fair and equal opportunity to earn the right to play.....and he blew it.....
So, no matter what, I just dont see anyone getting fired for his play at this point.....I think Haslem is smart enough to know who's really the screw up......
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Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season regardless of who they bring in as a "backup" (looking more and more like Josh McCown http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000473873/article/josh-mccown-visiting-qbneedy-cleveland-browns) or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick. "They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
Eric Davis on NFL Network this morning was insistent that the Browns must start JM this season regardless of who they bring in as a "backup" or either Farmer or Pettine losses his job for screwing up the pick. "They must give him a real chance to either make it or fail as soon as they think he is ready. Otherwise one of those two losses his job."
Strong words.
Strong is one characterization... but look at what he threw in as a qualifier... "... as soon as they think he is ready." Duh! I can hear Pet now... "Yeah, we think Johnny is ready, but I'm still going to sit him."
Add that no one is getting fired over one pick... especially not one as uncertain as JM was... and stupid becomes a better descriptor. Staff's are fired over direction of the team as whole and team performance vs. expectations.
Sometimes air time just has to be filled.
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I'd fire Farmer before I'd fire Pettine.
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To answer the question posed in the title:
Off season, Farmer is under more pressure.
In season, it is Pettine.
Pretty simple, really.
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Farmer is under waaay more pressure at this point. At the end of it all... the GM always takes the knock for bad picks. But what's made his seat somehow even hotter is the idiotic transgression to text the sideline during a game. That's joker level... bush league... and his head should roll for that. There's probably a telling reason it's never been done before (GMs are usually savvy guys) and it *hints* something about Ray that he was the first and only to ever do it.
It takes a lot of faith to keep Ray Farmer in the GM seat; it took a ton of faith to put him there to begin with.
The bright side is, the Ray Farmer story could one day be special for a good reason (possibly) if Jimmy lets him get his lumps in at GM. Right now, thus far, the Ray Farmer story is *special* for a bad reason, as though he were dense. The dude is 40, very very young for a GM.... he should get better, but the leash can't afford to be real long from here. A savvy draft in 2015 is all he needs....
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For the record.... Johnny was just like Indians SS/2B prospect Brandon Phillips. Way over-confident... not humbled enough by their age.
Brandon Phillips had MLB All-Star fielding skills but his bat needed developed. His attitude was such a distraction in the minors that he was put in "The Show/The MLB" and hit at the Mendoza Line (.200) for a season to humble him.
Mike Pettine saw Johnny's poor commitment & didn't start him until he faced the toughest Ds on the schedule: CIN, @CAR, @BAL (got hurt in CAR). This may have been for a good reason... and it seems to have worked.
Johnny voluntarily entered Recovery, seeking to resolve his belief system. It worked. (at least to the first degree)
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Farmer is under waaay more pressure at this point. At the end of it all... the GM always takes the knock for bad picks. But what's made his seat somehow even hotter is the idiotic transgression to text the sideline during a game. That's joker level... bush league... and his head should roll for that. There's probably a telling reason it's never been done before (GMs are usually savvy guys) and it *hints* something about Ray that he was the first and only to ever do it.
It takes a lot of faith to keep Ray Farmer in the GM seat; it took a ton of faith to put him there to begin with.
The bright side is, the Ray Farmer story could one day be special for a good reason (possibly) if Jimmy lets him get his lumps in at GM. Right now, thus far, the Ray Farmer story is *special* for a bad reason, as though he were dense. The dude is 40, very very young for a GM.... he should get better, but the leash can't afford to be real long from here. A savvy draft in 2015 is all he needs....
But what's made his seat somehow even hotter is the idiotic transgression to text the sideline during a game........ There's probably a telling reason it's never been done before (GMs are usually savvy guys) and it *hints* something about Ray that he was the first and only to ever do it.
Thats an assumption....."that it's never been done before"......
It's just as possible that it happens all the time and the real "first" is that our OC broke code and cried to a reporter about it.....
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Philips went on to become a multi-time MLB All-Star (albeit for the Reds, not the Indians)....
and likewise, Johnny's future may be more than we could foresee after 6 Quarters in 2014.
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Look, Mudfly from Painesville...
The fact remains that the transgression occurred. And it's a gross one.
I'm not calling for his head, but I would have a right to... a smoking gun reason to.
There's a logic you employed that is really fucked up. Recognize that.
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How 'bout you employ just a bit more of your brain, old man Tour2ma if you care to follow up my point?
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the texting rule was made because of knucklehead players texting friends and family AND other players during the game.
now what would have happened to farmer if he had just gone down on the sidelines and talked to someone? is that against the 'rules' too?
i seem to remember owners on the sidelines every game, but there is no rule against that, is there?
to say someone should get fired for texting the sidelines is ludacris.
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I'm not personally a fan of Manziel any more than what wearing Brown and Orange grants you in my Heart.
What I know is...
A] the kid got his ass handed to him through 6 quarters in NFL, after doing acrobatics at A&M...
and a lifetime's worth of who knows what outside the lines.
and
B] he entered treatment either to truly sort out his purpose & mission or because his PR dept. convinced him for his image.
C] this season... we got till April 15, 2016... to determine which part of B is true and how that looks to translate between the lines going forward.
D] it's been done before that a 21/22 yr old finds themself after chaos and lives on to do things contrary to perception.
That's what I know... and at least through 2015, we want to be open to the narrative of redemption for Manziel. Discover the developing story... flaming degenerate or redeemed quality QB (to his NFL potential, whatever that is.) The teller is whether the guy will actually work his ass off in that film room. How is he changing? Not what isn't he doing, but 'what IS he doing?'
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actually, miktoxic...
you should likely review the knucklehead because the rule was not made for players, and the owners are only on the sideline well before kickoff on game day.
you don't know the rules you speak towards and you might not understand them if you would read 'em.
There's certain boxes in the stadium for owners & GMs & other team personnel like the spotters & callers of the game.
There's a reason that players use that phone on the sideline.
And only certain team officials are able to be on the other end of that line, or on the radio with the sideline.
GM & Owner are not among those designated to be communicating with the sideline during a game.
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actually, miktoxic...
you should likely review the knucklehead because the rule was not made for players, and the owners are only on the sideline well before kickoff on game day.
you don't know the rules you speak towards and you might not understand them if you would read 'em.
There's certain boxes in the stadium for owners & GMs & other team personnel like the spotters & callers of the game.
There's a reason that players use that phone on the sideline.
And only certain team officials are able to be on the other end of that line, or on the radio with the sideline.
GM & Owner are not among those designated to be communicating with the sideline during a game.
actually, miktoxic...
you should likely review the knucklehead because the rule was not made for players, and the owners are only on the sideline well before kickoff on game day.
you don't know the rules you speak towards and you might not understand them if you would read 'em.
There's certain boxes in the stadium for owners & GMs & other team personnel like the spotters & callers of the game.
There's a reason that players use that phone on the sideline.
And only certain team officials are able to be on the other end of that line, or on the radio with the sideline.
GM & Owner are not among those designated to be communicating with the sideline during a game.
that's why my post was formed with questions because i was asking. i don't know the rules.
so the times where we see jerry jones on the sidelines are at a designated time at the end of the game?
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