For the religious - a question
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It seems, at least in my mind, ever more likely that life exists outside of this planet - in some form at least, maybe just at the microbial level. If this is proven to be the case, how does this affect your religious outlook - does this fit in with your personal view of how the universe came to be, or would it conflict with it? And if your view is different from the 'standard party line' of your religion, what about the two viewpoints?
No hidden agenda here, not just looking for answers from christians - hopefully Os can chime in, we maybe have different types of christians along with any lurking others. I'm genuinely interested to find out.
It seems, at least in my mind, ever more likely that life exists outside of this planet - in some form at least, maybe just at the microbial level. If this is proven to be the case, how does this affect your religious outlook - does this fit in with your personal view of how the universe came to be, or would it conflict with it? And if your view is different from the 'standard party line' of your religion, what about the two viewpoints?
No hidden agenda here, not just looking for answers from christians - hopefully Os can chime in, we maybe have different types of christians along with any lurking others. I'm genuinely interested to find out.
There is undoubtedly life outside earth. Intelligent life even. That in no way disproves the notion of a god. We have no idea what the universe really is or how it works. For all we know we could be a single molecule in God's fingernail.
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with all due respect - why does religion have to do with the statement by NASA?
It is a simple answer for a believer to think and know that if the Creator of heaven and earth
can make life out of nothing.... a microbe at Europa is small potatoes?
So I think that (faith?)is what is ultimately (attacked?) here with this discussion..
That and whether Assimov or Roddenberry had better storylines?
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The universe is a vast vast place. The furthest reaches of what we can see is similar to looking through binoculars on a clear day and seeing twenty miles or so.
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The universe is a vast vast place. The furthest reaches of what we can see is similar to looking through binoculars on a clear day and seeing twenty miles or so.
The universe is a vast vast place. The furthest reaches of what we can see is similar to looking through binoculars on a clear day and seeing twenty miles or so.
yes if the Hubble is relative, the limits of which uncovered exactly what Carl Sagan called "billions and billions"
of galaxies, and we still just scratched the surface?
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I'm not trying to attack anything and I'm sorry if you feel I am.
I guess the angle I'm thinking is "great creator, made the universe for humans" - the traditional holy books typically present humanity as the chosen species and the earth as the chosen planet of their respective deity. If we find other life, how does that reconcile with that stance? And what about intelligent life?
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Well, being very much a man who knows God is there and is indeed our Creator,
but not being religious at all,
I won't comment.
Nah.... it makes no difference to me at all - God doesn't have to have the Bible
explain that God also made other planets with different forms of life in other universes.
I do believe that in the infinite expansions of the universes...that surely God made life
elsewhere, maybe even people like us,
except they would be classier and not allow the invention of pittsburg steelers....
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I would think discoveries like this would require believers to have an even looser interpretation of their holy book.
On time travel, I don't really see how that's possible without a multiverse theory (from my understanding of it at least). Maybe going forward in time though, which theoretically is already possible.
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The Bible and thr Torah and the koran were all written when man was ignorant of the universe. If there is a god and he created all why would you reveal the infinite universe to someone who wasn't ready?
Early man walked away as modern man took control. Their minds weren't all the same and to conquer was their goal. So He built his great empires and he slaughtered his own kind, and he died a confused man and killed himself in his own mind... -
I would think discoveries like this would require believers to have an even looser interpretation of their holy book.
On time travel, I don't really see how that's possible without a multiverse theory (from my understanding of it at least). Maybe going forward in time though, which theoretically is already possible.
I would think discoveries like this would require believers to have an even looser interpretation of their holy book.
On time travel, I don't really see how that's possible without a multiverse theory (from my understanding of it at least). Maybe going forward in time though, which theoretically is already possible.
somehow "looser interpretations" comes off as funny from an engineer whose discipline is grounded in strict interpretations?
when it is exactly discoveries such as those gathered so far, that exclaim more intellegence than ourselves, even if it seems mysterious.
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I'm not trying to attack anything and I'm sorry if you feel I am.
I guess the angle I'm thinking is "great creator, made the universe for humans" - the traditional holy books typically present humanity as the chosen species and the earth as the chosen planet of their respective deity. If we find other life, how does that reconcile with that stance? And what about intelligent life?
I'm not trying to attack anything and I'm sorry if you feel I am.
I guess the angle I'm thinking is "great creator, made the universe for humans" - the traditional holy books typically present humanity as the chosen species and the earth as the chosen planet of their respective deity. If we find other life, how does that reconcile with that stance? And what about intelligent life?
actually the jews are the chosen people through the ancient covenants by God described in the hebrew texts of the Torah ( and later transcribed into greek.)
the claims made by the bible writers are only taken by faith and are simply put to the reader or seeker as "will you believe?"
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which leaves it as just faith.... not science first and only - but a faith proved by scientific discovery?
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What does the Bible say about the number of stars? Jeremiah writes: âAs the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of David my servantâ Jeremiah 33:22. At that time, when men of learning were convinced that there were only about 3,000 stars, Jeremiah wrote that nobody would be able to count the stars.
The bible does take into account the vastness of the universe. There is no evidence in science or the Bible that there is life elsewhere. We are His handiwork.
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What does the Bible say about the number of stars? Jeremiah writes: âAs the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of David my servantâ Jeremiah 33:22. At that time, when men of learning were convinced that there were only about 3,000 stars, Jeremiah wrote that nobody would be able to count the stars.
The bible does take into account the vastness of the universe. There is no evidence in science or the Bible that there is life elsewhere. We are His handiwork.
What does the Bible say about the number of stars? Jeremiah writes: As the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of David my servant Jeremiah 33:22. At that time, when men of learning were convinced that there were only about 3,000 stars, Jeremiah wrote that nobody would be able to count the stars.
The bible does take into account the vastness of the universe. There is no evidence in science or the Bible that there is life elsewhere. We are His handiwork.
There's life elsewhere.
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What does the Bible say about the number of stars? Jeremiah writes: âAs the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of David my servantâ Jeremiah 33:22. At that time, when men of learning were convinced that there were only about 3,000 stars, Jeremiah wrote that nobody would be able to count the stars.
The bible does take into account the vastness of the universe. There is no evidence in science or the Bible that there is life elsewhere. We are His handiwork.
What does the Bible say about the number of stars? Jeremiah writes: âAs the host of heaven cannot be numbered, neither the sand of the sea measured: so will I multiply the seed of David my servantâ Jeremiah 33:22. At that time, when men of learning were convinced that there were only about 3,000 stars, Jeremiah wrote that nobody would be able to count the stars.
The bible does take into account the vastness of the universe. There is no evidence in science or the Bible that there is life elsewhere. We are His handiwork.
No evidence yet. The question was based on the supposition that, as anticipated by NASA, evidence of some form of life is found. How would you reconcile your beliefs as expressed above with that news?
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The Bible and ETs
It is often asked, âJust because the Bible teaches about God creating intelligent life only on Earth, why couldnât He have done so elsewhere?â After all, Scripture does not discuss everything, e.g. motorcars. However, the biblical objection to ET is not merely an argument from silence. Motor cars, for example, are not a salvation issue, but we believe that sentient,intelligent, moral-decision-capable beings is, because it would undermine the authority of Scripture. In short, understanding the big picture of the Bible/gospel message allows us to conclude clearly that the reason the Bible doesnât mention extraterrestrials (ETs) is that there arenât any.1 Surely, if the earth were to be favoured with a visitation by real extraterrestrials from a galaxy far, far away, then one would reasonably expect that the Bible, and God in His sovereignty and foreknowledge, to mention such a momentous occasion, because it would clearly redefine man's place in the universe.
- The Bible indicates that the whole creation groans and travails under the weight of sin (Romans 8:18â22). The effect of the Curse following Adamâs Fall was universal.2 Otherwise what would be the point of God destroying this whole creation to make way for a new heavens and Earthâ2 Peter 3:13, Revelation 21:1 ff? Therefore, any ETs living elsewhere would have been (unjustly) affected by the Adamic Curse through no fault of their ownâthey would not have inherited Adamâs sin nature.
- When Christ (God) appeared in the flesh, He came to Earth not only to redeem mankind but eventually the whole creation back to Himself (Romans 8:21, Colossians 1:20). However, Christâs atoning death at Calvary cannot save these hypothetical ETs, because one needs to be a physical descendant of Adam for Christ to be our âkinsman-redeemerâ (Isaiah 59:20). Jesus was called âthe last Adamâ because there was a real first man, Adam (1 Corinthians 15:22,45)ânot a first Vulcan, Klingon etc. This is so a sinless human Substitute takes on the punishment all humans deserve for sin (Isaiah 53:6,10; Matthew 20:28; 1 John 2:2, 4:10), with no need to atone for any (non-existent) sin of his own (Hebrews 7:27).
- Since this would mean that any ETs would be lost for eternity when this present creation is destroyed in a fervent heat (2 Peter 3:10, 12), some have wondered whether Christâs sacrifice might be repeated elsewhere for other beings. However, Christ died once for all (Romans 6:10, 1 Peter 3:18) on the earth. He is not going to be crucified and resurrected again on other planets (Hebrews 9:26). This is confirmed by the fact that the redeemed (earthly) church is known as Christâs bride (Ephesians 5:22â33; Revelation 19:7â9) in a marriage that will last for eternity.3 Christ is not going to be a polygamist with many other brides from other planets.
- The Bible makes no provision for God to redeem any other species, any more than to redeem fallen angels (Hebrews 2:16).
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So you're saying that if there's life elsewhere, the bible is invalidated? I suspect there might be some who disagree with you.
Also, answering a hypothetical by saying the hypothetical wouldn't happen is just poor form.
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I know nobody asked but -
Id rate the "Bible Commentary" used by OBFan as accurate - but it doesnt fit your OP
NASA said life at the molecular level? microbes or something?
Didnt say ETs....
but if you want to talk angelic realm, then well you have something - created beings apart from humans.
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I know nobody asked but -
Id rate the "Bible Commentary" used by OBFan as accurate - but it doesnt fit your OP
NASA said life at the molecular level? microbes or something?
Didnt say ETs....
but if you want to talk angelic realm, then well you have something - created beings apart from humans.
I know nobody asked but -
Id rate the "Bible Commentary" used by OBFan as accurate - but it doesnt fit your OP
NASA said life at the molecular level? microbes or something?
Didnt say ETs....
but if you want to talk angelic realm, then well you have something - created beings apart from humans.
ET's would invalidate the bible which is why (in bad form) I said that hypothetical would never happen. As for some kind of microbes that would not affect my beliefs.
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I see no reason why you couldn't believe in the Bible and believe that there are other planets with intelligent life.
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Is the Bible falsifiable? And would a real live ET do it?
http://creation.com/is-the-bible-falsifiable
Is the Bible falsifiable? And would a real live ET do it?
(Round 2)
Further response by Gary Bates and Jonathan Sarfatihttp://creation.com/is-the-bible-falsifiable-and-would-a-real-live-et-do-it
These are a couple of the commentaries I looked at and agree with.
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