Oh Boy Here We Go
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mccown looked fine last week. if the D hadn't given the raiders a 2 touchdown lead at the half we wouldn't even be having this stupid ass discussion.
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mccown looked fine last week. if the D hadn't given the raiders a 2 touchdown lead at the half we wouldn't even be having this stupid ass discussion.
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mccown looked fine last week. if the D hadn't given the raiders a 2 touchdown lead at the half we wouldn't even be having this stupid ass discussion.
mccown looked fine last week. if the D hadn't given the raiders a 2 touchdown lead at the half we wouldn't even be having this stupid ass discussion.
Sorry Mik, but you're truly talking out of your ass on this one.
The first half he was god awful and he's overthrown/underthrown receivers 2-3 times that would have led to big plays or TD's
Mik- glad you think McCown looked fine last week- it's certainly a minority opinion. The fans aren't blind- they saw exactly what they expected out of Josh- a less than thrilling journeyman dud. This wasn't the Seahawks the Browns were playing.
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mik-the first half McCown looked like a rusty 36 y.o. coming back from a head injury. The 2nd half he looked like the player Pet thought he brought in and that is the only reason he gets the start over J-Man.
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Sure. McClown, Gilbert, Farmer, and Pettine. All world class choices.
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If I said those things now that you are saying, I get written off again as "fanboy" or "Manzealot" and no one takes me seriously.
Sure some would, but you've shown too much objectivity to get lumped back into the zealot crowd.
May have been a couple pre-mature pocket bails vs. TN, but the last, TD pass was the one, obvious JFF moment in that game. Since it came late, it worked and it was in a situation when most of us felt a play was needed, we approve. However, the throw to Benji was not the only choice. It was the maximum risk/reward choice. A first down would have sufficed. I'm pretty sure that's Pet's takeaway.
While I recognize the above, I also recognize that there were a lot more plays in the game when JM turned down the opportunity to go JFF. And that's what will ultimately win me over... and maybe even Pet...
I think Im about ready to see some extended Johnny play too......giving McCown(and more importantly, the team) another week....
Hey...if we lose this week, Id say play offs are out of the picture......so why not?.....put him in and let er rip!!!
Getting there myself, mud... but still depends on the SD game.
The choices are get it out of the way now or guarantee yourself that chicken season in 2016.
I just don't see the binary choice you do.
You don't? I guess I just think every rookie quarterback has to get used to the game by playing the game. And except for a couple of guys that first season is problematic.I just don't see the binary choice you do.
~edit and since that will either happen this year or next year and if the coach is on any kind of a deadline to win doing it next year pushes him into a third year of problems~
That's just my general observation, & I freely admit that you know a thousand times as much about the game than I do.
And as with many of these situations I would like to hear why you think otherwise. Seriously.
(and I don't believe that the last two games set anything in stone either way)
WSS
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ugggh.
hiatus time.
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TMZ stands by it's story today.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/09/tmz_stands_by_johnny_manziel_s.html
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It's really not an outrageous story. I can't imagine how some players might prefer one quarterback to the other nor can I imagine that they haven't discussed it out loud. I'll bet there are guys who'd rather have Josh out there too.
Kind of a non-story but that's what sells papers.
WSS
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TMZ stands by it's story today.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/09/tmz_stands_by_johnny_manziel_s.html
TMZ stands by it's story today.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/09/tmz_stands_by_johnny_manziel_s.html
True or not....My feeling on that story is that it's damaging to the team and whoever said it was out of line and doing more harm than good....
ALL locker rooms have varied opinions on a LOT of things.....real pro's keep that shit in the Locker Room and not on TMZ...
So, the team is struggling with the Defense, running game and O line, yet the coach has to deal with questions about TMZ & Johnny supporters all week.....no wonder he is getting short when he's asked about this crap every day...
And, I will qualify that this is NOT directly Johnnys fault, per se......but it is a sign of the shit storm that constantly swirls around him....
Yesterday, Pat Mcmanamon was on WKNR and talked about this.....saying "he" thought our FO was completely fed up with 15 months of dealing with it......(and I think he knows)
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TMZ stands by it's story today.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/09/tmz_stands_by_johnny_manziel_s.html
True or not....My feeling on that story is that it's damaging to the team and whoever said it was out of line and doing more harm than good....
ALL locker rooms have varied opinions on a LOT of things.....real pro's keep that shit in the Locker Room and not on TMZ...
So, the team is struggling with the Defense, running game and O line, yet the coach has to deal with questions about TMZ & Johnny supporters all week.....no wonder he is getting short when he's asked about this crap every day...
And, I will qualify that this is NOT directly Johnnys fault, per se......but it is a sign of the shit storm that constantly swirls around him....
Yesterday, Pat Mcmanamon was on WKNR and talked about this.....saying "he" thought our FO was completely fed up with 15 months of dealing with it......(and I think he knows)
True or not....My feeling on that story is that it's damaging to the team and whoever said it was out of line and doing more harm than good....
ALL locker rooms have varied opinions on a LOT of things.....real pro's keep that shit in the Locker Room and not on TMZ...
So, the team is struggling with the Defense, running game and O line, yet the coach has to deal with questions about TMZ & Johnny supporters all week.....no wonder he is getting short when he's asked about this crap every day...
And, I will qualify that this is NOT directly Johnnys fault, per se......but it is a sign of the shit storm that constantly swirls around him....
Yesterday, Pat Mcmanamon was on WKNR and talked about this.....saying "he" thought our FO was completely fed up with 15 months of dealing with it......(and I think he knows)
And if the Commissioner is able to trace back the signing of Austin to that two year contract to our FO currently on suspension, the Browns will be even deeper in the crapper.
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mccown looked fine last week. if the D hadn't given the raiders a 2 touchdown lead at the half we wouldn't even be having this stupid ass discussion.
mccown looked fine last week. if the D hadn't given the raiders a 2 touchdown lead at the half we wouldn't even be having this stupid ass discussion.
Damn, beat me to it. All this agreement up in here is creeping me out.
McCown looked like we expected him to look. He's not the problem. The defense is what's sinking my battleship.
But not sunk yet. No sirree.
I would like a win though. I don't really care how, or what QB.
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Players going to TMZ shows a lack of leadership and respect for the Head Coach/Organization.
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Just coming from a band standpoint there's always a difference of opinion as to who should do what. One guy thinks it should be a horn solo one guy a piano solo one guy a guitar solo. I bet there are guys in Springsteen's band that thing Stevie Van Zandt should get to put a couple of his songs on a record. But in none of those cases, well hopefully, is anyone actually outraged over the way things are. I would hope that the guy who think Johnny is the best choice will play hard and respect Josh McCown.
If I was Travis Benjamin I'd want Johnny to start. Or Andrew Hawkins. If I was Gary Barnidge I'd probably be happy with Josh.
Joe Thomas said as much when he hinted that the offensive line kind of likes a pocket passer so they didn't have to worry about where the hell the quarterback was going to be.
( probably some of the Steelers fans on this board would rather we had a different moderator, one that didn't fuck with their stupid screen names.
. )WSS
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True or not....My feeling on that story is that it's damaging to the team and whoever said it was out of line and doing more harm than good....
ALL locker rooms have varied opinions on a LOT of things.....real pro's keep that shit in the Locker Room and not on TMZ...
So, the team is struggling with the Defense, running game and O line, yet the coach has to deal with questions about TMZ & Johnny supporters all week.....no wonder he is getting short when he's asked about this crap every day...
And, I will qualify that this is NOT directly Johnnys fault, per se......but it is a sign of the shit storm that constantly swirls around him....
Yesterday, Pat Mcmanamon was on WKNR and talked about this.....saying "he" thought our FO was completely fed up with 15 months of dealing with it......(and I think he knows)
And if the Commissioner is able to trace back the signing of Austin to that two year contract to our FO currently on suspension, the Browns will be even deeper in the crapper.
And if the Commissioner is able to trace back the signing of Austin to that two year contract to our FO currently on suspension, the Browns will be even deeper in the crapper.
not sure where the TMZ story and that tie in.....but ok....
New Headline: players speak out on Johnny, Ray Farmer better watch out for commish....
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mik-the first half McCown looked like a rusty 36 y.o. coming back from a head injury. The 2nd half he looked like the player Pet thought he brought in and that is the only reason he gets the start over J-Man.
If TMZ story is true, still only 3 of 53 on anonymous record...
mik-the first half McCown looked like a rusty 36 y.o. coming back from a head injury. The 2nd half he looked like the player Pet thought he brought in and that is the only reason he gets the start over J-Man.
Only disagree with "only reason"... main reason is style as Faded has been hammering on for days now. It's been at the root of the QB decision for 1-1/2 years now.
As for McCown... I'm in the he was not that bad camp... tough camp to be in with 3 deep balls finding the ground:
- - overthrew Gabe breaking free out of the best pocket of the day mid-Q2.
- - underthrew a wide open Gabe two-steps behind DB in early Q4.
- - badly underthrew an open Benji on the final drives opening play.
If anyone wants to stop their QB analysis with the above three plays... that's their prerogative.
I prefer to consider:
- The shot to Hart for 17 on 3rd and 6 in Q1; the first ball he cut loose.
- The seam route to Barn for 41 on the run in mid-Q2.
- The hook to Barn for 15 on 3rd and 10 in mid-Q2.
- The pure-timing shot to a hooking Benji's outside shoulder for 17 on 2nd and 16; DB was closing from inside.
- The patient series of 8 completions of between 5 and 10 yards in our first TD drive before...
- The pretty throw-on-the-run to Barn who turned it up for a 27-yd TD.
- The gorgeous pass he dropped into Hart's arms on the far sideline for 41 yards right before his second Gabe miss.
- The touch pass to Hawk at the back of the endzone was deflected by a fingertip of a completely stretched out Safety.
- The perfect ball he rifled to Gabe on the near sideline for 10 in mid-Q4.
- Final drive passes of 10, 19, 15 and 18 yards...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
If TMZ story is true, still only 3 of 53 on anonymous record...
mik-the first half McCown looked like a rusty 36 y.o. coming back from a head injury. The 2nd half he looked like the player Pet thought he brought in and that is the only reason he gets the start over J-Man.
Only disagree with "only reason"... main reason is style as Faded has been hammering on for days now. It's been at the root of the QB decision for 1-1/2 years now.
As for McCown... I'm in the he was not that bad camp... tough camp to be in with 3 deep balls finding the ground:
- - overthrew Gabe breaking free out of the best pocket of the day mid-Q2.
- - underthrew a wide open Gabe two-steps behind DB in early Q4.
- - badly underthrew an open Benji on the final drives opening play.
If anyone wants to stop their QB analysis with the above three plays... that's their prerogative.
I prefer to consider:
- The shot to Hart for 17 on 3rd and 6 in Q1; the first ball he cut loose.
- The seam route to Barn for 41 on the run in mid-Q2.
- The hook to Barn for 15 on 3rd and 10 in mid-Q2.
- The pure-timing shot to a hooking Benji's outside shoulder for 17 on 2nd and 16; DB was closing from inside.
- The patient series of 8 completions of between 5 and 10 yards in our first TD drive before...
- The pretty throw-on-the-run to Barn who turned it up for a 27-yd TD.
- The gorgeous pass he dropped into Hart's arms on the far sideline for 41 yards right before his second Gabe miss.
- The touch pass to Hawk at the back of the endzone was deflected by a fingertip of a completely stretched out Safety.
- The perfect ball he rifled to Gabe on the near sideline for 10 in mid-Q4.
- Final drive passes of 10, 19, 15 and 18 yards...
If TMZ story is true, still only 3 of 53 on anonymous record...
Only disagree with "only reason"... main reason is style as Faded has been hammering on for days now. It's been at the root of the QB decision for 1-1/2 years now.
As for McCown... I'm in the he was not that bad camp... tough camp to be in with 3 deep balls finding the ground:
- - overthrew Gabe breaking free out of the best pocket of the day mid-Q2.
- - underthrew a wide open Gabe two-steps behind DB in early Q4.
- - badly underthrew an open Benji on the final drives opening play.
If anyone wants to stop their QB analysis with the above three plays... that's their prerogative.
I prefer to consider:
- The shot to Hart for 17 on 3rd and 6 in Q1; the first ball he cut loose.
- The seam route to Barn for 41 on the run in mid-Q2.
- The hook to Barn for 15 on 3rd and 10 in mid-Q2.
- The pure-timing shot to a hooking Benji's outside shoulder for 17 on 2nd and 16; DB was closing from inside.
- The patient series of 8 completions of between 5 and 10 yards in our first TD drive before...
- The pretty throw-on-the-run to Barn who turned it up for a 27-yd TD.
- The gorgeous pass he dropped into Hart's arms on the far sideline for 41 yards right before his second Gabe miss.
- The touch pass to Hawk at the back of the endzone was deflected by a fingertip of a completely stretched out Safety.
- The perfect ball he rifled to Gabe on the near sideline for 10 in mid-Q4.
- Final drive passes of 10, 19, 15 and 18 yards...
Good post. I think it's safe to say there were some synchronization issues, as l would expect from any QB in basically his first full game of the year with a team.
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Well if it is a question of "style" then why is he even keeping Manziel? Does he really think he can control that streak of innovative playmaking that befuddles "my way or the hiway" coaches like himself? If you could dissect and remake what it is that makes him special you'd probably ruin it in the process. JM has accommodated to the pocket player "style" that Pet wants, but when push comes to shove he's gonna pull one of those "Vintage Manziel" plays out nowhere that often leads to 6 points. If Pet can't stand that then he needs to either find a way to live with it or send him to Chip or Jerrah. Dallas once had a QB like that. And he won them a Superbowl after 5 years away in the Navy. Somehow his "by the numbers" coach found a way to live with Roger's "innovations".
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I don't like Pettine or Farmer. I see bad decisions and no leadership.
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