Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Yes mud, a lot of these fans deserve the finger. You .... border on haters but you guys aren't that bad.
Cant speak for Tour.....and admit Im no longer a Johnny fan.....but definitely not a hater....
I got right on board when he was drafted and then sat on the edge of my seat waiting for something great to happen....
And it hasnt happened....(though, many of my initial concerns HAVE been proven to be true....so far.....)
Im just willing to call a spade a spade, when I see one.....and, to me, Johnny is just that.....still time to prove me wrong though....
Cant speak for Tour.....and admit Im no longer a Johnny fan.....but definitely not a hater....
I got right on board when he was drafted and then sat on the edge of my seat waiting for something great to happen....
And it hasnt happened....(though, many of my initial concerns HAVE been proven to be true....so far.....)
Im just willing to call a spade a spade, when I see one.....and, to me, Johnny is just that.....still time to prove me wrong though....
I have been the most vocal this week and I'm certainly not a hater, so I am not sure who he is referring too.
I had Johnny pegged as the best prospect in his draft. I didn't want him with our first pick because we were picking too high for his risk at 4 (or
for my money, but I had no problem getting him where we did.Then I saw the first season. Was terrible when he finally played. Was unprepared and unfocused, as he admitted, and the first year was a complete waste. Then he misses a treatment at the end of the year because he's partying, and you just shake your head about him being a franchise QB.
Despite that, I wiped the slate clean and was ready to root him on in 2015. Was encouraged he was owning up to things and was going to rehab. Then I saw his second season. Unable to beat out McCown, and it wasn't close. Played poorly in opener, but then came back the next week to beat the Titans and I was encouraged. And then the distractions start again ... obviously those three months in rehab were wasted, he could have been working on his QB skills, because he was drinking again. Ok ... I can live with the drinking ... let's see what he can do. Then the video, lying about the video, asking people to lie about the video ... sigh. Still not taking on the responsibility of a starting NFL QB. Then he plays, and it's not that good. He gives 100% effort on Sundays. But his footwork is horrible, he doesn't follow his progressions, he's not accurate, he's not disciplined, he's inconsistent, and our offense scored about a TD per game less when he starts. 13 out of 32 last week when we needed a passer down the stretch. I like his effort, but he is so fundamentally off, that either the coaching is not taking, his off-the-field work is not enough, or he simply lacks key NFL skills.
Those are NOT good signs at the end of year two.
So I am in favor of bringing in another prospect and seeing what we can get for Johnny. I wish the best for him, but I think he is done in Cleveland. It just didn't happen. In my mind he has not been dedicated enough to the Cleveland Browns. That's my opinion. I don't hate Johnny. I like him. I love to party too. I like that he gives his all on Sunday.
But I've determined he's not good enough for the Browns. Maybe I'm wrong. But it doesn't make me a hater. It makes me a guy with an opinion ... Who wants the best for the Browns.
Zombo
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Actually Westside, you both made good points; but, I think mud is saying we would not have had to use another offense if we had 3 similar QBs and the Cinn game would not have been so bad. At least that is how I read it; I could be wrong.
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So, anyone heard who will be starting this week then? Maybe Shane Falco is available
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So, anyone heard who will be starting this week then? Maybe Shane Falco is available
.Austin Davis. Pryor get reps as his backup.
Zombo
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So, anyone heard who will be starting this week then? Maybe Shane Falco is available
.OSU homer.
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Austin Davis is basically Tom Brady anyway
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LOL, funny pulls out. OK, how about Adam Sandler's guy from the remake?.
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LOL, funny pulls out. OK, how about Adam Sandler's guy from the remake?.
Too many off the field issues.
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Does this seem fishy to anyone else?
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Does this seem fishy to anyone else?
Does this seem fishy to anyone else?
After his latest (albeit harmless) party video? That's what i was thinking too. As much as I don't like John the person, this video is a non-story to me, but I can see Pet thinking otherwise.
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He was riding his hoverboard around and hit his head on the dining room table. I thought those things had a minimum height requirement to avoid that. Also the hb was a Christmas gift from his father for toning down the drinking
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I totally agree with his off the field immature jackassery. But on the field and in practice/preparation all his teammates and coaches are pleased with the changes and leadership in the huddle. Is he worth the tradeoff?
If there were a clear cut no brainer QB in this draft I would say absolutely not. Or if we make an off season acquisition such as Bradford like you suggested, again nope he isn't worth keeping until he grows up to be a responsible man. Problem is there isn't an easy answer at the moment. McCown isn't it. Too slow and can't keep from getting creamed too often. Shaw? Maybe. Davis? He's a younger McCown without the accuracy.
Here's a list of the 2016 FA QB's-Osweiler might be worth a shot. Or even Cousins. Both are young and getting better.
But on the field and in practice/preparation all his teammates and coaches are pleased with the changes and leadership in the huddle.
Ag,
That is strictly a comparative statement to the 2014 JM you want Mud revise as they are "the initial things he brought last year".
You can't have it both ways.
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I call BS. Nicer way of benching him..
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Yes mud, a lot of these fans deserve the finger. You and tour border on haters but you guys aren't that bad. Read some of the shit on this board. If I was from out of town and read that crap I give some of these assholes the finger. I won't mention any names but you know who they are.
Just the idea that there is all this crying about a complete non issue should give you a clue.
WSS
You and tour border on haters but you guys aren't that bad.
Certainly suits my borderline personality...
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Then you don't recall correctly mud. I thought it was a stupid idea to put in an entirely new offense for the Cincinnati game. None of the players looked good. None of them.
Again block and tackle and run and stop the run. Any slight differences between your quarterbacks shouldn't make that much difference.
WSS
Any slight differences between your quarterbacks shouldn't make that much difference.
Problem is that the differences are not "slight" when JM is in the mix.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Occasionally Mik- you get to see the good Ghoolie. It's a fun time. And BTW- I disagree with Zombo. The suck defense needs more help, talent, and coaching than the offense does. McCown may have put up better numbers than Manziel- but as I said- he's a backup for a reason. Doesn't pass the eye test, regardless of numbers. And he's not going to get any better. Personally, I'm tired of him standing back there like a pinata waiting, waiting, and WAITING to get busted up.
If Manziel is a backup, you build the team, and take your franchise qb last. 2016 is not shaping up to be the year.
I didn't say the the defense didn't need more help, and I didn't say McCown was the answer.
I said we need another prospect at QB with a higher ceiling than Manziel.
As far as when to take a franchise QB, you try and find one when you don't have one.
I'm of the opinion that we don't have one.
Zombo
Zombo said:
I didn't say the the defense didn't need more help, and I didn't say McCown was the answer.
I said we need another prospect at QB with a higher ceiling than Manziel.
As far as when to take a franchise QB, you try and find one when you don't have one.
I'm of the opinion that we don't have one.
Zombo
Well then, we agree about taking a quarterback next year Z. Plenty of talking heads with more football smarts than me agree with you that Johnny's ceiling isn't high enough to get it done. The question is when do the Browns pull the trigger on a qb.
You ought to know- I'm (and a bunch of other guys on this forum) are running out of "wait till next year(s)" fast. Drafting Lynch or Goff means another year or two in the dumpster ala the Jags or Titans. The fanbase is getting restless my man- VERY restless.
I'll go out on a limb and say the Browns are going to draft second. Let's posit for a moment the best of the 2016 quarterback draft class is Tannehill good. That's not good enough in my book to blow yet another first round pick on marginal talent- that may not even turn out any better than- gasp- Johnny Football ! The grass is always greener Z, and the next great thing may not turn out to be all that.
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