Camp Cook

The Gipper

@tour2ma said:

Guten Morgan...

I agree... you are incapable of discerning a difference.

Not with this group of QBs. No. I don't think there are vast differences in the talent among the first group and the latter group.

Actually you are arguing "closest", but let's set that aside.

Fine....Bosa is the closest thing to a sure thing.....not a closer thing. Happy now?

How do you compare Bosa's chances in a 3-4 vs. a 4-3?

I don't think it matters. He is a football player. He will tackle people and rush the passer from whichever system he plays in. I said he reminds me of Howie Long, who played DE in the 3-4. He was considered the ultimate 3-4 DE. Ray Horton runs the 3-4 I believe. Bosa may have played in the 4-3 in college....but he moved all over the place.

He would do fine in whatever.

bbedward

And you cite the experts when it comes to Bosa, but you ignore them when it comes to every QB.

The Gipper

@bbedward said:

I'm pretty sure the case is the opposite. You say "no QB is a first round talent" based on a report from before the college season even started and ignore everything that disagrees with you (literally everybody disagrees with you)

Again, yes they will be drafted in the first round.....or should I say overdrafted.

All I am saying is that with our #2 pick.....we would be reaching mightily to take a QB there. If we had the #10-15 pick, it may not be so bad.

But we need #2 talent with our #2 pick.

We don't need the QB equivalent of Trent Richardson.

The Gipper

@bbedward said:
And you cite the experts when it comes to Bosa, but you ignore them when it comes to every QB.

the experts disagree on the QBs.

They don't disagree on Bosa nearly as much.

I guess you want another Trent Richardson...not much I can do to change your mind.

Westside Steve

@the-gipper said:

Again, yes they will be drafted in the first round.....or should I say overdrafted.

All I am saying is that with our #2 pick.....we would be reaching mightily to take a QB there. If we had the #10-15 pick, it may not be so bad.

But we need #2 talent with our #2 pick.

We don't need the QB equivalent of Trent Richardson.

More like a quarterback who probably would have slid down as far as 22 had we not snapped him up.

WSS

bbedward

@the-gipper said:

the experts disagree on the QBs.

They don't disagree on the fact that they are top 30 on overall talent.

They don't disagree on Bosa nearly as much.

They're starting to diverge on the #1 overall DE in the draft, while they're converging on the #1 overall QB

I guess you want another Trent Richardson...not much I can do to change your mind.

I saw a CBS local Dallas big board today. I thought it was interesting because it was so different - it was something like #1 Myles Jack, #3 Elliot, #7 Goff, #8 Bosa. (Keep in mind basically every big board out there ranks Goff in the top 10). But it said something about how even though they ranked Elliot as the #3 overall talent - he won't go anywhere close to #3 overall because of positional value, whereas Goff as the #7 overall talent will jump a few spots because positional value is so high for a QB.

With that in mind, I have no idea what Trent Richardson has to do with anything.

The Gipper

@bbedward said:

@the-gipper said:

the experts disagree on the QBs.

They don't disagree on the fact that they are top 30 on overall talent.

Yea, they should all rank about #30

They don't disagree on Bosa nearly as much.

They're starting to diverge on the #1 overall DE in the draft, while they're converging on the #1 overall QB

Prove it. Give the current draft prospect listing of at least 5 different respected draft services on both of these guys.

I guess you want another Trent Richardson...not much I can do to change your mind.

I saw a CBS local Dallas big board today. I thought it was interesting because it was so different - it was something like #1 Myles Jack, #3 Elliot, #7 Goff, #8 Bosa. (Keep in mind basically every big board out there ranks Goff in the top 10). But it said something about how even though they ranked Elliot as the #3 overall talent - he won't go anywhere close to #3 overall because of positional value, whereas Goff as the #7 overall talent will jump a few spots because positional value is so high for a QB.

Fuck CBS local. CBS National ranks Bosa #1 overall prospect. In your research give me CBS, Fox, NBC, ESPN...national. None of your fly by night shit. None of those guys opinions are any better than yours or mine.

With that in mind, I have no idea what Trent Richardson has to do with anything.

You take one of these QBs at #2, you are getting the QB version of TR. A high draft bust. (You really couldn't follow that analogy?)

I am saying that is a possibility.

Zombo compared Goff to Paul McDonald. You are probably too young to remember Paul McDonald. Look him up....and see what we will be getting in Goff.

bbedward

CBS national ranks Goff #4

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@the-gipper said:

Not sure WTF you are looking at. Nearly everyone still has him as the #1 overall prospects.

Oh, what....is there someone out there that thinks its hip to be stupid? To not put him at #1.

Sure, they may be outliers....but he is as much a consensus #1 pick as anyone we have seen lately.

I'm looking at the rankings on NFL.com that clearly have DeForest Buckner rated as a better DE prospect than Bosa. Further, Bosa is far from the #1 overall prospect - he's more like the 7th. I happen to trust the NFL official board moreso than the CBS - considering as these guys are getting drafted to play in the NFL and not CBS.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/tracker?icampaign=draft-sub_nav_bar-drafteventpage-tracker#dt-tabs:dt-by-grade/dt-by-position-input:s

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@the-gipper said:

And everybody else is wrong....but you and the one guy out there that you found that thought Buckner was better.

By "one guy" do you mean the official NFL draft board?

Hey, I guess if I had to pick "one guy", I could do worse than the NFL.

Then again, I'm arguing with a guy who thinks there's no difference between the 3-4 and the 4-3...

The Gipper

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

By "one guy" do you mean the official NFL draft board?

Hey, I guess if I had to pick "one guy", I could do worse than the NFL.

Then again, I'm arguing with a guy who thinks there's no difference between the 3-4 and the 4-3...

There is NO official NFL draft board. There are 32 official NFL draft boards.....those kept by the teams. Everything else is unofficial.

NFL.com produces articles by writers. Their rankings are no more official than Kiper's.

And like I said, you found one source.

List 10 others and see what they say.

The Gipper

@bbedward said:
CBS national ranks Goff #4

They are also saying that Wentz, Prescott and Brandon Allen are QBs on the rise.

And the Cowboys draft #4.....maybe that would be a good place for Goff.

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@the-gipper said:

There is NO official NFL draft board. There are 32 official NFL draft boards.....those kept by the teams. Everything else is unofficial.

NFL.com produces articles by writers. Their rankings are no more official than Kiper's.

And like I said, you found one source.

List 10 others and see what they say.

So if none of these are official, I'll just choose to believe the NFL endorsed opinion rather than any cut rate third party opinion out there.

Good to know we're in agreement.

The Gipper

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

So if none of these are official, I'll just choose to believe the NFL endorsed opinion rather than any cut rate third party opinion out there.

Good to know we're in agreement.

So....if the Browns have the #2 pick....and Bosa and Buckner are both available....who would you take?

Mudfly

@the-gipper said:
So....if the Browns have the #2 pick....and Bosa and Buckner are both available....who would you take?

Myles Jack...

RoyceRolls

guess I've gotta break my own rule and argue with Gip.... Jesus.

its hilarious that you ask for multiple sources from people when your "source" was "there was a guy who said something once in the not so recent past, and I blindly agree without doing any independent player evaluation."

I've gotta respect your dogged, Skip Bayless style approach, but here's the thing, Gip. Your personal worth isn't directly tied to being 100% correct on your first take. You don't have to be Skip Bayless and make paper thin arguments and excuses which back up your initial claim. You're a human being, you are valuable, no one will think less of you for abandoning a shaky, out-dated, borderline re-tarded argument... Of course you never will. You will reply to this post and interject your snarky little responses in a contrasting color and continue to tell the world that Tim Tebow, Brandon Weeden and Johnny Manziel are destined for greatness and that Lebron James isn't Very good. Cheers.

Tim Couch Pulls Out

@the-gipper said:
So....if the Browns have the #2 pick....and Bosa and Buckner are both available....who would you take?

Carson Wentz.

TexasAg1969

@mudfly said:
Myles Jack...

If he plays anything like Von Miller, you may be onto something there. Does he have 4.4 speed?

Tour2ma

@the-gipper said:

How do you compare Bosa's chances in a 3-4 vs. a 4-3?

I don't think it matters. He is a football player. He will tackle people and rush the passer from whichever system he plays in. I said he reminds me of Howie Long, who played DE in the 3-4. He was considered the ultimate 3-4 DE. Ray Horton runs the 3-4 I believe. Bosa may have played in the 4-3 in college....but he moved all over the place.

He would do fine in whatever.

Sure...

@roycerolls said:
guess I've gotta break my own rule and argue with Gip.... Jesus.

lol... thanks for playing our game...

Tour2ma

@the-gipper said:
So....if the Browns have the #2 pick....and Bosa and Buckner are both available....who would you take?

I went to Jared...