Benjamin to sign.....Mack out then in ?
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I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
I think you are sugar coating the report.
This has nothing to do with whether you love Johnny or hate him only the worth of the analytical report.
WSS
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I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
I think you are sugar coating the report.
This has nothing to do with whether you love Johnny or hate him only the worth of the analytical report.
WSS
I think you are sugar coating the report.
This has nothing to do with whether you love Johnny or hate him only the worth of the analytical report.
WSS
What am I sugar coating?....the report said he was most likely to succeed.....not the one with most potential or the highest ceiling, etc...
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I think you are sugar coating the report.
This has nothing to do with whether you love Johnny or hate him only the worth of the analytical report.
WSS
What am I sugar coating?....the report said he was most likely to succeed.....not the one with most potential or the highest ceiling, etc...
Uh, well that's great. Just saying that if it turns out he isn't the most successful of the group the report wasn't worth the money.What am I sugar coating?....the report said he was most likely to succeed.....not the one with most potential or the highest ceiling, etc...
I basically just poking a little fun at analytics. I would trade Ozzie Newsome for every computer in DePodestas office.
WSS
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Uh, well that's great. Just saying that if it turns out he isn't the most successful of the group the report wasn't worth the money.What am I sugar coating?....the report said he was most likely to succeed.....not the one with most potential or the highest ceiling, etc...
I basically just poking a little fun at analytics. I would trade Ozzie Newsome for every computer in DePodestas office.
WSS
Uh, well that's great. Just saying that if it turns out he isn't the most successful of the group the report wasn't worth the money.
I basically just poking a little fun at analytics. I would trade Ozzie Newsome for every computer in DePodestas office.
WSS
Clearly it wasnt worth the money, because they didnt listen to it.....BUT, Id say it was worth it, had they listened.....because we would have a decent starting quality QB right now, instead of party boy Manziel(and negative $12.5m)....so, in hindsight, that woulda been worth a LOT more than the 100k they paid for that report....
and, instead of talking about another new QB with our #2 pick....we'd be looking at a top defensive player, or RB, or WR....but we're just starting over...one more time....
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Uh, well that's great. Just saying that if it turns out he isn't the most successful of the group the report wasn't worth the money.
I basically just poking a little fun at analytics. I would trade Ozzie Newsome for every computer in DePodestas office.
WSS
Clearly it wasnt worth the money, because they didnt listen to it.....BUT, Id say it was worth it, had they listened.....because we would have a decent starting quality QB right now, instead of party boy Manziel(and negative $12.5m)....so, in hindsight, that woulda been worth a LOT more than the 100k they paid for that report....
and, instead of talking about another new QB with our #2 pick....we'd be looking at a top defensive player, or RB, or WR....but we're just starting over...one more time....
Well that's assuming that bilgewater would have made Jack shit in the way of difference here.Clearly it wasnt worth the money, because they didnt listen to it.....BUT, Id say it was worth it, had they listened.....because we would have a decent starting quality QB right now, instead of party boy Manziel(and negative $12.5m)....so, in hindsight, that woulda been worth a LOT more than the 100k they paid for that report....
and, instead of talking about another new QB with our #2 pick....we'd be looking at a top defensive player, or RB, or WR....but we're just starting over...one more time....
Maybe you believe he would have been that much better in his rookie season then Josh McCown. Maybe you think our defense and running game would have been stellar because he was there.
And if we had him and went 3 + 13.....
WSS
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I didnt say that by us picking him, we'd suddenly have a great D...thats a lame premise and no QB would do that for our team....its only a piece of the puzzle........I said he'd be a better QB than Johnny was/is....and its pretty clear that he is....
I see no reason that he'd have been better than Josh McCown given the same circumstances.I didnt say that by us picking him, we'd suddenly have a great D...thats a lame premise and no QB would do that for our team....its only a piece of the puzzle........I said he'd be a better QB than Johnny was/is....and its pretty clear that he is....
Especially if Josh had Adrian Peterson in the backfield.
Or that it would have made any difference to the WL list.
WSS
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Id venture to say we wouldnt have even needed Josh McCown, because Bridgewater would've beaten out Brian Hoyer the year before and, unlike with Johnny, we wouldnt have had the same needs in early 2015 due our our rokkie QB being in rehab and absolutely terrible on the field....and he looked pretty good in Minnesota without Peterson in 2014, considering he was first runner up for rookie of the year and in the playoff this year....Vikes went from 5 wins, to 7 wins to 11 wins.....so, argue away, as if picking Johnny is was just as good as picking Bridgewater would have been....
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Id venture to say we wouldnt have even needed Josh McCown, because Bridgewater would've beaten out Brian Hoyer the year before and, unlike with Johnny, we wouldnt have had the same needs in early 2015 due our our rokkie QB being in rehab and absolutely terrible on the field....and he looked pretty good in Minnesota without Peterson in 2014, considering he was first runner up for rookie of the year and in the playoff this year....Vikes went from 5 wins, to 7 wins to 11 wins.....so, argue away, as if picking Johnny is was just as good as picking Bridgewater would have been....
Id venture to say we wouldnt have even needed Josh McCown, because Bridgewater would've beaten out Brian Hoyer the year before and, unlike with Johnny, we wouldnt have had the same needs in early 2015 due our our rokkie QB being in rehab and absolutely terrible on the field....and he looked pretty good in Minnesota without Peterson in 2014, considering he was first runner up for rookie of the year and in the playoff this year....Vikes went from 5 wins, to 7 wins to 11 wins.....so, argue away, as if picking Johnny is was just as good as picking Bridgewater would have been....
Dude you're obsessed with Johnny. That ain't the point that never was.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
ha!...obsessed?.....I think the discussion was about the report and where we would be had we followed it....Johnny is the unfortunate by product of not doing that....
I only mentioned Johnny, because he was the alternative to Bridgewater(who Ive been talking about and you keep shooting down) and because you suggest that picking Bridgewater wouldnt have been a better move because 1) our defense would still suck....or 2) we still wouldnt have won more games(which I doubt).....or 3)McCown might have beaten him out...???
And, now its because Im obsesses?....
You seem to be the one obsessed with protecting him from us baddies and acting as if he's an angel and perfectly fine draft pick, who just wants to have a lil fun and is getting a raw deal....
Much to your chagrin, I guess....people who are obsessed with football(me) and love their team(me) happen to notice when their first round pick is a complete douche and a loser(especially when we saw it from day one)....its also a topic of discussion nation wide, as a matter of fact....so, yeah I talk about it.....surprise surprise....
Ive talked about plenty of other bad picks too....you just haven't noticed cause they're not your boy....
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Id venture to say we wouldnt have even needed Josh McCown, because Bridgewater would've beaten out Brian Hoyer the year before and, unlike with Johnny, we wouldnt have had the same needs in early 2015 due our our rokkie QB being in rehab and absolutely terrible on the field....and he looked pretty good in Minnesota without Peterson in 2014, considering he was first runner up for rookie of the year and in the playoff this year....Vikes went from 5 wins, to 7 wins to 11 wins.....so, argue away, as if picking Johnny is was just as good as picking Bridgewater would have been....
Dude you're obsessed with Johnny. That ain't the point that never was.
WSS
That ain't the point that never was.
Re read the comments again........it's exactly the point....
I see no reason that he'd have been better than Josh McCown given the same circumstances.
Especially if Josh had Adrian Peterson in the backfield.
Or that it would have made any difference to the WL list.
WSS
Id venture to say we wouldnt have even needed Josh McCown, because Bridgewater would've beaten out Brian Hoyer the year before and, unlike with Johnny, we wouldnt have had the same needs in early 2015 due our our rokkie QB being in rehab and absolutely terrible on the field....and he looked pretty good in Minnesota without Peterson in 2014, considering he was first runner up for rookie of the year and in the playoff this year....Vikes went from 5 wins, to 7 wins to 11 wins.....so, argue away, as if picking Johnny is was just as good as picking Bridgewater would have been....
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So what if we drafted Derek Carr, Blake Bortles or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Would anyone still be bitching about that stupid report?
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
So what if we drafted Derek Carr, Blake Bortles or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Would anyone still be bitching about that stupid report?
WSS
So what if we drafted Derek Carr, Blake Bortles or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Would anyone still be bitching about that stupid report?
WSS
No one knows what exactly the report said. Word only got out that with the 22nd pick, Bridgewater was considered to be the best available player/QB. For all we know it could have said that the Browns should have picked Thurman Thomas in the top 10. No one will ever know. It could very well have said that Bortles was the best QB but that he wasn't available for the first Browns pick.
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So what if we drafted Derek Carr, Blake Bortles or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Would anyone still be bitching about that stupid report?
WSS
So what if we drafted Derek Carr, Blake Bortles or Jimmy Garoppolo?
Would anyone still be bitching about that stupid report?
WSS
I doubt it, because we'd have a quarterback now.....
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OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
You are speaking as if the team has ultimate authority on the issue. Every FA this year knows their is a ton of money to be had especially after the salary cap increase. Keeping Benjamin requires Benjamin wanting to be kept, and he'll only stay in Cleveland if Cleveland overpays for him. And if a guy is good enough to overpay for, he's good enough to franchise tag, and Benjamin is a #3 wide receiver on any other team in this league. He's not worth a tag, and he's not worth overpaying for.
Common sense also suggests that Hue Jackson has a pretty good chance attracting Marvin Jones and/or Mohammed Sanu to Cleveland. I'm pretty sure we'll have Josh Gordon back, too. Would it be nice to keep Benjamin? Sure. Is he a must-keep, no way. I'd much rather the effort is expended on retaining Gipson, Mack, or Schwartz.
You are speaking as if the team has ultimate authority on the issue. Every FA this year knows their is a ton of money to be had especially after the salary cap increase. Keeping Benjamin requires Benjamin wanting to be kept, and he'll only stay in Cleveland if Cleveland overpays for him. And if a guy is good enough to overpay for, he's good enough to franchise tag, and Benjamin is a #3 wide receiver on any other team in this league. He's not worth a tag, and he's not worth overpaying for.
Common sense also suggests that Hue Jackson has a pretty good chance attracting Marvin Jones and/or Mohammed Sanu to Cleveland. I'm pretty sure we'll have Josh Gordon back, too. Would it be nice to keep Benjamin? Sure. Is he a must-keep, no way. I'd much rather the effort is expended on retaining Gipson, Mack, or Schwartz.
Exactly. Flugels was dancing around my question of- Exactly how much do you think Benjamin is worth? Not, gee, let's keep our homegrown talent. Of course not franchise tag for at best a #2 wr. Not Emmanuel Sanders $5 million a year either in my book. BTW, looking at Sprortrac, Both Sanu and Marvin Jones were making peanuts this past year for the Bengals. Upgrade or downgrade form Benji? You can bet Hue has a pretty good idea. .
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I think you're missing the point of the report....it wasnt intented to predict who would be the best quarterback...it was to predict the least likely to fail....big difference...
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
We cannot continue to roll our FO period. Jimmy at bye week. Boots Farmer, puts Sashi in then, even as interim GM. We may not be here with Gipson, Schwartz & Benji. That was the time to get them re signed. Mack, no way thanks to Farmer genius idea of offer sheet leading to a great opt out clause contract. We have been drafting them, developing them & no FO has had enough sense since Ward & Skrine to say "Hey we need to lock him up" before end of season. Yes, they all want to play for winners but look at Denver $$ (they not going there for $$) We have always got the cap, we had some talent, We just need the talent in the FO & Jimmy to want to Win with what we can build on & pay them to stay..
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You are speaking as if the team has ultimate authority on the issue. Every FA this year knows their is a ton of money to be had especially after the salary cap increase. Keeping Benjamin requires Benjamin wanting to be kept, and he'll only stay in Cleveland if Cleveland overpays for him. And if a guy is good enough to overpay for, he's good enough to franchise tag, and Benjamin is a #3 wide receiver on any other team in this league. He's not worth a tag, and he's not worth overpaying for.
Common sense also suggests that Hue Jackson has a pretty good chance attracting Marvin Jones and/or Mohammed Sanu to Cleveland. I'm pretty sure we'll have Josh Gordon back, too. Would it be nice to keep Benjamin? Sure. Is he a must-keep, no way. I'd much rather the effort is expended on retaining Gipson, Mack, or Schwartz.
Exactly. Flugels was dancing around my question of- Exactly how much do you think Benjamin is worth? Not, gee, let's keep our homegrown talent. Of course not franchise tag for at best a #2 wr. Not Emmanuel Sanders $5 million a year either in my book. BTW, looking at Sprortrac, Both Sanu and Marvin Jones were making peanuts this past year for the Bengals. Upgrade or downgrade form Benji? You can bet Hue has a pretty good idea. .
Exactly. Flugels was dancing around my question of- Exactly how much do you think Benjamin is worth? Not, gee, let's keep our homegrown talent. Of course not franchise tag for at best a #2 wr. Not Emmanuel Sanders $5 million a year either in my book. BTW, looking at Sprortrac, Both Sanu and Marvin Jones were making peanuts this past year for the Bengals. Upgrade or downgrade form Benji? You can bet Hue has a pretty good idea. .
I think he's worth keeping as I've stated so many times. Let's start by understanding this subject heading we're in and the other one we've disagreed in about our cap space of over 42 million $. It never looked like he needed to be franchise tagged; and it sounded like close to being signed ended in a nitpick barrier to signing him. I never got the financials to put a specific money value to it. We've never even come close to being in cap trouble especially now that there's a rookie salary cap tag teaming our tradition of keepers drafted so I give this how much a big fat DILLIGAF (Do I Look Like I Give A Flock?).
My repetitive take on Benjamin is easy and it shouldn't hurt your feelings as much as it has Larry. For a franchise that has not had to pay any of its draftees a #1 WR salary and throughout 2015 (in a world of what have you done for me lately), why not pay Benjamin a good salary someone else will pay him anyway if we were as close to his yes tag as the subject heading implies? We've done way worse with free agency such as guaranteeing 9 million $ to a WR that played his last good football in 2011. Are you going to word surgery this into Flugel thinks Benjamin is way better than Antonio Brown? For the record I don't.
If we're going to hear we have to build program continuity through the draft - why not KEEP our current success stories when they're beginning to play their best football? Cleveland invested 3-4 years (despite endless turnover w/ QBs,HCs, OCs and FO) for this 4th round draft pick to become just as productive as a WR as he's been in the return game. Now that he is a better WR, his 4.3 speed helps open up underneath routes for teammates as well as seams for the TE (who played the best football of his career as well). Is it Benjamin's fault he had to be our best WR in 2015? No.
Building through the draft is important but you have to be GOOD at it while the Cleveland Browns have been awful at it. What WRs have we drafted that were good enough to make the team in 2013, 2014 and 2015? Understanding that, we don't have the following draftees rallying around the loss of an Emmanuel Sanders to free agency: Antonio Brown, Markus Wheaton, Martavis Bryant, and Sammie Coates. Another important variable to that is to understand how many of those guys joined that team without a 1st round contract/salary (2 of them before the current structure w/a rookie salary cap). If we had been drafting other WRs worth keeping in 2013, 2014 and 2015 - I wouldn't find it nearly as important to retain Travis at this time. Seriously, I'd be okay with it if I didn't have to take inventory of what is in the WR Corps today.
So, where are you? Cleveland is going all in on free agency at WR this year (with 2 guys Sanu and Jones) right after we let a 4th round WR depart for free agency and not too long after press conferences revealed we won't be making any splash in free agency. Makes perfect sense coming from a guy calling me out about how much $ we can afford to part with. And you'll be excited we have Sanu replacing Benjamin? Part of what makes guys like Jones and Sanu seem attractive right now is their beneficiary status from opponents' match-up priorities to guys like AJ Green, Eiffert, and Bernard considerably easing their match-ups/attention. Meanwhile, Benjamin was often drawing the #1 corner or a corner plus Safety over the top in 2015 as our guy that had never even been asked to be our #2 WR all the while he was here before 2015. I like to think he was a pleasant surprise especially considering how many here even had him making our team in 2015 prior to training camp. If your reliable football messiah ever decides to show up and be a #1 WR for all 16 weeks for the very first time as a vet - one would have to think the sum of Gordon + Barnidge + Duke could give us an even better version of Benjamin than 2015. He'd have easier match-ups than he had in 2015 as our substitute #1 producer at WR. Keeping Benjamin to go with your most reliable hero of all time at WR also means we don't have to draft Doctson at #32 in lieu of going defense there. We can add a WR in round 4 or 5 with the understanding we're receiving 3 mid round comp/supplemental picks on top of what we are scheduled for. Seems like a formula for less growing pains in the passing tree around a rookie QB or just continuity for McCown when/if the rookie isn't ready.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
How do you think we should address the non-OL blocking issue from this past season?
Current Roster
TE: Barnidge, Bibbs, Telfer
FB/HB: Johnson [likely cut]
The problem is that none of the TE have proven to be worthwhile blockers, and Johnson isn't an NFL caliber athlete. Barnidge is more suited for the "look-out block" ["McCown, look out! I got beat again!] than anything substantive.
Are Bibbs or Telfer ready to do something useful? Telfer's draft profile asserts blocking ability.. it's surprising he didn't earn PT. Bibbs is a pure pass-catcher.
Perhaps one of the FB's [Gronk's brother from KSU?] would be worth a late-round pick? I'd think it would depend on the scheme Hue wants: if they want 2 TE's and no FB then draft a blocking TE instead.
The more labels you have for yourself, the dumber they make you. "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." Paul Brown -
OK-then why hasn't analytics and common sense kept Benjamin when we know this is a weak FA and draft when to comes to WR? The question is for everyone, not just you Mud.
You are speaking as if the team has ultimate authority on the issue. Every FA this year knows their is a ton of money to be had especially after the salary cap increase. Keeping Benjamin requires Benjamin wanting to be kept, and he'll only stay in Cleveland if Cleveland overpays for him. And if a guy is good enough to overpay for, he's good enough to franchise tag, and Benjamin is a #3 wide receiver on any other team in this league. He's not worth a tag, and he's not worth overpaying for.
Common sense also suggests that Hue Jackson has a pretty good chance attracting Marvin Jones and/or Mohammed Sanu to Cleveland. I'm pretty sure we'll have Josh Gordon back, too. Would it be nice to keep Benjamin? Sure. Is he a must-keep, no way. I'd much rather the effort is expended on retaining Gipson, Mack, or Schwartz.
You are speaking as if the team has ultimate authority on the issue. Every FA this year knows their is a ton of money to be had especially after the salary cap increase. Keeping Benjamin requires Benjamin wanting to be kept,
Common sense also suggests that Hue Jackson has a pretty good chance attracting Marvin Jones and/or Mohammed Sanu to Cleveland. I'm pretty sure we'll have Josh Gordon back, too. Would it be nice to keep Benjamin? Sure. Is he a must-keep, no way. I'd much rather the effort is expended on retaining Gipson, Mack, or Schwartz.
So why are you correcting him like you are the authority? Doesn't that also mean the Mack we already gave a dream contract to has to want to stay? And is he? I'd like to keep Schwartz too now that he is playing his best football every bit as I'd like to keep Benjamin. But does he want to stay?
I already covered the Jones and Sanu part in my reply to Hoorta 1 post up.
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Exactly. Flugels was dancing around my question of- Exactly how much do you think Benjamin is worth? Not, gee, let's keep our homegrown talent. Of course not franchise tag for at best a #2 wr. Not Emmanuel Sanders $5 million a year either in my book. BTW, looking at Sprortrac, Both Sanu and Marvin Jones were making peanuts this past year for the Bengals. Upgrade or downgrade form Benji? You can bet Hue has a pretty good idea. .
I think he's worth keeping as I've stated so many times. Let's start by understanding this subject heading we're in and the other one we've disagreed in about our cap space of over 42 million $. It never looked like he needed to be franchise tagged; and it sounded like close to being signed ended in a nitpick barrier to signing him. I never got the financials to put a specific money value to it. We've never even come close to being in cap trouble especially now that there's a rookie salary cap tag teaming our tradition of keepers drafted so I give this how much a big fat DILLIGAF (Do I Look Like I Give A Flock?).
My repetitive take on Benjamin is easy and it shouldn't hurt your feelings as much as it has Larry. For a franchise that has not had to pay any of its draftees a #1 WR salary and throughout 2015 (in a world of what have you done for me lately), why not pay Benjamin a good salary someone else will pay him anyway if we were as close to his yes tag as the subject heading implies? We've done way worse with free agency such as guaranteeing 9 million $ to a WR that played his last good football in 2011. Are you going to word surgery this into Flugel thinks Benjamin is way better than Antonio Brown? For the record I don't.
If we're going to hear we have to build program continuity through the draft - why not KEEP our current success stories when they're beginning to play their best football? Cleveland invested 3-4 years (despite endless turnover w/ QBs,HCs, OCs and FO) for this 4th round draft pick to become just as productive as a WR as he's been in the return game. Now that he is a better WR, his 4.3 speed helps open up underneath routes for teammates as well as seams for the TE (who played the best football of his career as well). Is it Benjamin's fault he had to be our best WR in 2015? No.
Building through the draft is important but you have to be GOOD at it while the Cleveland Browns have been awful at it. What WRs have we drafted that were good enough to make the team in 2013, 2014 and 2015? Understanding that, we don't have the following draftees rallying around the loss of an Emmanuel Sanders to free agency: Antonio Brown, Markus Wheaton, Martavis Bryant, and Sammie Coates. Another important variable to that is to understand how many of those guys joined that team without a 1st round contract/salary (2 of them before the current structure w/a rookie salary cap). If we had been drafting other WRs worth keeping in 2013, 2014 and 2015 - I wouldn't find it nearly as important to retain Travis at this time. Seriously, I'd be okay with it if I didn't have to take inventory of what is in the WR Corps today.
So, where are you? Cleveland is going all in on free agency at WR this year (with 2 guys Sanu and Jones) right after we let a 4th round WR depart for free agency and not too long after press conferences revealed we won't be making any splash in free agency. Makes perfect sense coming from a guy calling me out about how much $ we can afford to part with. And you'll be excited we have Sanu replacing Benjamin? Part of what makes guys like Jones and Sanu seem attractive right now is their beneficiary status from opponents' match-up priorities to guys like AJ Green, Eiffert, and Bernard considerably easing their match-ups/attention. Meanwhile, Benjamin was often drawing the #1 corner or a corner plus Safety over the top in 2015 as our guy that had never even been asked to be our #2 WR all the while he was here before 2015. I like to think he was a pleasant surprise especially considering how many here even had him making our team in 2015 prior to training camp. If your reliable football messiah ever decides to show up and be a #1 WR for all 16 weeks for the very first time as a vet - one would have to think the sum of Gordon + Barnidge + Duke could give us an even better version of Benjamin than 2015. He'd have easier match-ups than he had in 2015 as our substitute #1 producer at WR. Keeping Benjamin to go with your most reliable hero of all time at WR also means we don't have to draft Doctson at #32 in lieu of going defense there. We can add a WR in round 4 or 5 with the understanding we're receiving 3 mid round comp/supplemental picks on top of what we are scheduled for. Seems like a formula for less growing pains in the passing tree around a rookie QB or just continuity for McCown when/if the rookie isn't ready.
I think he's worth keeping as I've stated so many times. Let's start by understanding this subject heading we're in and the other one we've disagreed in about our cap space of over 42 million $. It never looked like he needed to be franchise tagged; and it sounded like close to being signed ended in a nitpick barrier to signing him. I never got the financials to put a specific money value to it. We've never even come close to being in cap trouble especially now that there's a rookie salary cap tag teaming our tradition of keepers drafted so I give this how much a big fat DILLIGAF (Do I Look Like I Give A Flock?).
My repetitive take on Benjamin is easy and it shouldn't hurt your feelings as much as it has Larry. For a franchise that has not had to pay any of its draftees a #1 WR salary and throughout 2015 (in a world of what have you done for me lately), why not pay Benjamin a good salary someone else will pay him anyway if we were as close to his yes tag as the subject heading implies? We've done way worse with free agency such as guaranteeing 9 million $ to a WR that played his last good football in 2011. Are you going to word surgery this into Flugel thinks Benjamin is way better than Antonio Brown? For the record I don't.
If we're going to hear we have to build program continuity through the draft - why not KEEP our current success stories when they're beginning to play their best football? Cleveland invested 3-4 years (despite endless turnover w/ QBs,HCs, OCs and FO) for this 4th round draft pick to become just as productive as a WR as he's been in the return game. Now that he is a better WR, his 4.3 speed helps open up underneath routes for teammates as well as seams for the TE (who played the best football of his career as well). Is it Benjamin's fault he had to be our best WR in 2015? No.
Building through the draft is important but you have to be GOOD at it while the Cleveland Browns have been awful at it. What WRs have we drafted that were good enough to make the team in 2013, 2014 and 2015? Understanding that, we don't have the following draftees rallying around the loss of an Emmanuel Sanders to free agency: Antonio Brown, Markus Wheaton, Martavis Bryant, and Sammie Coates. Another important variable to that is to understand how many of those guys joined that team without a 1st round contract/salary (2 of them before the current structure w/a rookie salary cap). If we had been drafting other WRs worth keeping in 2013, 2014 and 2015 - I wouldn't find it nearly as important to retain Travis at this time. Seriously, I'd be okay with it if I didn't have to take inventory of what is in the WR Corps today.
So, where are you? Cleveland is going all in on free agency at WR this year (with 2 guys Sanu and Jones) right after we let a 4th round WR depart for free agency and not too long after press conferences revealed we won't be making any splash in free agency. Makes perfect sense coming from a guy calling me out about how much $ we can afford to part with. And you'll be excited we have Sanu replacing Benjamin? Part of what makes guys like Jones and Sanu seem attractive right now is their beneficiary status from opponents' match-up priorities to guys like AJ Green, Eiffert, and Bernard considerably easing their match-ups/attention. Meanwhile, Benjamin was often drawing the #1 corner or a corner plus Safety over the top in 2015 as our guy that had never even been asked to be our #2 WR all the while he was here before 2015. I like to think he was a pleasant surprise especially considering how many here even had him making our team in 2015 prior to training camp. If your reliable football messiah ever decides to show up and be a #1 WR for all 16 weeks for the very first time as a vet - one would have to think the sum of Gordon + Barnidge + Duke could give us an even better version of Benjamin than 2015. He'd have easier match-ups than he had in 2015 as our substitute #1 producer at WR. Keeping Benjamin to go with your most reliable hero of all time at WR also means we don't have to draft Doctson at #32 in lieu of going defense there. We can add a WR in round 4 or 5 with the understanding we're receiving 3 mid round comp/supplemental picks on top of what we are scheduled for. Seems like a formula for less growing pains in the passing tree around a rookie QB or just continuity for McCown when/if the rookie isn't ready.
You didn't need to write a novel Tom. I'd like to keep Benjamin too, FWIW. If Travis wants to shop around, and come back with a number for the Browns to match- that's his prerogative. If it happens to be a stupid number, we'll see if the Browns want to eat up the cap paying him. Oh and you didn't answer the question- again, so I'll answer it for you. I pay Travis the lower end of what a #2 WR is making in the NFL. Happy now?
Since he opted for FA, he (or his agent) obviously think he's worth more than what the Browns were offering.
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