Camp Goff

[bbedward]

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Then you're about the only one, then.

One of two

[Tour2ma]

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Be strong in your convictions. If Wentz blows the big one and Goff becomes the next Brady, you'll be able to say "I told you so".

Although I don't see that happening whatsoever...

I am fortified by your words...

@mike-h said:

And when that day comes, Tour will pack his bent billiard pipe and smoke it, with an ever-so twinkle in his eye.

lol.... no pipe, but by then Cubans should be easy to come by...

@bbedward said:

One of two

'bout time you showed up, mi compadre'...

[Mike H]

Always pictured you as a pipe guy, no innuendo/pun intended.

[Tour2ma]

@mike-h said:

Always pictured you as a pipe guy, no innuendo/pun intended.

lol... none taken...

Dad was a pipe guy for a time long ago... maybe you are confusing us?

[Mike H]

Pipes were popular in the 1800s

[bbedward]

I had a couple (real) Cubans in Mexico (I know they were real based on my research, almost everybody sells fakes). I honestly can't tell the difference between a Cuban and any other cigar - I smoked one on the beach though which was nice.

[Mike H]

@bbedward said:

I had a couple (real) Cubans in Mexico (I know they were real based on my research, almost everybody sells fakes). I honestly can't tell the difference between a Cuban and any other cigar - I smoked one on the beach though which was nice.

A lot of other Central American nations use Cuban tobbakky in theirs. Because they are rolled, packaged and distributed by another country, they're OK to get through the embargo. When is that ending?

[Canton Dawg]

@PFFCollege

North Dakota State QB Carson Wentz had an accuracy % of 37.5 percent on deep (20+ yard passes), tied for 81st in the nation

#PFFDraft

https://mobile.twitter.com/PFF_College/status/710975253799772161

[calfoxwc]

and how many passes, how is his wr's on those long throws?

Bobby Bettilyon ‏@BobbyBattlelyon

@PFF_College @PFF that is all well and good but on average, teams averaged two 20+pass plays a game last year

Jake Johnson ‏@JakeJohnsonJO

@PFF_College @PFF if you saw our receiving core on deep routes, you would understand.

http://www.scout.com/nfl/cowboys/forums/1786-the-ranch/14639643-interesting-college-qb-passing-distant-comparison-by-pff

[calfoxwc]

It's just close between these two qbs.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-hq/0ap3000000645532/2016-NFL-HQ-Fan-Mock-Draft-Browns-select-quarterback-Carson-Wentz

[bbedward]

I really don't think it's that close, but that's just me.

[Mike H]

Using stats isn't the best for this type of discussion, but UGH, OK we can do that. Justin is a very good friend of mine and put a ton of work into this, please give it a read (don't just read the charts).

http://draftbreakdown.com/2016-nfl-draft-breaking-down-situational-quarterback-performance/

Wentz has advantages in a few of the categories, not just above Goff, but above the rest of this QB class.

[calfoxwc]

http://www.walterfootball.com/draft2016positionreviewQB.php

Position Review: Quarterbacks

Quarterback Class
Early-round talent: B
Mid-round: B+
Late-round: B-
Overall grade: B

Merging the 2016 and 2015 prospects
Jameis Winston
Marcus Mariota
Carson Wentz
Jared Goff
Paxton Lynch

Connor Cook
Garrett Grayson
Cardale Jones
Dak Prescott
Christian Hackenberg

Sean Mannion
Jacoby Brissett
Kevin Hogan
Bryce Petty
Brett Hundley

Brandon Allen
Nate Sudfeld
Trevor Siemian
Read more at http://www.walterfootball.com/draft2016positionreviewQB.php#BLi3hBg2TzRhSb2R.99

Safest Pick: Carson Wentz, North Dakota State

image: http://www.walterfootball.com/college/NorthDakotaState_logo.gif

Normally, this is a pretty easy choice for me, but it was difficult this year. I think Wentz and Goff are at a similar level of risk. Goff didn't play in a pro-style offense and there are size concerns, while Wentz faces a big jump in competition and has a relative lack of starting experience. I decided to pick Wentz because sources across the league with a variety of teams have said that he is a complete quarterback prospect with a great skill set, off-the-field attributes, and football I.Q.; all while coming from a pro-style system. I think both Wentz and Goff will pan out. I think if either is a bust it will be because they went to a bad team with poor management and the organization itself ruins the playe

Read more at http://www.walterfootball.com/draft2016positionreviewQB.php#BLi3hBg2TzRhSb2R.99

Quarterback Rankings by Attributes

Accuracy:
NFL prototype: Aaron Rodgers, Packers

1. Jared Goff
2. Carson Wentz
3. Paxton Lynch
4. Cardale Jones
5. Dak Prescott
6. Jacoby Brissett
7. Christian Hackenberg
8. Connor Cook

Arm Strength:

NFL prototype: Joe Flacco, Ravens

1. Cardale Jones
2. Carson Wentz
3. Paxton Lynch
4. Christian Hackenberg
5. Jared Goff
6. Connor Cook
7. Dak Prescott
8. Jacoby Brissett

Field Vision:
NFL prototype: Tom Brady, Patriots

1. Jared Goff
2. Carson Wentz
3. Connor Cook
4. Christian Hackenberg
5. Cardale Jones
6. Jacoby Brissett
7. Dak Prescott
8. Paxton Lynch

Decision-Making:

NFL prototype: Tom Brady, Patriots

1. Carson Wentz
2. Paxton Lynch
3. Dak Prescott
4. Jared Goff
5. Connor Cook
6. Jacoby Brissett
7. Cardale Jones
8. Christian Hackenberg

Upside:

NFL prototype: Cam Newton, Panthers

1. Cardale Jones
2. Carson Wentz
3. Paxton Lynch
4. Dak Prescott
5. Jared Goff
6. Christian Hackenberg
7. Jacoby Brissett
8. Connor Cook

Mobility:

NFL prototype: Cam Newton, Panthers

1. Cardale Jones
2. Carson Wentz
3. Paxton Lynch
4. Dak Prescott
5. Jared Goff
6. Jacoby Brissett
7. Connor Cook
8. Christian Hackenberg

Intangibles:
NFL prototype: Drew Brees, Saints

1. Carson Wentz
2. Dak Prescott
3. Jared Goff
4. Paxton Lynch
5. Jacoby Brissett
6. Christian Hackenberg
7. Cardale Jones
8. Connor Cook

Read more at http://www.walterfootball.com/draft2016positionreviewQB.php#BLi3hBg2TzRhSb2R.99

[calfoxwc]

Looking at that, I don't see how Goff is more talented than Wentz.

[Tour2ma]

@bbedward said:

I had a couple (real) Cubans in Mexico (I know they were real based on my research, almost everybody sells fakes). I honestly can't tell the difference between a Cuban and any other cigar - I smoked one on the beach though which was nice.

I'm sure their reputation has a mystique factor built in due to being hard to get. Kind of like Coors beer as it crept east in the 80's.

That's the 1980's, Mike...

@calfoxwc said:

Looking at that, I don't see how Goff is more talented than Wentz.

Looking at that after watching all their 2015 game tape, I don't agree with those rankings.

[bbedward]

Looking at those alone it'd mean cardale was a top 3 QB in the draft - he's not.

[Tour2ma]

@mike-h said:

Using stats isn't the best for this type of discussion, but UGH, OK we can do that. Justin is a very good friend of mine and put a ton of work into this, please give it a read (don't just read the charts).

http://draftbreakdown.com/2016-nfl-draft-breaking-down-situational-quarterback-performance/

Wentz has advantages in a few of the categories, not just above Goff, but above the rest of this QB class.

Nice article... curious about the scale development and the relative weighting (or lack thereof) for the categories.

Also feel there's a discountable element of collegiate QB's running that's not considered. An element that shows in 3rd Down and Red zone passing stats that won't translate to the NFL... not fully anyway.

[Tour2ma]

@bbedward said:

Looking at those alone it'd mean cardale was a top 3 QB in the draft - he's not.

Gruden (or Jaws?) had an interesting take on Cardale today...

"Cardale Jones is not a pro prospect. He is a pro project."

[Mike H]

@tour2ma said:

Nice article... curious about the scale development and the relative weighting (or lack thereof) for the categories.

Also feel there's a discountable element of collegiate QB's running that's not considered. An element that shows in 3rd Down and Red zone passing stats that won't translate to the NFL... not fully anyway.

Those are passing red zone numbers. If you added in running, it'd make Wentz even higher above the rest in that category

[Flugel]

@tour2ma said:

Gruden (or Jaws?) had an interesting take on Cardale today...

"Cardale Jones is not a pro prospect. He is a pro project."

As a HC, Gruden seemed best at borrowing veteran QBs like Rich Gannon and Brad Johnson rather than drafting/training young inexperienced QBs. GB was good at training young QBs when he was there; but that also included other offensive minded coaches like Andy Reid, Mike Holmgren, and Steve Marriucci.

I've never been a big fan of Jaws especially when he couldn't understand how Joe Thomas continues to make the Pro Bowl. My guess is things really changed the minute he stopped having Dick Vermeil around to translate NFL film for him and give him the week long wtf's in practice. Vermeil prolly liked him because he felt needed but at the expense of burnout from too many hours to the extreme of frequent sleeping at the office. Ryan had the mentality if a QB needed that much attention - he was replaceable. Today, I'd rather listen to Greg Cosell summarize film than the over-caffeinated Jaws.