Cousins would "seriously consider" the Browns
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Redskins fans are stuck. Like you for so long we just wanted stability and a good option. We now have that ... and hes good and made us consistent. We were so bad the past 2 years from the lack of draft picks and this year had a ton of injuries so it’s hard to say whether it’s Cousins or the team. We are now bored with .500 and want “the next step” and whether that includes cousins or not ... no one knows. Cousins very well could be elite with talent around him. He just hasn’t had much to work with in DC.
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So hes a player who can come in and win us 8 games (potentially getting us into the playoffs), that's exactly what I'm looking for.
I can't believe there are so many browns fans on here that are like ," I don't want him, he only wins 8 games a season". Are you guys forgettng it usually takes 3 seasons for us to get 8 wins?
If you don't think he's a top 10-12 QB who isnt going to have us contending for the playoffs, I understand not wanting to pay that money. I don't know what makes you think that but I get it
Are you even listening to what several Redskins fans are saying? You've set the bar too low, if 8 wins is your goal. Looks like you're ready to have a parade for that level of mediocrity. For example, 50 miles south of Dayton where Dandy Andy Dalton (with a stellar supporting cast- there's a good comparison) is just barely good enough to make the playoffs, and go one and done. I want better than that.To pay Kirk that kind of money, I want Rodgers, Brady, Rothlisberger good. Reports from Washington- sorry to bust your bubble- say Cousins isn't in that league- though he's probably going to get paid like he is.
Are you even listening to what several Redskins fans are saying? You've set the bar too low, if 8 wins is your goal. Looks like you're ready to have a parade for that level of mediocrity. For example, 50 miles south of Dayton where Dandy Andy Dalton (with a stellar supporting cast- there's a good comparison) is just barely good enough to make the playoffs, and go one and done. I want better than that.To pay Kirk that kind of money, I want Rodgers, Brady, Rothlisberger good. Reports from Washington- sorry to bust your bubble- say Cousins isn't in that league- though he's probably going to get paid like he is.
I never said he was in that league, but he is a top 10-12 guy and he can get us to the playoffs.
We're a rebuilding team and the bar is too low? What if our draft pick sucks? Alex Smith isn't going to make this team much better. So we suffer for 3 more years instead of watching a competent offense.
We have talent in this team, and we should get a ton more this off-season. Cousins could make us contenders in the AFCN with in a year or 2. I'm tired of Cleveland being the laughing stock of the NFL. Let's bring in the best talent available and win some games
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Redskins fans are stuck. Like you for so long we just wanted stability and a good option. We now have that ... and hes good and made us consistent. We were so bad the past 2 years from the lack of draft picks and this year had a ton of injuries so it’s hard to say whether it’s Cousins or the team. We are now bored with .500 and want “the next step” and whether that includes cousins or not ... no one knows. Cousins very well could be elite with talent around him. He just hasn’t had much to work with in DC.
Redskins fans are stuck. Like you for so long we just wanted stability and a good option. We now have that ... and hes good and made us consistent. We were so bad the past 2 years from the lack of draft picks and this year had a ton of injuries so it’s hard to say whether it’s Cousins or the team. We are now bored with .500 and want “the next step” and whether that includes cousins or not ... no one knows. Cousins very well could be elite with talent around him. He just hasn’t had much to work with in DC.
No kidding. There are very few quarterbacks in the league that can rise a substandard team to a playoff team. And a playoff team is usually pretty damn good no matter which quarterback is under Center as long as he's decent. Look at the Eagles the Vikings and the Jaguars.
I don't doubt that Kirk Cousins could be competent it's just that I don't want to skip on a top prospect to get him here.
WSS
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Redskins fans are stuck. Like you for so long we just wanted stability and a good option. We now have that ... and hes good and made us consistent. We were so bad the past 2 years from the lack of draft picks and this year had a ton of injuries so it’s hard to say whether it’s Cousins or the team. We are now bored with .500 and want “the next step” and whether that includes cousins or not ... no one knows. Cousins very well could be elite with talent around him. He just hasn’t had much to work with in DC.
No kidding. There are very few quarterbacks in the league that can rise a substandard team to a playoff team. And a playoff team is usually pretty damn good no matter which quarterback is under Center as long as he's decent. Look at the Eagles the Vikings and the Jaguars.
I don't doubt that Kirk Cousins could be competent it's just that I don't want to skip on a top prospect to get him here.
WSS
I don't doubt that Kirk Cousins could be competent it's just that I don't want to skip on a top prospect to get him here.
WSS
There’s only so many elite talents. If you think Rosen or Darnold can elevate to be a Top 3-5 QB you just draft them and have them for “cheap” for 5 years. If you’re not sure, Cousins is at least a known commodity to a certain extent and is only 28.
If you put Cousins on the Jags, Vikings or Broncos they all would likely have been SB contenders.
I will say, given how bad the Skins defense has been the last 3 years ... and how awful our offensive weapons were this year ... Cousins needs to get a ton of credit. He certainly didn’t elevate the team to playoff caliber but he was close, and the team was ravaged by injuries and he didn’t have a legit 1 or 2 WR. Like I said, I think he can get a team to the title but he won’t “carry” anyone. He makes a bad team .500 ... and would make a decent team playoff caliber. Just hard to say how high his ceiling will be.
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Cousins is a goody two-shoes nerd who's too soft to win a big game. Make him the highest paid player? No way. Dude folds under pressure. He doesn't have the "it" factor to justify a massive payday. Nice guys get stepped on. He's a nice guy.
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Are you even listening to what several Redskins fans are saying? You've set the bar too low, if 8 wins is your goal. Looks like you're ready to have a parade for that level of mediocrity. For example, 50 miles south of Dayton where Dandy Andy Dalton (with a stellar supporting cast- there's a good comparison) is just barely good enough to make the playoffs, and go one and done. I want better than that.To pay Kirk that kind of money, I want Rodgers, Brady, Rothlisberger good. Reports from Washington- sorry to bust your bubble- say Cousins isn't in that league- though he's probably going to get paid like he is.
I never said he was in that league, but he is a top 10-12 guy and he can get us to the playoffs.
We're a rebuilding team and the bar is too low? What if our draft pick sucks? Alex Smith isn't going to make this team much better. So we suffer for 3 more years instead of watching a competent offense.
We have talent in this team, and we should get a ton more this off-season. Cousins could make us contenders in the AFCN with in a year or 2. I'm tired of Cleveland being the laughing stock of the NFL. Let's bring in the best talent available and win some games
I never said he was in that league, but he is a top 10-12 guy and he can get us to the playoffs.
We're a rebuilding team and the bar is too low? What if our draft pick sucks? Alex Smith isn't going to make this team much better. So we suffer for 3 more years instead of watching a competent offense.
We have talent in this team, and we should get a ton more this off-season. Cousins could make us contenders in the AFCN with in a year or 2. I'm tired of Cleveland being the laughing stock of the NFL. Let's bring in the best talent available and win some games
Obviously you weren't listening when I directed a comment in your direction. You want wins- any wins- and screw the long term consequences.
Regarding top 10-12 guys so is Alex Smith. Man- you just want Cousins so bad, you can't even see there's other options out there. Cousins is not significantly better than Smith, and sorry if you're totally in denial about that. Smith can get us to the same place- without the long term commitment.
Two years of Smith- $45 million max. Cousins $95 million guaranteed minimum- for the same level of talent. You just flunked accounting 101.
+++ Apparently you're afraid we're going to mess up another #1 overall QB pick.
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https://brownswire.usatoday.com/2018/01/29/joe-thomas-i-would-actually-sign-kirk-cousins/
Cleveland Browns left tackle Joe Thomas has not been shy about expressing his opinions on all things lately, including the future of the troublesome quarterback position in Cleveland. Thomas weighed in with an interesting choice about the Browns QB options during an appearance on ESPN’s Golic and Wingo show.
“We have $118 million in cap space. So we’ve got plenty of money to do whatever we want,” Thomas told Golic and Wingo last week. “But I would actually sign Kirk Cousins and then I would use the first and fourth pick on the best players available.”
Who does Thomas have in mind for those picks?
“Probably Saquon Barkley and one of the defensive players. I’m not exactly sure where they go, where they rank all the quarterbacks. But, for me, I would rather sign Kirk Cousins because we have the money. Then you don’t have to trade a draft pick for a guy like Alex Smith.”
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Looks like Joe's switching horses since it looks like Drew Brees isn't coming to Cleveland anytime soon.
On Cousins... there were some comments that make up my take. His redzone performance concerns me. His price tag promises to be way out of line with his W/L impact.
As for the Cousins/Smith debate... In 2017 Smith was the league's top QB in deep throw efficiency... something both Hue and Todd value.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
I never said he was in that league, but he is a top 10-12 guy and he can get us to the playoffs.
We're a rebuilding team and the bar is too low? What if our draft pick sucks? Alex Smith isn't going to make this team much better. So we suffer for 3 more years instead of watching a competent offense.
We have talent in this team, and we should get a ton more this off-season. Cousins could make us contenders in the AFCN with in a year or 2. I'm tired of Cleveland being the laughing stock of the NFL. Let's bring in the best talent available and win some games
Obviously you weren't listening when I directed a comment in your direction. You want wins- any wins- and screw the long term consequences.
Regarding top 10-12 guys so is Alex Smith. Man- you just want Cousins so bad, you can't even see there's other options out there. Cousins is not significantly better than Smith, and sorry if you're totally in denial about that. Smith can get us to the same place- without the long term commitment.
Two years of Smith- $45 million max. Cousins $95 million guaranteed minimum- for the same level of talent. You just flunked accounting 101.
+++ Apparently you're afraid we're going to mess up another #1 overall QB pick.
Obviously you weren't listening when I directed a comment in your direction. You want wins- any wins- and screw the long term consequences.
Regarding top 10-12 guys so is Alex Smith. Man- you just want Cousins so bad, you can't even see there's other options out there. Cousins is not significantly better than Smith, and sorry if you're totally in denial about that. Smith can get us to the same place- without the long term commitment.
Two years of Smith- $45 million max. Cousins $95 million guaranteed minimum- for the same level of talent. You just flunked accounting 101.
+++ Apparently you're afraid we're going to mess up another #1 overall QB pick.
Cousins isn't significantly better? How many games do you think Smith would have won if he was in Washington? Cousins didnt have Travis Kelce, Tyreek Hill, Kareem Hunt, or a top notch defense. Somehow how he put up better numbers evert year.
I'm not trying to make Cousins something he's not, hes good, not elite. On the other hand you are making a case for a guy that only plays well in the right system surrounded with top level talent. We don't run that kind of offense and we don't have that level of talent.
We could still take a QB 1st overall if we feel that he is the best option. Cousins will likely get a 5 year deal with little garuntees in the last 2 years of the deal. The guy we draft will have a 4 year deal with a 5th year option. So if cousins gives us 3 years of breathing room while we develop our guy we could potentially move him with little cap damage and have out QB of the future. Isn't that what you want from Smith? This way we get a better player who has shown he can win on a team of our caliber
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Looks like Joe's switching horses since it looks like Drew Brees isn't coming to Cleveland anytime soon.
On Cousins... there were some comments that make up my take. His redzone performance concerns me. His price tag promises to be way out of line with his W/L impact.
As for the Cousins/Smith debate... In 2017 Smith was the league's top QB in deep throw efficiency... something both Hue and Todd value.
Looks like Joe's switching horses since it looks like Drew Brees isn't coming to Cleveland anytime soon.
On Cousins... there were some comments that make up my take. His redzone performance concerns me. His price tag promises to be way out of line with his W/L impact.
As for the Cousins/Smith debate... In 2017 Smith was the league's top QB in deep throw efficiency... something both Hue and Todd value.
2017 is a good indicator of Smith's play style. He's been in the league for a long time and he's a well known dink and dunk kind of guy. It's hard to belive he developed the deep ball at 33 years old.
Money shouldn't be an issue if you have more than enough and the player wins games.
Cousins redzone # arent thagt bad. He definitely has room for improvement but it may have something to do with his recivers being on the smaller side. Cousins primary targets have been Crowder, Garcon, Desean Jackson, Jordan Reed. None of these guys are particularly good red zone targets. Even their TE Reed is in the shorter side and plays like a possesson receiver.
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Obviously you weren't listening when I directed a comment in your direction. You want wins- any wins- and screw the long term consequences.
Regarding top 10-12 guys so is Alex Smith. Man- you just want Cousins so bad, you can't even see there's other options out there. Cousins is not significantly better than Smith, and sorry if you're totally in denial about that. Smith can get us to the same place- without the long term commitment.
Two years of Smith- $45 million max. Cousins $95 million guaranteed minimum- for the same level of talent. You just flunked accounting 101.
+++ Apparently you're afraid we're going to mess up another #1 overall QB pick.
Cousins isn't significantly better? How many games do you think Smith would have won if he was in Washington? Cousins didnt have Travis Kelce, Tyreek Hill, Kareem Hunt, or a top notch defense. Somehow how he put up better numbers evert year.
I'm not trying to make Cousins something he's not, hes good, not elite. On the other hand you are making a case for a guy that only plays well in the right system surrounded with top level talent. We don't run that kind of offense and we don't have that level of talent.
We could still take a QB 1st overall if we feel that he is the best option. Cousins will likely get a 5 year deal with little garuntees in the last 2 years of the deal. The guy we draft will have a 4 year deal with a 5th year option. So if cousins gives us 3 years of breathing room while we develop our guy we could potentially move him with little cap damage and have out QB of the future. Isn't that what you want from Smith? This way we get a better player who has shown he can win on a team of our caliber
I'm not trying to make Cousins something he's not, hes good, not elite. On the other hand you are making a case for a guy that only plays well in the right system surrounded with top level talent. We don't run that kind of offense and we don't have that level of talent.
We could still take a QB 1st overall if we feel that he is the best option. Cousins will likely get a 5 year deal with little garuntees in the last 2 years of the deal. The guy we draft will have a 4 year deal with a 5th year option. So if cousins gives us 3 years of breathing room while we develop our guy we could potentially move him with little cap damage and have out QB of the future. Isn't that what you want from Smith? This way we get a better player who has shown he can win on a team of our caliber
That's where we'll have to disagree. You're willing to pay a "good" player "elite" money. Said it before, bad economics. Cousins a better player? His potential contract is "face of the Franchise". If you're going to stick to your guns that Cousins is better, I'm not going to debate you anymore on that. Ha, so exactly how many more wins is Cousins good for than Smith at twice the price? Two? Let Denver take the guy for a one last shot at the SB. @ 30 years old really think he's going to want to walk into a multi year rebuild with the Browns?
2017 is a good indicator of Smith's play style. He's been in the league for a long time and he's a well known dink and dunk kind of guy. It's hard to belive he developed the deep ball at 33 years old.
Money shouldn't be an issue if you have more than enough and the player wins games.
Cousins redzone # arent thagt bad. He definitely has room for improvement but it may have something to do with his recivers being on the smaller side. Cousins primary targets have been Crowder, Garcon, Desean Jackson, Jordan Reed. None of these guys are particularly good red zone targets. Even their TE Reed is in the shorter side and plays like a possesson receiver.
Yeah, I'd like to see wins too. Seeing a lot of them next year with Cousins is about as likely as Jimmy giving me a 50% price break on my season tickets.
Money is an issue if you don't want to put your team in cap hell down the road. I'll give you a couple fer instances. Garrett turns into another Bruce Smith- got some space for a Suh contract? Gordon reverts to his pro bowl form and stays off of drugs = top 5 WR money. We're going to have a bunch of guys a few years down the road coming off their rookie deals- (like Schobert) and if we want to keep them, we had better have the cap room to do so.
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Looks like Joe's switching horses since it looks like Drew Brees isn't coming to Cleveland anytime soon.
On Cousins... there were some comments that make up my take. His redzone performance concerns me. His price tag promises to be way out of line with his W/L impact.
As for the Cousins/Smith debate... In 2017 Smith was the league's top QB in deep throw efficiency... something both Hue and Todd value.
2017 is a good indicator of Smith's play style. He's been in the league for a long time and he's a well known dink and dunk kind of guy. It's hard to belive he developed the deep ball at 33 years old.
Money shouldn't be an issue if you have more than enough and the player wins games.
Cousins redzone # arent thagt bad. He definitely has room for improvement but it may have something to do with his recivers being on the smaller side. Cousins primary targets have been Crowder, Garcon, Desean Jackson, Jordan Reed. None of these guys are particularly good red zone targets. Even their TE Reed is in the shorter side and plays like a possesson receiver.
2017 is a good indicator of Smith's play style. He's been in the league for a long time and he's a well known dink and dunk kind of guy. It's hard to belive he developed the deep ball at 33 years old.
Money shouldn't be an issue if you have more than enough and the player wins games.
Cousins redzone # arent thagt bad. He definitely has room for improvement but it may have something to do with his recivers being on the smaller side. Cousins primary targets have been Crowder, Garcon, Desean Jackson, Jordan Reed. None of these guys are particularly good red zone targets. Even their TE Reed is in the shorter side and plays like a possesson receiver.
Could be that Smith had untapped deep ball ability all along.
Quickest way I can think of to make all that cap space disappear is to start by overpaying a QB.
In 2016 Cousins was the 3rd worst full time starter in redzone completion percentage at 44%. In 2017 he rose to T-7th worst at 50%. He did have a good 2015, his first full season, when his 60% clip put him in the top 5.
His 2016 showing inspired the following November article...
Kirk Cousins has been the NFL’s worst red zone QB, and it’s not close
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Cousins is an established loser. Give a rookie a shot. Maybe he actually wins a playoff game.
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We have 118 million in cap space. If we spend 30m on a QB we still have a ton of cap space. We could make Garrett and Gordon the highest paid players at their positions and still have enough money to bring in some free agents. Not to mention were going to lose other players in the next couple of years like Thomas, McCourty, and others who don't live up to their contract or aren't good fits.
Spending on a QB won't hurt us unless we get carried away in free agency. Getting a QB is the easiest way to get wins and Cousins wins games.
I know I'm coming off as Cousins fan boy, but I'm not. I am anti- Smith because I've watched him play since he was drafted. He would be a waste of money that won't get us in a position to get into the playoffs. If your looking for someone to take lumps until the rookie is ready just throw Kizer out there. It won't cost us anything and we weren't going to the playoffs anyway
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@louisville-slugger, you're missing another point in all your reasoning: NFL contracts tend to put most of the money on the third year of contract. And it makes a lot of sense, because that ensures Cousins (in this case) that we won't dump him after 2 years because the shitload of money we would have as dead cap.
Just remember that last year we made a deal with Houston to take Osweilers contract for a second round pick. What's a 2nd round pick worth? Ask Garoppolo.
We have a lot of cap space NOW, but that doesn't mean that we don't have to use it wisely.
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Why are you guys so worried about money? We have a ridiculous amount and it doesn't roll over. If we don't sign Cousins that money probably goes to waste. Our front office has to work the contracts so we don't end up in cap he'l if they can't do that they need to be fired
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Why are you guys so worried about money? We have a ridiculous amount and it doesn't roll over. If we don't sign Cousins that money probably goes to waste. Our front office has to work the contracts so we don't end up in cap he'l if they can't do that they need to be fired
Why are you guys so worried about money? We have a ridiculous amount and it doesn't roll over. If we don't sign Cousins that money probably goes to waste. Our front office has to work the contracts so we don't end up in cap hell if they can't do that they need to be fired
Unused Cap space certainly does roll over. That may well be the error in your thinking. It's not a "use it or lose it" situation. IIRC- and Tour can correct me if I'm wrong on this- the only caveat is (I think) there's a 5? year rolling period where a team has to spend a minimum on contracts. There's not only a ceiling, there's also a floor. And like they say "it's complicated".
Yup. working contracts is pretty important- that's why we're going to need cap room down the road- when we (think) we're only one player away, to afford the mega contract they're likely to demand. This isn't the time to make Cousins the highest paid QB in the league when the roster still has more holes in it than swiss cheese. I'm glad you're not doing the bean counting for the Browns.
Case in point- the Dolphins threw humongous money at Ndamukong Suh, and they currently have very little wiggle room to go out and sign FAs. Latest stat from over the cap has the Steelers $3million over- so where you think they're going to pull $10 million+ out of their a$$ to keep Le'veon Bell on the team? You want instant gratification? There's the guy we should go after.
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Based on the conversations in here, it's clear many of you would steer clear of Cousins. There's some talk in DC right now of giving Cousins the 3rd franchise tag at $34.5 million and trying to negotiate a trade. Of course, Cuosins has to be a party to that and willing to do a long-term deal with the trade partner. Talk here is that Denver is of mutual interest. But the Browns, simply due to the cap space and plethora of picks, have also come up. Given that you'd have to pay the man, what picks would Browns fans be willing to part with? I think it's safe to sa that #1 and #4 would be off the board. By the sounds of it, many of you would be against any trade given you'd be against signing him for "free" ...
As a Redskins fan, I want Cousins back. But if we're not going to get him to a long-term deal, I'll take anything that can help us move the franchise forward. In the case of the Browns, I'd jump at getting 33 & 35 ... and if that's too rich, 33 & 61.Browns would have Cuosins as their long-term solution at QB. If he completely bombs for whatever reason, you've got Kizer who can still be groomed. Then you can go BPA at 1 & 4 and continue to load the defense and probably add Saquan.
I will say, Saquan + Cousins + Gordon, Coleman, and whoever you add in FA at WR (Allen Robinson?) ... would make for a suddenly potent offense to go with your extremely young and loaded defense.
The Browns remind me a bit right now of Jacksonville 2 years ago. I think with Cousins, you could accelerate the timetable from 2 years from contention to immediate contention. in one off-season.
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Oh and the "talk" re: Denver is pure speculation ... and if it's mutual, the discussion was around Denver sending #5 and #40 to Washington for Cousins and #13 ... effectively the equivalent of a mid-first round pick in terms of trade-chart value.
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